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/biz/ - Business & Finance


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29906127 No.29906127 [Reply] [Original] [archived.moe]

Any successful salesmen around /biz/? How does one learn to be a salesman? Is it even possible to learn it from scratch starting later in life, or do you have to be born with the knack and grind out your skill level from early adulthood to have any chance of getin gud?

Asking you guys is a shot in the dark, because I know that every once in a while some real pros and genuine sharks go through here, and sometimes they're in a sharing mood. Whether I get an answer or not I'll just start with reading, and then re-reading a bunch of classics on the subject everyone seems to agree on, like the works of Tracy, Ziglar, Hill, etc.

>t. got an offer to start selling windows and doors starting in a couple months. Surveying, installation, servicing, the whole shebang

>> No.29906489

>>29906127
not a salesman but you literally just have to be confident and be willing to talk up anything. you'll probably turn into basically a sociopath but if you can learn to do this you become a god amongst men who can make money by selling turds to dummies who don't know any better AKA 99% of americans. most people i have met make 200k+ (commissions too, fucking based) are salespeople

>> No.29906556

>>29906127
The salesmen here can get anons to buy a fucking Luigi coin, so I think you might actually get some good advice.

>> No.29906605

>>29906127
abandon all sense of ethics and morals
focus on the numbers
always be closing

>> No.29906699

Know you'r product, listen to customer questions, & act the part

>> No.29906717

>>29906489
>>29906605

>turn into basically a sociopath

Not a problem, we're approaching peak clown world, I see it as my moral duty to hasten the collapse by fleecing normans.

>> No.29906902

>>29906717
then go get a sales job
should be easy, look in construction sales or even landscaping/ pest control has a lot of opportunities to make big bucks doing high pressure gimmicks on old people

>> No.29907535

I've had this Apu but in a shit quality, so I'll bump a thread for that

>> No.29908643

Bump. I want to be able to sell a contradiction. How do you talk to people though?

>> No.29909176

>>29906127
You're selling a niche so if they're not interested, then they're not interested. Move on. No need to pester them like a pajeet behind a burner number.

Pro tip: Buy some sort of accessory item of your local football team (university or nfl). Maybe sunglasses to wear on your head or one of those rubber wrist bands (cheap). Make sure to know a little about the team and the storylines in case the customer notices and strikes up a conversation. Boomers love to shoot the shit and are much more likely to buy something from you if you're able to talk casually with them about something they're interested in.

>> No.29909544

>>29906902
Just make sure the fleecing is earning you the right amount to do so. Don't fleece your fellow normies for some guy named Marty Goldberg.

>> No.29909648

One of the dumber guys from my frat made 250k last year at VMWare in sales.. Starting to think I took the wrong path

>> No.29910210

>>29906127
Renewal by Andersen anon?

>> No.29910510

>>29906127
Simple to learn, difficult to master

>> No.29910959

>>29906127
What company? I spent a summer doing that job I can tell you all about it. If it’s renewal by Andersen stay away.

>> No.29911026
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29911026

>>29908643
That's one thing I got going for me, desu. Even though English is not my native language (I'm a Polak), I have no trouble speaking to people, and my accent is a weird mix of Burger and Dutch, long story. Hell, twice I got a job I wasn't qualified for in the least, one of those times they even offered me 15% more than my ask all by themselves, just because I'm good at talking to people in suits.

I lost that job because it was technical, and I had no fucking clue what I was doing, kek. Now I'm fitting windows and doors, only this time I didn't lie about not knowing shit, so I started at the bottom. Then the fitter I'm helping brings up wanting to strike out on his own, and needing someone like me to drum up business, and it got me thinking I was going about shit all wrong from the get go.

As to talking to people, I think first thing is to listen and watch. Your whole attention should be on them, ideally. LISTEN to what they say, paraphrase snippets of what they just said back to them, turn it into a question leading to where you want to go. I'm not sure I'm explaining it right. How to Win Friends And Influence People is legitimately good, if you can get over the fact that it tries to make you into a glorified doormat. Take what you like from it and leave the simp shit, I say. I hear the 48 Laws of Power are good as well, I've yet to read it tho.

>> No.29911132

>>29910959
>Renewal by Andersen
Nah, its in
London
L
o
n
d
o
n

not telling you guys which tho. Just telling you its London is not enough to find it, there's like a thousand of the fucking things here.

>> No.29911450
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29911450

>>29910959
Also, please tell me your secrets, shifu. I offer rare Pepes in return.

It's basically upvc and aluminium windows and doors, vertical sliders and casements, wooden box finishes, and we're trying to find a source of hardwood windows back in Poland. Being London it gets complicated with zoning, regs, and adjusting prices according to postcode. The same shitty upvc casement can go for five times the price in the City than in Greater London area.

>> No.29911467

>>29911132
No worries just wanted to know if it was the same place. If you’re selling good products at a good price windows and doors are good bc you can physically point to their old shitty wood windows and explain the energy cost savings. RbA straight up rapes customers though with their ridiculous prices and I was too much of a moralfag to cut it scamming people. It was a very fun job though bc my team were all friends and I was walking around with balls of steel that summer. Wish you good luck, are you door to door or in home?

>> No.29911691

>>29911467
Thass the thing man, I'm not selling shit yet, I'm a fitters mate for now. A glorified helper at 30+ years old, I've just recently graduated to trimming the damned things. What can I say, my life got all messed up after Rona hit.

I don't think we'll be selling door to door. The guy I work with is a master of his trade, and knows like a billion people, he gets semi regular side jobs just from word of mouth. We're just looking to change that to our own thing, ditch the company we're working for now and start our own operation. Tall order, I fucking know.

>> No.29911912

>>29911026
Nice, thanks. Will read.

>> No.29912313

>>29906127
Key factors
>confidence
>charisma
That's it

>> No.29912383

>>29911691
Oh dude if it’s your own operation even better. Make sure your product and price point is good, your confidence in the product will give you confidence in your selling and they’ll build a virtuous cycle off of each other. Not a lot of people can go full sociopath mode and just lie and lie and lie with a straight face. Only one person out of 13 could do that at my company. Everyone else including me got tripped up bc they knew they were hurting the people they sold to in the back of their head. I think your plan is solid, one thing that would help is make a full script with rebuttals for every rejection you can imagine, memorize it all like your life depend on it. Obviously don’t sound like a robot but it takes some of the edge off when you can plan for the most probable routes the conversation will take. Then role play it with your partner and over time throw more wrenches into each other’s pitch so you learn how to improvise on the fly.

>> No.29912569

2 more things, looksmaxx as much as you can, hit the gym etc. and if you’re selling to a couple, ALWAYS try to get both of them in the room at one time for your appointment. Pitching to only one half of the couple leaves them with the easy “well I need to ask my hubby/wife” cop out.

>> No.29912828
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29912828

>>29912383
>make a full script with rebuttals for every rejection you can imagine, memorize it all like your life depend on it
Now see, this is the kind of shit I was hoping to get by starting this thread, note taken. I'm reminded now I;'ve read something about rehearsing conversations years ago, and even do it subconsciously before job interviews and the like, I'll need to revisit it.

>>29912569
Already on the looxmaxing, losing weight and hitting the kettlebells, the other suggestion is golden too. Kek, desu I'd never be alone with a woman customer anyway if I can help it.

as promised, rere pepe for both of u

>> No.29912887

>>29912828
>both of u
derp

>> No.29913104
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29913104

>>29906127
Not my area but I hope you get some good answers. Good luck with the new job anon, hope you kill it

>> No.29913186

>>29906127
Unironically read way of the wolf by Jordan Belfort. He's a conman, but thats the best sales book there is, and I've read all the major ones.

>> No.29913752

>>29912828
What a lovely peepee. I wish I still had a copy to share with you but some of the key point I remember (Reddit spacing incoming)
-Mention a neighbors name and address that you did work for (could be fake)
-analyze the house from all angles you can see before engaging
-make a note of any flaws such as condensation in windows, rotting wood door trim, if the house has its original 25 year old pvc windows still, if there is a bay or a bow window that was skipped in the last renovation, plastic wrap over windows due to describes etc
-point out these issues in your pitch
-“new windows can save you up to 56% in the summer and 42% in the winter on energy costs” (actual line don’t know if even a real fact)
-use energy costs to explain why this is a good long term investment
-get clues about the customer before going in and tailor the pitch; example, Prius in the driveway= heavy focus on energy savings
-have pre prepared responses to common rebuttals
-keep a “10 percent discount card” as a last resort “well, Boss might get mad at me for this, but here, this will save you 10% on your closing cost”
-book the husband and wife for appt at the same time

>> No.29913837

>>29913752
*plastic over windows due to draftiness* sry phonefagging

>> No.29914014

How is selling real estate as a straight male? I'm not american and I most agents I encounter are women who always seem to have their social media littered with lust-provoking selfies. Is it actually indirect prostitution?

>> No.29914061

>>29914014
Cocaine

>> No.29914177

>>29906127
You can improve your skill as a salesman, it's definitely a craft you can learn. But it's also a basic binary: can you do it? And then if yes, your potential ceiling is based on your inherent abilities. The real classic books are How to Win Friends and Influence People, which is pretty dated but still useful. Then you have SPIN Selling by Neil Rackham and The Challenger Sale by Adamson and Dixon. The basic principle that these lay out is the same whatever line you're in - ask questions, find out what problem the prospect has, and then try to offer a solution that works for them. To be really successful you need to very good at reading people, everyone knows the motormouth idiot salesmen because everyone's met them but those guys don't really ever make it.

I am quite senior in sales, last few years I've been selling custom software dev & content creation projects to large corporates. Door to door stuff is a real fleapit, and not something I've ever done, but if you can succeed there you can make it out and into a better line of work.

>> No.29914211

>>29913752
And by script I mean a literal paper script that you role play with your business partner. Start off easy, give your partner the “sale” right away just for reciting the script. Then start adding in your pre planned rebuttals and responses to those. Then once you know the script and rebuttal responses by the back of your hand, start talking like an actual customer, mixing up your rebuttals, interrupting the “salesman” etc. Then you can start to have fun with it we would do all kinds of scenarios for fun, like customer is high on PCP, customer barely talks and gives one word responses, customer just caught his wife cheating on him etc

>> No.29914214

>>29906127
My friend and later roommate years ago taught himself to be a salesman. He started at Golds Gym. He fought anxiety with self help shit and went balls deep in Tony Robbins type shit, he became a true believer and he is incredibly successful today. I don't envy him tho, he had to give himself up to all this nebulous crap to effectively hussle people for his shekels. I couldn't give myself over to anything other than God but it can be done.

>> No.29914529

>>29906902
>pest control has a lot of opportunities to make big bucks
A guy on my AAbgroup does this, spends half the year here and the other half traveling the country. He said he has a spot for me but I'm a fucking introvert and hate bullshitting people
Crypto will save me r-right guys?

>> No.29914704

>>29906127
NGL if car dealerships were open on Sundays in my area I'd love to be a salesman

>> No.29915058

>>29909176
This!

Been a salesman for almost 15 years now. this anons advice and your product are the only things you need to know. don‘t fall for the wolf of wallstreet meme, it’s not the 90s anymore

>> No.29915134
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29915134

>>29914211
>customer is high on PCP, customer barely talks and gives one word responses, customer just caught his wife cheating on him etc
Ok, that sounds fun as fuck kek

>> No.29915256

>>29912828
>I'd never be alone with a woman customer anyway if I can help it.
wise
even if a 'metoo' type customer would be one out of 50, it's still not worth the risk.

>> No.29915282

>>29915134
Careful now don’t go crashing the Pepe market

>> No.29915706

>>29906127
OP, unironically watch Mad Men. I'm biased because I'm a theatre faggot (it's the best drama series of all time), but it genuinely hits the nail on the head when it comes to business and sales. It's all problem -> solution, obviously, but once you learn to read people's emotions and how those manifest into their motivations you can capitalise on that. Certain scenes and storylines in Mad Men show this excellently. Don's advertising genius and uncanny charisma come from this concept; he sees right through people. However like others have said this can easily turn into sociopathy. Who cares though, most people are NPCs and deserve to be exploited.

>>29914177
This guy fucks.

>> No.29915783

>>29906556
Kek

>> No.29915805

>>29906556
i keked so hard thank you anon

>> No.29916207

>>29906127
whats a good entry level sales job? I want to be in sales but everything on indeed says they need 1 year of sales experience so what do i do?

>> No.29916416
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29916416

See, this is why \biz\ is still worthwhile, its not all pajeets scamming other pajeets. I'm breaking out the rarest of my pepes just because you guys are fucking stars, the lot of you in this thread.

>> No.29916682
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29916682

>>29916207
I've noticed this too, any respectable sales job is behind a cv/degree wall. I reckon there's two ways to get around that, 1 is to start with a less than respectable sales job just to show you can do it, and 2 is to know the right people at the right time. A company I used to work for recruited their sales people straight outta collage, but get this- set salary, no commission. They justified it as "we want our reps to build relationships with their customers, not chase new leads all the time", but everyone knew what's up, the yearly turnover for reps was huge. They basically got to tick the box on their cv's saying "sales rep for a biotech company", and fucked right off to greener pastures.

>> No.29917584

>>29916682
salary sales sounds horrible

>> No.29917824

>>29917584
The place was toxic as fuck, ngl. They fired me literally on the day my 6 month probation ran out, which made me basically unemployable in the field, but screw that. Then I find out the previous guy who held my position got the same treatment, just nobody told me about it. And then I got to talking with a couple reps and ex-reps, not to mention one of the field service engineers who had a fucking heart attack at 35 due to working insane hours under immense stress and being on the road, unpaid, for most of his "free" time. Fuck that place was a mistake.

>> No.29918139

>>29915706
OH SHIT if you’re still in here anon another good show Rec is White Gold on Netflix. It’s literally about dudes in bongland selling shitty pvc windows in the 80s

>> No.29918643
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29918643

>>29918139
kek, meme magick is real

>> No.29919228

>>29906127
Was fired from 4 sales jobs and became the best one at my 5.
It's just failure and getting better, maybe you are faster, sales is a skill but the bottleneck is you, the best tip to become great in sales: meditation

>> No.29919250

>>29918643
I’m surprised more ppl here don’t know about it. It has serious /biz/ energy. Probably bc it’s on basedflix.

>> No.29919304

>>29919250
I swear I typed basedflix my mind is playing tricks on me lmao

>> No.29919354

Check out The UK's Most Hated Sales Trainer. Brass tax, down to earth kiwi based out of Britain. But ultimately many anons have said it. The product is irrelevant as long as your not selling garbage. Be open. Ask questions. Know a bit about everything so that words are lube. Offer something no one else can (bundles, freebies, incentives). Also check out Influence by Robert Cialdini. Good book on compliance techniques.

>> No.29919379

>>29919304
Onions flix keeps autocorrecting to basedflix what is this lmao

>> No.29919682

I’ll drop some value here, desus. Become a software sales engineer. Best role I’ve ever had. Comes without the stress of carry an individual bag/quota like that of a software sales rep, but you still get a very decent cut of the action in commissions.

>> No.29919863

You need to accomplish two goals:
Get the customer to trust you
Get the customer to find what you’re selling is valuable to them

Also best way to deal with customers who try to get negotiate with you is provide them options. Always sell the most expensive item and if they try to negotiate price just say oh if that’s out of your budget I have these windows that aren’t energy efficient that can fit in your price range. Customer cares more about product then price if you sell it right

>> No.29920094

start chasing pussy more

>> No.29920318

>>29916207
Make something up. Lots of places closed out of business last year/this year due to rona. Pick one and say you did sales there. Not like they can call the place up and check.

>> No.29920663

>>29906127
you have to be born a con man sorry

10 years in and I've seen kids make more money than seasoned vets because they just had it already

there's training that can make you competent, but nothing replaces natural sleaze

>> No.29921137

>>29920663
At 33 I'm old enough to realize that there will always be someone younger than me, and better at just about anything you care to mention. That's no reason not to search for something that I can be good at, seeing as I haven't yet found it. What else I should do, give up? In todays world, being the BEST at any particular thing is a really fucking tall order, as you have to compete with literally the entire world. The internet makes it so that the absolute top of every profession is a global arena.

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