"having a job" is a scam

[Anonymous No.55711039]

you're expected to give your employer the utmost loyalty and dedication but they can turn around and fire you for any reason whenever they want

[Anonymous No.55711046]

>>55711039
whoever pays calls the shots, why is that so hard to understand?

[Anonymous No.55711048]

I'm a union worker I can't hear you behind my AFL-CIO Wiengartien rights.

[Anonymous No.55711058]

>>55711046
The ownership class actually risks very little outside of monetary compensation and even then the very worst that can happen to them is they fall into the rungs of the working class.

Workers on the other hand actually risk life body and limb so the whole "well muh HECKIN investment areno" argument is actually incredibly lame.

[Anonymous No.55711134]

non union getting paid more than management.
I made them 3 million. This is fine because it is possible in their structure to make this profit for them.

I cannot use my labour to make 3 million alone without taking advantage of others in some way or keeping it from those who have less. They could also replace me to make a similar or relative amount.

What is irreplaceable that you are bringing? they made a system, as shit as it is. they made a structure. thats their end of the bargain, bring something in and sign it or fuck off to a commune.

You would have been a farmer in the bloc. Look up what happened to them chief.

Anyways, buy cobalt.
Australia is about to announce investments for cobalt recovery methods as well. could be a good long term fix if you put the work in.

[Anonymous No.55711140]

>>55711039
It's very simple. Everyone is a contractor. If you lack the means of production to provide a service or produce any products, you are contacting your time to another entity that does.

[Anonymous No.55711223]

>>55711058
If you don't like the conditions don't do it. Why is this even an argument? It's not like somebody is holding a gun to your head. If you think you know better work for yourself. Why do adults need hand holding?

[Anonymous No.55711267]

>>55711134
What do you think they did? You think they laid out the blue prints for a production facility or something? Everything that was invited during the industrial revolution was invented then. All they did was invest capital they also exploited off the backs of their laborers. Hell the people managing the operation I work for are so Incompet that they keep sending us kids that should be working at McDonald's rather than experienced mill workers. One kid lost his finger not to long ago actually.

Where as workers actually know what they are doing because we, you know, work on the floor and actually do the job so I still fail to actually see your point.

[Anonymous No.55711283]

>>55711223
>Slave or be homeless bro it's not like some one has a gun to your head.

Such a lame argument made by midwits. Doesn't even justify a response.

[Anonymous No.55711358]

>>55711267
go make me 3 million then.
i literally gave you a tip and a chart that you could convince investors to fund you 3 mill right now.
Yeah they stole a good idea, what did you do?

no you dont know what youre doing, obviously. you know what i allow you to know so you dont fuck my compartmentalisation.
put in the fucking work you little bitch.

oh they should send me experienced workers? who got experience where exactly? stop trying to claim monkey work is a skill.

maybe you shouldnt be fucking shit to work near? maybe safety starts with you. maybe you couldve looked out for your fellow man. let alone a kid who couldve used your experience. how did it happen on your watch super hero? get your fucking house in order.

but for real for a socialist you sure have no concept of social structuring.

bring something to the contract and sign it.
if thats your labour and thats all you have to give thats fine, but ill compensate you accordingly. the same amount as i could spend to find your easiest replacement. Bring more value and get more value.

If you provide more value and receive less then its a duty to withhold it.

thats fiduciary duty. not socialism. you dont need to reinvent the system. you just need to learn it

[Anonymous No.55711374]

>>55711283
bring value to a partnership or be partnerless when a better option is found.

no one has to settle for you.

[Anonymous No.55711382]

>>55711283
You sound like you can't respond to it. Is this true?

[Anonymous No.55711505]

>>55711382
I did respond: Be homeless or be a wage slave isn't an option that is actually worth anything. I currently have the best job in my whole town and we still are way under paid for the work we do.

[Anonymous No.55711536]

>>55711505
So if people didn't own these businesses, who WOULD own them exactly? There's a public park near me. I can use it any time I want. But its paid for by property taxes, so everyone who owns a house is forced to pay for the park.
How would ownership of the means of production function if it wasn't private?

[Anonymous No.55711554]

>>55711505
So what are you going to do about it?
Why isnt be more successful by constantly and consistently setting up opportunities for growth?

Just do tiny little things every day until youre capable of the bigger tasks.
You seem so fucking useless. But i know youre better than this.

If you grow up now you can take advantage of the reduced opportunity cost that accumulates the longer youre an immature little cunt.

[Anonymous No.55711570]

>>55711358
We literally do make you 3 million. How are you not understanding this; Labor is and always has been the superior of capital and the later could not exist with out the former and the former deserves much the higher consideration.
Again you clearly don't understand what you are talking and neither do the retards you think so because again I don't have to lie or make up shit like you do I literally see it. Even menial work like this does take skill not that you would know but hey I guess if it doesn't take skill go ahead and slab reels of paper 12 feet long and thread paper in-between two rollers spinning 2000rpms with air.

The kid who lost his finger actually lost it because of a guard the company itself knew about yet failed to install again after it broke off and that's why he lost his finger. Maybe the company shouldn't be so cheap but I guess that's the nature of capitalism
I mean since it's so easy and what have you, kek.

[Anonymous No.55711572]

>>55711536
everyone, or no one.
a revolving elected body of independent and autonomous senate.
Y'know the monty python joke. This is hardly the big question.. Like we have common land and common property in law. its just that. public property..

[Anonymous No.55711597]

First post and and already a bootlicker.
Tons of capitalists like him that think being a boss means you can abuse your employees and pay them minimum wage.

[Anonymous No.55711609]

>>55711570
but you didnt tag it out.
or insist that the workplace be up to that standard.

so you went and did something worthy of becoming an associate or partner in the company? YOU brought that 3 mill in BECAUSE or YOUR skill and not theirs or their systems.

no the problem is you.

and yes. i could get anyone to do it. and id pay them a dollar more to replace you. just because i dont think i like your attitude and its effect on the workers around you. but i cant afford to waste more time argueing with someone that claims a purpose made tool that literally does one thing. is a skill mastery comparitivly to multistage operations.

i need to forecast when youre going to crack it and take a sick day or try and maliciously comply so my timelines and averages add up.

and no. they made the 3 mill. you were just there. why are you irreplaceable specifically?

if you are then all you have to do is ask for more money. nicely at first. if theres no compliance and you are actually essential then you can demand it. period.

[Anonymous No.55711733]

>>55711570
ok. fuck it. simple this time.
you didnt invent air entrainment.
the machine is designed for air entrainment.
its humourous that a monkey could fuck it up and then say they know better some how.

make a better guidance system, get compensated, get good. or just keep being a sook. its not up to your manager.

its up to you to be undeniable or start your own shit. what kind of a man lets themself be managed by a man.
thats fag shit

[Anonymous No.55711759]

>>55711039
But do make sure, before you leave, you give the Boss your standard

>two more weeks

[Anonymous No.55711769]

>>55711058
>ownership class
This is why I prefer to play a wizard

[Anonymous No.55711789]

>>55711733
Well come bud. Go sign up to work on a paper machine that make spaperboard. Make sure you keep us updated and tell me how well you do it since it's so easy.

[Anonymous No.55711802]

>>55711733
>Guidance system.

See you really don't understand what you are talking about. The only way to make paper and thread paper into a paper machine is to do it by hand. There is no guidance system. There can't be one. Also if your air hose gets caught in a perpendicular rollers nip and you are on the wrong side guess who goes with it?
Not the CEO that's for sure kek. You are not only a dumb ass you have no idea what you are talking about and clearly have never done actual work in your life.

[Anonymous No.55711805]

>>55711039
yeah but I need money

[Anonymous No.55711825]

>>55711223
>If you don't like the conditions don't do it. Why is this even an argument?

most people don't have the luxury of that decision, they must earn or fall into ruin.

[Anonymous No.55711875]

>>55711789
why?
i have skills

btw im gunna need you to recertify and VOC your colleagues.
https://www.osha.gov/sites/default/files/publications/osha3170.pdf

shit you cant?

well fuck i guess i shouldnt pay you more to train, or observe safety or create a better systems and processes as an ops man.

homie. i dont need to.
why put poison in their meals when a bit of coin will have them oiling up the wheels.

you are wrong. thats why i dont need to fear you leaving. Labour comes AFTER capital.
otherwise gobekli tepe would probably be intact.

compartmentalisation is required. if one of the unqualified hit one thing they shouldnt they damage plant. thats actually my concern. not your fucking fingers. worst a finger cost me is downtime and 180k fine.

fuck yourself. i got bills too.
See that first paragraph.

yeah if you actually know how to read that say YOU THE WORKER need to highlight the incidence around you or I AM INDEMIFIED faiap

[Anonymous No.55711914]

>>55711802
reeeeeeee but muh technical. i dont need to work a machine for a living. i can make them, people pay for it. show me a plan and redline the issue area. ill consult if you actually want a solution. but i have minimums outside my curiosity.

did you invent the machine? if so then you can fix it.
if not then operate the fucking thing like you were told.

homie. i dont need to reinvent your job over a basket forum. yeah you know your role better than i.

im telling you that unless YOU get better YOU are there FOREVER.

Look just pretend theyre on your side. how can you enable them to help you best. if theyre dumb guide them. if theyre incompetent train them. if theyre malicious let the fair market take its course and leave.

[Anonymous No.55711923]

>>55711609
Lmfao tag out a running Fourdrinier. Lmfao.
God damn you are so dumb.we only lock out tag out the machine when we work on it and do maintenance.

All I hear from you is "blah blah blah blah"

[Anonymous No.55711927]

>>55711914
We have millwrights that doball that shit again you are coping super hard Mr ceo

[Anonymous No.55711948]

>>55711825
then your options are work hard and MAYBE suceed. which yes. can suck, but you are hopeful and open.
or
dont work hard and defiantly fail. which is a guarantee of sucking more because you'll ignore the opportunities which could go your way.

[Anonymous No.55711960]

>>55711948
I can literally smell the crust boomer ear wax over this post.

[Anonymous No.55711976]

>>55711923
didnt you just say it wasnt fit for service becasue of a guard defect and thats why it hurt someone?
have you even read your documentation?

i'll give you a hint. you dont need to be a sparky to isolate equipment or plant. its actually your duty.
if you didnt see if coming just sday you fucked up.
if you did see it coming that speaks for itself.

[Anonymous No.55712015]

>>55711960
sounds like youve got me dude.
the third sentence i made itt. you still haven't touched.

and since you've told me that you are henry himself then sure youre right. you deserve some of the credit for the means of production.

im sorry you dont have a skill or and outlook that can forsee any hopeful prospects. i pity you. but i've just been trying to help.
sorry if ive upset you and made it personal somehow.

[Anonymous No.55712028]

>>55711960
btw. just on this outlook.

whats your alt superior take? i'm genuinely curious.

[Anonymous No.55712034]

>>55711058
Yes, choosing which vegan bagel your Californian startup will have in the cafeteria is a high-risk job. Your brain, cock or both could explode.

[Anonymous No.55712036]

>>55711976
>He still thinks you can just stop a paper machine.

Really go look up how paperboard is made. The company knew about the guard defect for MONTHS and did nothing about itm this is normal behavior though: Blame the individual and not the company at all costs. We loose limbs and fingers but retards like this will constantly go on about "muh risk" Also I enjoy my job and I do it proficiently I'd much rather be a worker than a parasitical owner.

[Anonymous No.55712053]

>>55712028
Well I'm a socialist bud.

>>55712034
Yeah service industry workers deserve a living wage and respect too because not everyone is lucky enough to have a production job like me. Most people aren't actually but that is besides the point and another conversation all together because capital flight has resulted in lower productivity in the United States. You should read the thread before posting.

[Anonymous No.55712062]

>>55712053
You probably work in the service industry yourself and are roleplaying as a late 19th century/early 20th century factory owner. Get with the times, gramps.
Also, if you're a socialist, what the fuck are you doing in a board called "Business & Finance"? Isn't owning a business the most evil thing one can do?

[Anonymous No.55712070]

I hate working for (((employers)))
It's such a jewish practice, including but not limited to the sociopathic application and interview process, whereby you have to jump through hundreds of (((hoops))) all for the privilege of getting some awful job that you're going to hate anyways.

[Anonymous No.55712082]

Anyone who is stuck in this system and wants out, I suggest you just take advantage of your employer and rip them off as much as possible, because that's what they're doing to you. They do nothing but lie and manipulate, control you with fear, and psychologically abuse you. Do the same to them.

[Anonymous No.55712091]

>>55712062
Nope I work at a papermill.
RTFT
Believe it or not socialism involves economics and I also invest in my Roth IRA and 401k so why wouldn't I be here? I've been lurking 4chan probably longer than you have known about it.
Finance and economics are similar but two different fields. Do you think this isn't the place to talk aboutnwcon though? I'm genuinely confused and baffled at how it's possible to be this stupid, frankly.

[Anonymous No.55712132]

>>55712070
Interviews are the worst. Only a woman could enjoy them.

[Anonymous No.55712156]

>>55712036
so youre admitting to operating without isolation

y'know you can work for yourself and be both. in fact thats how every success story that wasnt a trust fund gimme happened.

>>55712036
yeah. you use your fucking words and demand safe working conditions.

cunt i have guys who are 300 kgs at work. ya dig?

i was once a young man who had his hand jammed in the roller conveyor for the "largest belt in sth hemisphere"
I was fortunate that I had guidance from mature colleagues who helped us find a better way when it was clear we wernt up to standard.

im lucky that it wasnt a serious pinch. and no the company would have blamed me.

guess what. its on me to leave and find a place that suits me and my skills.

all those fuckers were missing teeth too. but the machines didnt do that.

i offered a consult if you send a spec and outline the issue. you danced around and got personal not me

systems design is holisitc. it isnt us vs them.

yeah management needs you. they need you to be good and at least hitting the bare minimums of care.

how many days since last incident? should always be zero.

what you had no near misses to report?

shut the fuck up, improve the process.

the only thing you've said is
>its more profitable for companies to expend my time and body and those around me at the sake of their profits and downtime.
and i like that. Im just hoping that you've meant to say something, missed it and are going to cover it. youre talking shite generally. unless you give specifics we cant discuss the specifics

[Anonymous No.55712185]

>>55712053
thats not an answer.
its not even a witty cop out.
please answer the question at least somewhat intelligently. being facetious isn't exactly holding up your argument here. i mean it sort of proves my points no?

[Anonymous No.55712186]

>>55711039

Lol, you want what they have, but clearly if you got fired, it didn't work out the other way around.

Why do unskilled morons seeth when they come to find out how undesirable they are? News flash, Billy, "loyalty" is not a skill. They aren't paying you for being punctual.

[Anonymous No.55712222]

>>55712186
yo but i am. they are required to be punctual.

but i also pay for literally every thing they buy. so its cool, i can expect minimum standards

[Anonymous No.55712256]

>>55712186
they do want loyalty though, and to be able to shitcan you whenever, what he says is a fact.

[Anonymous No.55712269]

everyone knows that capitalism doesn't work and only leads to misery for 99% of the population, but left wingers are all mentally insane schizos and pedophiles and right wingers are so brainwashed by cold-war anti-USSR propaganda they unironically think there's only full bootlicking of corporations or food tickets and gulags, no in-between. just accept that civilization is fucked and resistance is not possible anymore and just try to survive. steal, lie, gamble, manipulate. try everything you can to escape wagieness and make sure your kids can have future. that's all you gotta do

[Anonymous No.55712287]

>>55712156
Papermills are one of the most dangerous industries on the planet. You really don't understand the amount of labor time and moving parts it really takes to produce paper. OSHA has it's own set of regulations specifically for paper mills. So yes we have to operate the machine in close quarters with out locking out the machine because you can't. It isn't feasible to the operation to lock out tag out the machine when you hay out or go off the reel. It's just not possible. What happened was the guard from the load line was missing where you drop the reels on to load into the winder to cut the paper to size and the new guy stuck his hand in-between a spring and it sliced his finger off because finger + 4ton roll of paper does equal good results. You were the one being a prick first so don't cry when people throw it back at you.

Accidents are going to happen and yes people shouldn't be stupid but the first step in safety is having a safe work place which is required by LAW my guy. But companies don't want to take accountability because it isn't profitable and cucks like you just cuck out for them because you are cucks.

Also companies exploit labor by doing no work of their own but bleeding labor out of the worker to return a profit. Our CEO made over 900k last year while we received not even a fraction of that.
You can lead a horse to water but can't make it drink: The only thing a company cares about is profitability thus accidents happen more often and individuals are balmed every time. It isn't rocket science.

>>55712185
Let me spell it out for you: Workers should control and own the places they work collectively not CEOs only interested in the generation of profits.

[Anonymous No.55712311]

>>55712287
>Workers should control and own the places they work collectively
Ironically, this is totally possible RIGHT NOW. If you took a typical office job in America, and told all the workers to quit and pool their resources together, they'd be able to run their own operation RIGHT NOW.

Whether or not they're successful is beyond the scope of your argument, since your argument doesn't explain any fail-safes in the event that not a single one of the workers has any kind of leadership or strategical thinking capabilities.

[Anonymous No.55712361]

>>55712287
sorry dude. to me you are functionally illiterate.
if you dont read it then to my eye its the same as being incapable of reading.
whether its intentional or ignorant it looks the same to me.

yeah it really isnt rocket science.. you are projecting.

you fucked up. all you have to do is admit it.
if you were a responsible adult and expected to live around mature adults. that kid would be ok.

just act like the man you say you are.

>Our CEO made over 900k last year while we received not even a fraction of that

if you cant see the solution then its on you.

TAKE THE CORE TEAM
if youre essential youre essential.
which means you ARE superior and can therefore leave and outcompete.

the law states that YOU have a place in a safe workplace. you did EVERYTHING you could to prevent it.

look if you dont respect yourself and want to work in complacency then do it.

kids have had their hands fucked since before the 1800s and will after the 2040s. im sure the rate is increasing

[Anonymous No.55712384]

>>55712311
>since your argument doesn't explain any fail-safes in the event that not a single one of the workers has any kind of leadership or strategical thinking capabilities.
then just give them bailouts like the US government does for Big banks.

[Anonymous No.55712393]

>>55712287
>What happened was the guard from the load line was missing where you drop the reels on to load into the winder to cut the paper to size and the new guy stuck his hand in-between a spring and it sliced his finger off because finger + 4ton roll of paper does equal good results.
and nothing could possibly be done.
it was impossible
it was unfeasable
it was too hard
it wasnt hard but it was lunch
i was lazy

you gunna sue me when you couldnt wipe nuggets from your ass too?

how long did you say you've worked here again?

[Anonymous No.55712409]

>>55712384
Cool it with the antisemitism.

[Anonymous No.55712492]

>>55712409
>>55712384
shut it down.
it's too close to making sense.

sorry to be political. but could i poll the thread on the current dictatorship they support is?

[Anonymous No.55712538]

>>55712492
>but could i poll the thread on the current dictatorship they support is?
Idk I never voted in my life
I don't think governments should provide every little thing to their citizens, but I do think they shouldn't be openly hostile to their own citizens either

[Anonymous No.55712612]

>>55712538
i just mean over the last week theres been some interesting developments regarding democratic processes in the outlands.

for example ukraine suspended voting until the end of the war and suspended political opponents

niger just had a coup removing a western friendly head of state.

blinken is in aus talking some made space billions and guided missile launch sites.

putin is in africa currying favour with china and western enemies.

just interested in the penetration of certain messaging

[Anonymous No.55713748]

>>55711572
Sounds pretty dumb ngl.
If you don’t like your job just quit.