sanity check

[Anonymous No.24989094]

Can someone enlighten me, why people should buy bitcoin at 30.000 USD? Provided that:

>2 years ago it traded at 3,100 dollar
>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin, it's adoption or its use case

I realize that the dollar is losing value, so some price increase is justified. But the dollar has not lost 90% of its value just because of your hopium.

Be happy that we all made money on here this year. But don't let greed delude you into thinking you can't loose it all just as easily.

[Anonymous No.24989133]

>>24989094
you are fucking retarded. just don't buy crypto, go away and stay poor

[Anonymous No.24989144]

>he still doesn't know

[Anonymous No.24989168]

>>24989094
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/M1

[Anonymous No.24989179]

>>24989133
>you are fucking retarded. just don't buy crypto, go away and stay poor

[Anonymous No.24989198]

>>24989094
> nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin
And everything fundamentally has changed about the world

We're in uncharted territory anons. No one knows what's happening. This is a once in a century "pandemic".
Just ride the wave. Don't get attached to anything

[Anonymous No.24989227]

>>24989179
Calm down OP. Same faggin won’t help.
Come to terms with your IQ

[Anonymous No.24989244]

>>24989227
>t. samefag

[Anonymous No.24989291]

>>24989094
Every year we have this very same discussion. Yes, indeed, nothing has changed. The same things just keep happening and somehow people don't learn anything.

[Anonymous No.24989309]

>>24989198
Idiot, nothing has changed

[Anonymous No.24989346]

>>24989198
>And everything fundamentally has changed about the world
delete this.
These faggots are so busy battling their emotions staring at bitcoin that they dont realize the world around them is sinking

[Anonymous No.24989373]

>>24989094
Can someone enlighten me, why people should buy bitcoin at 1,300 USD? Provided that:

>2 years ago it traded at 200 dollar
>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin, it's adoption or its use case

I realize that the dollar is losing value, so some price increase is justified. But the dollar has not lost 90% of its value just because of your hopium.

Be happy that we all made money on here this year. But don't let greed delude you into thinking you can't loose it all just as easily.

[0.0006 !!Om2RqAgFS9N No.24989387]

>>24989094
>There is less available bitcoin for mining
>halving happened, difficulty increased
>The less there are free resources the scarcier do they become
zoomzoom logic

[Anonymous No.24989390]

>>24989133
>>24989144

I don't know what?

That normies are massively using crypto now, as opposed to two years ago?

That 2020 is the year where governments denounce their currencies and adopt cryptocurrencies?

I mean we all like to see that type of adoption happen. But if you look at it without your mind clouded with hopium you'd understand that with regards to adoption not that much has happened in the past 2 years.

Really the only breakthrough has been more adoption with regards to DEX's. But those effects have already been priced in by now.

[Anonymous No.24989414]

>>24989094
>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin
That's a good thing.
adding to this >>24989198

a lot of things changed during this year, so Bitcoin proving that it's still the same, no change in supply, no change in code, no change in security, it makes it more and more safe to hold than other unpredictable assets. the only unpredictable thing about Bitcoin is the price, but if you trust the plan you know it's all just bumps on the road

[Anonymous No.24989453]

>>24989373
>But the dollar has not lost 90% of its value just because of your hopium.

[Anonymous No.24989455]

>loose it all
learn to spell

[Anonymous No.24989503]

>>24989094
you had 10 years

[0.0006 !!Om2RqAgFS9N No.24989520]

>>24989503
Zoomers hadn't.

[Anonymous No.24989560]

>>24989094
because its still undervalued since its creation

[Anonymous No.24989561]

>>24989094
Lots of reason. I wrote this a couple weeks back. If you're bored, read it and debate me if you want.

https://aqloe.medium.com/bitcoin-investors-letter-2020-7ce54550467e

[Anonymous No.24989611]

>>24989390
>not that much has happened in the past 2 years.
are you being serious? did you miss the past 6 months or something?

[Anonymous No.24989638]

>>24989094
take all the money in the world in savings account and divide that by 21m
thats how much a BTC is worth.

[Anonymous No.24989719]

>>24989309
Lmao you have no idea how the world you've known since WW2 is about to crash
If you're American, you'll be comfy. But Europeans and Arabs and Chinks and Pajeets who've thrived on America policing the world are about to be in for a surprise

[Anonymous No.24989752]

>>24989094
time for your nap uncle warren

[Anonymous No.24989853]

>>24989719
Based and Zeihanpilled, the only thing zeihan gets wrong is crypto tough , on a mercantilistic world crypto will thrive , but boomers don't tend to get technology so he get it's wrong.

[Anonymous No.24989947]

>>24989094
>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin
it's all about the usd supply m8 bitcoin stayed largely the same it's inflation got cut in half tho, but the usd supply skyrocketed.

[Anonymous No.24989978]

>>24989094
>Can someone enlighten me
no, if you don't get it by now then please go back to sucking your broker's cock

[Anonymous No.24989997]

>>24989094
there's always more and more people aware and using it and having wallets. even if it doesn't grow exponential, it always goes up and went up since 2 years ago. so, are you retarded?

[Anonymous No.24990108]

>>24989094
>"This painting here? I bought it 10 years ago for $60,000. I could sell it today for $600,000. The illusion has become real, and the more real it becomes, the more desperate they want it. It's bullshit. Capitalism at its finest"
You are now enlightened.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqjQxs9l5fg

[Anonymous No.24990118]

>>24989094
There’s no reason. The price is manipulated using tether and the game is simply to create a pump and sell the worthless shit you have and can’t get rid of.

[Anonymous No.24990161]

>>24989094
it's digital gold, it's worth what people think it's worth

[Anonymous No.24990221]

>>24989719
Mutt cope, its going to be the other way around and Biden will shill the EU.

[Anonymous No.24990400]

>>24989094
>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin, it's adoption or its use case
all the big mobile payment apps like square, venmo and paypal are adopting it.
microstrategy the largest business intelligence firm is fomoing in, due to government issued fiat failing around the globe.
even JPM projects btc to exceed 300k within a year.
>>24989168
>monetary supply increased by 65% in a single year
bingo.

[Anonymous No.24990441]

>>24989094
>Nothing has changed
Taking a quick glance at the balance sheets of the FED/ECB tells a completely different story.

[Anonymous No.24990929]

>nothing has changed in 2020

this might be the dumbest post on biz this year

[Anonymous No.24991098]

>>24989094
bitcoin isn't increasing in value. the dollar is decreasing in value.

[Anonymous No.24991223]

Where can I buy Bitcoin for thirty bucks?

[Anonymous No.24991336]

>>24990400
>even JPM projects btc to exceed 300k within a year.
source?
i think i saw they said over 100k but didn't know it was in a year

[Anonymous No.24991368]

>>24990221
This. Euros, Arabs, patrician south americans and Chinks are sick of zog. Pajeets, Mutts, and Brazilian creaturas are screwed.

[Anonymous No.24991466]

>>24989719
>If you're American, you'll be comfy
???
They will be the first ones to hit the floor in the western side. BLM bullshit was the first step.

[Anonymous No.24991499]

>>24989094
all the more reason to short it
with leverage
20X minimum

[Anonymous No.24991581]

>>24989094
You shouldn't. Crypto is a scam.
Even if the dollar did lose 90% of the value, crypto is far too volatile to be useful as a currency, so business have to incentive to accept it.

>Ib4 "stay poor"
Well done for your 10x return on your $1000 "investment" into casino chips. Now go back to flipping burgers while the big boys accumulate real assets.

[Anonymous No.24991618]

>>24990400

suppose bitcoin reaches a stable "value". one bitcoin today buys the same amount of commodity today as it does tomorrow.

investment group x uses their bitcoin to buy up a lot of palladium. palladium is now scarce. palladium is necessary for manufacturing a,b,c. makers of a,b or c need to buy palladium with bitcoin, and must do so at a higher price than investment group x.

if you acknowledge the scarcity of natural resources, it's a prisoner's dilemma.

[Anonymous No.24991676]

Network effect + M1
1M btc will happen, however things might have gotten out of hand by then

[Anonymous No.24991780]

can someone ((enlighten)) me as to when this is going to bust back down, perhaps around a curious date in Jan/Feb? If it is around 5-6 I might consider buying in then and joining the ride to Valhalla

[Anonymous No.24991812]

>>24989094
>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin, it's adoption or its use case

Ok, nothing has changed about btc, but you have to be living under rock to think nothing has changed about rest of world which is causing people to hoard btc

[Anonymous No.24991819]

>>24991581
and volatility doesn't reduce with volume because?

[Anonymous No.24991990]

>>24991618
>palladium is necessary for manufacturing a,b,c
you forget it's possible to design things that wouldn't use palladium
there's always other options being researched

[Anonymous No.24992028]

>>24991618
that or i missed the point of your post
just woke up so probably that

[Anonymous No.24992140]

>>24989453
>New house
>Less than 2x the average income

That's like 80k today. Damn, we really did get the short end of the stick

[Anonymous No.24992269]

>>24989094
the only things I fear about BTC:
>satoshi nakamoto is part of the WEF
>SHA-256 gets broken

[Anonymous No.24992596]

>>24992140
this
inflation has been in things like assets instead of commodities, but it's still inflation

[Anonymous No.24992608]

>>24992269
>sha-256 gets broken
that's why i hedge with mochimo

[Anonymous No.24992643]

>>24989094
'cause of the Rainbow Graph

[Anonymous No.24992687]

>>24989453
Why is milk still so cheap?

[Anonymous No.24992697]

>>24992269
the sha-265 gets broken thing is retarded tho
how do you imagine breaking a hash algorithm in a way that impacts btc functions?

[Anonymous No.24992744]

>>24989168
bitcoin is literally inflated worse than this. today you pay 20k for 1 bitcoin out of the 6 being mined. imagine in the future you pay 1 million for the 1.5 bitcoins mined in the future

[Anonymous No.24992756]

>>24989094
People are paying 40k for 1 LP

[Anonymous No.24992772]

>>24989094
bc they just got a shitload of extra money through corporate welfare and they’re looking for somewhere to store it?

[Anonymous No.24992777]

>>24989291
>Yes, indeed, nothing has changed.

Inflation.

[Anonymous No.24992778]

>>24989390
are you retarded? if you are so out of the loop you are NGMI

[Anonymous No.24992787]

>>24992744
also in 1924 germanys stock market sit at 99 points. after inflation of quadrillions of currency it rose to 8 billion points

[Anonymous No.24992822]

>>24989094
narrative.

[Anonymous No.24992842]

BTC will be bought up more than any alt. You have no idea how much money the conventional markets are holding and they will not buy altcoins just yet. Next cycle yes but this time it is only about btc

[Anonymous No.24992846]

>>24992643
just because it is fucking halving doesnt mean its more valuable. its not even scarce. today it is scarce. it just slows down the amount of time until 2100s

[Anonymous No.24992990]

>>24989094
>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin, it's adoption or its use case
have you seen the news lately? you're right bitcoin hasn't changed (though i think this discards the uniqueness of each halving's impact), but the sentiment has vastly changed

[Anonymous No.24992995]

>>24991336
sorry, I meant citibank, not JPM
https://www.ibtimes.com/bitcoin-price-prediction-btc-could-hit-318000-2021-citibank-analyst-says-3083618
>>24991618
>suppose bitcoin reaches a stable "value". one bitcoin today buys the same amount of commodity today as it does tomorrow.
bitcoin may have a pretty big marketcap compared to most financial stocks.
but it's nothing compared to currencies.
as currencies around the world fail and as nations get sanctioned out of the global market, bitcoin will become more necessary for survival.
>if you acknowledge the scarcity of natural resources, it's a prisoner's dilemma.
the thing that a lot of goldbugs fail to comprehend is that the price is capped by however much it costs to mine or recycle.
I don't think it's a coincidence that the world's largest gold mine was discovered right after there was a run on gold and the price recovered to its previous ATH.
https://www.sgtreport.com/2020/10/russia-to-open-worlds-largest-gold-mine-in-siberia/

BTC has a hard capped supply. No matter how hard you mine for it, you cannot generate more of the supply.

Back to the importance of borderless payments. Corrupt governments can and will seize wealth. Like when the UK straight up stole Venezuela's physical gold for the lulz.
https://prruk.org/britains-theft-of-venezuelas-gold-is-part-of-illegal-us-regime-change-agenda/

They can't do that with bitcoin. It can be smuggled in and out of any country without the remote possibility of confiscation.

[Anonymous No.24993248]

what's the deal with owning bitcoin and also being an annoying dumb faggot? Enjoy the gains. You are not changing the monetary world with your 4.5 bitcoins.

[Anonymous No.24993288]

>>24992744
Bitcoin yearly inflation is 1.80% , current usd monetary inflation is what? 40%? Sure the cpi is not inflating but that's because wages have been growing below inflation for 49 years and people are poorer than ever.

Who the fuck is going to keep buying shit while this goes on?

>>24992777
Checked

[Anonymous No.24993331]

>>24993248
Wait until 2100

[Anonymous No.24993344]

>>24992687
Globalization allowed to hide the inflation by importing stuff from places were wages are way below what the usa had on gold terms, everything that can't be imported is inflating hard worldwide.

[Anonymous No.24993356]

NEW PARADIGRAM

[Anonymous No.24993398]

>>24993248
Why would holding 4.5 bitcoins change the monetary world?

[Anonymous No.24993403]

Can someone explain to me what the point of accumulating altcoins is? I can understand making shorter term gains, but why would you build up a stack of something that rises and falls according to BTC?

[Anonymous No.24993446]

>>24989094
huh, I didn't notice that BTC jumped I was busy looking at my sick GRT gains

>50k eony

[Anonymous No.24993461]

>>24993403
accumulating?
Delusion
buying?
Speculation

Never underestimate the stupidity of others, and profit from it

[Anonymous No.24993505]

>>24990400
M1 is a drop in a bucket for all financial assets tho. BTC is still nonsensical trash that by definition is bag holding. The only hope for btc is to find someone else to hold yours

[Anonymous No.24993586]

>>24993461
>Delusion
This is kind of what I was thinking. They believe that ETH or XRP will eventually overtake bitcoin right? I can't understand why else you would invest in them long term. I am trying to set some ground rules and diversify but I don't see the point in relation to crypto

[Anonymous No.24993598]

>>24989094
It sounds like you're still thinking like a reddit web app developer, still babbling about "muh technology" proving you never understood bitcoin in the first place. Try looking at it more from a monetary / economics perspective.

[Anonymous No.24993678]

>>24993598
>you never understood bitcoin
That is possible. Please elaborate

[Anonymous No.24993698]

>>24993586
ETH is bogged down by all of the countless useless, unprofitable zero adoption projects on it. ETH does what it's supposed to do though.

XRP is all about the schizo scenario in which it's used as an interledger for CBDC's. Could it happen? Sure, why not. Link is similar. Could they succeed? Sure. Will they? Probably not.

Both are purely speculative plays. I would maybe even through in a 1-5% of my capital if it wasn't for Bitcoin. Anyone not all in Bitcoin now is simply not paying attention.

[Anonymous No.24993758]

>>24991819
Why should it?

[Anonymous No.24993883]

>>24993758
The more an asset has a more distributed/larger order book, the harder it becomes to move the order book up (or down). A less distributed/smaller order book can be moved up and down with ease with less capital.


......duh

[Anonymous No.24993890]

>>24993758
educate yourself

[Anonymous No.24993951]

>>24993883
>less capital
But more volume implies more capital

[Anonymous No.24993996]

>>24989133
FpBp

[Anonymous No.24994147]

>>24989094
>>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin
This is literally day 1 Crypto 101 class. Lurk more. Just come up with your own value proposition for bitcoin and your own investment thesis and there you go. Why should you care about fundamentals changing in short term?

[Anonymous No.24994159]

>>24993951
Gold has more volume, still much harder to push the price in any direction, not terribly complicated and is why shitcoins exist. Also, the institutions getting in now have drastically larger time horizons than 2017 retail traders.

Part of why Bitcoin is volatile (went down 60% compared to blue chip's 50% back in March btw), is because this is the first time in history where retail has been given the opportunity to front-run the institutions. Retail has no clue what they're doing. This is why IPO's don't allow retail to get in first, it's all banks and institutions that curb volatility.

[Anonymous No.24994187]

>>24992995
blessed, ty for source

[Anonymous No.24994225]

>>24993505
>The only hope for btc is to find someone else to hold yours
I hope it's (You)

[Anonymous No.24994267]

>>24993398
im just calling out the attitudes that little bitcoin bag holders have. Obviously bitcoin is some new world order bullshit that acts and behaves just like fiat stock exchanges and Im just saying enjoy the money but quit pretending that you are some financial genius

[Anonymous No.24994412]

>>24994225
So you are saying I'm not wrong?

[Anonymous No.24994417]

>>24994147
Saved

[Anonymous No.24994483]

>>24994159
Volatility of purely speculative assets not backed by anything but memes... Hmmmm

[Anonymous No.24994492]

>>24994267
Based on your comment, I could say the same for you.

[Anonymous No.24994526]

>>24994483
Yup, that's what it's backed by. Forget the macro. Forget what it does. It's just memes.

[Anonymous No.24994645]

>>24992140
>That's like 80k today. Damn, we really did get the short end of the stick

The biggest bill was the 10k thousand usd bill that inflation adjusted for real estate inflation today is worth 250k.

Meanwhile today they seize cash if you have like 4k on routes or more than 10k on airports.

Not only wealth is being inflated but freedoms all due to the events of 1971.

[Anonymous No.24994686]

>>24994483
Bitcoin has lower inflation than the usd , the euro , real estate and even gold since may.

It's not "backed by nothing" it's the asset with lowest inflation on the planet and if you believe earth is unique on the universe.

[Anonymous No.24994734]

>>24994526
My understanding was even btc shills have finally gave up on it as payment system, that is not feasible. So they only thing it does is pretends to be a commodity by artificially limiting supply. 100% useless, but if people agree it has value (demand) that it does. As long as we keep pretending.

[Anonymous No.24994920]

>>24994734
Yes, because everything in life is pretending. There isn't a single case in the universe where something is "worth" anything more than the value we pretend to give it. It's the nature of the universe. So, it's useless to you, because you give it that value just as others assign it their own value. But really it's pretending, because intrinsic value is just another value!

Yes, not a payment system. Layer 2/3rd parties can do that. It doesn't need to do everything.

[Anonymous No.24994955]

>>24994686
>lower inflation
I think it is called deflation...

[Anonymous No.24995043]

>>24992772
They got that money months ago. I'd suspect, it's the recent news of pornhub not having access to MasterCard and visa. They only have crypto options now.

[Anonymous No.24995057]

>>24989094

>DON’T BUY IT BECAUSE IT USED TO BE CHEAPER

[Anonymous No.24995085]

>>24994412
I'm saying you're a little bitch.
I'm stacking fat ass bricks of fucking cash while you puss the fuck out, like you always have. Repeating the same arguments you had when bitcoin was at $100, $1,000 and $10,000.
After it passes $100,000 you'll either be repeating the same pointless arguments.
That's the fate you've sealed for yourself.
Good luck with being a little bitch.

[Anonymous No.24995105]

>>24994920
>There isn't a single case
Car has not pretend value. If you want to move something from one place to another you need a vehicle. Company that makes cars hence has value. It's a derivative, but it means something. Etc. BTC has ONLY imaginary value. Same as fiat.

[Anonymous No.24995111]

>>24994955
No bitcoin will be inflationary until 2145.

[Anonymous No.24995229]

>>24995111
it's relatively deflationary to fiat
and now gold too

[Anonymous No.24995283]

>>24995229
>it's relatively

Now you get it , and fiat is inflationary relative to assets since 15th august 1971 and is creating a caste system due to inflation.

Bitcoin or feudalism , no other paths.

[Anonymous No.24995307]

>>24994645
man, fuck boomers

[Anonymous No.24995381]

>>24995105
>If you want to move something from one place to another you need a vehicle

What if you don't want to do that? How much is a car worth to someone who can't drive? This isn't about Bitcoin, it's philosophical. There is NO objective value of anything. Just like beauty is in the eye of the beholder. There is no collection of atoms that have assigned themselves value that transcend themselves into actualization. You have to understand this to begin thinking about Bitcoin. People assign their own subjective values to things, based on their human consciousness, but the inherent value of anything is as imaginary and abstract as the value you give to anything. The only thing that can "define" value, or the universe, is the universe itself.

[Anonymous No.24995443]

>>24995381
cool read ty for posting

[Anonymous No.24995481]

>>24995381
>There is NO objective value of anything.
But there are needs. You starve a couple of weeks you will give up every last btc you have. To make food you have to farm. To farm you need tractors. To make tractors you need infrastructure. Etc, etc. BTC is not in this chain

[Anonymous No.24995605]

>>24994645
Everything went to shit once they had abandoned the gold standard.

[Anonymous No.24995704]

>>24995085
I'm happy your risk paid off. But going around trying to insult anons, look who is really acting like a bitch

[Anonymous No.24995732]

>>24995481
There are needs. And there is price, and costs. But now we're getting into semantics. Do we need Bitcoin? Do we need fiat? People value different things differently for different reasons. Just because an order book exists for cars or Bitcoin or food doesn't mean that they have intrinsically assigned value. We give them this "value". To further press this point, value has no value - it's simply a word that humans have created, it doesn't mean anything in the cold vast space of the universe though. We value value because it's a word that helps us understand and communicate with each other.

[Anonymous No.24995747]

>>24995605
https://wtfhappenedin1971.com/

[Anonymous No.24995758]

>>24989094
How new are you

[Anonymous No.24995765]

>>24989094
>the dollar has not lost 90% of its value
This will be wrong in literally a year's time.

[Anonymous No.24995768]

>>24989094
Who the fuck are you?

Oh a retard

[Anonymous No.24995788]

Are there any patternfags in this thread? What can you tell about the current crabs?

[Anonymous No.24995795]

>>24989094
Hey guys why are people paying $1m for a house that sold for $11,000 in 1950.

[Anonymous No.24995807]

Assuming you want to protect yourself against systemic issues affecting middle men what are your options? Precious metals are an option but only if you have them physically delivered, paper gold is an IOU from a middle man. Physical metals have a premium in low volumes and where I live they're taxed.
There are only two asset types that are actually practical for me, real estate and Bitcoin.

[Anonymous No.24995828]

Read up on tether
After you are done you will truely need a sanity check
Basically fiat is a scan
Tether is a bigger scam build on fiat
Bitcoins price is an even bigger scam build on tether
It's the biggest pyramid scheme with less to back it up than stonks
It will all be coming down again it's just a matter of time

[Anonymous No.24995834]

>>24991499
Please do this and post losses

[Anonymous No.24995849]

>>24995605
>>24995747
Yes because pic related

[Anonymous No.24995876]

>>24989719
Its america thats gonna get fucked, EU is gonna be fine.

[Anonymous No.24995882]

>>24989094
>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin, it's adoption or its use case
Except it has. There is tons of adoption now. Paypal for instance. Square is another one. Tons of people are embracing crypto.

[Anonymous No.24995884]

>>24995828
Yes after it hits 500k

[Anonymous No.24995940]

>>24992697
Quantum computing

[Anonymous No.24995953]

>>24995884
Nah probably after the lockdowns get lifted and people are vaxxed up against covid

[Anonymous No.24995961]

>>24993288
Double checked

[Anonymous No.24996033]

I'm late to the party. Did anything even happen with this shit or is it still just a meme?

[Anonymous No.24996047]

>>24995481
>To farm you need tractors. To make tractors you need infrastructure.
Or you can outsource tractor production to the third world, farming too. Maintain a huge military paid in tokens you print to force the third world to accept the tokens.

[Anonymous No.24996171]

>>24991990
>doing a Stille coupling without Palladium
preposterous

[Anonymous No.24996267]

>>24989094
BTC starts with zero monetary value. Goes up as price discovery begins. Continues going up, on average, for years.
>Durr why buy something that goes up in value?
I can't even anon...

[Anonymous No.24996271]

>>24995940
First off quantum goes hand in hand with quantum resistance. As the technology progresses, the technology that counteracts that technology progresses. New wallets can be updated to neutralize the quantum threat.

Also, with quantum (or a 51% attack), there is no way to "cash out". No exchange is going to pay you a dime. In this scenario, a fork of Bitcoin occurs, the quantum Bitcoin chain can keep truckin' on, worthless. While the sans-quantum chain is left unscathed.

Most importantly however, quantum means that the entire internet is broken. Quantum is probably my biggest FUD when it comes to Bitcoin, but the motive behind it is broken. It's self-defeating, the only reason to quantum attack Bitcoin would be for chaotic purposes - it doesn't accomplish anything.

[Anonymous No.24996301]

Everything you said can be assumed to be true about diamonds, gold and silver too. But their value skyrocketed over the centuries too. It’s about price discovery and exposure.

Everything in the crypto sphere is better now. Back in 2017, every pump was coupled with massive exchange outages. There were flash crashes, hacks and 51% attacks. There was also no history of scam ICOs that we have now to reflect on. Everything has changed since then, so what you say now about 30k compared to 3k could just as easily be said about 3k compared to 20k.

[Anonymous No.24996374]

>>24989094
>>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin, it's adoption or its use case

HELLO ECONOMICS????????? Everything has changed about Bitcoin. Bitcoin is infinitely more valuable when everyone accepts Bitcoin. Therefore the price is higher. SIMPLE AS THAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT.

BITCOIN IS MY SAFE WORD TOO.

ADOPTION IS KEY. THE VALUE GOES UP AS ADOPTION GOES UP.

[Anonymous No.24996517]

>>24995732
you were doing well til you went off the rails saying value has no meaning

the word doesn't itself matter . but value does exist. human beings have interests and certain objects or services help them to attain those ends, creating demand for things of limited supply. that's value.

[Anonymous No.24996576]

>>24995732
value is subjective. markets shows the "average" of all the perceived value for every given item, at a given point in time.

[Anonymous No.24996579]

>>24989094
You're going to need this anon. Bookmark it, it will help you along the way.
https://www.bitcoinjumper.com

[Anonymous No.24996677]

>>24989719
Anon, as an American I disagree about us being comfy
The whole world is going to shit, there will be no comfyness for anyone

[Anonymous No.24996720]

>>24996517
Value as a concept was invented by consciousness, it's a word and an idea that helps us communicate and understand each other. It exist in consciousness alone, aside from that space alone, value doesn't exist. So, even though you and your friend agree that something has value (assigning your own value properties), doesn't mean I agree with you, or that "everything" agrees with you.

[Anonymous No.24996771]

>>24996576
This is what I'm trying to say, you're just more succinct.

[Anonymous No.24996802]

>>24991581
you just have liabilities larper
you will never pay your student loans, slave

[Anonymous No.24996853]

>>24996720

Forget about the word itself.

All living organisms expend energy to obtain sustenance, mating opportunities, and so on. Those things that they pursue have value to them.

Value is not a "concept" that is "invented". All living things have needs and the things that they need are limited in supply.

[Anonymous No.24997132]

>>24996853
>Value is not a "concept" that is "invented". All living things have needs and the things that they need are limited in supply.

Notice your use of wording here i.e. *value* isn't invented, living things have *needs*.

It's a semantic argument at this point. It would be more prudent to derail our argument and discuss how we define value and needs. All this musing stems from people arguing about Bitcoin's value, which I've claimed isn't objectively definable. Ironically, I believe the people that disagree only prove my point.

[Anonymous No.24997154]

>>24995704
nah, you just talking the same fud that I was spitting in the mtgox era.
Difference is I stopped being a bitch and hopped on the dank train to the moon, like a player should.
You're stuck in normie town central station, patting yourself on the back for "winning" an internet debate, while missing the biggest opportunity the world has to offer you right now.

[Anonymous No.24997181]

>>24996720
The concept exists as a product of its context. The same is true of space and apples and chairs and clowns.
If a subjective observer notes a pattern in random noise that can be interpreted as a face it's objectively true that it can be interpreted as a face by face detecting neural nets. This pattern was picked out of the noise because you were looking for it but it's still objectively there like a trillion other patterns you discard as uninteresting.

[Anonymous No.24997186]

>>24996802
>you just have liabilities larper
>you will never pay your student loans, slave
Imagine being a burger and not being able to understand getting an university degree paid for.

Cope.

[Anonymous No.24997237]

>>24995940
no but you didn't answer my question
what do you think would do to bitcoin if sha-256 gets"broken" whatever the fuck that means and yes what the hell would that mean?

[Anonymous No.24997248]

>>24997132

>Ironically, I believe the people that disagree only prove my point.

Perhaps you're not expressing your point clearly enough.

The fact that non-human, non language using organisms have needs / "things that they value" shows that its not a semantic issue, and that value exists independently of language or human mental conceptualization.

[Anonymous No.24997279]

>>24996271
you don't even understand the first thing about quantum computers or how they are a threat to crypto. yet you keep yapping.

[Anonymous No.24997294]

dude just trust the vision

[Anonymous No.24997387]

>>24997237
Most web people used md5 for a long time even though it was always dumb. Then one day some guys figured out you could produce collisions, basically fake hashes. All that happened was everyone changed their hashing functions. In a similar situation with Bitcoin the hard fork problem wouldn't be a problem since one fork works while the old one doesn't at all.

[Anonymous No.24997421]

>>24997181
>it's objectively true that it can be interpreted as a face by face detecting neural nets

Agreed (as far as we understand it), but the jump from interpretation to value is a long one.

To take this one step further (this is getting way off track), unless you are "God", the universe itself, or in other words perceive and understand all things at all times - then you don't objectively know anything. Everything you perceive now through your limited human consciousness could be completely wrong. Not saying it is, but this is technically true. And I would argue my opinion of this truth, is in itself a paradox. Gets tricky from here.

[Anonymous No.24997527]

>>24997387
yeah but you could still use md5 for the purposes bitcoin uses it. collisions make it possible to alter large assemblies (especially ones filled with large areas of zeros) maliciously thus making it unsuitable for signature use. (second preimage attack)

that's a very specific problem, totally unrelated to bitcoin. even if sha-256 will not be accepted to sign assemblies bitcoin can still easily use it.

[Anonymous No.24997537]

>>24989094
“Why should I buy now, after another halving, when inflation went lower then gold and some companies and institutions started putting it on their sheets when it was lower 2 years ago” hurrr durr plebbit says it’s over so it’s over

[Anonymous No.24997575]

>>24996771
I know

[Anonymous No.24997579]

>>24997248
Okay, now I understand you. You are claiming that value is regulated to need. I would argue that value can exist outside of need. So, I agree with you that organisms have needs they require in order to survive.

>>24997279
True, what am I missing?

[Anonymous No.24997602]

>>24989094
did you completely miss paypal news?

[Anonymous No.24997669]

>>24997527
well at least as a pow function, what could possibly happen is that difficulty skyrockets if a new generations of asics use some weakness discovered in the hash function.

this sha-256 fud is totally retarded it stems from a great misunderstanding in how it relates to bitcoins security.

quantum computers are a potential theoretical threat to public key cryptography. the key word is theoretical. it's not even remotely practical. and the bit size is laughable on today's quantum computers and it's exponentially more difficult tot add a single qbit. but whatever.

taproot will bring quantum resistant signatures to bitcoin way before any of that becomes a serious discussion.

[Anonymous No.24997728]

>>24993678
Bitcoin is the opposite of your silicon valley reddit big tech zuckerborg new paradigm meme stocks

Bitcoin's worth comes from its security, its longevity, the extreme hardship to change it, it is the evaluation of consensus, essentially the value of a tradition.
Silicon valley meme technology is based on an essentially endlessly depreciating value of units of computing power
Thus you always have to stay ahead, find the next thing, out with the old in with the new for those short term exponential returns from whoever finds the way to use the new order of magnitude in computing power for a technology

But bitcoin is hard money, there will never be more than 21 million and you can't get a bitcoin by any other means than buying sooner rather than later even if you tried
You can't hack it, you can't make a better bitcoin or a better blockchain as many have tried (Dash)
One these facts settle in your mind you start thinking in sats, praying for dips instead of pumps in the price for as long as possible because the inevitable is coming

[Anonymous No.24997759]

>>24997579
>True, what am I missing?
well mostly two important things:
1, you need a general purpose q computer of about 700 qbits to a 1000 qbits to start breaking bitcoin p2pk addresses
2, symmetric algorythms like aes or sha-256 are not practical to attack with a q-computer it would probably be slower than a home pc.
3, 50 qbits is the best we can do today annealing matrices can't run shors so they don't matter. adding a single qbit is a huge huge engineering ordeal.

[Anonymous No.24997852]

>>24997759
Big brains over here. So do I buy btc or not? Euro cuck. Use . Not commas

[Anonymous No.24997886]

>>24989094
if you need to be convinced how will you even understand the convincing?

[Anonymous No.24997896]

>>24997852
i would say always buy btc just dca man
buy for a $100 every week or something.

and you will make it.

as for go all in right here right now? i wouldn't.

[Anonymous No.24997956]

>>24997896
Thank you anon. I’ve been dca’ing since ‘17. Since this pandemic I’ve been putting all extra money in Bitcoin, eth, and link. Im getting worried that we’re going up too quickly. Are you investing in other crypto asides from btc?

[Anonymous No.24997961]

>>24989198
cold and flu season happens every year you dumb faggot. We just don't have power hungry faggots pushing a false narrative every year.

[Anonymous No.24998036]

>>24997956
that's good, 3 year dca should do it. soon you won't be able to add to your position in any appreciable percentage then you can stop it.

[Anonymous No.24998077]

>>24997956
and no nothing else for me only btc.
doing my last year of dca in 2021. after that i will be planning my profit taking and just sitting on my eggs.

[Anonymous No.24998082]

Bitcoin is now a 23.5k stablecoin...

What a time to be alive.

[Anonymous No.24998091]

>>24989094
because numbers go up and institutions are shilling their bags, greyscale buying all supply and reselling at 1000% premium.

[Anonymous No.24998114]

>>24998082
should really go back at least to $20k but as low as $14k is possible. anything lower right now is retarded bera talk and nocoiner cope. things can change of course.

[Anonymous No.24998141]

>>24998091
wat?

[Anonymous No.24998326]

>>24989094
BTC has set itself as a store of value. Its going to remain forever. I don't think it can go 10x though. I have been looking at mirror.one for a while now. Threw 1 ETH at it - lets see how it goes

[Anonymous No.24998361]

>>24989094
they shouldn't.
unless it's the real bitcoin, of course.

[Anonymous No.24998419]

>>24989094
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTf5j9LDObk

[Anonymous No.24998489]

>>24998361
Lol bcash

[Anonymous No.24998610]

>>24998489
bitcoin cash is what bitcoin should have been

[Anonymous No.24998715]

>>24998361
>>24998489
>>24998610
I just bought some Beecash pls no more dumping lower :=s

[Anonymous No.24998751]

>>24998610
nah, bcash is s shitshow not because of the blocksize at all. but that turned out to be a mistake also.

[Anonymous No.24998752]

>>24997759
is there anywhere i could read up on this quantum stuff and how coins would be resistant (similar to the info you posted)

[Anonymous No.24998778]

>>24998752
i bet there are hundreds of articles about this shit. try google it.

[Anonymous No.24998828]

>>24989094
>>24989094
This is the best advice i have seen on the subject

[Anonymous No.24999149]

>>24997421
>Everything you perceive now through your limited human consciousness could be completely wrong
When I point to a chair and say it's a chair I'm not wrong just because ackshually the chair is an inconceivable quantum whatever fuckery made of a trillion complex interactions.
1+1=2 is objectively true as long as you also accept the basic premises of math like lines existing. No logical statement can be made without it resting on a premise so all coherent statements and definitions including the definition of "objective" are built by context that you can trace back to fundamental assumptions. A chair objectively is a chair, the context for the statement is well established. Value is objectively value.

If we simulate the earth with me in it infinite times I will still just experience it as the one life. There's no difference between it being a simulated reality or what we conceptualize as the highest order physical reality, partly because the world described by physics can't be the highest order. The core of subjective experience that's modulated by physical brains with memories has to be a property of reality outside all known laws, that and the fact that all physical models need an axiom not derived from the model means there is a higher order we can never fully model. "You" exist primarily outside all physical rules and before time in that realm where the form of chair was defined but no physical chair can exist. All physical chairs are fallen chairs, corrupted by sin but redeemed by faithful service to Christ the embodiment of the principle of creation.

[Anonymous No.24999152]

>>24998751
>not because of the blocksize at all. but that turned out to be a mistake also.
huh? you saying 32 MB blocks were a mistake?

[Anonymous No.24999214]

>>24989094
Market crash in 2 months to 9k-12k, with the biggest pump ever seen around July. Buy on the dip and be rich forever when it aims for 35-50k depending on how fucked we truly are.

[Anonymous No.24999237]

>>24989390
If you shitcoin ticker doesn't start with X you might not make it.

XBT
XRP
XLM
XMR
XIFYKY

[Anonymous No.24999462]

>>24999152
apparently yes. but we didn't knew it back then.

[Anonymous No.24999723]

https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption

Single Transaction Footprint - Equivalent to the carbon footprint of 734,575 VISA transactions

[Anonymous No.24999912]

>>24992687
dairy subsidies.

[Anonymous No.24999927]

>>24989094
Imagine still being a bobo

[Anonymous No.24999979]

>>24999723
that argument can easily be turned around
bitcoin could reduce greenhouse gas expulsion by 41%

[Anonymous No.25000009]

>>24989453

>house in my area is 20x the average yearly wage

Australia is so fucking bad and I hate Boomers for this horseshit

[Anonymous No.25000170]

>>24999723
That's a bad argument because the network is not working just to process transactions but to maintain the ledger.

It would be like massuring trains co2 vs planes , but ignoring the rails and metals for cables needed to power those trains that need to be maintained too.

Also visa & mastercard & banks need a lot of ATMs and employees who use energy and calories to operate.
You can't just close a branch of those since the monetary system also works under a ledger just a centralized one.

[Anonymous No.25000269]

>>25000009
You should stop wasting money on starbucks. Sips

[Anonymous No.25000327]

>>24989094
>But the dollar has not lost 90% of its value just because of your hopium
You've got increased US sanctions against people who are more than happy buying bitcoins at any price to do business. That's what bitcoin was originally meant for; getting around bullshit rules, not just buying drugs and people.

[Anonymous No.25000334]

>>24989390
Institutional investors are loading up and them will drag the price to high levels before offloading.

[Anonymous No.25000354]

>>24997579
i like how this anon doesn't just 'you're wrong i'm right" shit but actually asks "what am i missing" type shit

[Anonymous No.25000364]

>>24998778
k i will do that

[Anonymous No.25000501]

>>25000170
I am not against crypto or anything. You are right about including all the relevant factors in the energy consumption calculation even for Visa or other payment methods.
But woul you agree that BTC is not very energy efficient?
I would be much more happy to use crypto for day to day payments because fuck governmets and their shit puppeteering of our lives. We all agree that BTC will not be a day to day payment crypto. But what will? And when or if will the crypto situation stabilise and be widely adopted by the general public?

[Anonymous No.25000620]

>>24999214
how do you know that

[Anonymous No.25000654]

>>25000501
>But woul you agree that BTC is not very energy efficient?

It depends on what you see from it , if you understand it and see it as a bretton woods bancor settlement system then it's extremly efficient.
If you see it as a payment method is a shitty one , if you see it as a private bank it's a great cheap one at that.

The energy efficiency will get better tough , once the last asics arrive due to moore law limits in the next 2 to 3 years , people will start to find creative uses for the excess heat, the only thing that prevented this so far was the need to upgrade hardware.

We will see shit like people using asics to grow food in winter , or companies storing excess energy in bitcoin.

>We all agree that BTC will not be a day to day payment crypto. But what will?

Litecoin , XMR , Cash, Visa ,Mastercard.

>But what will? And when or if will the crypto situation stabilise and be widely adopted by the general public?

Crypto is absurdly stable , the volatility is upwards and caused by fiat going downards at ever increasing speeds.

[Anonymous No.25000724]

>>24991581
I used to think this. It's going to become a "reserve currency" there's a difference.

[Anonymous No.25000797]

I didnt read a single thing in this thread but except OP is a sell single af, but fuck you retarded niggers im shorting, 24 was the targt longs closed and bag has been secured anyway.

[Anonymous No.25000806]

Why not

[Anonymous No.25000892]

>>25000654
I need to study the workings of crypto more. I like the idea of using excess heat in a creative way. It is a new way of thinking of how the "money" lifecycle could work.
Do you maybe have any book recomendations? Not about the inner technical workings, I can find that, but a more visionary, how the future can look if crypto succeedes.

[Anonymous No.25000916]

>>25000654
>>We all agree that BTC will not be a day to day payment crypto. But what will?
probably a mix of different stablecoins

[Anonymous No.25001014]

>you are fucking retarded. just don't buy crypto, go away and stay poor

[Anonymous No.25001143]

>>24999462
what do you mean, how are they a mistake?

[Anonymous No.25001450]

>>25001143
economically disastrous.

[Anonymous No.25001597]

>>24989094
gotta love all the shills at $24k ATH
>keep buying retards

[Anonymous No.25001949]

>>25001597
i literally just bought 2,000 usd more
come at me

[Anonymous No.25002421]

>>24996047
American Imperialism at it finest.

[Anonymous No.25002542]

>>25000620
It will go above a new high and people will dump. There will be a repeated crash but just in lightspeed. Gonna be a true shitshow. Worse and faster than last time.

[Anonymous No.25002909]

>>24999237
Don't forget XBY

xtrabytes.global

[Anonymous No.25003375]

>>25000892
Yes look at this book

https://www.amazon.com/Bitcoin-Standard-Decentralized-Alternative-Central-ebook/dp/B07BPM3GZQ

[Anonymous No.25003468]

>>25001450
you're not making sense, i'm asking why you think 32 MB blocks were a mistake.

[Anonymous No.25003516]

>>25000892
btw the use of excess heat from asics is already happening in things like tomatoes cultivation.

Also it created an incentive to burn methane byproduct from oil extraction and convert it to co2 & bitcoin(methane is way worse than co2)

https://www.upstreamdata.ca/post/natural-gas-venting-how-bitcoin-solved-a-160-year-old-problem

and excess hydro power is being bought in places lika china during rainy seasons creating an incentive to build more clean energy.

>>25000916
I doubt , stablecoins have bigger inflation than bitcoin already.
I think cash is here to stay and return to it's glory days people seem to forget the biggest usd bill in the lunar landing of 1969 was the 10k usd bill worrth 250k usd today if adjusted for inflation.

Bitcoin will destroy they war on cash that governments have been doing and governments will be force to embrace cash to compete with free cryptos , cbdcs are going to be a disaster.

[Anonymous No.25003637]

>>24989094
just wait for the next dump and watch it fall down to $1300 per btc

[Anonymous No.25003661]

>>24998361
If you were an OG you would know exactly whats the "real" Bitcoin today...

[Anonymous No.25003704]

>>25003516
heating your house with crypto miners is literally a future thing
when will moore's law be hit with crypto miners where new ones won't be massive leaps over the previous generation?

[Anonymous No.25003781]

>>25003661
i were but lost most in the mtgox hack. bitcoin cash people are mostly OGs that actually believe in the original intent of bitcoin, if you hadn't noticed.

[Anonymous No.25003858]

>>25003468
well can't you see? it's plain as day. for bitcoin to stay alive as block rewards decrease it has to do two things: appreciate and fees taking over partially then fully the miners reward. and on bitcoin this works on the cash forks it doesn't.

that simple. not the only thing that only works on bitcoin for example spv the sv cucks are so enamored with doesn't really worth a damn on sv only works on btc as intended where reorging blocks is extremely difficult and a deep reorg is impossible..

[Anonymous No.25003886]

>>25003704
>when will moore's law be hit with crypto miners where new ones won't be massive leaps over the previous generation?

Current best asics are at 5 nanometer chips

https://www.asicminervalue.com/

They are built by TSMC in taiwan which also builds cpus for AMD, intel is far behind at 14 nanometer , SMIC the chinese company is at 28nm but has 7nm chips tough not in mass production.

3nm is the smallest they can get with moore law , so we are one generation of asics away from that.

Probably 2022-2023, but current asics generation is in use since may 2020, to give you an idea this is the longest this fuckers have been in operation , it used to be that they were changing them every 3 months.

So we are one generation from the last asics , hell with intel and the chinese so far behind this may last for years who knows.

>heating your house with crypto miners is literally a future thing

This unironically happened a lot , many people became rich due to using asics for heating lmao.

[Anonymous No.25003941]

>>25003781
i hadn't notice that they would believe in the original idea of bitcoin. the original idea and intent of bitcoin was definitely not a minority hash shitfork that disregards the nakamoto consensus sustained by brainlets memeing about their retarded use cases completely ignoring the 3 most important things about bitcoin that should never be sacrificed.

[Anonymous No.25004033]

Can someone enlighten me, why people should buy bitcoin at 6.00 USD? Provided that:

>2 years ago it traded at 0.01 dollar
>nothing has fundamentally changed about bitcoin, it's adoption or its use case

I realize that the dollar is losing value, so some price increase is justified. But the dollar has not lost 90% of its value just because of your hopium.

Be happy that we all made money on here this year. But don't let greed delude you into thinking you can't loose it all just as easily.

[Anonymous No.25004044]

>>25003858
adoption were supposed to be filling the blocks and we were steady on the way with steam accepting bitcoin. then blocks became full, people started thinking it was a store of value not meant for paying and everything just spiraled down the shitter. of course you THINK you need full blocks because that's all you know. of course there won't be adoption because the blocks are full. circular logic.

>>25003941
yeah you're a lost cause. i knew you were full of shit from the start, said >>24999152 just to confirm.

[Anonymous No.25004099]

>>25003781
I expect that very serious problems with the falling block reward will start long before the last Bitcoin block with a block reward is mined. I would say sooner than 10-20 years. This issue and the corresponding attacks will show up first in coins such as BCH, BSV and LTC. In the latter case LTC may be supported by the merge mining of DOGE. DASH will survive longer because it has a slower rate of fall of its block reward. That being said it will eventually suffer the same fate. Of course this assumes no hard fork to introduce a tail emission.

BCH and BSV will face very stiff transaction fee competition from XMR. This is because XMR transaction fees can fall with the square of the XMR block weight as XMR adoption increases. The XMR blockchain would remain secure because of the tail emission, but BCH and BSV WILL(!!!) have to restrict their blocksizes in order to get some kind of mining security making them non competitive with XMR.

When transaction fees become dominant the chain becomes vulnerable to a Scrooge attack, e.g. a 51% attack (around Christmas Day, December 25th. This is the day of the year when there is the lowest amount of worldwide commercial activity, and hence the lowest likely transaction fee revenue).

BTC has a chance for longer survival, but that depends on maintaining the store of value narrative. The question then becomes: Can BTC keep the store of value narrative if another coin becomes dominant as a currency for transactions?

There are all sorts of attacks that have been proposed in the literature against BTC in the scenario where transaction fees dominate over the block reward. What I have not seen is a case for this "fee market" that is supposed to replace the block reward in BTC.

None of the above even takes privacy and fungibility into account making coins like XMR even a bigger threat.

Bytecoin had to abandon its adaptive blocksize in 2019 because of the falling block reward issue.

[Anonymous No.25004420]

>>25004044
nah you are stuck in 2017 that's all.
we now have a clear vision for bitcoin scaling with small blocks. we can see it can scale exponentially not linearly with block size.
and that makes absolute sense.
you fucking neo luddites will never get it. you never got segwit you definitely won't get taproot.

[Anonymous No.25004468]

>>25004044
but nice attempt at dodging my point that bitcoin EVIDENTLY capable of sustain miners with fees and the cash forks failed to show any evidence of being able to do so after the next halving.

[Anonymous No.25004583]

>>24989094
>sanity check

Shut the fuck up with these Orwellian words.