/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>50627920
You have bitcoin to blame for that

>>50627920
Unbelievable
Gold is literally worse than xrp

>>50627920
sounds like a good buy

>>50627920
With 7% inflation that is actually 1/2 the price. topkek.

because only paranoid schizophrenics buy gold nowdays with weird end of the world conspiracy theories as if anyone is gonna fucking want your worthless shiny rocks when the world ends

>>50627920
>people unironically buy gold when historical data exists

>>50627920
Why buy shiny rocks or digital shiny rocks when I can buy great American businesses?

Hahahahaha

Just wait

OP

>>50628098
forgot to write, the graphs are what would happen if you invested 1$ into each category in 1802

>>50628098
kek goldbugs rekt

>>50628089
pretty much this.
gold is acceptable as a compliment to your stock portfolio, the only way to excuse making it your primary asset is by being a schizo with a hardon for armageddon.

>>50627920
Ethereum is the new gold, it ll be scarcer than anything, token needed for 32eth monyprinter node!

>>50628089
I bought Silver 1 years ago with my $60k bitcoins. Sold them a few months back when Bitcoin dumped to $30k and felt like I had made a good discision.

>>50628098
>Two more centuries until my bags pump and my real life can begin

>>50628055
this

>>50628089
Yeah, only every major company and the majority of countries currently ditching the USD use it. Oh and it’s also what jews stole from your country and invaded the middle east for and are now building a brand new nuke inside a mountain in Switzerland just to store it all. Sure that’s because it’s not gonna come in handy soon

>>50628380
How are they going to push the gold is king narrative during a media blackout?

>>50628113
>>50628098
>he thinks you can invest in “stocks” and “bonds” as if it’s a singular item like gold and not a near infinite combo of possibilities based on investment choices

>>50628098
>kikes financialized the west
>stonks rose because of this
>you should buy now just before collapse of the west
Idiot.

>>50628380
what do you expect is coming soon?
and how do you expect to secure your gold when 'it' happens?
also, the dollar is gaining strength right now, not losing it. pretty much every country wants dollars so they can pay back their debts and buy goods, and because of rate hikes and inflation, they need much more than they did last year.
>>50628425
the graph is meant to represent a 'diversified portfolio' of stock/bonds against fiat and gold.

>>50628425
>You can't just buy the nasdaq you fool buy rocks instead!

>>50628432
enjoy you three fiddy in 200 years, schizo :^)

>>50627920
gold and silver are both massively overshorted and overbought

i actually wanted to get some recently and none of my local brokers have actual gold
they are trying to sell you those contract fuckerys tho which will be worth jack shit if the shorts actually burst

it cannot hurt to get some imo

>>50628432
>>you should buy now just before collapse of the west

>>50628433
>right now
keyword
>the graph is meant to represent a 'diversified portfolio' of stock/bonds against fiat and gold
Sounds legit and totally not made up. Like I said “stocks” isnt a singular investment, without knowing what this person invested in within that category that graph is entirely worthless. One does not
>invest in stocks
they invest in companies, or give their money to people that do it for them. Again, this has a near infinite number of combos that would all result in different outcomes. This graph makes no sense without saying what they invested in

>>50628098
What is this bullshit chart, a 5$ gold coin from 1850 is now worth like $700++++ so?....

>>50628506
To clarify further, what exactly did this $1 get invested into? Did it sell and then buy a new company with its gains? Did it remain invested in a angular company that has increased 950,000x?? How exactly does one invest a dollar in
>the stock

>>50628506
its meant as a theoretical example you retard, the value is calculated using the average yearly ROI, which can be easily caluclated using historical data.
the graph was presented at a financial conference i attended recently, im pretty sure they knew what the fuck they were presenting.

Kek, stop wasting yar time anon, just check Yopi Network

>Backed by physical gold
>RPG games with many payout features depending on the desires of the player
>Yopigold pursue price stability by buying physical gold

>>50628098
I put 15.000$ into Stocks.

The state decided that I am not allowed to have russian stocks so I lost 10.000$ - no refunds, baby. The rest kind of went down.

>>50628217
kek

>>50628520
Yes and $5 back then was worth something like $220 today

more graphs to make you guys seethe
this are the highest and lowest returns for stocks(red), bonds(blue) and tresury bills(blue), over the peroid specified under the graph.
stock outpreform everything in the long run. stay mad.
>>50628685
the company i work for has just initated the transfer of out russian stocks into russian DRs, hopefully it will be done by the end of september, then we might get some value back.

>>50628685
What state would that be?

>>50628685
I'm sorry European. Your government will never let you build wealth. Should have been an American where the government does everything they can do to pump stocks

>>50628711
the highest and lowest returns for portfolios of stocks that were analyzed in the study the book it ifs from is based on*
ill get you the name of the book soon

>>50628714
Germany. But I think it is the same for all of EU.

>>50628708
Ok now adjust the """stock""" and """bonds""" lines for inflation

>>50628770
My Swedish based broker in Finland just said that they can't guarantee that Russian stocks can be traded but no stocks were taken from people.

>>50628822
EU&US both banned any trading with russian stocks listed on our exchanges and started valuing them at 0, but an event is underway where you can exchange them for russian stocks trading in moscow where they will have a value, heres a transcript for the transfer for one of them.
this has been announced and canceled several times now, hopefully it goes through this time.

>inflation already weimar levels and the recession hasn't even officially started yet
>gold value is at an all time low
what the fuck even is this clown world anymore...

>>50628098
yeah but that graph is kinda wrong because index funds didnt exist until recently. people had to do their own index fund and rebalance regularly themselves. this stocks return suffer from survivorship biais: tons of companies went bankrupt since 1800

>>50628055
>>50628347
>what is inflation
you lost money holding gold retards

>>50628983
>this stocks return suffer from survivorship biais: tons of companies went bankrupt since 1800
Exactly this. Gold's role in a portfolio can be to balance the risk from stocks or bonds.

>>50628425
>what is an index
fucking retards get off my board

>>50628870
Yes but here is the catch, you cant own russian stocks if you are not russian. So even in that event most people are fucked.
My attorney told me he knows one guy who lost 400k just on Gazprom.

>>50629226
yeah, the hope is that trading will also become allowed for us unfriendlies at some point.
I work for a company that manages mutual funds and individual portfolios for whales, and we lost half a fund overnight, as well as significant chunks of others.
>>50628711
book is pic related

>>50628098
and here is this graph again with the sources explained for all the retards saying "you cant just invest into stocks"

>>50629312
did wealth managers even know about the concept of an index funds back in the day? I dont think so.

>>50628098
>>50628113
Funny thing is, most of these stocks and bonds expired worthless and cannot be traded anymore
Make the same chart including the amount of destroyed value. Gold will be on top.

>>50629312
see >>50629496
Do it faggot

>>50628098
w-what happened in the late 1920s?

>>50629496
the graph is yearly ROI of the "boradest index of stocks availible at the time", applied to a 1$ investment every year for 200 years, not stock value or realized gains, how is this so hard to understand?

>>50629546
I understand. Do you? How can you know in advance if a company is going broke? What about Enron, PanAm? This chart is a lie.

>>50628470
don't worry about extreme political polarisation, and the rise of nationalism and war in europe, and infinite quantitative easing, and exponentially increasing inflation that can't be stopped without raising rates to levels that'll crash the economy worse than 2008.
it'll be fine

>>50629570
>historical data
>how do you know in advance
retard alert
what was the ROI for enron for the year when they went broke? what % of all us stocks whose ROI could be calculated for that year was enron?
if you have 200 stocks that makde 5-20% ROI that year a single -100% isnt that significant.

>>50629599
Ok i'll bite.
What about multiple -100% like what happened in the 1930s?
Chart is assuming you just switched to "profitable" companies that survive. Thats not what happened.

>>50629630
you have to take into account the the data gets averaged out over 200 years.
sure, years like 1930 are going to have the average yearly ROI in the negative, but compared to the 190 positive years it still comes out as 6.9% average yearly ROI.

>>50628380
How are these nations using their gold? Are they keeping it in the New York Fed?

>>50629650
OK so i have your agreement on that point? Good. Lets take it one step further.
Lets say we have today some companies like e.g. Apple, Microsoft, Alphabet, Amazon, Meta and just assume they go down at the same time. Does your original statement still stand?
Will you please update that chart with destroyed wealth?

>>50629701
its not my chart buddy, refer to the book >>50629278 and mail the author who spent his life analyzing long term investing

>>50629710
Maybe i will.

>>50628685
That is not true.

I own sanctioned russian stocks (Gazprom and Lukoil) at Onvista in Germany. They stopped the ADR programm but they can be switched to the underlying russian stock which will be helt for you at Citibank Moscow instead of Clearstream. The alternative is they sell the stock in the future and you get the money (after fees and taxes).

Also nice diversification, Kevin.

>>50630152
This is funny because i have a german client right now that invested most of his wagies pension fund in Gazprom. He cannot Exchange them for the real stock, because he is obviously german and not russian. Seems his wagies will take a loss when the stocks will be sold at a lower price.
Why are germans so stupid?

>>50628098
Almost like dollar was backed by gold till literally 1971 LMAO new child.
The delusion of wall street babies is off the charts

>>50630240
your point being?

>>50630322
Your chart is delusional and not realistic in 99% cases

>>50630194
You can exchange them even if your broker is shit, but it is complicated. You would need a russian broker (maybe a german broker with access to the russian market will also work. probably not though). And then you must apply to the russians directly to switch your stocks. The russians made a new law to allow that. Depending on the amount he has invested it might be worth it.

You would need to fill out english and russian forms, which can be hard if he has no russian speaking friends.

Anyway I am German and my broker got it done. My father has a bit of Gazprom stock and his broker is only allowing the stocks to be sold automatically at a later time.

What was really infuriating though were these fuckers asking me to sell my stocks for 2 fucking cents per ADR. 1 cent for 1 gazprom stock. I really hope nobody was dumb enough for that.

>>50630322
the point being you are using a numeraire (dollar) which was formerly pegged to the value of a commodity you are tracking the value of over time (gold) and comparing the value of another class of assets over time against gold in dollar values.

>>50630373
Yeah but you need a russian party to hold the stock.
Obviously thats not possible in this case as it is not his money but that of the pension fund.

>>50630387
im sure jermey siegel is a hack who doesnt know how to draw a chart and you guys all know better.

>>50627998
Kek. Blame BTC for everything. The question is, why is the crypto market also down. Fed rates, recession, inflation. The safest thing you faggots can do right now is hide under your stablecoins. Stake them. I personally do so on a lower risk pool with SPOOL because it's fully audited but use whatever the fuck you prefer.

>>50629312
Disingenuous kike. Gold was fixed in price for years. Now do the chart since 1971 and compare. Stupid fucking faggot.

>>50628425
>buys VTI
heh, nothing personnel, bucko

>>50627920

>>50630598
do you honestly think that that was not accounted for by the fact that THE FUCKING DOLLAR AND GOLD LINES ARE 1:1 CORRELATED UP UNTIL THAT POINT?
do you think that the 'disingenuous kike' would really ignore such an obvious detail and draw the chart regardless?
good job proving my point that only schizos seriously invest in gold

>>50628098
Stocks necessitate intelligence to pick the bests, gold doesn't make you rich but its a foolproof way to protect your wealth against inflation on the long run.

Of course only an idiot would hold gold waiting for big gains, it's something you buy when you already have a sizable amount of money that you want to secure for the next generations.

it is called "diversification" btw

>>50630414
>Yeah but you need a russian party to hold the stock.
Yep. It will also take some time till I will be allowed to trade the stock, but I didn't really inted to trade it anyway. I just hope they fix the dividends next year. Or the year after that.

>Obviously thats not possible in this case as it is not his money but that of the pension fund.
Haha, shit. He might still break even if he invested early, but I doubt it depending on the conditions of the sale.

>>50630637
the esl is strong with this one

>people still don''t understand gold is a meme

>>50630793
>he still doesnt understand meme magic
>gold one of the oldest memes imprinted in humankinds dna
>>50629123

>>50630668
PULL THE CHART FROM 1971 comparing the returns retard. Have you been alive investing since 1801. FUCKING FAGGOT.

>>50630152
Yeah, point is i can not handle over the stocks do i?

Say about gold or bitcoin whatever you want but you owe them. You can give them away if you want. The stocks i consider lost until i can handle them like a free man again.

>>50628098
How about Bitcoin

>>50628654
>its meant as a theoretical example you retard, the value is calculated using the average yearly ROI
that makes absolutely no fucking sense you fucking retard. Those two scenarios are in no way comparable and you and whatever idiot made that graph are too stupid to realize that apparently.
One scenario is a guaranteed roi for every single investor based on a singular investment vehicle.
The other is an “average” roi for “most” investors, all of whom also have entirely different investment vehicles from each other, as well as entirely different investments vehicles than the prior year.
Further, average stock ROIs are based on strategic decision. They are sold at highs and lows, where as the gold in your example is just being held, indefinitely. The two are literally in no way shape of form comparable. In order to make that graph have any meaning it would need to be individual stocks listed, NOT a strategy. You’re comparing an entire category of investment vehicles and decisions, against a single investment vehicle discounting the decisions made with that vehicle. Is the gold line the average ROI of good traders??? Is it just holders??? Again, your stock category are traders not holders, retard. How did you factor in all the people that lost money on stocks and compare that against people that didn’t on gold? You can’t so you didn’t because it makes no fucking sense how you calculated this

>>50632761
>i can not handle over the stocks do i?
Hä?!
>Say about gold or bitcoin whatever you want but you owe them. You can give them away if you want. The stocks i consider lost until i can handle them like a free man again.

And my points are
a) if your broker is not shit you can just trade the ADR into the original stocks. Then you wait. Then you make profit (or not).
b) diversification. Precious metals can be part of your diversification. Every asset has its risks and it is your job to decide how much risk you can take and how to balance that risk.

>>50628711
>leaves out gold
>claims to have lowest returns, doesn’t have a single one going to zero
seems legit kek what the fuck even is that vague ass x axis?

>>50628983
>this stocks return suffer from survivorship bias
exactly, as well as utilization bias. One is active traders and swingers vs pure holder

The fact the paid manipulators on here are making threads to put you off Gold should tell you everything, what they dont tell you is that all the Central Banks are loading up on it the last 10 years.

Do as they do, not as they shill.

>>50629050
good bait

>>50629161
>retarded faggot doesn’t know what index funds actually do
kill your self rwtar

>>50629161
>retarded faggot doesn’t know what index funds actually do
kill your self retard

>>50636488
I have one gold krugerrand
amigmi?

>>50629312
>posts source that clearly states the stock category is based on a “wide” variety of stocks within index funds (multiple investment vehicles)
>says it proves it’s only one
kek

>>50636620
sorry “broadest”* not wide

I think I'm coming around to the idea that shills are paid to fud gold. Gotta keep tards in the shitcoin casino somehow.

>>50628808
Based nooticer

>>50629599
>ROI that year a single -100% isnt that significant.
It is 100% significant if that’s where your *singular* dollar investment went you absolute fucking moron.

>>50636695
>>50629599
and if you try to argue
>b-but that singular dollar went into an index that dispersed it through many stocks!
Then you need to
>1)
Clarify your graph as to specify index funds as you did latter but purposefully didn’t do originally because you wanted to be misleading. This is also why you left gold off you second chart here >>50628711, leaving one to suspect that your entire report was hand tailored with a braid toward trying to portray gold negatively (as you only seem to incorporate it in your comparative imagery when it serves to do so) why exactly was the report made anon, please illuminate us.
>2) Explain which index funds in particular because you’re portraying those funds as a singular decision, when they’re not. There is no singular index fund you could have put a dollar into back then and get that return. Therefore you’re comparing multiple investment decisions at different times to a singular decision at a singular time. Which you say so yourself in your graph here >>50629312
What if that gold holder sold the tops and bought the bottoms as your index funds attempt to do with their “stocks”, did you account for that? No, you didn’t. Because your comparing two completely different things. One, a singular decision. The second a multitude of different investment vehicles being swapped in and out at varying moments depending on their value. In fact one of the “stocks” that could be in your index fund are fucking gold related stocks retard

>>50629650
Who the fuck lives 200 years?
>T-trust me goy! Gold is a bad investment for your lifetime because stocks would be better in a reality where you live 3-4x as long and are never on the receiving end of the perpetual ass fucking a that take place in those years!

>>50627920
gold bugs btfo
pwn
pwn

>>50629667
Look, if gold was worthless it wouldn’t be the corner stone holding up every single currency and other investment in the know world. It literally all comes back to gold. This is what it’s all backed by when you dig far enough. Crypto was created to replaced gold. To get people to buy replacement gold instead of real gold.

>>50636488
Based post.

Also gold went from $300 to $1800 from 2000 to 2010. OP cherrypicking time frames when gold operates on looooooong timeframes.

>>50629667
Do the retards on here think they’re smarter than the central bankers? Because that seems to be the the common opinion. Gold is the only currency that has a set limited amount in existence, that’s where it’s worth comes from. Its worth is derived for the fact that it’s agreed upon as a representation of value and that it’s supply (and therefore value) is very hard to change on a large scale so that value is stable (this is where bitcoin got it’s premise from). Golds allure is its stability as a store of value. Think of gold as locking in your gains. Whereas holding anything else is like keeping your crypto on an exchange. Yes you can make more money trading other things, like fucking dogecoin. But if you make money with dogecoin and the usd shits the bed and you haven’t converted it to something that actually holds value like real estate or gold, you might as well have made nothing with dogecoin, because your usd gains have evaporated with usd. This is why central banks store most of their “gains” in gold. Because everything else will eventually be worthless at some point in time, from moment to moment you don’t know when it will strike. Which is why the graphs above are retarded, because it’s comparing apples to oranges. Gold is a store of value that also has a return, while stocks are essentially gambling for return alone and a much higher risk store of value. Yes you can make a lot of usd making good stock decisions compared to just holding gold. No one’s arguing that’s not true. But when shit goes bust everything you “earned” anyway might be worthless in a flash, when you need it most. Stocks are higher risk and do on average yield greater potential to increase your currency or gold at time of sale, but you have to pray you’re the average person, and pray you aren’t living in one of the time periods when shtf and everything you didn’t store in gold value goes bust

>>50629496
>>50629570
Based highly intelligent response.

>>50629599
Ok now diversify gold with rhodium and plot the chart. Need to be fair right?

>>50628098
SHINY
YELLOW
ROCKS

>>50630619
Yeah, now what does VTI do lol

>>50630693
This. Exactly this. It’s the corner store to all modern exchange value.

...Anonymous (ID: gidGqy77)
07/29/22(Fri)15:15:39 No.50638241
I'm new to collecting gold. Can someone confirm what I'm thinking? So the price of an ounce of gold was $30 back in the 1890s, adjusted for inflation that's about $700 an ounce. Does that mean gold has essentially only increase in value 3x and over 100 years?

>>50628098
> stocks
brainlets have the delusion "stocks" is a stocks entity
think about this a little because that's all the hint you'll get.

>>50636603
the value you secured when buying it will last into the future regardless of economic circumstance that happen surrounding other investment vehicles, likely with a increase to your original value, yes

Gold (ticket: GLD) bros.... no not like this....

>>50637428
central bankers have a completely different risk to reward profile then low income wagies. if i had put all my monies into gold at $1200 4 years ago then i'd have 1.4 times more then what i started with today. those gains don't even outpace inflation. fine for banks sure, they can store their value and loan it out for interest or whatever they do. but for the average person gold doesn't get you anywhere.

just imagine some poor wagie with 10k worth of gold, maybe a few years from now it's 15k worth of gold if hes lucky. adjusted for inflation however hes lucky to still have 10k worth of purchasing power. thats just no way to get ahead. pointless, the sad fuck would be better off "gambling" in crypto or stocks. "but you could lose everything" doesnt matter when you have fuck all to begin with.

>>50638318
see >>50637428

>>50638502
Unless the dollar collapses and you can use your silver to barter for groceries, and your good to barter for a horse

>>50638569
woop de doo
invest your chump change in silver and if the fucking apocalypses happens you win some groceries. thats your big plan to get ahead? lol

all these poorfags with their little piles of silver and gold coins waiting with excitement for the world to collapse so they can barter for groceries. or for the gold price to maybe double in a few years and then they have at most 20% in profit after inflation lol. what the fuck ever. unless you're already rich you're wasting your time with gold and silver.

>>50638562
see >>50638502

>>50627920
zoom out

if you have many millions of dollars do yourself a favour and sell some of your stocks and crypto for gold to preserve some of your wealth.

for everyone else do yourself a favour, sell off your shiny rocks that preserve your poverty-tier "wealth" and buy some stocks or crypto and hope for the best. if things go well you might one day have some wealth worth preserving and then you can buy gold and silver.

poorfags have no business holding gold or silver

>>50638731
Lliterally nobody waits for collapse and apocalypse because money or gold or whatever doesn't matter at that point, only guns food and technology. Everything will turn into jungle.
Thing is many people want easy way to not make their hard earned money stored in dollars literally disappear in few years in half %. Nothing more than that, gold is not about investing, never was

>>50638923
Lol who the fuck is this salty poster? Someone is grumpy today

>>50639063
Gold and silver really make people seeth unreasonably. Just look at that guy. 4 posts in 5 minutes.

>>50638955
depends on how deep the collapse is. everyone always imagines a total apocalypse where ammo and canned food become the only currency. but that need not be the case, more realistically its not a total global collapse but something more localized with some countries collapsing harder then others and your gold and silver would still be worth something to someone somewhere and therefore worth bartering. if theres any kind of an economy left at all the only physical asset you can acquire that has the relevant aspects of money (divisibility, verifiability, fungibility, scarcity etc etc) is gold and silver, natures currency. it was used as money for millenia for a reason and those reasons are still relevant. only an absolute total global apocalypse where nearly everyone is dead and there's no economy left to speak of anywhere would render gold and silver useless and only until some kind of economy builds itself back up again into existence and then its worth something again.

im not saying gold and silver is dumb. im just saying until you have an amount of wealth worth preserving you're better off not wasting what you have on an asset that isn't going to get you anywhere.

maybe have 1k worth of gold and silver for some emergency until you have over 100k in wealth then make it 10k worth of gold and silver at most. or just buy a watch. and then when you have 10 million dollars worth of wealth put 100k in gold and silver.

but all these poorfags putting their life savings into gold and silver is a waste of time. if more then 10% of what you have is in gold and silver and you're not a mega-millionaire you're wasting your resources on the shiny rocks.

>>50639125
The problem is that the value of gold is not something that makes sense in the modern era. We hold onto the idea of its value almost out of tradition, but it no longer makes sense. Before you might hold onto some gold and then during a time of poor economic downturn your by then adult children could take it to the market and buy some chickens and feed.

Money and wealth have taken on such an abstract and superficial kind of meaning, with the value of some products being based entirely on whims of a few or a passing trend. You can't financially recover with it, you can't be sure to have that wealth in the future. So much has changed in how things are valued that purchasing precious metals to hold onto is just quaint. No one doing so has a significant amount that it would ever do them good. Now it only makes sense as an investment, but it makes for a poor one.

Gold, silver, doesn't matter. We've reached a point where raw materials are treated as disposable and throw out as garbage when compared to the things they're used to create. It's just a way for people to feel better when they're paranoid the world is ending and have a hard time understanding what's going on, at least they still have that gold for when shit goes bad.

>>50639323
You are right silver and gold are worthless.

The thing about silver is that there's more than 100x as much in the ground as there is gold (which is also worthless), and its "industrial uses" are massively overrated because copper outclasses it for any conceivable use.

Silver is going to zero, you'll be able to get it for free off of craigslist soon enough if you're willing to go clean it out of dejected stackers' houses and transport it away. Furthermore, asteroid mining operations will be up and running by 2030 and they will QUADRUPLE the supply.

>>50627920
Gold is for doing naked puts/covered calls against for income. Its not for buying low and selling high

>>50628089
Pretty much this. Any prepper worth their salt would rather stock up on canned foods, ammo, water etc than hoard something they can't eat or drink with

>>50628105
based and stockpilled

>but stocks don't 10x overnight
just sell naked puts on value stocks on margin (with the intention to hold them when assigned) and do a bunch of naked puts on VIX and VIXM to hedge, and you can make 60% or more a year on the most boomer underlyings.

>>50639381
that's true about the asteroid mining. everyone talks about how expensive it would be to mine space rocks based on the current cost of launch systems. but if spacex starship really can lift 100 tons into space for 2 million dollars one day like elon says then the equations change. there are rocks out in space with quadrillions worth of gold and 100 tons of mining equipment into space for 2 million could feasibly tap into that and then get sent back to earth on a big rocket that just finished dumping another hundred tons of mining equipment into space before refueling and returning to earth with a load of mined materials. maybe that won't happen but its totally conceivable and not the impossibility so many people think it is.

>>50639381
>asteroid mining operations
Almost agreed with your post until here.

Asteroid mining is insanely expensive, and Gold will need to 100x before it becomes profitable.

Its a dumb reddit meme so don't repeat it.

That said, copper is GOAT. SCCO is a great dividend stock too

>>50639619
or access to space could become 100x cheaper wouldn't that also change the equations?

>>50627920
on a longer timeline, gold will outperform inflation

that said, suck it gold nerds

>>50639645
Yes, but not in our lifetime

>>50627920
didn't the total supply double a little while back from some big gold strike or something?

>>50638502
you’re saying, to you, the risk of gambling is worth the potential reward. That’s fine. No one’s saying gambling on stocks never works out or that it cant yield you a higher return, it can. But it does require more work and better timing to ensure you’re not one of the losers and it can result in you losing your value during times of economic uncertainty. To compare golds value over long periods of time (to survivor biased investment decision at broad) when it’s only ever suppose to be used by the common man during periods of uncertainty, so that he can easily stabilize/secure his gains until he can release them again, is retarded and leaving out the most important thing in this graph, which is time/context, context of what was happening during these time periods. There are many time periods when stocks have done worse than gold. By your logic the initial graph here >>50628098 also doesn’t apply to the common man because of its length of time. There are smaller time periods where gold has retains and even gained in value against stocks.

To put it in your example again, when and if the dollar collapses, due to the decisions of many powerful groups that desire to see such happen in this lifetime and most notably recently, yes the common man may be better off putting some of his money into gold to secure value in the event of downturn. Yes he can gamble on stocks like you said. but if you don’t want to gamble, gold is a good way to secure that value indefinitely regardless of situation. This is why central banks use it.

By your logic, apart from its current culture of greater fool theory, bitcoin is also inherently worthless as it’s just internet banking with fake gold, also unable to be traded for almost any goods, like your horse example.

>>50639674
sooner then you think

>>50638502
But yes, comparing “stocks” broadly to gold on a giant time frame as if both aren’t entirely dependent on time of and decision is absolutely retarded kek

pic rel is spx denominated in gold over the last hundred years. stocks relatively high right now, but overall theyre similar but with highly volatile swings.
If you want a broad measure of stocks use the wiltshire 5000, gives the same result but only goes back to 1971.

>>50639771
>>50639724
if you're poor, like 95% of people are, then you don't have enough money to worry about preserving your wealth with gold and silver. in order to have enough wealth to be worth preserving you need more reward then what gold and silver can realistically offer. which means taking on more risk, which means stocks and crypto. if you do well in stocks and crypto then you can worry about preserving for the long run, if you do poorly oh well you lost an amount of wealth that wouldn't have gotten you anywhere on its own anyways.

the risk to reward ratio on gold is such that its not worth it unless you already have a lot of money. what about this is so hard to understand

>>50639839
>if you're poor, like 95% of people are, then you don't have enough money to worry about preserving your wealth with gold and silver
not necessarily true, it may be used to store the value and then at a later date convert it into a new store of value. If usd collapses and the government rolls out their crypto-fed-coin it will be marked as having a higher equivalent value-ratio to usd. If you hold gold you may be able to convert it for more of the eventual more widely accepted currency (fedcoin), than usd amount would teanslate into fed coin. Again, it’s a stabilizing investment. Gold is about having a stable currency during periods where the common currency is unstable. Yes, you can make more by being on the money with your stocks decisions, but there is risk involved. Also if your company keeps its value in the form of usd alone that company will be fucked if something happens to the currency. This is why companies like Palantir have a huge gold reserve.

>>50638569
>your investment in stocks is bad because if there's an apocalypse it'll be worthless
yeah that's IF there's an apocalypse; there won't be an apocalypse though.

>>50638923
You have no business telling others what risks they should take with their earned money. Also, look at this from an outside point of view. Some seething anon screeching about not buying precious metals during one of the worst economic periods in the last 40+ years along with the worst inflation which isn’t in control. You are probably the least trust worthy anon in this thread.

Buy high sell low

>>50639692
>didn't the total supply double a little while back from some big gold strike or something?
No. And you have absolutely 0 clue about mining if you believe bullshit like that. You don't even know how extraordinarily dumb it is to believe the supply could double in a week. Embarassingly retarded.

The ugandans claimed to have found deposits with a an average grade of ~10 kg per tonne. That is 1000 times higher than what is considered high in deposits located in the rest of the world. Didn't stop the average biz user from making 1000 threads about it.

>>50628038
just bought gold and xrp

>>50640356
fair enough, you've convinced me. that does make sense to me if you're worried about the dollar and you're going out of the market for a while to go into gold. just using gold as a tool to store value temporarily before re-entering the market at a later date.

>>50641664
there is no such thing as low risk and high reward. all low risk comes with low rewards. if you're trying to break out of poverty low reward isn't going to cut the mustard simple as. holding on to gold longterm as a poorfag is a waste of money that the poorfag needs to put to better use if he ever wants to get out of poverty. it only makes sense for the poorfag to use gold as a kind of alternative to the dollar if he is waiting to enter the higher risk higher reward markets at a later date.
>You have no business telling others what risks they should take with their earned money
lol fucking relax buddy, go suck a cock or something if it helps you calm down

>>50642602
No one said anything about high rewards. Your arguments are in bad faith and your need for insults just proves you’re just lashing out. People don’t buy precious metals to break out of poverty. They buy precious metals because what little money they have is being inflated away day by day. The stock market is a casino which can collapse in on itself at any moment. The whole house of cards is a sham. With that said no one said you can’t buy precious metals and also invest in gambles.

>>50630693
but gold's value in USD has increased less than almost anything on the market in that time period
it's better than holding dollars only but worse than most practical assets

>>50642908
>People don’t buy precious metals to break out of poverty
look at the following goldbugs
>>50628380
>>50628454
>>50636488
>>50636643
>>50637139
>>50637428
statistically speaking they're probably all poorfags. clutching their gold and silver and putting out desperate arguments for how great an opportunity gold is right now and how they have to "load up" or stay poor etc. and they're preaching this to a bunch of other poorfags and if they get led astray by this thinking and hodl their little gold coins they're going to miss out on the high risk chances they should have taken a risk on if they actually want to break out of poverty which is what they need to do.
>>50640356
this guy is the exception, preaching a reasonable use case for gold that even poorfags can benefit from. most gold shills are ranting about the jews loading up on gold to create gold fomo to other poorfags

>>50640356
That's what gold has always been for.
If someone is still delusional go look up house prices in gold over time and you'll shit bricks, there's nothing much else you really need to see

>>50627920
except 1700 is resistance...

>>50627920
Thanks for the thread to remind me I should buy more.

GUYS GUYS IM HEDGI---ACCK

>>50629226
I wonder what is going to happen to these shares. 81% of shares on MOEX were foreign owned prior to the war. That's a lot of wealth that got vapourized in an instant.

>>50629312
Nobody can invest in 1802 so who gives a fuck. You retards and your ridiculous investment time horizons

>>50627920
It gets even more hilarious when you look at the chart adjusted by inflation.

>>50628098
>>50629312
Seems like BS.
'Broadest index at the time' implies that you needed to accurately predict when the british empire started it's wane, maybe also the dutch and perhaps some ch1nge in american indices along the way.

A comparison between SPX and gold since 1848 seeps to indicate only a 10x divergence, all of which happened prior to the gold window being shut.

>>50646939
>>50629312
nice if we had one of these chats to compare stocks to real estate

>>50628098
bruh

>>50628098
In the 1800's companies didn't release annual reports, the SEC didn't exist, insider trading was rampant and legal, and the stock market was rife with scams. If the average Joe had invested a dollar in the stock market in 1802, he probably would have had to say goodbye to his money before the Civil War

>>50643693
>Statistically speaking
Why don't you statistically speak for yourself mister diamond hands

>>50643693
>>50636643
This guy demonstrating my point

>>50627920
Metal not needed

>>50628089
Pmg fud? Something is coming

>>50628425
>never heard of diversified indices
Lmao

>>50629546
So it's not securities you could actually buy with a dollar in 1802, nor is it returns that you could actually get buying anything that is available to you in 1802, it's how much bigger the stock market game has gotten over time. It completely ignores companies entering and exiting the index. It ignores transaction fees. In other words, it's pure fiction

>>50627920
After the discoveries in Uganda gold is now more abundant than copper, that it still has any value at all is through pure human stupidity

>>50627920
so it's time to buy?