[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/biz/ - Business & Finance

View post   
File: 36 KB, 510x612, 1368221100797.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
53229 No.53229[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

Is college an investment or a luxury?

>> No.53243

It's a consumer product that's virtually worthless.

>> No.53244

a waste
don't do it

>> No.53250

Something that provides a useful marketable skill is an investment, something that doesn't isn't.

But I wouldn't write off things like gender studies, philosophy as completely unmarketable but understand the market is much much smaller and less lucrative.

>> No.53253

>>53229
>Is college an investment or a luxury?

Neither, it's a right.

>> No.53257

>>53253
Ha
everybody look at him and laugh

>> No.53258

It's an investment, but for many it is a bad investment. I guess it could be seen as a lifestyle luxury for people who just want to fuck around for a few years too.

>> No.53320
File: 148 KB, 195x557, hmmcontaplating.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
53320

>>53253
This is some low quality bait, but it's really fun to smack down positive right pinkos.

>> No.53413

anyone else think the labour market is pretty bad at valuing education?

sure, Exxon probably have a pretty good idea of what a chemical engineer major is worth, but I feel there is much room for discrepancies when it comes to "softer" subjects

I'm an accounting major and since I started university we've had several people give lectures about what it's like being an accountant, controller or marketing professional and they all say the same thing: besides technical tools like excel, they've had little or no use of the actual stuff they learned in university. what they HAVE used from uni is instead the ability to learn and the propensity for analytical thinking.

so if what the employer is paying for is mostly this analytical mindset, aren't they missing out on alot of human capital that just happen to have the "wrong" degree?

>> No.53439

>live in a country with (almost) free education
>pay for a private university anyway because contacts
>pay less than most murricans but go to a top tier school
Feels good.

>> No.53446

In decent countries (with free education) is it neither, it is a necessity

>> No.53450

Investment if you actually bother. Luxury party if you don't.

>> No.53451

This only valid studies that justify attending university are science and engineering, along with math and economics in a lesser degree. Education should be a right, any country worth its salt will let its youth enjoy the feast of learning without financial burden.

>> No.53465

>>53439
Country? Cause from what I've heard in most countries with cheap public universities, private ones are looked down upon as places where you can just buy your degree and invest little to no effort.

>> No.53469

>>53320
b-but how am I supposed to rape her when she's asking for it

>> No.53484

>>53413
Yes, but they're not allowed to test for intelligence since 1971 (cuz das racis dawg) and therefore have to base it on your major and gpa which isn't a great proxy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griggs_v._Duke_Power_Co..

>> No.53490

>>53413
Wow, if you are an accounting major and don't understand what's the use of what you learn, perhaps you should pay more attention in class.

Get yourself an intership in audit, and you'll see.

>> No.53492

Went for a year, felt like a waste of time. Most of my friends have degrees and can't get jobs, so i'm just gonna work my way up someplace.

>> No.53499

>>53465
Germany. It works because
>state exams

>> No.53515

>>53451
wikipedia is free, virtually any book can be pirated, lots of experts will respond to a civil intelligent email. Everybody at this point can learn as much as they have the desire to

>> No.53534

>>53490
as I said, these people come from varying fields and I'm not even sure accounting is a fair translation of my subject

alumnis basically end up as anything from finance analysts, marketing people, sales people, HR-people, accountants, auditors and all kinds of managers in all kinds of business sectors

but sure, I get your point about auditing and that's why people who want to get certified has to take certain specific electives

>> No.53527

>>53229
If you're actually intelligent it's a great way to do networking in the real world.
If you're some stupid faggot who thinks you're actually learning anything there then you're wasting your time and money.

>> No.53542

I'm just wasting money here. I don't have the discipline to do any work.

I'm going to apply for a McJob next week and then drop out.

>> No.53550

>this fucking thread

This is why we're the laughing stock of the world, guys.

>> No.53585

>>53229
>Is college an investment or a luxury?
It depends. If you study something useful that your could realistically use to get a career (e.g. medicine, CompSci, Law) then yes it's worth it.

If you're studying something faggoty like a BA, or women's studies, or film and television etc then you're wasting your time and you're a fucking idiot.

>> No.53595

>>53229
Luxury, only useful for networking.

>> No.53605

>>53229
Depends on the field.

Medical? Definitely investment.

IT? Waste of time.

Art? Waste of money.

>> No.53612

You go to university to get a qualification. There's also networking, but that's not exclusive to a university.

>> No.53623

>>53542
I feel you
I hate school and my major, but I don't have the balls to deal with the fallout of dropping out. Plus I'm already in the red with loan debt.

and so I spend my days day trading and praying I get a break with these fucking cryptocurrencies

>> No.53624

>some people actually believe they could learn every subject on their own

>> No.53658

>>53624
That's because we actually did.

>> No.53661

>>53229
It depends on where you live that makes it either a luxury or necessity.

It SHOULD be a right, but in practice it's more of an investment.

>> No.53651

>>53605
>IT? Waste of time.

Wait, what? IT is very comfortable right now. You're still below programmers, but eh.

>> No.53653

>>53534

Sounds like "Commerce"

>> No.53672
File: 130 KB, 1134x1357, 1380332992030.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
53672

>>53605
>Medical
>A good long term investment

That quasi-state market is going to get a market correction within the decade probably.

>> No.53684

>>53653
my unis website list it as "Bachelor Programme in Business and Economics"

>> No.53818

Practically a necessity but only thanks to herd mentality and government intervention.

Not ACTUALLY necessary for most professions.

>> No.53914

>>53818
>most professions
like a McD customer satisfaction associate?

>> No.53931

>>53914
he's right
when you actually enter the workforce you will see how useless your college education is, all you need is the certification

>> No.53942

>>53257
>>53320
>honestly believing denying college education to the masses represents progress

>> No.53953

im in the process of leaving college to do some startup bootcamp things, i feel like things like these are 100% more beneficial than a college ever would be and it's done in way less time.

http://bootcamper.io/

>> No.53954

>>53942
>YFW some idiots who just go >uni >good in this thread

>> No.53960

>>53623
Good luck. I'm already preparing for my lower quality of life. I've already cried today.

Maybe I'll just kill myself. I'm worthless anyways.

>> No.53970

>>53942
>thinking natural rights exist
you crack me up

>> No.53975

>>53684
Pretty sure we'd call that a bachelors in business administration, which is as generic as it gets for business degrees. You would then major in something more specific
>I'm graduating in May with a BSBA majoring in management

>> No.53990

>>53960
Well that'd be a fucking stupid thing to do
If you've already made the leap and given up on ordinary life, you're in good shape. Now you go do things that will actually satisfy you as a human being instead of subjecting yourself to the tedium
Travel. That's what I'd do

>> No.53999

>>53975
what is the english word for the process of acquiring capital for a business? I might make that my major, or accounting

>> No.54003

>>53990
I have nothing that will satisfy me as a human being, as I inherently don't want to do work. This is why I don't fit anywhere.

>> No.54017

>>54003
>I have nothing that will satisfy me as a human being, as I inherently don't want to do work.
I never said to find a job that'll satisfy you. I know exactly what you mean. Find what *will* satisfy you

>> No.54041

>>54017
You can't do things without money. To get money I need a decent job, and to get a decent job I need to pass college, and to pass college I need to spend 40 hours a week studying, and I don't want to do it, therefore I'm not, therefore I'm not passing college, therefore I'm not getting a decent job.

>> No.54106

>>54041
Fuck me this is like having a conversation with myself

What's your major?

>> No.54117

>>54106
Computer Science.

>> No.54151

>>54117
Year? Freshman year comp sci shouldn't be that brutal. Considering any other fields?

don't sleep on non-STEM majors, that is my biggest regret and now I'm stuck in a school with garbage programs in everything but engineering and CS.

>> No.54154

>>53229
Depends
>what college
>what degree

Ignore the NO COLLEGE JUST HAVE SELF-CONFIDENCE ex-/pol/ fags, that's fine for certain career paths, but for a lot of high-earning areas you're going to need at least an undergrad under your belt to show you actually have some fucking idea what you're doing

>> No.54185

>>54151
It shouldn't be but now I'm fucked. I guess I could try for informatics but there's nothing I want to do right now so I don't care. I have to get all A's this semester or I go to community college.

I wish I had the motivation to do the studying and work required, but I just don't.

Hell, I can't even do my non-STEM homework. I have an essay that requires that I make a "Personal Narrative" of myself and I'm just drawing a blank.

>> No.54188

College is a right here.

>> No.54204

>>54185
That sounds like you're a loser, rather than that college isn't good enough.

>> No.54210

>>54204
That's the point I've been trying to get to for the past 5 posts.

>> No.54253

>>54210
Maybe you need a break. Seriously, I know of a lot of friends who had to stop and take a year off from college because they just needed to mentally recalibrate.

>> No.54272

>>54185
>Hell, I can't even do my non-STEM homework. I have an essay that requires that I make a "Personal Narrative" of myself and I'm just drawing a blank.
well that's because that's a stupid fucking assignment I wouldn't judge the whole of humanities and social sciences based on that

but yeah, I'm going through pretty much the same thing. I've been considering this
>>54253
and just taking a year off, especially since it's getting tough just paying tuition.

>> No.54326
File: 190 KB, 1200x659, deutschland über alles germany.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
54326

It's a human right

>> No.54395

>>53942
>honestly believing jacking up the price of college by convincing everyone they need a degree, and providing them with loans even though they have no qualification for one, thus immensely increasing the demand for an education while only increasing the supply by as many chairs as you can pack into the same classrooms represents progress

>> No.54413

>>53229
College is an investment. Having a college degree helps both an individual's earning power as well as his overall productivity.

IMO, college should be paid for through taxation, as an educated populace creates a positive externality--the more educated our society is, the more we are able to progress in terms of science, wealth, productivity, and culture.

>> No.54490

>>54413
I could get behind that if we were very discriminating with regards to majors. The economic argument falls through when you are funding educations that will not make us more "able to progress in terms of science, wealth, productivity," as that money is plainly wasted.

I omitted "culture" because it is not something that can be meaningfully measured in any capacity

>> No.54518

My computer engineering degree is definitely an investment.

I'm also graduating without debt because my co-op jobs allow me to fully pay tuition and save some extra.

So college can definitely be worth it depending on what you take.

>> No.54541

>>54518
School?

>> No.54558

>>54490
>i get to decide what is waste and what isnt
Protip: Almost every university course exists for a reason. People are not born to work and die, philosophy and art make a huge part of human cohabitation.

>> No.54584

>>54541

Simon Fraser University

>> No.54600

>>54558
if you want to say we should fund higher education publicly because it produces a positive externality you can't ignore that most of the funding you are advocating is not going to produce a quantifiable positive externality and cannot be justified with your reasoning. It's not my arbitrary will that says it's waste, it's your reasoning.

I agree there is value in the humanities, but it's neither quantifiable nor economic. We should foster a society and culture in which these things are celebrated and promoted, but we should not direct public funding toward them.

>> No.54616

>>54600
>it's neither quantifiable nor economic
Sony Music and Hollywood says something different. Please, stop talking your slavemonger bullshit out of your ass.

>> No.54612

>>53229
investment for the wise, luxury for the foolish

I fully intend to repay my parents 10 years down the line after I get my undergrad in MIS, masters in comp sci and MBA

>> No.54632

>>54490
Culture isn't quantifiable directly, but happiness can be through survey's, etc..., and happiness is a by product of all the things I listed.

The reason I listed culture is because certain degrees contribute to culture rather than the previous three. An art or philosophy degree doesn't usually create wealth or productivity or scientific innovation, but it gives a country an edge culturally. When people have a sense of culture and identity, productivity rises.

>> No.54640

>>53229
Depends on where one is going and what they are going to it for.

>> No.54703

>>54616
>Sony Music and Hollywood says something different.
yes Lady Gaga and The Hunger Games are clearly the most culturally and artistically valuable works of 2013, this is why they made the most money.

>>54632
I'm not saying that humanities degrees are totally worthless, I am saying that their economic value is nigh impossible to calculate. Any figure you conjure up by looking at "happiness" is going to be incredibly unreliable and I would not feel comfortable relying on such a nebulous figure.

we cannot meaningfully determine the happiness output of an artist, so any time you're crafting policy and deciding how much money to allocate to these programs you're flying blind and will inevitably waste resources
if you advocate providing education regardless of the field of study, then the policy is wasteful prima facie. inefficiency isn't good.

>When people have a sense of culture and identity, productivity rises.
intuitive, but source?

>> No.54757

>>54272
i dunno this was literally me about a year ago, i dropped out, moved in with my parents and treated my depression. you should probably do the same kiddo. and also find something you like. just because you spend a lot of time on the computers doesnt mean its exactly your thing, but the online world is a plethora of information so circlejerking with yourself that nothing exists for you is a waste of time when you could be trying something out. college isn't for everyone and if you haven't read the thread, it's considered a farce by many. don't get hung up about failing on a large scale for once in your life

>> No.54762

>>54703
Anon please, take for example Arts, Sports and English. Ostensibly they have little to no financial value but when no one can study it without taking huge pains and paying it all for themselves but you still need someone to teach this in elementary, middle and high schools where it is integral.

If you're so fixed on hurr durr productivity just fund community college and leave your fingers off the higher education, you clearly missed the point of your own.

>> No.54791

>>53229
Which country are we talking about? Is it only the U.S?

>> No.54812

>>54762
>If you're so fixed on hurr durr productivity
now you're just being dense. I've acknowledged the value of the humanities in like every fucking post, but it doesn't mean government can form sound policy when we have no reliable metrics to quantify the benefits. That is the reality of the economics of what you are proposing.

>> No.54820

>>54812
In case you're too thick to notice by this point, I'm not that guy.

>> No.54841

>>54820
I knew you weren't >>54616
but how was I supposed to know who >>54762
is

>> No.54851

>>54841
Maybe you should stop assuming you know who the other guy is on a goddamn anonymous imageboard.

>> No.54886

>>54253
What different would a break make? I'd still be lazy and a loser when I come back.

>> No.54965

>>54851
that's the annoying part about trying to argue a point on 4chan. it feels like im getting attacked from all sides if i make a quip, as i cant distinguish anybody. maybe IDs should be used to allow conversations to flow easier?

>> No.55036

>>54965
No, if a point requires attackign it should get attacked unjudged by who is doing it. That's the point of an anonymous imageboard. Try reddit if you want pseudonymity.

>> No.55046

I'm going for an Economics degree, think its worth it or worthless?

Mainly doing it because I work in marketing and I need to sharpen up my numbers/math/statistics game up more. I've worked in digital marketing for a while, but couldn't find good jobs with a 2 year degree in it.

>> No.55059

>>55046
>I work in marketing and I need to sharpen up my numbers/math/statistics game up more.
sounds like finance or accounting would have been better than econ

>> No.55077

>>55059
I can't believe you fuckface decided to trip now. Get the fuck out.

>> No.55087

>America

>> No.55107

>>55077
ok

>> No.55133

>>55059

Econ is a req for finance, if I can get into the program I'd probably go for finance. I don't want to get an accounting degree because it'll lump me into being hired as an accountant during the hiring process instead of a creative guy with expertise in numbers too.

Other option is statistics, or statistics with quantitative models (if I can handle the math & programming, probably not)

>> No.55158

>Major in finance
>Can't fathom to work 9 to 5 in an office together
>Literally nothing I'm passionate about

I think I have two options here either fuck off with a degree and just do nothing until I get some motivation or power through my degree and do an extra 2 years part time to become a teacher.

I don't live in the USA so I could live off being a teacher and I could invest some money since my living expenses are next to none.

>> No.55198

I'm going to college because I want to learn and improve myself. It makes me sad that more people don't think this way.

The job opportunities are really more of a bonus for me than anything

>> No.55206

>>55158
>Literally nothing I'm passionate about
My problem exactly
I like to think I would have the balls to ditch engineering and pursue my passion if I actually had one

I think I'm just gonna go through the motions and graduate with a bad-not-terrible gpa and figure this shit out after that

>> No.55247

>>55206
Don't wait till it's too late. With engineering at least you can find some decent money and then take a break when you are 30.

>> No.55270

>>55206

>I think I'm just gonna go through the motions and graduate with a bad-not-terrible gpa and figure this shit out after that

You're going to be fucked once you get out of college, go talk to career counselors at school or get out and do an internship or something off the wall. Audit random classes at school, don't waste your time going for a degree with no direction.

>> No.55291

>>54812
I'm >>54632
not>>54762

he's arguing via ad hominem attacks and being a douche.

I do understand where you're coming from as far as quantifiable productivity gains, and I don't have a source for culture increasing productivity. I came to my conclusion from an intuitive reasoning perspective.

When looking through history, one can see that productivity rises when a sense of national culture and identity as well as a sense of individual identity rises. Rome went the way of the dinosaurs once the sense of "I'm a roman and that's my identity" was lost. Rome was incredibly productive, both economically and scientifically during its golden age. Once it lost that culture, it lost its place in the world and became economically and scientifically insignificant.

I'll continue to search for a source regarding culture and productivity, but I understand that intuitive reasoning is a weak argument and thus I'm not surprised you're not convinced.

On a different note, Id's would be a good thing for this board. I guess I'll trip until then.

>> No.55305

>>53527
>If you're some stupid faggot who thinks you're actually learning anything there then you're wasting your time and money.

People like you are the ones ruining education

University is not a job training center

>> No.55319

>>55270
well my real big mistake was going to an engineering school where everything but the engineering program is garbage (minus the OK business school)
the bright side is that I really am virtually guaranteed a job after graduating from this place. I *can* just keep going and graduate and get a job and at least get out of this mess with a valuable degree and a "good job" until I earn my way out of my loan debt

>> No.55330

Nobody is entitled to go to college and I don't think everyone actually benefits from going. The government shouldn't be allowed to set rates or fuck with admissions policies but it should prevent misleading advertising by universities.

>> No.55374

>>55291
Chicken and the egg, I think. Art is a luxury, when you have a productive populace and a healthy economy you have more time and comfort for things like philosophy and art. There is something of a hierarchy of needs there.

>> No.55388

>>55319

What school?
are you at SUNY Maritime ?

I have a friend who just finished an engineering degree, he did find a good paying job as soon as he got out.. It works for him though since he's a vanilla dude. If you can live a life where you're probably going to work at a fixed income, let's say $50-60k starting, and gradually move up, you could be content..

>> No.55391

Luxury.

It's like a big brothel.

>> No.55453

>>55388
yeah I know that the problem is that I'm already pretty sure I wouldn't be content as an engineer
but I know it would handle my loan debt and I'd at least have a good income while I figure the rest of my shit out

>> No.55530
File: 19 KB, 625x626, B8 gate.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
55530

>>54612
>I fully intend to repay my parents 10 years down the line after I get my undergrad in MIS, masters in comp sci and MBA

9/10 almost fell for it

>> No.55727

>>53499
I wish I lived in Germany. They really seem to have their shit together as a society and I'm pretty much 100% German living in Wisconsin so basically the only thing I'm missing is the language. We've still got some of the culture.

I might take a trip over there someday to see what I've been missing out on while being trapped in this American greed scam called my life.

>> No.55879

>>55727
Oh god, is this what Japs feel like when weebs decide to come over to their "true" homeland?

Nigga pls, you're American. Take this one: a basis of German society is the complete monopoly of force by the state. "The militia" does not exist and if you'd try to set it up you run the danger of getting to jail. Think again.

>> No.55975

>>53515
Yeah, I think the internet and technology has really changed how society works and how people interact with each other.

Traditional education models are archaic remnants of an underdeveloped society. It's about time for massive changes in education. The everybody is equal and deserve to be treated equally doctrine needs to be challenged. Mostly because some people treat education much more seriously than others and treating those two groups equally lowers education standards and frustrates the people who actually care because classes are forced to move slower for the people who dont care for education.

their differences when it comes to talking about education comes from the seriousness with which a certain person approaches their education. either take it seriously and get a lot out of school/college or take socialization seriously and you wont get a lot out of education. Not to say either of those approaches are wrong but implying everyone approaches school equally is incredibly silly.

>> No.55996

>>53492
This is sorta what I'm on now.

It's hard knowing what to do with my free time because I really enjoy learning things. It's just, what is worth learning? In a broad sense, I guess. Not just things that physically can improve my life.

>> No.56047

>>55975
Did you hear of the Gemran school system

After 4 years of elementary you get split three-way: Hauptschule for the underachievers, Realschule for the middlers and Gymnasium for the top scorers. The first boots you out after 6 years and tells you to become a carpenter or a baker's apprentice or something, the following boots you after 7 and enables you for community college, the last lasts for 8 years and enables you to university.

Works breddy gud.

>> No.56092

>>53953
yeah this is the kind of stuff I want to start looking into. The internet makes education sooo much more interesting and accessible. Shits crazy

>> No.56133

>>53253
Public school was a right, too. See how well that turned out?

>> No.56177

>>56133
>fuck the school system up terribly
>THIS WAS A TERRIBLE IDEA GUISE BETTER LET EVERYONE FEND FOR THEMSELVES
jesus you're thick
there are nations where it works out just fine, you know

>> No.56251

>>55879
haha, yeah, one good thing about America is we're not all caught up in long ass historical narratives. Being such a young ass country/landmass really allows us to do whatever the fuck we want with few cultural repercussions since we left most of that geographical/cultural bullshit behind in order to practice true "freedom".

Ironic how oppressive American "culture" has become. it's reinforced by social stigmas instead of by the state. "freedom" is now defined by what is "socially acceptable" and things that have become "acceptable" have been twisted by small, self-interested groups who have attained massive communication and marketing abilities over time.

"Freedom" in 2014 means some pretty dark, twisted, and ultimately restrictive social policies now exist in America. And things are pretty fucked for people in the margins of society nowadays. If you're not similar to those powerful, self-interested parties then enjoy having your freedoms stomped on by way of crazy intense social stigmatization.

>> No.56271

>>56251
>not all caught up in long ass historical narratives
>constitution is 300 years old
>german grundgesetz is 60 years old

>> No.56301

>>56047
lol and this guy was just giving me shit for praising German society >>55879

Yeah that method sounds pretty dope. Would have weeded the underachieving-in-high-school scum early on and I never would have had to deal with their bullshit because "they deserve an equal opportunity like anyone else."

Sure they should but not at the expense of my opportunities to get some actual get some real education done instead of having to wait for their disruptive asses every day in class.

>> No.56317

>>56271
Germany is older than its constitution
(so is America)

>> No.56325

>>54886
nigga take a year off and get fit
not giving a fuck and generally being unmotivated are signs of depression
try to deal with those before you aimlessly wander through school and end up with a mediocre gpa and no internships

>> No.56344

>>56271
I'm not saying we dont have old historical documents. I'm saying we're not caught up in traditional geographic boundaries and long passed grudges the way Europe's shit is put together.

Europe's history is much longer and bloodier resulting in much more in grown hate and ignorance for opposing viewpoints.

>> No.56364

>>56047
>>56301
The joke is: That very school systems has been critized for the last ten years by the German left wing.

I try tro counter it as much as possible.

>> No.56373

>>56301
Those posts are both from me. I think both of those things are positive. I don't want to live in a nation where every gung-ho dumbfuck thinks he's above the law because he says so.

Incase you didn't add it up yet, I'm the guy who plays a Paladin with total conviction in D&D. If you want Germany, cut down the Freedom and write in bold, print 72 letters LAW and ORDER. And I love it.

>>56344
It's been smoothed out after WW2 very well, the EU literally works wonders, The only fucknuts are Russia for obvious reasons and Britian because they still have delusions of grandeur about their empire.
>mfw Scotland wants to secede
Pfffahaaha

>> No.56492

>>56373
Law and Order is dope so long as it equally applies to everyone. And in America that's not at all the case. /r/pussypass illustrates this very clearly if you're into reddit at all.

Government has a role in protecting freedom but people seem to get that backwards a lot in America. They're always trying to protect their freedom by eliminating government (like industrial regulations and food regulations etc). Sure some regulations can be overbearing and restricting but most are in place to protect the average American and consumer. Not every person has the time and resources to investigate every product they consume and how that consumption affects that consumers life, environment, and society as a whole. The government is in place to do all that dirty work for them and ensure that the products being bought off the shelves meet many safety requirements ideally defined by science.

Law and Order is dope so long as it respects every person equally.

Lol at Scotland wanting to secede. GB is getting messed up in some really unusual ways in 2013/2014

>> No.56557

>>56492
>Law and Order is dope so long as it respects every person equally.
Another caveat, German GG says "in front of the law, all people are equal" instead of the "all men are created equal" from the constitution. This leads to no AA for example.

>> No.56764

>>53446
Fucking this. Thanks government run schools.

>> No.57337

>>54584

shittiest school ever

>> No.57597

>>57337

Why do you say that?

>> No.57670

>>53413
you're a first or second year accounting major, right?

>> No.57700

>>53229
Both, it all depends on the person and what they are learning. It is an investment in that it can pay off later in life (even if it doesn't it's not necessarily NOT an investment, just a really poor one). Then again maybe you aren't pursuing a degree, maybe you want to learn something else. Maybe a language, or just want to dabble in something?

>> No.57924

What's the best degree to go into and why is it engineering?

>> No.57969

>>53605
You are partially right. IT can go from "Have you tried turning it off and on again?" tier to youngest billionaire ever tier.

>> No.58003

College is not what you think it is.

Is Going to College Worth it?: VICE Podcast 031
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMAm2u_J50g

>> No.58024

i think most people need to take a step outside their class/strata bubble- so that way they can realize that the so called "college experience" varies extremely from class to class.

take one of my more well off friends for example- parents had already been paying a hefty tuition for a private high school so their checkbooks/"liquid income(? i'm not sure what the proper term is?)" had already become accustomed to setting aside money for school at the expense of say, not having a pool/nicer car. for someone like them, access to a rigorous high school means they can become competitive to top 10 universities. their parents value education and thus there is a mutual agreement that a fuckton of money would be set aside smartly for their kids future. i cannot say this for my working/middle class friend whose parents insist on local state school because the price tag of a private school intimidated them. they're reasoning was that "people like us don't belong in _private university here_" and that kind of thinking- that kind of willingness to follow their parents path even though the american middle class is eroding is going to cost them years of attempting to get their careers started in the long run.

what people need to consider is seriously taking a look into finding out what works personally for their own financial situation. i've known too many people who were felt pressured into making a decision that was good for others but not good for them. i know lower-middle class asian kids whose parents convinced them to take out massive student loans because "state school would make them loose face". i know people who had straight a's but spent most of their free time working min wage and was surprised when "real" employers wanted internship experience. evaluate your weaknesses and plan ahead is what i would say to incoming freshmen.
(btw since when did 4chan create a /biz/ board, i only found out that it existed today)

>> No.58205

This thread hasn't helped me at all. I still want to kill myself.

>> No.58474

This is my first post on /biz/ so be gentle.

I'm planning on doing a BA (HONS) in Business Studies. I've no idea what I'm doing with my life, though. I want to start a business but I'm dirt fucking poor, luckily in the UK the student finance system is very generous and liberal, so I'll have money then, though I'll need it for education.

Is it worth it? Should I dive into the world of business and hope for the best, or should I do the three year course and have a BA? Or should I simply do a 2 year HND at my current college?

I'd love someone's opinion

>> No.58544

>>53229
An investment. I'm investing 18k to become an electrician that'll have a return of a high paying job that's in demand sounds like an investment

>> No.58545

>>53229
>Is college an investment or a luxury?
Neither, it's an essential, just like food and water.

Why? Because if you have any hope to get a job in the coming job market, you have a skill or talent. If you're a skill-less worker, you might as well immigrate to Asia and compete with the locals for sweatshop labour. Otherwise, all jobs in the west will, in under 30 years, require some sort of skill or talent. It could be installing cabling or hedge funding, whatever it is, you need to be able to do something 99% of people you bump into on the street can't do... or you're a welfare leech on your country.

BTW liberal arts and sociology clearly don't teach any specific skills or talents, so don't fucking bring them up.

Also, neither do your last two years of high school, these should be simply removed with the idea that 16 year olds make a choice then and there to either go into a trade/apprenticeship or go to university, which is doable because you don't need the last two year of school for a trade and they reteach you everything of relevance from high school in your first and even second years of university, with the idea that foreign students have education systems so bad that they weren't taught.

>> No.58882

It's an investment in yourself. So, if you suck, don't do it!

>> No.58917

>>58474
Go to a uni with a decent society and relations to employers.

>> No.59041

>>58545
>>58545
I don't think college is very essential for service jobs. Or transportation jobs. Or hard labor jobs.

White collar, yeah. Blue collar, no. And there's not much wrong with blue collar if you know how to sacrifice in order to save money and don't make terribad life decisions like having kids when you're in high school or driving like a maniac or wasting money on drugs or lottery.

It's still surviving which is better than starvation.

>> No.59078

>>59041
>service jobs
Retail is automated, trades are a skilled job. Janitors can stick around, but the number of jobs which are unskilled and can't be automated are in the handfuls, likely we'll give them to kids and students looking for extra money in the future.

>Or hard labor jobs.
Automated as fuck, even now you need qualifications to operate a forklift.

>> No.59180

>>57924

Engineering. And because it's awesome.

>> No.59195

>>58024

state schools really are the best

>> No.59218

>Is college an investment or a luxury?
no

>> No.59229

>>53942
>something is expensive
>"YOU'RE DENYING IT TO THE MASSES"

>> No.59287

>>55391
I'm not enrolled but I live on campus and fuck college girls for free.

>> No.59471
File: 1.90 MB, 3200x2200, businessnigga.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
59471

So,
I am really interested in business but I'm not educated at all, I dropped out of college when I was 19 and I am now 23 (just turned).
I don't have a passion I want to pursue but recently I've been interested in marketing, especially since people said my creativity can fare well there.

Which direction would you guys point me in to check some shit out?

>> No.59495

>>59471
Self-educate, self-employ.

Maybe learn to develop websites with JS and HTML/CSS?

>> No.59639
File: 197 KB, 560x332, 1392691338705.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
59639

>>59495
Anything else than just make websites? I have a friend who is making websites.
I heard you can make some good money off websites and sometimes even sell them?

>> No.59988

>>59639
If you want to be in "marketing" I'm assuming by that you want to be in advertising of some sort? Unless you're one of those annoying wannabe PR types who hawk people on the streets and other awkward shit?

If the former, the most profitable thing I can suggest is that you design websites, along with logos, themesongs, etc. As a guy who codes things very similar to websites (apps), the most obnoxious people involved are the people who draw shit up in paint (or worse, colour pencils on a napkin) and expect you to design it, especially when they expect stupid shit that can't actually be coded easily, like minor features that'd take up like 80% of the code.

So, I suggest you learn CSS/HTML, Javascript and maybe Python, if you want some server side code. Everyone needs too learn to code these days bro, everyone and no exceptions.

>> No.60000

>>59988
I can't code but I do logos. I'm a very artistic person but I don't want to do art in university.

CSS/HTML, where can I start for those?

>> No.60025

>>60000
Even artists need to know how to code.

>CSS/HTML, where can I start for those?
Ask /g/ and scour through the gentooman library.

In the meantime: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL697D36B35F92E9E4

Also, to design fancy websites, you need javascript.

>> No.60188

>>54188
>The college is right here.
I fixed your grammar, college boy.

>> No.60320

How useful is a business degree?

>> No.60376

>>60320

not at all

>> No.60407

>>60025
>to design fancy websites, you need jquery

fixed

>> No.60416

>>60320
Might as well start working and get on-the-job training. I mean, if you want to learn nothing, then go ahead. I hear all the rich kids with no fucking clue what they want to do go this route.

>> No.60429

>>60407
I'm not a javascript dev, I'm a C, assembly and Java dev, because I'm in engineering and not in marketing. I know lots about C and assembly, a bit about Java, and lots, lots on DSP.

>> No.60473

>>53672
medical innovation is always going to be worth money. the only thing that's in danger of ending is the racket that doctors and pharmaceutical companies have on extorting money from sick people.

>> No.60501

Worthless unless it's a STEM field. Go learn a trade and earn some money there.

>> No.60692

>>53651

IT is extremely competitive, even low tier help desk jobs are hotly contested. Good luck trying to get a job in the field especially in a tech heavy area

>> No.60718

>>55530
Only one response...thought more people would fall for it

/biz/antines are smart

>> No.60863

>>54117
>Computer Science.
>>54041
>I need to spend 40 hours a week studying

What the fuck? That's the most piss easy degree you can get these days. You should kill yourself for being that stupid

>> No.61023

>>56177
Which nations?

>> No.61072

>>58474
>Business Studies

What!?

Find the thing you want to do for the rest of your life and start doing it seriously. all you really need to worry about is making it legal, through registering, and avoiding government from throwing you in jail, though budgeting and taxes. You'd probably get more business experience talking to some store manager during breaks.

>> No.61100

>all these people paying for university
If university costs less than $x, while taking y*hours and increases your wage by >$z it is worth it.
if y>x/z^2
then university is worth it
Q.E.D.
.
E
.
D
.

>> No.61306

>>58024
>(btw since when did 4chan create a /biz/ board, i only found out that it existed today)

See the time stamp on >>1

>> No.64256

>>61023
>Try All Of Scandinavia

where grade school - college is free

>> No.64276

>>54612
kek

>> No.64427
File: 14 KB, 324x298, friedmanlaugh.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
64427

>>64256
>free

>> No.64491

University is good for a piece of paper that says you know how to do some basic shit.

The problem with University is you have kids coming out of it with no real world experience and thinking they're a fucking genius because they aced their exam, then they get a job in their industry if they're lucky and have to learn a shitload.

Probably the best two things about University for me?

Getting laid and networking with people in the industry already.

>> No.64596
File: 29 KB, 525x368, 1392710431758.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
64596

>>64491
>University is good for a piece of paper that says you know how to do some basic shit

It was meant to be a prestigious finishing school for wealthy families, it's degenerated into high school 2.0 run by welfare queens.

>> No.67437
File: 409 KB, 1297x1080, 1372107077340.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
67437

>>64491
>getting laid in engineering school

>> No.67623

>>60473
>the only thing that's in danger of ending is the racket that doctors and pharmaceutical companies have on extorting money from sick people

Why would that end any time soon? Get paid hundreds of thousands of dollars by private medical firms to create a medication so they can mark it up 700% and get a return in the first 3 years. If they don't get paid enough, they get the fuck out. It's that simple.

>> No.68957
File: 13 KB, 220x264, adhdface.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
68957

>>67623
The problem with politicized markets, they can pop or stagnant around forever, you get a lot of regime uncertainty.
Every generation or so they 'reform' healthcare in good ol' USA.

Most people do not trust pharmacy drugs, they see them as white coat dealers.
It's only a matter of time before this resentment comes into the political arena especially as gen Y comes to power and boomers become more senile.

>> No.69059

College is literally the best place to learn marketable skills. 99% Of kids that attend college don't take advantage of the things that they pay for. Rather than take a class that will be challenging and help expand their skillset they will take some easy shit just to get the credits.

Also, when you pay "tuition and fees" - you're paying for more than the class. You're paying for literally all of the resources available at the school. Help areas, libraries, recreation areas, social areas, cafeterias, career services, clubs, etc are all included in the cost of attending class. 99% of student DO NOT EVER use these things. They are there specifically to help you improve your career placement once you graduate and hook you up with internships while still a student.

School is crazy affordable right now too but people are too fucking stupid to realize it. I posted this in a similar thread yesterday.

2 Years at community college. In-state tuition will be no more than $100 per credit hour. BA's are 120 credit hours total, so your first 2 years are done at CC, which totals $6,000. That's less than 6 months worth of work if you are working minimum wage. Then you transfer to a state institution for your last 2 years. Assume tuition is $250 per credit hour (it's usually much less), that will cost $15,000, bringing your grand total cost of college to $21,000 + books of course. $21,000 spread over a 4 year period is $5,250 per year. You have to be poor as fuck or lazy as fuck to not be able to afford that.

>> No.69285
File: 146 KB, 722x835, 1370210648780.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
69285

>>69059
>community college

Welcome to your new home.

>> No.69388

>>69285
What part of "Bachelor's Degree from a state institution" are you missing here?

>> No.70947

>>53413

College became the standard thanks to Griswald V. Duke Power, where it was determined that companies couldn't use broad-spectrum IQ type tests because of disparate impact.

A college degree served as a very good proxy of IQ at that point, so companies started requiring degrees for positions that previously didn't.

This drove more people to college because it offered a clear financial benefit. Colleges were happy to have more paying customers, so they let more people in.

This lowered the correlation between intelligence and work ethic and a college degree. The corporate world responded by requiring a degree for more positions, even trivial secretarial work. The degree still has screening value, it just has value at a lower threshold than it once did. They also started requiring specialized technical degrees for more positions, because those still show fairly strong correlation with IQ/work ethic.

Are they missing out on highly-skilled people with the wrong degree? Sure. However, the screening value of a technical degree is great enough, and the costs of creating DI-proof testing schemes are high enough, that most firms aren't willing to change just for a few stragglers at the edges of the market.