/cgl/ - Cosplay & EGL

I'm one of her patrons and overweight myself, I'm almost down to my goal weight and honestly it just felt like more excuses. It really is CICO and I don't like the perpetuation of that being a myth, especially with this being so purported as "researched fact". I'm just waiting for LWLN to return to normal. That image is rather upsetting though, I can understand why it caused such a reaction in her. Lolita really can make you feel like that, but so can clothes that don't fit you in general.

>>10423284
>It really is CICO
then whey does low carb work so much better for some people?
Those are facts she's stating. Like do you have better sources other than your own anecdote?

>>10423284
Yeah, you are totally right. I am not overwheight but im on steroids and have to watch for my weight.

However, Tyler is right, that it's not others business and fat people probably know already they need to lose weight and 1000 ways to do that

>>10423281
I've thought about it alot, and if your a medically heathly BMI I don't care. I hate the fat mentality that your one weight and you can never change that.
When it comes to lolita if you really are dedicated than you'd put the effort into yourself your body to suit your fashion.

I see the same amount of skinny shaming as fat shaming in lolita. not my fault I'd rather spend my money on brand rather than food.

>>10423284
No i'm sorry its not excuses, some people just can't lose weight and you might be one of them. You gain nothing from being inconsiderate of the situations of those less fortunate than you.

>>10423291
...Are you joking? Low carb diets follow CICO, the goal is that you end up eating less because you're not eating carbs, which don't feel filling. You still eat less calories than your TDEE, and you lose a lot more at first by virtue of how the diet works. Please look literally anything up before trying to one-up people.

>>10423296
>Low carb diets follow CICO
No, not all of them. You can actually get a lot more calories out of protein and vegetables.

>trying to one-up people
That isn't what's happening at all. We're all trying to have a discussion about this because cgl is notorious for fat shaming out of "concern".

Tyler poked some serious holes in that ideology.

I think the main problem of fatties in lolita is that they dont love themselves.
They dont wear makeup, don't do hairstyles, they wear wrong lingerie, they choose unflattering and ill-fitting clothes etc

I've been pretty consistently fat shamed here from when I was 95lbs to 180 so I take most of what online lolitas say with a grain of salt. I've been working hard to getting to a place where I'm happy with my body, mostly because purchasing dresses that don't fit feels awful.

I definitely also participated in online fat shaming when I was much younger. I've noticed AP has been making a lot more full back shirring items the past few years, which is great.

>>10423281
She says “why would someone take care of and nurture something they are made to hate?” but an obese person is already not caring for and nurturing their body. The self destructive and self loathing is already there, it doesn’t just magically go away someday as long as someone’s weight isn’t pointed out. I don’t believe fat shaming in itself is the entire catalyst for a person continuing their unhealthy lifestyle but more of an excuse used to justify its continuation.

Shaming of every kind exists especially kinda where it involves something about a person that they can’t change. Weight can be changed but the ones who don’t and would rather cry and scream “fat liberation!!!” are just weak individuals that care mire about everyone else changing for their own unhealthy benefit. It is narcissistic to me.

>>10423281
gonna ignore your questions because I don't give a FUCK about watching any youtube video linked here but answer with my own

>Have you ever weight shamed someone
I think being skinny, average chubby, and even a *little*overweight is fine. I don't care. Its your body, do what you're comfortable with, people arent going to really turn heads at you for these weights. even for all the shit folks gave PT back in the day I think her weight was "whatever" despite cgl calling her a hamplanet

when you are so fat everyone around you is visibly revolted, you have to lift up your rolls in order to properly bathe, you are fucking GRODY, you probably stink, everyone around you is displeased by your appearance.
when you are so skinny you look like goddamn Skeletor on a bad day, you need some fucking help.

I'm not even gonna pretend I hate obese people and people who are just sticks and bones out of concern for their health, I just find them fucking disgusting, and everyone else does too.

The only person I fatshamed where I was geniunely concerned for their health, Momokun. She's in this cycle where she eats and eats and eats, gets lipo, then goes back to eat and eat and eats some more. That is deeply concerning and disgusting at the same time

>>10423298
Not that anon but CICO works, no matter what you are eating. If you're eating garbage however you're gonna feel like shit and most likely end up with other health issues but you will still lose the weight.

>>10423305
>an obese person is already not caring for and nurturing their body.

Yes and she even talked about what may lead to this, the point is that fat shaming won’t help anyone become healthier or even thinner, instead, it only makes everything worse. Also, we should be minding our own business instead of going out of our way to make someone else feel bad.

I don’t even understand why we are so bothered by fat people. Yes, sometimes I think people are ugly, but this is my problem, not theirs, I will shut my mouth about it and keep it to myself. It sounds so entitled when others talk about how they feel about other people bodies and that they have the right to shame others into looking the way they think would be more pleasant for themselves. I’m sure a lot of people think lolitas are freaks and would be pleased if we looked different and that you would be offended if they told so to your face.

>>10423307
Momokun is developing a rather unique body as a result of constant weight gain and lipo though. She will end up looking completely different from any other woman.

I think this is good as a novelty for the world to have, mostly because I don't care about her personal well-being.

I was underweight for most of my life and made fun of for looking skelly with my ribs sticking out and all that. Then a few years ago I started on antidepressants which helped immensely with my mental illness, but caused rapid and significant weight gain. It completely fucked up my appetite. Now I'm overweight and people shame me for that instead. That honestly hurts a lot more than being teased for being skelly, because now people assume things about my personality like I must just be lazy and have no control, rather than considering it's a medical/neurological reason.

>>10423281
„too many are feeling left out for not fitting a standard that the majority of this country does not live up to“
Japanese fashion isn’t made with fat fucks in mind and that’s it. Saying to burn the system down is retarded.
Let’s be honest, which normal bodied person that actually fits and likes lolita would stop supporting the main brands because they don’t sell circus tent sizes?
As a designer/brand it is their right to make what they want wether you agree with it or not. Don’t buy it if you don’t like it or alter it to fit you if you insist on wearing it still but don’t cry when the artists vision looks like trash on you after all the effort.
As long as there are japanese, chinese and non-hambinas to support the designers they will keep on making what they want.
Also forcing brands to make plus size shit without proper plus size experience or passion for it will only result in hideous results.

>>10423313
Right? Overweight is average and normal in places like US/UK, where the average size is 14/16. How can people be so bothered by something they will see in half (or more) of the women in their country on a daily basis? It's not rare and shocking like a deformity.

>>10423313
It actually takes a toll on the healthcare system. When you're fatter, you're going to have more health issues. So many obese people are on welfare and taking up beds in hospitals. Several companies will have weight loss challenges because healthier workers means paying less insurance. If you're chubby, that's fine but getting big takes it's toll on everyone in the long run. I agree we shouldn't fat shame but we shouldn't encourage being fat either by telling them they look good as they are.

I'm not sure I agree with everything she said but I like how she presented it. I wish more people aimed to educate others on their opinions like this, I mean the information is presented in such a way that even people who are against her should easily be able to gain insight into the her mindset and that's really nice change from the snappy "do your own research" or "it's not my job to educate you".

>>10423291
In some instances people who have insulin resistance or over production of ghrelin find a reduction in simple carbs to help. With those being controlled helps curbs fatigue, hunger spikes and creates a feeling of satiation. CICO works in a general way if we exclude extreme health circumstances like Prader-Willi syndrome, cushings or the many other thyroid conditions that mess with retention and metabolism. Tyler wasn't focusing on that one aspect in a bubble but how it works in tandem with other factors.

>tldw
Tyler is the last person whose opinion I'd care about on this subject. I'd rather watch nutritionists speak on the matter. I didn't watch her video but I can hear her preachy screeching in my head regardless.

I wish body positivity and mental well being mattered at all to these left-tubers. The health at every size movement and demanding xxxxl sized lolita dresses isn't helping anyone. I'm sick of this us against them mentality, fatties and skellies are both ill and should work together to achieve health and happiness.

>>10423281
I have EDNOS (IDK if anyone considers that a legit ED diagnosis) and the image almost made me not eat tonight, I won't lie.....

I see why it triggered Tyler so badly. CGL especially has a really fucked up perception of weight, and calls people fat a lot. It's not helpful. Most of the people CGL calls fat isn't even that big, and those that ARE fat know they are, they don't need reminding.

I wish people would learn to mind their own business, especially if they aren't the person's doctor, and worry about their own weight.

>>10423353
It's not that CGL has a poor perception of weight, it's just used as an insult like incel, manlet, DYEL, troon, roastie, etc. It's just name calling and since almost all women are concerned about weight and self-doubt, it's ""effective."" Gulls will call one girl fat and another one fine who both have the same body shape just based on what they think of them.

At one point in the video, Tyler complains that brands make clothes to fit the average body type of women in Japan/China. She then goes on and says "if they want to sell to western markets. maybe it's high-time they pretend western bodies actually f------ exist."

I absolutely hate it when the same people talking about fat-shaming don't understand that the above statement is also body-shaming. I'm a Hispanic/German mutt of an American and brand sizing is a godsend for me. For years I hated my small frame because western clothes hung off of me like rags. I never "filled out" clothes properly and I hated it.
I shopped in the Junior's section and I can still wear a children's large/x-large t-shirt. As much as any other westerner, I also have a western body. Did I luck out in the genetic lottery by having a 28 inch ribcage? Probably. But pretending that brand sizes are inaccessible to western women is entirely false. Saying that brands need to change their sizing to accommodate western bodies completely overshadows a large group of western bodies that do fit brand and have felt too petite their entire adult lives to fit into "women's clothing."

TLDR; Claiming that all Western bodies are too big/fat to fit brand is also inflammatory and harmful to an entire group of women that find solace in brand-sizing after never fitting into burger-land clothes. Come at me if you want, I guess.

>>10423359
not only that, but it also body and fat shames asians. many larger or taller asians have trouble finding clothing because brands refuse to acknowledge they exist, even normie brands. why not mention that?? i wish people who spoke on these subjects understood more about the topic. not even just tyler but lor's recent video was the same level of laziness.

>>10423359
The notion that brand could never fit a western body is partially what triggered the onset of my eating disorder as a teenager (back in the LJ era when brand was harder to come by and brand sizing wasn't well documented.)
All I read online was posts telling me I'd never fit my dream dress with a normal western sized body, and I was so impressionable I trusted without question. I starved myself for years and still subconsciously worry that I won't be able to fit, even when I'm swimming in huge AP bodices.

>>10423359
The average american body size has just turned into a balloon fetish cartoon and the only way to cope with this fact is to force the narrative that it’s the norm on the world

>>10423359
I feel the same. I've filled out a little as I've gotten older, but when I initially got into Lolita, at least 20% of the reason for it was that Western clothes made me feel pathetic. Nothing fit me like it was supposed to except for children's clothes and it really affected my self-esteem (and worse, any time I expressed sincere frustration over this to someone they'd laugh and say something like "that's a good problem to have"). Lolita clothes were the first clothes that really felt like they were meant for me.

Having said that, I don't bear overweight Lolitas any ill will whatsoever. I do think there's a lot of unnecessary animosity towards them over something that is not anyone's problem but theirs and I understand that it must be hard to feel so excluded by a fashion that you feel like you're meant to be in. I just wish people could express that without saying things like "there's no way for any Western adult figure to fit into this stuff!". I know it's silly, but it does bring back bad memories of being in clothing store changing rooms and feeling like I couldn't wear anything without looking like a child dressing up in their big sister's clothes.

>>10423359
I'm a tall woman, the fact the only clothes I like will never fit me, unless I were to starve myself (even when I was 10lbs under a healthy weight, clothes wouldnt fit, 15 lbs underweight or more, clothes fit)

since I was 12 I dreamed of going to Japan and wearing cute clothes from shibuya 109, but when I showed up and realized nothing would ever fit me, I just cried.

I feel like I will never be seen as feminine or cute based on my height.

If brands made sizing that even were just a bit bigger, an american medium or large, I could fit. But they don't most of the time.

>>10423372
If you really wanted it you’d have stuff altered.

>>10423374
Yeah just multiply the existing fabric Jesus style, that’s how alterations work.

>>10423374
I've heard this one before, not insulting you for reccomending it to me, but I'll tell you my issue: you are reccomending I purchase something and.. add extra fabric, which most likely wont match the original garment because I tend to like patterns and prints.

Hey, if you can tell me how to do so without looking like shit, I'm all for it. But most people who do that to dresses are put into ita threads for a reason.

>>10423372
What is your height and what are your measurements? I know a couple of lolitas close to six feet tall that fit just fine, they just have to understand what cuts works for them and what don't.

>>10423365
It was pretty bad at the end of the video when she sited that 70% of adults are overweight, justifying her previous comments. I'm not sure how that's good supporting evidence. Just because a majority of people are at an unhealthy weight (due to factors within or outside their control), it doesn't mean we should accept it as a new norm.

>>10423377
Waist ties!!! Fuck them — hand them off to a seamstress, she can take out the seam and that’s a genuinely decent swath of perfectly matching material

>>10423384
The alternative is revolution, or at least major economic reform. Realistically, yes, this IS the new normal, unless you’re ready to tear down capitalism entirely.

>>10423379
I'm 6'1", main issue is broad shoulders, wide ribcage, and most tall women have a longer torso, but of course, height too.

My issue is
>broad shoulders
No OP has ever fit, only JSKs will work. The lolita blouses I have purchased (even going for larger sizes on taobao, have ripped in the shoulders.)
>wide ribcage
now that I'm at a healthy weight (honestly stepping away from jfashion helped me gain weight), things don't fit without shirring
>longer torso
where things will normally hit women on their natural waist, all lolita dresses (even larger sized ones) hit me directly under the boob. babydoll ones start about above my boob
>tall height
things are laughably too shot, sadly underskirts look bad with prints, OTKs fit me mid calf.

It makes it very hard to coordinate things.

I've tried customizing things from taobao, but a lot of them get confused by my measurements and height, and don't lengthen the torso area despite my requests. My personal favorite was when I had my translator tell them I was tall, and they got very confused, and sent me a garment that was.. 30 inches flat. I think they mixed up being tall with being heavy haha.

Even most western seamstresses have difficulty with lengthening bodices as well. I usually have to shop around for a very long time to find someone capable in doing such, and that's just for purchasing custom normie clothes (for example my prom dress, graduation dress, bridesmaid dresses) so these people wouldn't be capable of making decent lolita dresses or cosplay.

I appreciate your offer to help and sorry for the wall of text, its not often I get something more than the generic "get it altered" "get it customized" "just wear an underskirt" so I got excited

>TLDR: I know what works on me and still struggle, I wish I could find someone to custom make jfashion garments that wont fuck it up

>>10423281
some obese lolitas look really cute in fully shirred AP, and if you're a bit too big for that there are lots of places that do custom sizing but most girls who are super over weight seems to neglect appearance like how to make their hair and makeup look good. for these people they would look bad with or without the weight. I dont ever fat shame people directly but ive asked question here that probably sound super dumb and ignorant like why cant people just stop eating? boredom eating and eating to sate your hunger (when your used to eating a lot ) is like an addiction and would be hard to quit cold turkey but if you just cut down closer to your daily required calories instead of like double that like. the people i know who say they have thyroid problems or something and cant lose weight due to medical reasons all bake sweets literally every other week and go to meets to eat macarons and cupcakes. you cant snack on chips and soda between every meal, and get a frap with whipped cream at starbucks every day on the way to work, and say that youve done your best to try and be healthy and just cant because your have a chronic illness. i feel bad and dont mean to but it makes me think likethey dont have self control to save money and not impulse buy or commit to learning a difficult skill or instrument or language

>>10423374
you know that tailoring clothes is easier when you need to get them smaller?
Just like >>10423376 and >>10423377
said, altering a bodice to make it fit not only a larger but a taller person is a pain in the ass

>>10423359
everybody has their own problems, but why is it o hard to understand than some have it harder than other? Being small as a woman is nothing compared to be a short man, or a forever fat woman.

>>10423391
Here's hoping.

>>10423392
Dude here, and I love tall women! You need to embrace this and go full amazonian. Also maybe get into sewing? I'd bet good money if you made things that fit your size youd have a market for it.

>>10423295
Everyone can lose weight. If you are literally incapable of losing weight with CICO then you literally defy the laws of physics and need to be studied in a lab.

>>10423359
I hate it when people in my comm go on and on about how Asian women are shaped like little boys and if you have an adult woman’s body you can’t fit brand. It’s only body shaming if it’s your own body type I guess.

>>10423393
I’ve lived with, been friends with and been related to many obese people over the years and to be honest, all of them overindulge in junk food. No exceptions. They just have excuses for why it doesn’t count somehow like it’s a cheat day, they deserve it, they need it for their mental health, they’re “feeling faint”, other people are doing it, etc. I know so many people who won’t eat fruit because “it’s full of sugar!” yet have no problem getting sugary Starbucks coffee several times a week because they say they need the caffeine. I’ll never forget the lolita who shoved all the vegetables off her plate at dinner and then dragged us all to Dunkin Donuts because she was still hungry. Of course she claims her weight is genetic and that she eats healthier than anyone else she knows.

I do think it’s an addiction and these people deserve sympathy and understanding, but saying that out loud is considered shaming too.

>>10423401
thanks for the market you have a cock, no one needed that. Also the anon doesn't need to get into sewing, I'm almost as tall as her and there are certain brand dresses that fit me absolutely fine. I think we should have a tallita discord or something.

>>10423404
Overeating CAN be an addiction. No one thinks that's shaming, it's called having an eating disorder.

That said, I know several people who are obese because of medication containing hormones/steroids and it can make a person balloon up so fast. Not all obese people are obese from just food reasons.

>>10423402
Everyone can lose weight. Not everyone can lose weight and become more healthy. Health does not always directly correlate to a lower weight, everyone has a different weight that their bodies function best at. I agree that many people have health issues and bad relationships with food etc etc and DO need to lose weight, but it’s not always a direct positive. Some people could lose weight through CICO and it make them weak and emaciated.

eat less lose weight

>>10423384
Do you understand what the word "norm" means? If the majority of people in a society are x thing, then x is the norm.

>>10423281
how old is she again

>>10423359
That's weird. I have a ribcage of 67cm and I've never had trouble with clothing being too baggy. Is this more of an issue with American clothes sizes compared to U.K./European clothing sizes?

>>10423406
Many people won’t acknowledge that they’re overeating and will treat it as shaming if someone points it out, no matter how kindly.

>>10423359
I’m sorry to hear about your experience, but I really don’t understand how this translated to you as body-shamming. She didn’t said thin is bad or even implied it. I also am western and have a very petit figure and what she said was very clear to me: if you want to sell to a public in which the majority of people don’t fit your sizes you are doing something wrong. It doesn’t have anything to do with us, we are fine, we fit the clothes.

I watched this. Her video didn’t tell me anything I didn’t actually know already but I understand completely. That doesn’t mean I haven’t fat shamed in the past and I’m sure I’ll still have fat phobic behaviors in the future to work through.

Anyway, I am overweight, but fortunately I am no so far gone I can’t fit brand. I can tell you it completely is lifestyle related. And not just “I ate too much crap.” I did, but there were reasons behind it. For me, it was stress. Anyway my life is different now and I finally have the motivation to eat properly and have been. Lost 3 kg so far this month. Do I hope to fit some smaller dresses? Definitely. But in the end I am talking better care of my body so I’ll just accept whatever the outcome is.

>>10423281
Tyler has been insufferable for a year and if she gets any fatter her double chin will be tragic.

>>10423281
FINALLY A FUCKING NEW VIDEO

>>10423281
That gull that done this drawing lurks here

>>10423359
That isnt what she meant and you know it. There are plenty of people who fit into brand. We all know that. We also know that the majority of brands pattern their stuff to a body type and look that is common in japanese body but not in other cultures.

She isnt saying fuck you if you are skinny. She is saying hey lets make clothes fit the market better. Most other clothing companies do that by making multiple sizes, lengths, cuts, and a plus sizes line. It isnt revolutionary to think you can do this in lolita. An easy example is VM and their pencil skirts, they are just flat out made for people with no asses. That straight cut skirt was also popular in Larme. We dont have that in the west because our pencil skirts are made to fit people with thighs and asses. You can fit that waist measurement but be too curvy for that japanese cut on those skirts.

>>10423443
Read about ethnocentrism and realize you are doing it.

>>10423448
They aren’t saying that brands should just cease to create smaller pieces, just make more sizes. Taller Japanese lolitas must have the same problem, and brands just ignore them.

>>10423442
I'd be more surprised if they didn't.

>>10423443
Who is buying the most new brand? Probably Chinese and Japanese lolitas. Why should Angelic Pretty and other brands make larger sizes if most larger sized people aren’t buying direct from them?

Anyway, there are also Japanese brands that do make larger sizing and have done so for years. Meta’s sizes are often very generous even in old school years, and MAM has their lovely size line. Not to mention all the Taobao customs and western indie brands. Nobody has to wear Angelic Pretty or Baby to be the perfect lolita, and people need to change that opinion.

>>10423443
This argument has been made for a long time and I don't disagree in principle, but is it viable? Most Japanese brands are fairly small operations, which is why the size range is so small. For this reason, historically when larger lolitas have been accommodated by Japanese brands, it is almost always at the expense of smaller lolitas, because they simply don't have the capacity to make that many different sizes.

I'm not trying to be shitty here, I genuinely think it would be amazing if people of all sizes could easily find brand that fits them, but I'm sceptical that it can actually happen.

Wasn't going to comment on the video because both sides of the argument tend to be set in their ways, and everything that I can say about this has been said before. BUT, the idea that brands should cater to such a small percentage of bodies in their buyer base makes me upset. I remember when everyone shat on moitie for their sizes, then moitie releases stuff in larger sizes, and majority of their larger sizes stay IN STOCK. If an XL or XXL doesn't wanna spend money on new brand, sure as hell a XXXXXXL won't. People want change but then won't put their money where their mouth is, they just like to complain then never support or go to replicas, because they rather spend money on quick, cheaper gratification items. There are obviously overweight and obese that buy new, and I respect them a lot but let's be honest they are a very tiny minority within a minority. I'm 100% fine for catering to larger sizes, I have my own personal biases towards obese people, but seeing them doesn't bother me, and if they put in the effort to look good like everyone else does then I'm actually really happy to see them be a part of the fashion and thrive. But a lot don't, no one wants to put in the money or effort. Some have valid reasons for not looking good, look into the ACE study, idk if Tyler mentioned that, I didn't watch the whole video yet.
They mocked VM when it first closed but then they let IW almost die. They won't listen to available cute options like MAM, (some) Physical Drop, Enchantilic Enchantilly, etc etc. Fuck even most modern AP from what I've heard. It's really hard to still be empathetic when there's so much available already, when there's options to make change, and they don't take it but continue to complain, and at some point it just feels like enabling, for lack of a better word, to still be empathetic in lieu of all of this.

>>10423450
What >>10423454 said. It's great in theory but not feasible. Even if so, the act itself of expecting one culture to adhere to and play by the rules of yours is, anthropologically speaking, ethnocentric. That anon and you need to understand that westerners are by and large secondary participants. This is coming from someone who would fucking love to fit VM and MM. I'm not the target and I'm ok with that because I and by extension the West is not the center of the world

>>10423460
My point is not super clear so it may help to frame it with a hypothetical with less personal stake involved.

Imagine there is a fashion scene and clothing made somewhere in Africa. The fabric patterns and cuts are to the taste and bodytypes of the African market. You just so happen to learn about it and start importing it to wear. As time goes on, you decide you don't like the way the cuts fit your body type or that the fabric clashes with your skin. You demand that the clothing producers make stuff for you even though the primary consumers can't/won't wear it. While it would be nice to include you, their production is limited and it's a tradeoff. As time goes on, more non-Africans get into it and start inserting their specifications until it morphs into something no longer African.

>>10423442
And this was the caption that came with their post on Tumblr

>>10423310
well CICO doesn't work for me or anyone I know.
Low carb can work without exercise.

>>10423307
>gonna ignore your questions because I don't give a FUCK about watching any youtube video linked here but answer with my own
It's just a Tyler video jackass, chill out.

>>10423322
>When you're fatter, you're going to have more health issues
not necessarily true.

>Several companies will have weight loss challenges because healthier workers means paying less insurance.
That's not usually how that works. Most places will give you a set amount that they pay and then you pay the rest.
But that's just in the US - maybe you're not here and it's done differently where you live cause it sounds different based one what you're saying.

>>10423468
They don't HAVE to do anything. I'm not fat but I have boobs so I buy pieces with shirring (such as Meta) so they fit better and also buy Taobao/indie brand. Knowing how to choose things that fit your body or lack thereof is not anyone's fault but that person's. I rarely see fat people with fitting clothes mocked, js.

>>10423359
>Claiming that all Western bodies are too big/fat to fit brand is also inflammatory and harmful to an entire group of women that find solace in brand-sizing
But that isn't what Tyler said at all and she even talked about how she had an eating disorder too and how she's NEVER been fat.

>>10423384
>Just because a majority of people are at an unhealthy weight
Did you miss all the points where she talks about research and how it's not always "unhealthy" when you see a fat person?

>>10423401
>You need to embrace this and go full amazonian
fuck off fetishist

>>10423442
Jesus. The art is good but I can't imagine being so miserable and insecure to spend time on drawing this.

>>10423454
>they simply don't have the capacity to make that many different sizes.
how come small western brands have the capacity to do it then? What is the excuse now?
You're telling me a company like AP doesn't have the money to do this?
Bull fucking shit.

>>10423484
They have completely different production models

>>10423457
>They mocked VM when it first closed but then they let IW almost die.
those are both brands who make nothing but tiny clothes. If their sales were dropping, then you can only blame the thin people who also weren't buying from them. So that's besides the point.

And when Honey Cake came out there were SO many girls complaining that it was too big.
I still have screen caps from that fillymemes bitch going off on fatties from the HC release.

>>10423460
Mostku that >>10423484, AP and other popular brands make a lot more money than you think, and honestly lolita isn’t as expensive as everyone claims it to be. It’s not high fashion scope, and nobody expects them to do custom sizing, just a little more choice.
They already have custom made lace and fabric, if they just made 1/4 of their usual release bigger it wouldn’t make much of a difference financially. How come brands could do few sizes in the 2000s, but can’t now? If bloodbaths are still a thing, they can expect that whatever they make will sell, but they only do one size and they don’t even try to make more for one release. What’s the point in making clothes that are either too small or too big, like they recently do?

>>10423487
Here's they "they're trying to cash in on fattys!!" screencap

>>10423486
Why is it acceptable for a company to make this excuse, but when fat people have good reasons for being fat, everyone just says it's an excuse?

>>10423487
Innocent World makes 100 cm dresses, they aren't consistent with sizing anymore but when they do a shirred release with a S-M-L the L is decently big for westerners. Won't fit a deathfat but still a decent size range

>>10423490
I never said that? I don't have a problem with fat people in lolita at all. But the fact is, when you can make a limited range of sizes, you're going to pick a size that guarantees you the highest number of buyers. Maybe I'm wrong and AP just hates fat people, but I don't think they're denying themselves hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of potential income just for the sake of upsetting people.

>>10423302
>wrong lingere
Man is detected

>>10423492
>Won't fit a deathfat
Shit like this is why we can't just have a conversation about brand sizes.

>>10423493
They had no problem making HC huge.
I know you didn't say that, you're just making excuses for them.
"oh they can't risk losing money"
What money are they losing. HC sold out. I'm tired of this made up shit that fatties don't buy the bigger sizes.
YES WE FUCKING DO.

>>10423302
SCROTE ALERT

>>10423495
>>10423497
Isn't it interesting that men always come into threads where women are talking about their size.
I wouldn't be surprised if most of the anons ostracizing fat people were just males who are "trolling".

Although I'm well aware that women definitely do it too.

>>10423496
I also wasn't trying to say that fat people don't buy bigger sizes (though I know some other people in the thread are saying that and I can understand why you inferred it from my comments, so my bad). But the main market for these dresses is Japan and China, and not the west. There simply aren't enough of us. They occasionally cater to us, like with the HC MTO, but they're never going to make as much money from giving us what they want. It might not be fair but it's business.

Anyway, I'm done arguing about this because you're being pretty unpleasant, I don't feel like getting into shitflinging, and frankly, I don't even like AP that much.

>>10423457
BtSSB also tried to make large sizes but nobody bought those either.

>>10423499
>There simply aren't enough of us.
Ok, I'm not trying to shitfling - I'm not sure what I even said that is making you anxious but I'm willing to just have a discussion about this.

And I'm sorry but this is just an excuse for the company. My comm has 300 women in it. Only some of them are small enough for the sizing that AP offers for things like OPs. Even then, some of the smallest girls in my comm still have trouble fitting into the OPs!
And the girl I'm talking about in question, is ASIAN. She wore an OP to a meet and said she could barely turn her torso in it. And she's gotta be no more than 110 lbs.

So no, this isn't acceptable business practices and saying there aren't enough westerners buying is ludicrous.

Even in China, their main buyers, will make bigger sizes.
So why does Japan keep refusing and making excuses?

>>10423498
Women are bitches, men are slutty dogs. Both are bad but men have no voice in this discussion.

>>10423498
Incels be incelin’

>>10423500
>nobody
Stop using this exaggerated terminology. I have a bigger baby dress in my wardrobe. Hell, I know girls bigger than me that have the same dress cause they know it fits them.

Yes we are a small number of people but we do buy things and then get ignored under the guise of "but they don't buy big dresses". Like maybe if we stop throwing around this idea, we can actually make progress.

>>10423493
> you're going to pick a size
This is honestly upsetting because skinner people are either have to swim in the dress or get it altered jeopardizing the resale value. I remember them doing MRC in two sizes before - was that too expensive to stick with the strategy of at least two sizes?

>>10423489
Would you mind to elaborate what’s “going off on fatties” about this?

>>10423442
>the one on the table is the only one there with nice tits and a round ass
Ok, so they are upset because she has more to show off then they do?
It's funny because some people like skinny boy looking girls and some like women that have curves. It really dose boil down to what the people like. I know many girls that are "over weight" that make well over one hundred grand a year just because they are big models.
People need to consider this and also consider why some may not lose the weight even if they can.

>>10423508
>get it altered jeopardizing the resale value
This isn't a real thing. I sell altered dresses just fine and I buy altered dresses as well. So do other people.

>>10423302
tranny or scrote? Who knows? They're the same thing tho

>>10423510
I don't have a screenshot of it but at the time they were going off on the HC release and their main complaint was that it was "too big and looked like taobao"

I think they have since been deleted? There is a thread for the drama surrounding that account:
>>10416738

>>10423505
So a handful of people bought them, but not enough to make it worthwhile for them to repeat the experiment. Why are you upset with the business and not with the people who chose not to put their money where their mouth is?

>>10423471
CICO works with or without exercise, again it's just about eating less. The problem is people have trouble sticking with it and don't realize you can drink your calories. Too many people think if you don't lose 50 lbs in a week then "it's not working." Just a tip; you're going to see a quick loss in weight which is going to be water weight but after that, you should be loosing up to 1lb a week.
>>10423476
>not necessarily true.
But it is. Unless you have some type of rare condition, the more fat you have is going to put more stress on your body. Your joints, your heart, even your brain. Remember though I'm not talking about a bit of chub, I'm talking about full on fat. We're seeing more and more people die from obesity related conditions and illnesses. Even fat activists/body positivity folks are dying from heart attacks earlier than they should.

>>10423281
Here my 2 cent,
I think a lot of people who fat shame have difficulty to understand the reason why people are fat in the first place.
Tyler explained it for the USA but I think there is something deeper to understand than the statistics shown .
I live in a country with a big industrial and agricultural past and I noticed that peoples who are from family who did those jobs or 1rst gen other job have extremely different food as they eat more often traditional richer food than wealthier people living in urban area since multiple generations. Those diet where rather adapted to hard jobs, but now it's too much.
I really noticed that when I became friend with someone who was almost obese, they could spend a whole day walking, do physical things, do job where they had to stand up all day without sitting much. Even toward food, they and my other overwheight friends don't eat between meal more often.
You can also had to this issue that acces to cheaper/ non processed food at direct sale market can be difficult.
Education about healthy cooking is also lacking, I think, in most part of the world ( it used to be learn in every highschool in my country but they removed it to put a much less useful subject instead ).

>>10423521
As for the sizing of japanese brand, I also feel like as a non japanese who is a fraction of the main brands market I should not really have a say in it, but I noticed while in japan that irl the majority of girl I saw wearing lolita were often bigger than the average japanese woman. It's really weird that they don't catter more to them since they seemed to be a big part of the domestic market ( a number wore skirt and very few OP) . I kind of wonder why we want brands to broaden they size range like big clothing company can do if it mean equally hill-fitting clothing. Maybe brands that catter exclusivly to plus size ( as in EU/US plus size ) should exist, since I find that a lot of lolita bodice design doesn't work on plus size, even if the same design have back shirring or is sized up ( princess seam bodice completly pushed by bigger bust does't look very good if it's wasn't designed with said big bust in mind).
Lolita seem to be more adapted for this since there is no issues with designing pants, it's one of the hardest to make a pattern of that fit a large range of plus size morphology.

>>10423487
People complained about honey cake because the sizing was released AFTER people bought the dress. If they’re going to make such a large change to a popular piece when it’s rereleased, that should have been advertised.

>>10423515
To be fair they do put their money where their mouth is... in the form of unhealthy food.

>>10423487
Ayrt, IW did cater to other sizes which was my point. My point is that, if people are asking for bigger sizes, then why not support brands that do try? There will have to be overweight people that still fit an IW size L, a size L will be easier to alter to fit than a size S, but people still don't. I understand if it didn't fit but it feels like the goalposts so to speak keep on moving. Example, If not many buy an L, where is the incentive to make a size even larger? Where are the people to fill the gap between S and >XXL? I can't really articulate what I mean well enough, but to me it's just weird that people won't support the current larger sizes but then ask for even bigger, like it seems like there's always a reason not to buy. I'm not trying to paint everyone that's overweight in this light, there's obviously people that buy those sizes, but compared to the people that complain, the overweight people that do buy are a minority. Also, I hate the HC rerelease thing, it's literally one incident. It's better to bring up gulls that bitch about every new AP release being bigger rather than focus on the ONE incident when there's many documented incidents of overweight people complaining about every other release, but then don't buy when the sizing is accessible (like people who try to justify shitty holy lantern replicas).

Again, I'm all for more sizes, I want people to be included but if you want to be included you need to try. Support the brands that are inclusive, don't ignore them, and don't just complain online when there's no real intent to buy.

>Have you ever fat shamed someone on cgl?
Just put this board out of its misery already or move it to facebook or twitter where it rightfully belongs at this point. I can't take it anymore.

>>10423515
Baby is weird example because they often release big dresses.
My only explanation is that they're just not as popular as AP who still has consistent blood baths.

>>10423520
>CICO works with or without exercise, again it's just about eating less
I keep seeing more and more of this and only on 4chan. I love the whole "intermittent fasting" meme getting thrown around too.
You're just saying that people should starve themselves and using CICO and intermittent fasting to cover for it.
Seriously, the same people preaching intermittent fasting are the same ones insisting that CICO is only way to lose weight.

Tyler made a really good point. Any diet that sees weight as a problem is not a healthy one.
You're just pushing the typical "fat is unhealthy" meme that has already been proven wrong over and over.

>>10423533
Fat is unhealthy, retard.

>>10423527
I don't follow IW cause they're usually out of my size range. I didn't know that they tried to release larger dresses but how big were those even? Size L doesn't seem to mean much in asian clothing. Usually it means it can fit slightly bigger boobs.

And Tyler made a great point about cuff sizes. They increase bust size but not cuff size! How does that make sense. It almost seems like asian brands don't even know how bodies work and don't know shit about constructing the top of a dress.

And yes, I know there is a constant topic on this board about how AP keeps putting out HUUUGE dresses. I only bring up HC because it was the biggest dress they released, not because it was considered an "incident".

And people who buy HL replicas are dumb as hell. I have the real deal zipper cut JSK and it's also fucking HUGE. It's one of the few dresses I have that's actually too big on me somehow. And I'm fucking fat.

>>10423537
Did you even watch Tyler's video? Because she explains it with research.

>>10423533
>You're just pushing the typical "fat is unhealthy" meme that has already been proven wrong over and over.
Please spend less time with social media hugboxes and talk to some actual medical professionals.
Another reason people make fun of fatties is this level of delusion.

>>10423533
>You're just saying that people should starve themselves and using CICO and intermittent fasting to cover for it.
No I didn't. Burning more calories that you consume is not starving yourself. Cutting down how many calories you eat a day isn't going to kill you.

>You're just pushing the typical "fat is unhealthy" meme that has already been proven wrong over and over.
Okay, give me some science and medical links that says otherwise. I'm genuinely curious to see how being overweight does not affect the body negatively.

>>10423541
>Please spend less time with social media hugboxes and talk to some actual medical professionals.
Did you watch the fucking video?
Tyler covers that part. And she's right. Medical professionals are the same people who think black people have bodies that work differently than whites.
Why the fuck would you listen to people who think that?

>>10423542
You can watch the video which was the point of this thread.
Tyler covers this with evidence and research to back it up.

Also
>burning calories
I thought you said here >>10423520 that CICO works without exercise.
But now you still have to burn those calories huh?

Doesn't make sense.

>>10423281
It's easy to tell how a fat person feels about themselves when they're openly glaring at or shaming others for the bodies that they feel jealous of or wearing clothes that blatantly do not fit them, yet they insist on doing so anyway. And, they expect to be treated as if they're special needs and have nobody acknowledge the fact that they're a fat person. Fuck that. Nobody has to lie to you because you're in denial and fancy yourself to be Morrigan just because you have fat girl tits.

>>10423543
I don't give a fuck what some rando with a youtube channel thinks as long as she doesn't name her sources.
And lmao, here we go with the "we're just as oppressed as poc!" again.

>>10423546
>nobody acknowledge the fact that they're a fat person. Fuck that. Nobody has to lie to you because you're in denial
we don't want you to acknowledge it because it's fucking OBVIOUS.
If you have eyes then you can tell if someone is fat or not. If you think you need to state that someone is fat you're fucking retarded.

>>10423281
Tyler is becoming so fucking preachy and virtue signaling lately. Boring. Talk about drama and keep it at that.

>>10423543
>Medical professionals are the same people who think black people have bodies that work differently than whites
I literally never heard of that outside of /pol/ and I hang around with a lot of med students.

>>10423539
>I don't follow IW cause they're usually out of my size range. I didn't know that they tried to release larger dresses but how big were those even?

This JSK was released in the last 6 months iirc. L size measurements:
Bust: 89 ~ 102 cm
Waist: 68 ~ 85 cm
Length: 115 cm
It has partial back shirring and corset lacing.
>https://innocent-w.jp/fs/innocentworld/jumperskirt/194702

Meanwhile, the L size measurements for a blouse they just put up this year:
Bust: 100 cm
Waist: 78 cm
Shoulder width: 37 cm
Length: 53 cm
Sleeve length: 62 cm + 4 cm of lace
Cuffs: 18 cm and up (elasticised)
>https://innocent-w.jp/fs/innocentworld/202101

>>10423547
>some rando
She's not, you dumb ass. Are you even a fucking lolita? She's extremely well known and it pains me to defend her this much cause I don't usually watch her channel since she insists on doing that stupid news anchor voice.

She did name her sources and they are shown through out the video.

and

I AM A POC. I am oppressed. Fuck you.

>>10423551
>Bust: 89 ~ 102 cm
>Waist: 68 ~ 85 cm
>Bust: 100 cm
>Waist: 78 cm

This is the issue she talks about in the video. Wow, it can fit bigger titties. Soooo plus size.

That's why no fat girls bought those dresses. Because they're just being made for thin chicks who have big tits.

>>10423547
u sound so retarded do u have worms 4 brains

>>10423548
Half of this thread disagrees kek. Or they cope with "i-it's just my boobs". The point is that you fats squeeze themselves into clothing that doesn't fit or is unflattering for their body shapes and then are surprised that people make fun of that.

>>10423547
SCROTES STRIKE AGAIN

>>10423555
I can't believe trips got wasted on someone who used "u" and "4" as words.

>>10423556
>you fats squeeze themselves
>kek
>surprised that people make fun of them
Not that you have the ability to form any more cohesive sentences but no one is "surprised" - we're annoyed.

>>10423552
She's a rando in the grand scheme and not a medical professional, retard. Having a youtube channel for a small subculture audience does not make her an important spokesperson for everything.
>I AM A POC
So am I and it has nothing to do with this issue. You're just fat.

>>10423555
Excuse me, could you type in english?

>>10423554
How about a sack dress then? 102 cm bust, free waist.

>>10423559
>just quotes words she doesn't like and feels offended by with no argument whatsoever

>>10423562
>just quotes

no u

>>10423559
If you're annoyed by it then don't do it and wear clothing that is made for you?

>>10423562
"you fats squeeze themselves" is not how a sentence goes, anon.

>>10423564
I do wear clothes that fit me and I still get shit. So do others. Stop acting like fat shaming isn't real.

>>10423563
There was literally nothing else for me to reply to, because you didn't address anything I posted, just whined about my choice of words.

>>10423560
>She's a rando in the grand scheme and not a medical professional
I know it hurts for you to hear this but medical professionals can be wrong. People get misdiagnosed all the time.

>>10423565
maybe read the full sentence then

>>10423567
That's not even the same anon, you idiot.
I'm the one who made fun of your poor word usage.
If you don't know how this site works, quit posturing with "kek" and leave, newfag.

>>10423568
Holy shit the delusion. When thousands of them say the same with actual experiences, direct proof and autopsies for several decades and a few disagree with heavily biased studies and no long term medical proof, who do you think is more likely to be in the wrong?

>>10423571
It's not delusion. It's very real. Medical professionals and scientists can be wrong because they're imperfect humans.
It's just as stupid to believe all of them as it is to believe none of them.

This doesn't need to be about extremes. It's about how fat people don't need to be dehumanized using medical jargon that will confuse the masses to think its ok to shit on someone for being fat.

>>10423570
Oh I'm sorry mighty fatty defender crying about newfags, let me correct myself then.
There was literally nothing else for me to reply to, because they didn't address anything I posted, just whined about my choice of words.

>>10423512
Which means your alterings are well made plus your size range happened to work for bigger selection of people. Some people may not fit that selection. Some may be looking for a dress being intact or near that.

>>10423514
Going off on dresses being too big is not the same as going off on people. There's nothing wrong about being biased towards pieces that fit or not fit you personally.

tl;dr of the video pls
I don't think I can make it through

>>10423574
>There was literally nothing else for me to reply to
I did address what you posted. But you don't seem to have a lot of brain cells and missed that because not only can you not construct sentences, you also can't read.

Not "surprising" is it?

>>10423295
Don't see a lot of naturally fat people in Ethiopia but ok go on

>>10423573
>Faries are very real. Biologist and scientists can be wrong because they're imperfect humans.
How are fat people being dehumanized by telling them the truth? Being fat is unhealthy and choose food and instant-gratification over health and most of the time happiness says a lot about a person.

>>10423575
>Some may be looking for a dress being intact
I don't think you know anything about alterations if you're saying they're not intact.

>Going off on dresses being too big is not the same as going off on people.
Seriously? The dresses are going to be worn by people. This shouldn't be that hard to understand.

>>10423409
Except weight is directly correlated with health
https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/weight-loss/expert-answers/waist-size-and-life-expectancy/faq-20348574

My lesson: Nobody can please everyone. I'm kinda ok with just minding my OWN business, in general, for a lot of things.

BUT. If you UPLOAD your PICTURE onto the INTERNET, you are accepting the CONSEQUENCES of that action like any adult. So suck it up, or don't upload your pictures.

>>10423573
just know that you sound like anti-vaxxers and flat-earthers. is that good company?

>>10423579
Let's just ignore your stupid "Fairies are real" comment because that's outlandish and putting words in my mouth. Let's not do that, ok?

>How are fat people being dehumanized by telling them the truth?
What truth? How do you not understand that fat people already know that they are fat. It's very fucking obvious. Anyone with a pair of eyes can tell. Literally no one needs to say anything about it.

>Being fat is unhealthy and choose food and instant-gratification over health
Not always. Tyler mentions this in the video and some anons even mentioned it up thread. Being fat can be for MANY reasons outside of just eating a lot. Yes, you can get fat if you eat a lot. You can also get fat from birth control or other medications or if you're like most Americans - you can be on SEVERAL types of medication that interact poorly causing you to gain weight.
Stop pushing this bullshit that it's just because we eat milkshakes all the time. Something makes me think that you're not in the US because I'm very familiar with the "US is all fattys" meme from /ck/ that is usually spouted by people who don't know shit about the US.


>and most of the time happiness says a lot about a person.
This was addressed in the video as well. Making fat people unhappy by consistently telling them how fat they are isn't going to make them happy.

Just like me going off on you doesn't make you happy. Do you get it now?

>>10423583
Well I'm neither one of those and I even said in my post that's it's not good to go around not believing any medical professionals but whatever, you don't agree with me so you need to make me look bad cause you just hate fattys so much.

So much that you need to be able to make fun of them on the 4chans.

>>10423577
>nooo ur a retard!!!!! My argument is just too high IQ to actually write it down!!
Nice argument. Lets do it in small steps this time, maybe it helps you to actually respond.
>Half of this thread disagrees and is in denial about being fat
>fatties instead pretend it's just their boobs why they look like sausages in lolita
>fatties look bad in lolita and often squeeze themselves into clothing that is too small for them, ruining the aesthetic even more but are surprised that people think they look terrible

>>10423582
>So suck it up, or don't upload your pictures
This is a shitty way to be about the community in general, though. This kind of opinion stretches far beyond fatties. We don't get content if you make everyone afraid to post their coords because according to you:

If you post your photo online, get ready for a verbal lynching if someone finds something they don't like about you.

But this is all very obvious. Cgl has made a hobby out of making fun of people who post themselves online and if some anons had their way, no one would be able to post their face online.

tl;dr - you're ideology limits content created.

>>10423585
>if you're like most Americans - you can be on SEVERAL types of medication that interact poorly causing you to gain weight.
Why are people taking so much medication? Is this normal?

>>10423549
Clearly you’re new here. Tyler has always been making this kinda content, she was ranting about feminist origins of lolita years ago

>>10423545
No you don't have to burn those calories... You burn calories just sitting not excercising.

>>10423587
>maybe it helps you to actually respond
I did respond. Again, you didn't read.

>Half of this thread disagrees and is in denial about being fat
I don't think you read the thread either.

>fatties instead pretend it's just their boobs why they look like sausages in lolita
there are conversations in this thread talking about cuff size vs bust size...

>fatties look bad in lolita and often squeeze themselves into clothing that is too small for them, ruining the aesthetic even more
Not all of them do this. Some of us wear clothes that fit.

>but are surprised that people think they look terrible
No one is surprised, dumb ass. You keep saying this but it's fucking wrong.

MOST people, be they fat or thing, are not happy with their appearance for one reason or another. To point that out to them is annoying and obvious and UNNECESSARY.

>>10423540
Tyler states its due to stressors and poorness which is essentially “unhealthy”

>>10423585
>saying faries are real is outlandish
>saying a bad body condition is healthy is totally normal

>What truth?
Being fat is unhealthy.
>Tyler mentions this in the video
Show what actual medical staff says, not what a lolita youtuber thinks.
>Yes, you can get fat if you eat a lot. You can also get fat from birth control or other medications or if you're like most Americans - you can be on SEVERAL types of medication that interact poorly causing you to gain weight.
That's just ways to get fat, how does this disproof that it's unhealthy?
>"US is all fattys" meme
It's actual statistics.

>Making fat people unhappy by consistently telling them how fat they are isn't going to make them happy.
Yeah I'm sure that's the only reason they are unhappy.

>Just like me going off on you doesn't make you happy.
Stop projecting lmao, this is just a discussion and I wouldn't reply if I didn't enjoy it.

>>10423589
it's normal in America.

>>10423592
>You burn calories just sitting not excercising.
what in the fuck are you talking about.

>>10423573
Doctors don’t fit your hamplanet narrative and its so american to just decide to no longer “believe” science. You can’t be helped by lying to yourself so enjoy your daily insulin

>>10423483

Art is about self expression and they were seemingly expressing concern about feelings or treatment they have had or seen in lolita. Some people use art to help cope with their feelings in a different or cathartic way. Everyone doesn't draw things just for them to look pretty. For many people it's soe form of expression (fanart expressing love for a character, OCs as a creative writing/character design exercise, etc.). I don't think it's a problem or huge deal or even a sign of severe sadness or insecurity to create art that represents visually in a creative way something you see all the time.

>>10423597
Fairies have nothing to do with reality. Why are you so obsessed with them? You're the one who keeps bringing them up.

>Being fat is unhealthy.
>Show what actual medical staff says, not what a lolita youtuber thinks.
You just keep saying the same shit over and over like a broken record.

So let me get this straight. If someone is taking an anti psychotic medication that has an unfortunate side effect of making them gain weight - they should just stop taking it because being fat is unhealthy?

And don't say they should just switch. That's not how anti psychotics work.

Quit acting like nothing can hurt you. Typical bullshit keyboard warrior armor. I know deep down someone can hurt you and if they did, you wouldn't like it. I know you know how it feels to be on the other end of this and you just don't want to admit it because then you'd have to admit you're wrong for wanting to shit on fatties.

>>10423601
It's just as stupid to believe all of them as it is to believe none of them.


Did you miss where I said this?
Also, I don't take insulin and insulin isn't just for fat people you mega fucking retard.

>>10423573
How about you learn how to interpret statistics and read their research yourself? I'm sure you'll end up taking their side. There's a reason medical experts are on the same page about this and it's because they've been made to study data to get their degree.

>>10423602
Nah anon, it’s 2020. Time to censor everything that might upset anyone. Please compile a list for the artists on what is alowed to be drawn and what isn’t.

>>10423605
Why do you think all of them agree being fat is unhealthy, do tell. What do they have to gain. It's not like they believe in unicorns or something that can't be proven or disproved, there are mounds of evidence going back centuries that points to obesity being unhealthy

>>10423606
>How about you learn how to interpret statistics and read their research yourself?
Harvard studies are talked about and shown in the video, anon.
I wish she would have linked the studies in the description but she shows them visually in the video. They all appear on screen several times. It was well researched.

>>10423525

Nayrt but that isn't true for the USA MTO as far as I am aware; they released the sizing well enough in advance to have seen it somewhere (especially floating around cgl because of people arguing about it) before reserving it.

>>10423580
>I don't think you know anything about alterations if you're saying they're not intact.
By being intact I mean it being the same piece as it came out from AP's warehouse. No damages, no changes, seams having the same threads that factory seamstresses put in them. I see people being strict on this point, so they disclose re-sewn buttons that fell off or stuff like that.

>Seriously? The dresses are going to be worn by people. This shouldn't be that hard to understand.
Yeah, but personal bias is a thing. I see how people can be upset about bigger size because it doesn't fit them _themselves_. There're some things you do for community, there're some things you do for yourself personally. Besides advocating for others, people have every right to be upset about the problems they face themselves.

Also I just reviewed the screenshot and fuck it - she worded it inclusively. She never said she's upset over AP not catering to skinny people, she was sorry there aren't MANY sizes. What kind of inclusion do you want more?

>>10423610
>Why do you think all of them agree being fat is unhealthy
I don't? I don't know even know where that is coming from.

>there are mounds of evidence going back centuries that points to obesity being unhealthy
What is evolution. Things now are not like how they were centuries ago. Our food is totally different now for example.

Hell, look how food is different from like a couple decades ago. Pic related.

>>10423594
>Not all of them do this. Some of us wear clothes that fit.
They still look bad by default. All of the fashion influences are even made for thin and delicate frames, so they end up looking like elephants cosplaying as gazelles.

>there are conversations in this thread talking about cuff size vs bust size...
Yes, and wondering why the bust and cuff size not both cater to fat frames, which wouldn't be a problem if they just had big boobs.

>No one is surprised, dumb ass.
Then why are so many arguing against it?

>>10423612
Not only that but it's pretty common to see new releases before we know the sizing.
Example: that new map dress has photos out and we don't know the sizing or even all the cuts of it yet.

>>10423615
>so they end up looking like elephants cosplaying as gazelles
I'm pretty sure you're just using this as an opportunity to be a severe cunt.

>Yes, and wondering why the bust and cuff size not both cater to fat frames, which wouldn't be a problem if they just had big boobs.
Wrong. It's pretty common with bigger boobs to also have bigger arms. Unless you're an ana chan and you have boob implants.

You gain weight all over, not just in certain parts.

>>No one is surprised, dumb ass.
>Then why are so many arguing against it?
Why do you think being surprised is the same as being annoyed and upset?
It's because of cunts like you. That's why. Because cunts like you need to defend shitting on fattys this much. You can't just stop doing it, can you? You just need to shit on people.

>>10423320
>Overweight is average and normal in places like US/UK, where the average size is 14/16.
This isn't a good thing, and the reason why people get upset is precisely because it's becoming so common to see so many unhealthy people in society.

>>10423619
>unhealthy
there's that word again

I guess you didn't watch the video either?

>>10423603
>Fairies have nothing to do with reality
Neither does the assumption that being fat is healthy.
>Why are you so obsessed with them?
I mentioned them twice in the replies to you. Do fairies trigger you for some reason?

>You just keep saying the same shit over and over like a broken record.
And you still didn't disproof it or showed anything against it. "A youtube said it!" is not a source.

>So let me get this straight. If someone is taking an anti psychotic medication that has an unfortunate side effect of making them gain weight - they should just stop taking it because being fat is unhealthy?
Where did I say that? It doesn't matter what makes them fat. The situation you stated is difficult, but it doesn't change the fact that being fat itself is still unhealthy.

>Quit acting like nothing can hurt you. Typical bullshit keyboard warrior armor. I know deep down someone can hurt you and if they did, you wouldn't like it. I know you know how it feels to be on the other end of this and you just don't want to admit it because then you'd have to admit you're wrong for wanting to shit on fatties.
Again please stop projecting and take your anti-psychotics. Maybe it will help you to get some sense of reality.

>>10423620
https://youtu.be/26QcUdP2zvM

>>10423319
she didn't say to burn down the system. she said if the clothes don't fit, alter them.

>>10423620
https://www.cdc.gov/healthyweight/effects/index.html

But disregard that TAYLOR KNOWS ALL

>>10423614
Nayrt but holy shit you're retarded. Evolution doesn't just happen over a few decades and the value of a dollar 40 years ago isn't the same at it is now.

>>10423302
>they wear wrong lingerie
What lingerie are fatty-chans supposed to wear? Something that hides their body? Also typical porn-addicted Scrote being unable to understand there being female beauty outside of what's fuckable

>>10423614
People a century ago weren't eating 3x their daily recommended sugar and salt intake bro. You said believing all medical experts is dumb, but pretty much all medical experts will tell you it's unhealthy to be overweight. Why do you think the number one killer of Americans is heart disease? Do we just have bad heart genetics or what?

>>10423621
>Neither does the assumption that being fat is healthy.
Except it does and you are just being stubborn because you need to be able to make fun of fat people.

>Do fairies trigger you for some reason?
Typical double speak.

>And you still didn't disproof it or showed anything against it. "A youtube said it!" is not a source.
Well she talks about studies from Harvard. She shows them as well.

>Where did I say that? It doesn't matter what makes them fat. The situation you stated is difficult, but it doesn't change the fact that being fat itself is still unhealthy.
Then what are they supposed to do? Just get made fun of for being fat because you are so damn insistent on saying it's unhealthy therefor okay to fuck up someone's mental health even worse?

Why are you so hellbent on being horrible to fat people?

>Again please stop projecting and take your anti-psychotics.
Oh look! A cgl specific meme!

This is what typical 4chan board culture loving trolls want.
They want you to be in a situation you can't get out of so they can call you unhealthy and make fun of you and then justify making fun of you even though you can't change your situation.

>>10423629
>bro
Seriously though, why are so many scrotes in this thread.

>>10423627
>Evolution doesn't just happen over a few decades and the value of a dollar 40 years ago isn't the same at it is now.
>the value of a dollar 40 years ago isn't the same at it is now.
Yes. That was my point.
I agree with you... but you are still flipping shit and name calling. Nice.

>>10423626
who is Taylor?

Also Harvard studies. Do you disagree with the folks at Harvard?

>>10423632
>using bro makes you a scrote
Why can't you retards just stay on facebook?

>>10423635
They obviously meant Tyler.

>>10423632
I have a real biological vagina and that is a fact that can be proven with data, but I won't cuz I don't wanna camwhore

>>10423637
Well obviously but they don't really come off as someone who should be taken seriously, do they?

>>10423636
Cause a lot of lolitas are on FB as well as being on here.

>>10423639
>someone who cites sources for how obesity is bad for the human body
>someone who shouldn't be taken seriously

>>10423641
Calm down. I was just making fun of them for being an obvious noob who doesn't wear the fashion.

I was fat-shamed to the point that I developed an eating disorder and lost 50lb. Is that good or bad?

>>10423649
It's bad.
I'm sure other anons will say it's not though.

>>10423304
>I've noticed AP has been making a lot more full back shirring items the past few years, which is great.

Not really. There was more full back shirring in the early-mid 2010's when AP would release several cuts each release. Typically, in most releases, there would be an OP, Skirt, and two JSK options and usually at least one of those would be more forgiving. These days, it's an OP and JSK which may or may not be fully shirred. I've been sitting more releases out in recent years that in the past. The summer collection had just a few items, most were partial shirring and they happened to be the ones I was most excited for.

I've been purchasing more from Meta recently.

>Have you ever fat shamed someone on cgl?
I've been subject to it, but I don't really care. Honestly, fat and ugly don't really matter to me anymore. As a kid, if you were fat and ugly, it meant you'd have no friends, nobody would want to date you, you wouldn't be successful and you'd be miserable. Well, I'm still fat and ugly but successful, with a good social life, married longer than some people I know, and happy, so, whatever. I just like collecting and wearing weird clothes from Japan every once in awhile.

>>10423598
Sorry...here let me explain. It seems you're uneducated about this but that's okay. I'm not here to attack you.
Your body is constantly burning calories to live. Your heart beating, brain activity, sleeping, blinking, breathing, everything burns calories. When people look up their BMR they are looking at how many calories they are burning while just existing. Excercise adds to that burning. You can sit and do nothing and you are still burning calories but when you eat, you're adding more calories to your body. If you eat too much, your body stores that as fat so it can be used later. If you are eating more than you are burning, it creates more and more fat. Excersice can balance that out if you are eatibg too much so you have a choice

Eat less or exercise more.

>Men burn 1,900 to 2,500 calories per day, depending on their level of activity, Greaves says. Women burn 1,600 to 2,000 calories per day. To get a more accurate idea of your daily caloric requirements, you can turn to an online basal metabolic rate (BMR) calculator.

>>10423652
>Typically, in most releases, there would be an OP, Skirt, and two JSK options and usually at least one of those would be more forgiving.
I remember this era. I want to go back to this time.

>>10423635
What study does she show that proves being fat isn't unhealthy? She showed that bullying makes fat people feel bad, but everyone already knows that.

>>10423653
Oh no, I know about that. I just didn't think how it was original explained was worded well so it didn't make sense.

But just sitting doesn't burn that many calories. So it's not part of CICO. CICO focuses on exercise to burn calories.

>>10423649

Eating disorders usually involve unhealthy weight loss methods and amounts, and are a severe mental illness. Probably bad desu.

Losing the weight unless it made you severely underweight was probably good for you physically though. But usually EDs besides binge eating disorders implicate an unhealthily low weight.

>>10423631
>Except it does
>STILL doesn't show any source or argument of fat being healthy besides "tyler said x"
I'm not the one being stubborn here.

>Typical double speak.
I take this as a yes.

>Well she talks about studies from Harvard. She shows them as well.
And? What exactly, including the whole context of the paper, does it say? I'm sure you read it right? You're not actually retarded enough to unquestioningly believe a statement just because they name drop a fancy uni, right?

>Then what are they supposed to do? Just get made fun of for being fat because you are so damn insistent on saying it's unhealthy therefor okay to fuck up someone's mental health even worse?
It is unhealthy. Your ferlings being hurt by it doesn't change the fact that it's unhealthy. There are options for you, even with psychotic meds but as the first step it requires for you to stop deluding yourself into thinking it's healthy just to cope and to invite yourself to make excuses.

>Why are you so hellbent on being horrible to fat people?
Telling the ugly truth is not inherely horrible. Maybe leave cgl and go back to insta or facebook if you can't deal with reality and/or are too lazy to change it. They will happily hugbox you all the way to your need for even more medication, diabetes and fat induced heart failure.

>They want you to be in a situation you can't get out of so they can call you unhealthy and make fun of you and then justify making fun of you even though you can't change your situation.
Top kek just leave if anonymous discussion upsets you this much. You are being unhealthy and you can change it, it's just not easy or an instant gratification like the food you stuff your face with.

>>10423628
>posts a sexy romper
>confused about lingerie

Maleposter detected.

OP most likely means good, supportive, fitting bras and underwear. And sometimes a simple piece of shapewear (like Spanx bodysuits). The right lingerie will be comfortable and keep your clothes from taking more stress than they have to in holding your bust and torso in the right position. Bras and shapewear are considered lingerie... I don't get how you're not aware of that.

>>10423643
Nice backpedal. Also, just because someone called you out for saying something stupid doesn't mean that they're overreacting.

>>10423313
Because people see being fat as a choice (it is, up to a point of addiction anyway), and as such see the negative outcomes on them and everything and everyone around them as being a result of negligence.

Also it indicates a lack of care, effort and often comes bundled with infinite excuses that defy the laws of physics. Distaste at all this is, frankly, warranted. If you can't even bring yourself to go the effort to lose weight when it can vastly improve your quality of life, why should anyone except you to put effort in for anything else?

The way obese people are seen is not all too dissimilar from the way that drug addicts are seen.

>>10423649
t. Wannarexic whale

>>10423661

Most people would use the term shapewear or underwear/undergarments though, lingerie typically implies sexy or cute looking underwear so that's why people think they're a scrote.

This thread reminds me why I hate fat people, thanks.

>>10423657
nayrt
CICO is "Calories In; Calories Out" and takes BMR into account as calories spent.
You can avoid exercising and still use CICO.

>>10423670
Except by not exercising a quarter of your weightloss will be muscle loss, reducing definition of body form and lowering your BMR. Dieting *must* be coupled with exercise (in particular strength training, not just cardio) in order to be effective

>>10423666
bait

>>10423671
Also building muscle while losing weight is the best time to do it because you can actually build a small but serviceable amount of muscle at caloric deficit. Normally bulking in a reasonable way requires you to overeat, which is not a great idea if you were overweight before doing so for obvious reasons, so if you have a natural propensity to eating way too much and getting fat again, you want to gain that muscle while you're losing weight, not after.

>>10423667
Depends on where you're from. I grew up referring to everything from Spanx and Wonderbra to Victoria's Secret as "lingerie".

>>10423657
>CICO focuses on exercise to burn calories.
Ehhh yes and no. All CICO is is Calories In, Calories Out. How you go about that is up to the individual be it exercising, fasting, cutting carbs, throwing up your food etc. Some may be unhealthier than others but the point is that is works. Personally I do intermitten fasting if I'm being lazy and don't feel like weight lifting/cardio. When I do eat, it's usually high protein and fiber. If I end up downing ice cream and junk food, I try to make sure I can burn off what I ate later.

>>10423654
The nice thing was, there were options for most people. Half shirring too big for you? There's a few options that might work out better for you. Are you pretty plus sized? Well this release also has full shirring! Did you splurge on the last release but want this one too? Well, there's a skirt.

Now it's like, pick one of two that may be the similar in size or cut, the only difference is sleeves or a difference in embellishment.

>>10423675

Nayrt but exercise is not an efficient way to lose weight/reduce calories. Lowering your intake from the start is better. It takes way more time to burn off a serving of junk food than it does to just eat something lower calorie but still satisfying.

>>10423672
Nah, if you think meanies on the internet gave you in eating disorder, you are 100% a wannarexic whale.

>>10423677
How about both like literally every medical professional, personal trainer and nutritionist will tell you

>>10423677
>Lowering your intake from the start is better.
Right and that's what I do. I work out to build muscle and keep the fat off longer but when I'm too lazy, I just won't eat as much thus the intermittent fasting. Them weighted squats keep my ass looking good and I like the slight buldge of muscle in my arms.

>>10423678
OP with the ED here. Where did I say it was meanies on the internet?

>>10423677

To add to that/clarify, exercise is more about toning your body and developing a healthy muscle mass and strength so you don't become a skinnyfat limp noodle. For many women anyway. Also of course cardio for heart health and general well being. The exercise is more about fitness while reducing calorie intake helps with reducing fat/weight

>>10423678

I never said exercise wasn't something you should do, just that for weight loss specifically most studies show it does little/is ineffective. There are other health benefits.

>>10423681
By using snowflake terms like fat-shaming. I doubt anyone in the current age will tell you such things into your face and either way, the point still stands.

>>10423539
I don't follow IW either but I know that they *tried* to make their sizing more inclusive, even if they weren't successful. Cuff sizing and sleeve length too just have to do with them focusing on the wants of Japanese lolitas, their main customer base. I don't like it, but I understand what it is that way. And Japanese brands know how Japanese bodies work, it sounds kind of entitled to say how bodies work in general when American bodies aren't a global standard that others should be held to (no single body is), or even relevant to the Japanese. I know you probably didn't mean it like that but others think like this and that's this topic is always heated.
The HL replica-chans and the like are who me and reasonable gulls basically criticize when this topic comes up. Even when there are options, majority of the people complaining about sizes don't buy. Fat people who do buy are not the intended target of this criticism, because they are working hard to be included and obviously deserve to be included. It's the newbs, the itas, the lolitas-at-heart that refuse to hear different, refuse to hear that there are options, then opt for a replica or just sit and bitch. I mentioned brands that have larger sizing, yet no one else pro-bodyposi in this thread says anything about them (Meta and AtePie have accessible sizing too, I forgot) instead they are hung up on the ones that don't support them, but aren't supporting the ones that do. There's never going to be change if those brands die. I do want larger lolitas to be included and it's sad to see that the ones that try get drowned out by the ones that don't, and then bear the brunt of the criticism.

>>10423281
Fat shaming is good.
Being overweight is unhealthy.

If you are being fat shamed, you will think twice before eating a chocolate or any junk food.

It is not that hard to lose weight:
- Never drink soda. NEVER! Only drink water.
- Avoid sweets in general
- Avoid anything with cheese.
- Avoid anything fried.
- Eat green stuff.
- Do any kind of physical activity.

>>10423410
FATTIES BTFO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>10423687
You don't even need to do half that shit as long as you can keep them in moderation. Cutting soda is the biggest one there by far. I've seen very large folk lose almost 100lb just by cutting soda/alcohol and doing nothing else different

>>10423684

Nayrt but people talk shit about fat people to their face irl all the time. Especially when younger (childhood through 20s)

When I was a child my mom bullied me for my weight for normal growth and size increase as I aged from age 8 to the time I moved out of her home and I was never fat until later in my life--was always a size small before then--I developed a binge eating disorder as an unhealthy coping mechanism. Slowly recovering from that but "fat shaming" happens irl even to non fat people and it just has worse outcome for everyone.

I don't think obesity is healthy at all but it's also not healthy to have an obsession with other people's appearances to the point you have to attack them for it or remind them they're fat when they probably know (and some non fat people think they are because of the fear of being so and that causes issues too).

Yeah it's unhealthy but no one goes around telling people who eat potato chips all day how unhealthy they are if they're thin or starts quoting stats about soda being awful if they catch a skinny person drinking a coke.

And people put that pressure on women more than men as well because it's not about health. It's about looks and women have more pressure to look a certain way. No need to pretend it isn't. If it was about health people would go after thin people who eat badly too.

Someone being unhealthy has no impact on you in a society like America where there is no universal healthcare and even if it was different the solution is to approach them in a way they'll be more receptive to and positively support them to change for the better, not bully them into hating themselves.

>>10423692
Being fat is a social signal for "I don't give a crap about my body or about moderation or exercise".

Being fat is also a negative to those around you who love you and care for you, so by extension it's also a social signal of "my appetite is more important than being around you".

In addition, despite fat acceptance being a thing, hardly any fat people are actually comfortable about their weight, so even on a personal level it's a negative for their mental state, which — you guessed it! — happens to impact those around them.

Some of the most vile people I've known are people who espouse fat acceptance and yet are blatantly uncomfortable with their weight, to the point if anyone in their vicinity so much as even tries to lose weight they'll jump in and try to convince them not to. It's insane.

>>10423687
Problem with some of that, while you're not wrong, is mental issues are a factor as well. A lot of people eat because it's a coping mechanism and/or a litteral addiction. They need to find the source of why they are overeating or under eating and address that so that they can stick with easy normal eating habits. Doesn't help that america has poor education on nutrition and food companies throw in addictive additives to keep sales up.

>>10423696
The biggest takeaway from this insight with respect to addiction: Most people see fat people the same way they see a heroin addict

>>10423694

I think my biggest problem with people being so aggressively hateful towards fat people is that it also negatively impacts the ones like me so are actively trying to lose weight (it's a slow process, it takes time); we get the same treatment as HAES pro-fat people and it makes it hard to want to continue because people like you said look at us like we're not trying when we really are and are just not there yet bevause it takes time and consistency and we have the consistency and good intentions but not enough time has passed for it to show yet.

What about people like us who are changing and putting in the discipline? Do we deserve to have people make sweeping assumptions about our entire lives just because don't look like we "care about ourselves" yet?

>>10423700
>Do we deserve to have people make sweeping assumptions about our entire lives just because don't look like we "care about ourselves" yet?

Not that anon but bruh no matter what you look like and do you're going to be part of a group that is going to have sweeping assumptions about them. What do you do? Be proud that you are not like them. Be proud that you are doing better. Let it motivate you to not end up like "them." Keep going and keep working at it. It will take time but be happy that weight is something you can actually change about yourself unlike sex and skin color.

>>10423706

Yeah I'm black and female so I get the gender and skin color thing. I try so hard to be a decent person and not perpetuate stereotypes people have about my race and gender AND size altogether and it's emotionally draining. Even changing the one thing I can will still leave me with two other avenues for people to judge or discriminate against me with and it makes it hard to want to keep trying because no one sees my efforts as a person when they look at me. They the stereotype of a fat black woman and how good of a person I try to be or how healthy I try to eat and how educated I am, etc. gets thrown out the window for some people as soon as they see me...it feels so unfair as I don't make assumptions of others for their appearances or at least try to be conscious not to but the rest of society doesn't afford me the same courtesy. I can see how people would just rather give up and stop trying when their effort has no real reward. I know losing weight won't make me feel any better about myself but it will make me healthier and that's just kind of important.

>>10423489
Maxicimam, period

>>10423496
I don't like the term deathfat or other neg terms either but anachan and skelly was also said and no one says anything bad about that. Especially considering anorexia has the highest fatality and suicide rate out of all the mental and eating disorders...but no, who cares about them right? Normie beauty standards don't like anorexia bodies either btw, I hate it when overweight/obese conveniently forget that to justify treating them poorly only to freak out when the same is done to them. No one should be treated poorly for physical characteristics that they cannot easily change or don't want to change, just putting that out there before I get swamped.

Also, side note, I agree with other anons that people should mind their own business and leave overweight/obese people alone, and I can vouch that it is unhealthy/counterproductive to harass someone over it thanks to my education. But it is equally bad to harass underweight people too, especially considering anorexia is basically brain defects (altered pathways, physiological changes) and recovery is a lot harder and longer with potential for lots of relapses (I say that because a lot of people act like it is a choice, or larp about it). An anecdote, but I constantly see people say incredibly harmful and tone-deaf comments to lolitas with obvious ED, and get away with it. Those lolitas are expected to be stronger, expected to take that bullshit, expected to be criticized for the handling of their disorder. If the situation was reversed, those people would be destroyed, having expectations for how fat people should be/act is considered wrong and rightfully so. I'm happy that negative comments towards overweight/obese get called out or cancelled now, but it seems like the more we progress there, the more we are normalizing attacking clinically underweight people, as we put them down to make the opposite end of the spectrum feel better.

>>10423711

Maxicimam offers things in both plus sizes and standard sizes, but they don't have a ton of options for prints, etc. I wish for the price they charge for things they would expand and consider more prints.

>>10423687
I agree, humans are social creatures. Feeling shame or being shamed by fellow humans is what made us civil - and therefore a civilization - in the first place. It's the same reason we outlawed certain behaviour which is harmful, like killing and raping. It's a very human response.

This whole video Taylor set up feels very 'victim card' to me

>>10423715
Maybe if lolitas supported them more, they would expand

>>10423715
I wish they would do uberfabric stuff again

i got into lolita when i was a very skinny, underweight teenager. i slowly put on weight over the years. cgl was the first time i ever received a weight related comment. i had posted a meetup coordinate in a brand miniskirt, and cgl commented on my thighs being fat.

then i started actually putting on weight and cgl called me every name under the sun and talked about how much cuter i "used" to be. i always thought that was funny because cgl didnt like my coordinates when i was thin either! they just made fun of them for other reasons.

i have bad body image issues, for other reasons besides cgl now. im still chubby by cgl standards, and cgl didn't comment on my weight loss or coordinate improvements. most of the users here are just projecting or indulging in a vendetta when they comment on someones weight.

>>10423709
>Black and female
Same here! and I completely understand everything you're talking about. This is why you have to keep focusing on you. It sucks that people will make these judgments but remember that's just people in general. You have to do what makes you happy and surround yourself with positive people to offset the rest of the world. If you are trying to better yourself, just about everyone supports that. I believe in you, prove them all wrong.

>>10423717

I buy from them regularly through CDJapan. They're the only brand I buy new main pieces from even after losing some weight because I have a bigger bust and their blouses are great for that since I can take in the waist with back corset lacing usually.

>>10423691
i was a soda addict as a teen, and i mean i was knocking back 3-4 cans of non diet pepsi and coke a day. i was thinner then than i was now. i wish i was one of those people who lost weight by just switching to water

>>10423694
I've personally experienced what you describe at the end of your post here. As soon as I was noticeably changing my diet and buying new clothes, the friends posted fat-acceptance and body-posi copypastas on their social media suddenly turned their noses up at me. To my face. My eating was disordered, sure (premeasured peanut butter and four sticks of celery for lunch. A specific amount of nuts or dried fruit as a snack--never more than 70kcal. Everything had to be logged. I've dropped those habits now.) but they weren't worried for my health as a person with an eating disorder; I was a traitor to the body-posi cause.
I recall going out for coffee with one of those friends, and they saw that I had ordered the lowest cal latte option from the menu, and immediately jumped on me for it. They lambasted the diet culture movement and talked about how they had become happy with their size (size 14~) before I was able to talk about other stuff. Later, on social media, they posted a rant about diet culture and how they couldn't be in a healthy mindset around people who promoted that sort of lifestyle. I've had to stop talking to a couple of people for the same sort of thing, and even get back-handed compliments from my own mother about how I should have been happy at the size I was.

>tfw when you can fit into most brand very easily
>don't feel thin because of non-flat stomache and fat looking thighs

I'm not an anachan though. My frame is very small. I guess I'm lucky

>>10423687
This, Korean's shame eachother to hell and back and they're thin. The reason fatshaming doesn't work for us is because fat people here don't feel shame in the first place.

>>10423731

In other countries, Asian pmes included, people eat sweets and things regularly and are fine. One of the largest issues in America or maybe the West in general is the all or nothing mentality about food and the lack of realization that portion control is one of the easiest ways to reduce calorie intake and stomach size. I loved Japan because of the smaller portions; I could eat conbini single serve haagen dazs ice cream every day and still lost weight so long as I didn't go overboard on rice at dinner in my dorm.

Japanese people enjoy sweets and snacks and non water drinks (besides unsweet tea), otherwise there would be no market for it in their country. They just choose to eat smaller portions and have unhealthy things less often. On top of the public transport culture making it easy to get a lot of walking and exercise in daily.

>>10423472
Cool, still dont care. Im also an oldfag who doesnt know or care who she is

>>10423404
This is the mentality of so many people I've come up with and it's super awkward to be around, like if you know a friend has been trying to lose weight and they keep making bad food decisions but you can't say anything about it because it's insensitive, how do you deal with that?

>>10423727
It feels like >>10423697 says about heroin addiction, in a way, in highschool they taught us about peer pressure and I remember the example of someone who wanted to quit smoking. All of their friends continued smoking around him, offering him cigarettes and getting annoyed with him like "what you think theres something wrong with us? live a little it wont kill you" and if he needed to get away from them to cut the addiction and not go out for smoke breaks with them, he was losing the ability to stay social with his normal friends and needed to 'quit' them, too. If you make a lifestyle change for the better, the people you associate who are just like you, are going to try to drag you back down because 'theres nothing wrong with us' and they dont want to feel bad when you move on and improve where they could never.

>>10423733
Eating sweets isn't the only problem though. It's that all of our food is chock full of sugar. Our bread is full of sugar, condiments are full of sugar. You can't really go out to eat and avoid sugar unless it's a resturant or meal that's specifically low or no sugar (or natural sugars, like from fruit that may be in salad dressings). All of our low-calorie options are laden with sugars to replace the fat.

So even if you don't eat sweets, or have them in moderation, you're still consuming a crapton of sugar if you're not conscious about what you're eating. The only way I was able to avoid sugars was eating at home and specifically going low carb.

In Japan for instance, meals aren't as sugar-laden quite like in the USA.

Beyond that, the USA is a huge country. Walking to the convenience store may be an hour trip, whereas in parts of Europe or Asia, they're nearby. We drive everywhere. Walking or biking isn't a daily mode of transportation, but a leisure or fitness activity. We also work a fuck ton more than the rest of the developed world for less pay, in general.

There are a lot of layers to this issue and it's not as simple as just not eating sugar. It's just as much of a socio economic issue as it is a health issue. It's why it's common to see morbid obesity in the poor here, because cheap and easy to access food is full of sugar and garbage and they're working too much to get expensive healthy food.

>>10423728
I think I have the same figure as you and honestly it's quite a blessing, i took some weight but still have the same bust and waist mesurement.

>>10423625
No she says burn down / dismantle the whole system after the alteration part

>>10423533
1500 calories a day (1200 if you're really short and sedintary) and doing light exercise is not starving yourself retard

>>10423738

Eating out isn't generally a neccedity. I lost weight when poor because of not afflrding eating out and when I did I was careful about making requests to reduce calories.

Yes junk food is cheap but depending on where you live and how many people are in your household, so are fruits and veggies.

Yes it is more complicated and people in the US are far away from stores, etc. And need cars more but I mentioned that it's public transport culture. Tbh anyone with the budget for lolita has the budget to eat better.

I know what it's like to be fat and the system IS messed up, I was just expressing what I liled about Japan, whete it makes portion control, etc. Easier. They have soda and sugary things there too, Japanese cooking us actuallt fairly high in sugar in many regions (home cooked recipes ADD sugar to savory meals often for flavor)

It's a combo of a lot but smaller portion sizes have a huge impact on public health there. Let's be real, you can eat only sugar but if it's little enough calories many people barring those with legit conditions will still maintain or lose weight.

>>10423656
Seconding this anon
She shows all the reasons why people have become fat and that fat shaming in itself is a contributing factor that is scientifically proven to make it worse. At no point does she say its healthy or unhealty, just that it’s a large percentage of the America.

>>10423692
Imo a large part of that fat-shaming as we were growing up is that out parents and their previous generations mental health awareness/knowledge didn’t really exist and studies proving that this type of behavior causes negative results wasn‘t known back then.

I genuinely just think you shouldn't post pictures of yourself online if your self-esteem can't handle criticism and trolling. Especially when the hobby you're in almost entirely about an aesthetic.

>>10423697
Because it is.
Sugar is on the same level but it’s literally in everything. You‘d be amazed to see all the things it’s mixed into. it‘s a literal bitch to find canned vedgetables or things you otherwise wouldn’t expect any sugar in. The most insane sample I noticed it in is small salt packets, the ones you‘d use at a restaurant. Everyone is being fed garbage without realizing it

>>10423533
Intermediate fasting has health benefits for thin people too. It's good for your gut biodome. And you don't need to go on a fad diet, just count calories. It's not healthy to eat processed foods. Limit your meat intake, eat more plants, don't drink soda.

>>10423752
Why would you buy canned veggies over frozen ones unless your were making a pot pie or something?

>>10423751
Wrong

>>10423738
Also need to add that compared to europe produce in America is WAY more expensive for some reason.
Not to mention there are literal „grocery stores“ like Walmarts that carry 0 produce. I thought I was going insane the first time I visited a Walmart and couldn’t find the produce section when it simply didn’t have one lol

>>10423590
Except i'm not. I saw this video,it was actually genuinely interesting. This is just pure virtue signaling

>>10423738
Just read the ingredients and stop eating processed food. I can think of a million things to eat that aren't processed, eat those.

>>10423758
Can’t always be bothered to cut up fucking tomatoes to tiny pieces to make low carb spaghetti sauce desu.

>>10423726
That's because your metabolism is a lot higher when you are teen. The body uses most of the calories on body growth.

>>10423750

My mom was a nurse and had mental illness and low self esteem because she was fat but instead of empathizing she was a huge bully literally projecting her self hatred for her own weight problems onto me even though I was tiny (I was very short and small); some family is genuinely ignorant and some are just bad people.

>>10423760

Every Walmart I have been to has had a produce section (I have lived in 4 different US states growing up and traveled to even more than that); in many places the quality wasn't ideal nor the selection but it was there.

>>10423764

Grocery stores typically carry no sugar and salt added tomato sauces and canned beans. Tomatoes also naturally can have sugar as well; unless you mean the ingrediens list added sugar on things like pure tomato paste.

>>10423539
right, if you're mad about cuff size, buy JSKs. IW's shirring is great, their sizing is awesome and the larger girls in my comm (self included here) all fit in their IW shirred pieces.

Here's the thing about cuff sizes. They're making a dress to fit certain proportions. If you have giant arms, the dress is going to look very different. They are designing it for people who fall into a certain range, not for your individual body type. Our arms might not be the same circumference, what fits me might not fit you, even if we have the same bust/waist measurements. This IS entitlement, even if you choose not to see it.

who doesn't have an ED?
it really just starts out innocent wanting to fit into something and then its down from there.

>>10423539
people buy hl replicas because of the price, not just size

>>10423551
That's not much better than regular sizes tbf. My 105cm tits wouldn't fit even though my waist would be fine.

>>10423500
They need to release large sizes of things people actually want, like Kumya dresses. Look, tons and tons of fat girls bought the large size Honey Cake. But despite that, AP hasn't released any more large size options, so I guess it doesn't even matter to the company.

>>10423727
Why did you expect people to be nice to you when you were literally starving yourself? Extreme diets are unhealthy too.

>>10423791

nayrt but regardless of how unhealthy someone is in either direction that shouldn't give society a free pass to bitch at them and make them feel bad/worse, it doesn't fix anything.

>>10423619
No one said it was a good thing, but it is common and normal at this point, so having a visceral reaction to it is weird. Do you get upset every time you see someone with acne or baldness or any other "undesirable" trait as well?

>>10423687
>fat shaming is good
found the asshole

seriously though, if fat shaming really worked there would be no fat people. but keep screaming into the void under the mistaken assumption that you're somehow 'helping'.

>>10423787
I don't.

>>10423692
>Yeah it's unhealthy but no one goes around telling people who eat potato chips all day how unhealthy they are if they're thin or starts quoting stats about soda being awful if they catch a skinny person drinking a coke.
This. The only time I hear it's unhealthy for thin people to do is the person themselves saying they should eat healthier.

>>10423716
>Taylor
there it is again..

>>10423687
>If you are being fat shamed, you will think twice before eating a chocolate or any junk food.
so you didn't watch the video, because studies have proven this is incorrect and are quoted there.

>>10423731
have you not seen photos of korean lolita meetups?? they are absolute fatfucks, dare i say even more fat girls than american lolitas

>>10423793
No, I'm not one of those people who has a meltdown every time they see a fat person, but I don't think obesity should be normalized and I disagree that just because it's becoming more common means that it's okay and we should be complacent about it, which is what you were saying.

>>10423802

There are a lot of tubby Koreans, especially men. Only the Kpop stars are super thin and even they struggle with EDs and body shaming. Not deathfat level like USA but not more thin people overall the way Japan is. Part of that is their westernized diet that is heavier in meat and dairy than Japan and they have some yoyo dieting culture like Americans too.

>>10423760
Yea I used to work at Walmart and they had a produce section.
Maybe you're talking about the smaller stores back in like 90s? That's the time before they added groceries to their stores. Almost every walmart is a super center that includes a grocery section (that definitely has a produce section) or it's a neighborhood market which are Walmart's version of a grocery store and they have a pretty large produce section among other things like a deli, etc.

Now what Walmart is known for is having all the new flavors of every kind of junk food you can imagine.

>>10423806
you don't have to "be complacent" or agree with it. you just need to leave people alone and mind your own business. how hard is that?

>>10423795
>seriously though, if fat shaming really worked there would be no fat people
This.

>keep screaming into the void under the mistaken assumption that you're somehow 'helping'.
A lot of people in this thread are definitely trying to justify making fun of fat people.
That's why I made this thread. I knew several gulls would be pissed about this.

>>10423540
how is it not unhealthy? because they are getting fat due to economic reasons and not because they are just lazy or chronically ill?

idc how you got fat, your organs are being crushed under your weight and your life is being negatively effected. i have many overweight friends and i love them but it hurts to hear about their low energy, sore knees and hips and backs, insomnia, depression, digestive and gynecological issues, that they blame on vague "chronic illness"

the health issues seem very clear to me, well worth spending a little extra money or discipline on getting better food and having at least one physical hobby that you enjoy instead of watching netflix. i know it's a meme at this point among body posi people of friends that say offensive things because they 'want the best for you' but like, literally wtf. i keep my mouth shut now but when i outlive my friends when they have a fucking stroke or are wheelchair bound in a care home by the time theyre 50 it's going to be miserable. it stresses me out seeing the people i care about suffering and shortening their lives.

>>10423778
>This IS entitlement, even if you choose not to see it.
Wanting to be included is entitlement now.

>>10423687
>If you are being fat shamed, you will think twice before eating a chocolate or any junk food.

Ehhh, when I was being fat shamed I just sort of got into an unhealthy mindset of continuing to not change my lifestyle because "fuck those cunts"
no one fatshamed me out of concern for my health, they did it out of malice and because they wanted someone to make a mockery of.

I'm skinny now because I chose to go on the weight loss journey for myself, not because people were shitheads to me (them being shitty actually discouraged me greatly from weightloss) I did it because I wanted to fit into clothes again.

If fat shaming worked, I'd be back to my baby weight by now, you bitches are relentless

>>10423757
>Intermediate fasting has health benefits for thin people too. It's good for your gut biodome
This is some Jordan Peterson shit.

>>10423791
I literally said it was disordered. Absolutely no one will ever claim that disordered is healthy. The fact that my friends on the hardcore fat-acceptance train thought it would be better to shame me and bitch about diets rather than ask "are you okay?" is not cool. I had to cut them off.
They didn't even clock my eating as disordered, either. It was never explicitly mentioned. I don't know what they thought I was doing, but I was shamed for "buying in to diet culture" as if I was doing it just to spite them and their ~cause~.
Weight-related bullying seldom brings about healthy change.
>Why did you expect people to be nice to you when you were literally starving yourself?
I didn't expect to have my ass kissed, and I certainly didn't expect or deserve to be bullied for a mental health issue either.

>>10423818
>i have many overweight friends and i love them but it hurts to hear about their low energy, sore knees and hips and backs, insomnia, depression, digestive and gynecological issues, that they blame on vague "chronic illness"
You sound like such a great friend. "chronic illness" huh? You don't even believe what your "Friends" are telling you.

>>10423818
I'm overweight and have never had a single health issue. Meanwhile I know people who have always been thin and now have diabetes or cancer. This concern-trolling is gross.

>>10423824
>you bitches are relentless
Right?
Why does most of this thread, 82 posters and 297 replies - all want to defend their right to make fun of fat people this fucking hard?

Like what is in it for you anons that you absolutely NEED to fat shame people?

>>10423828
I guess you having no issue means her friends are lying about their health issues?

>>10423823
creating a wide range of sizes is prohibitively expensive and brands are already barely getting by. they sell "off the rack" clothing for cheap, made to fit the general body sizes of their majority customers; the asian market. aatp has stopped releasing many things in men's sizes, is that misandry, or is it just that no men buy any of it? the men's size could also fit larger women, but if those women were buying it, they wouldn't have stop producing it. the larger size is not selling well enough to justify the cost of making it.

meanwhile, plus size lolitas can buy from taobao sellers who work directly with factories and can cheaply do custom sizing.

inclusion is entitlement when including you means bending over backwards and reducing the profit margin of companies that are barely keeping afloat, when there are dozens of alternative taobao and indie brands that will cater to your size or even custom size to your measurements.

>>10423814
I don't waste my time harassing fat people. But we're in a thread talking about them and a ton of people are saying that obesity is normal and okay so I decided to speak up about that. If you can't handle what I said, go back to Facebook, YouTube or Twitter. There are lots of people on there who will coddle you.

>>10423834
>is that misandry, or is it just that no men buy any of it?
what?? A lot of women, trans, and non binary wear ouji. Brands are definitely aware of that.

>>10423835
>a ton of people are saying that obesity is normal and okay so I decided to speak up about that
oh no that must be so soul crushing for you that they're being accepted by some people

>>10423832
It means that fat does not equal unhealthy and thin does not equal healthy. There are so many other factors.

>>10423829
Honestly I appreciate this anon as weird as it sounds, because they aren't pretending its for "concern for their health uwu" >>10423307

You'd think on an anonymous imageboard people would say "nope, you're right, I just want to make fun of fat people because I'm a bitch"
but they want to be seen as good in their own eyes, even on an anonymous imageboard and say "noooooo... I'm a vapid bitch for their own health!!!"

I can't wrap my head around it, its like a sort of mental gymnastics to try to make themselves look good.

>>10423837
>when you don't have a good argument so the best you can come up with is this

I don't care if someone wants to kill themselves being fat but being overweight should get little to no healthcare other than encouragement to lose the weight.

>>10423847
Don’t comment on this thread when you clearly didn’t bother to watch the video it’s about

>>10423829
less productive, less able people, slower to do almost any job even if it's just stocking shelves or standing at a cash register, in groups we have to slow down and find somewhere to sit after walking for 15 minutes, taking up more space than needed, consuming more resources than needed, radiating heat and sweat and smell in close quarters, straining the healthcare system, filling up public transit, causing chaos in staircases and doorways during a fire or something, can't do shit like dig and plant a garden, rearrange your furniture, help carry a heavy load like if your friend is moving out, go hiking in nature, play with your kids, jog with your dog, take up arms and fight off the invading russians, whatever it is, you are less able and a bigger strain on the country's resources, you contribute less and require more given to you, your presence in a crowd is its own man-spreading. idc abt diet or exercise or whatever but dont pretend like people are just so vain they want u to change to look better for their sake and im not going to say its about health, to me its about being less of a burden on society.

>>10423854
>in groups we have to slow down and find somewhere to sit after walking for 15 minutes
this is such an exaggeration.
I briefly worked with one of the girls from my 600 lb life and she was able to walk quite a ways with no issues.

>to me its about being less of a burden on society.
Well making fun of them and concern trolling them doesn't make them go away, stupid.

>>10423853
Anyone can comment on any thread they want.

>>10423863
That's true but that's also pretty stupid.
I sure as hell don't waste my time in threads where I'm not even interested in the subject. Why are you doing that?

>>10423864
Because I can and I will.

>>10423284
Based self discipline femanon, don't let other jealous people bring you down, achieving a body type is a feat of accomplishment, and deserves to be acknowledged for the will and restraint that goes in, in fact, just the idea alone that a girl is doing everything she can to lose weight is attractive and enduring I think, because it shows that that individual has good self discipline and a sense of who they see themselves as, and willingness to get there. Physical beauty and personality actually can be connected, and with that kind of attitude, it shows, that truly is the best form of beauty. Keep up the hard work femanon.

>>10423847

Fat people can have health problems unrelated to their weight (in fact, some of these health problems affect hormone and other balances that end up increasing their appetite and indirectly leading to weight gain like pcos and thyroid issues). But even disregarding health issues that can lead to weight problems, you can have other health problems regardless of size and then end up being fat later. And being overweight and seriously obese are also two different categories so a chubby person can have health concerns like strep throat, STIs, COVID-19, pregnancy (which needs tons of medical care and often pregnancies lead to weight gain), disabilities, etc.

I know this is a troll and yes weight loss is a good health goal for obese people, but it's possible to be fat and still have other separate health conditions. Heck, mentally speaking, a health concern like depression or addiction to food going untreated often leads to the weight gain to begin with because of using food as a coping mechanism

>>10423867

Scrote detected

Losing weight for oneself is good but cgl is full of women, fuck off with that "femanon" shit and blabbing about what men find attractive. Even thin lolitas on this board couldn't give two fucks about what men like or find appealing in a woman. Most of us stay small for health, our personal aesthetic preferences, and to fit our Japanese burando,

Seriously, this thread is full of men and it's very telling.

>>10423868
Pregnancies actually don't need much medical care unless there's complications. The medical industry in America at least, has coddled women into thinking they can't do it without them. The whole birthing process only benefits the doctors. As for Covid 19, obese people are among the list of people that are most at risk of suffering drastically. No excuses.

>>10423874
More like full of overweight women.

>>10423876

I never said there is any reason not to encourage obese people to lose weight. Pregnancies can easily have complications and require regular checkups; you sound like a dude acting like pregnancies don't need medical attention. Even midwives are supposed to be trained and experienced people if you don't go the hospital birth route. Pregnancies easily have complications/they are common enough to be on the lookout for.

And yes obese people are higher risk and they should lose weight generally speaking but the argument they should be denied treatment for an infection targeting their lungs (or any illness like asthma, cancer, whatever else that they could have still had even if they weren't fat) and told to go lose weight instead of being given the care they need is just actually retarded.

>>10423879
>Pregnancies easily have complications/they are common enough to be on the lookout for.
Not really. If you look at women in other countries having a baby is a matter of staying nourished and then squat the baby out and go back to work. 1st world countries actually have higher complications of pregnancies because, you guessed it, the mother being overweight and the medical industry so keen on pumping you with drugs and laying you in positions that hurts both you and the baby.

>told to go lose weight instead of being given the care they need is just actually retarded.
That's actually what happens because being overweight is more then likely a cause for those issues. Someone with asthma that keeps up with cardio excersice is going to have stronger lungs than someone who doesn't.

>>10423878
Spoken like a true scrote.

>>10423887
>other countries having a baby is a matter of staying nourished and then squat the baby out and go back to work.
Yea that doesn't sound like the way to go. Most women need like 6 weeks at least of recovery time before they go back to work if they have a physical job.
I guess it's different if you just sit at a computer for work all day.

Last place I worked was an office job and one of the higher up ladies got pregnant and was gone for like a few months. Her husband also got time off to spend time with the baby.

A mom going back to work right after popping out the kid doesn't sound like the best for the parent/child bond.

>>10423888
I'm not a man, but go ahead and tell yourself whatever you need to.
The majority of this thread and cgl in general is made up of overly defensive fat women.

>>10423893
No one's going to believe you because you use terms like "femanon"

And if you ACTUALLY read the thread, you would see that it's mostly bitter thin bitches defending their need to hate on fatties. There are very few fat people in this thread from reading the replies.

>>10423839
OP of the thread here. I made this thread last night and woke up this morning and read through all the replies I missed.

I've mostly been sitting back and observing, only to reply to a couple people in the thread every now and then as we're sitting at 326 replies.

It's amazing that hardly anyone answered the questions I posted, especially the most hard hitting question, "Have you ever fat shamed someone on cgl" - I think only one anon owned up to it and the rest who did answer that question were the ones getting shamed which is really saying something about the kind of anons on this board in general.

>>10423899
I'm not that anon. And now I'm wondering if you've been reading the thread because there are more than a few people admitting they're fat in the thread. Plus it's pretty easy to tell when someone is by how angry and defensive they get when anyone even dares to imply that obesity isn't positive.

>>10423891
during colonization women were sent to america from england and franc and they were given money from the government once they had 6 kids to encourage populating the colonies. the average woman had 9 children during this time, with no modern hospitals or technology. life was extremely hard, they worked much harder under much more duress than we face now, while pregnant, and it was common for one or two children to die before reaching adulthood. complications during childbirth were not common, or these women wouldn't have survived to have a dozen kids. we're certainly doing something wrong in modern times, whether it's the healthcare system or our lifestyle and diet.

>>10423903
>there are more than a few people admitting they're fat in the thread.
yes, but the amount of people hating on them outnumbers them.
That is why I used the word "mostly".

>>10423903
>Plus it's pretty easy to tell when someone is by how angry and defensive they get when anyone even dares to imply that obesity isn't positive.
It's also pretty easy to tell that this thread triggered all the ana chans on this board who need to justify hatting fatties. What's that about.

>>10423891
>Most women need like 6 weeks at least of recovery time before they go back to work if they have a physical job.
Yes, we're spoiled and coddled. It did not use to be like this. The proper way to have a baby is in a squatting position, some can even do it standing up and pull the baby out themselves. You wrapped the baby back up and nursed while you worked the fields. Women are stronger than you realize...or used to be.
>>10423900
It's 4chan, I don't know what you expected. Just because we're women doesn't mean we aren't as bad as the men on this site.

>>10423900
Most people I know don't fat shame anyone directly, cgl or otherwise, but we do talk about weight issues as a negative thing in general. I think it's perfectly reasonable to say that it's an issue for people's physical and mental health, the healthcare system, and especially hurts children and people aging through their 30s into 40s and up. Most people here are in their teens and 20s and their main experience of negativity about weight is appearance based which makes sense in lolita especially. They might not have glaring health issues right now, but going forward that could change drastically. This will also be the first time in history we have such a sedentary and overweight population and we don't know how that's going to affect the healthcare industry, or if the average lifespan is going to drop back down. In the next 30 years, if the world holds up, it will be interesting to see if our bodies do.

>>10423908
>It's 4chan, I don't know what you expected. Just because we're women doesn't mean we aren't as bad as the men on this site.
seriously, these people need to visit /g/ on the farm some time lmao

>>10423876
Women used to die in childbirth all the time, are you insane??

>>10423904
Those women only had 12 kids because their husbands raped them every night and didn’t care if they died. Stop jerking it off to what your fantasies of the “gold old days” are.

>>10423907
People have already given plenty of reasons in the thread. Putting aside any opinion on physical appearance, your attitudes are atrocious and very hard to feel sympathetic for.

>>10423500
Yeah they did??? Just because you weren't interested doesn't mean that others weren't

>>10423917
>>10423921
It's kinda sad that you don't know the history of women but not surprising. They don't exactly teach these things in school. The point of this argument is women are tougher and much more capable than what you all are lead to believe. We are not weak especially when it comes to childbirth which is something we were built to do, but that has slowly been taken away from us over time. All the medication, device and procedures created because men thought that they knew better when it's been something we been doing fine by ourselves. The main reasons for death and complications in the past is malnourishment and abuse. Leave a woman alone and let her eat right and there rarely is a problem.

>>10423921

>>10423561
Sack dresses don't look good on plus size ppl, which is why I don't buy them


Same goes for a lot of the plus size brand dresses, yeah they "fit" but a good chunk of them are high waist

>>10423925
if enough people bought them they would have continued to make them. companies arent stupid, they tried it and if there was enough interest, if plus sized lolitas were such a big market, they would absolutely be releasing bigger sizes. that just isn't the reality. it's a small market and catering to them would cause the company to lose more money than it's worth, you need to make a certain number in a production run, and sell a certain number of those, to break even. they don't not-know you exist, they know it and know that either you're too cheap or too few in number to justify the cost of production. brands are on life support and can't cater to a minority of their customer base for sjw points, and japan of all places certainly doesn't accept sjw points as legal tender

>>10423589
Big pharam pushes pill sells and with the over diagnosis of children we have at least two generations that grew up on meds that cause weight gain

>>10423618
>You just need to shit on people.
That's really what it is desu


If fat people didn't exist, these people would shit on pocs or uglies, fatties are just the low hanging fruit

>>10423933
Yup and they hate being called out on it.

>>10423911
>Most people here are in their teens and 20s
Yea this is a good explanation for all the piss poor trolling.

>>10423908
>It's 4chan, I don't know what you expected. Just because we're women doesn't mean we aren't as bad as the men on this site.
Why are you happy with that.

>>10423913
Yes, I'm aware of the farm.

>>10423933
poc and uglies arent obviously lazy, gluttonous, lacking self control and discipline, incapable of completing most entry level labor and straining the economy on welfare, straining the healthcare system and taking up hospital beds, becoming disabled because they can't control themselves and needing able bodied more disciplined people to cart them around and wipe their asses. the war on drugs failed, obesity is worse for the country and caused by addiction and toxic coping mechanisms, poverty and lack of education. sjw delusional lunacy is preventing anyone from speaking out against a cancer on our society

>>10423938
>the war on drugs failed,
God, were you a fan of W Bush?

>>10423790
The kumya skirts are sometimes plus size, but it's a pain fighting off everyone and their grandma to get them

>>10423939
i voted for him yes

>>10423938
Is your space bar broken? Breath bitch

>>10423956
And yet that doesn't discount anything that they said.

>>10423899
Weird, when I scroll up it's mostly the defensive fatties doing the namecalling and brainless sarcasm whenever they are out of arguments why crushing your organs with fat is healthy. I'd also think the one who can't fit into most lolita and suffers under their fat but doesn't change it is the bitter one.

>>10423938
This. But hamplanets simply can't cope healthily (or judging by this thread, argument properly), so telling themselves any critique is just the hatuurz is the easy solution.

>>10423887

Losing weight won't cute cancer; losing weight won't stop your thyroid hormones from being wacky, losing weight doesn't always help depression (endorphins aren't a replacement for meds for those with real chemical imbalances).

Fat people DO need to lose weight and it can make some health issues worse but there are people who would still catch diseases or develop sicknesses besides the ones connected to their weight.

If a fat person broke an arm, are you going to deny them a cast? If they have poor vision, will you deny them glasses? If they had asthma, should a doctor not provide a rescue inhaler and tell them to jog it off and hope for the best?

Yes fat can cause heart disease, type II diabetes, and more, but people can be sick or need medical attention in ways that losing weight wouldn't fix and even if it would they still need healthcare in that moment or else they will die before having a chance to lose weight anyway.

It's the same as denying a smoker skin cancer treatment (because smoking is a risky behavior and an addiction similar to extreme eating) and telling them "if you quit smoking it will go away", even though the smoking didn't cause the skin problem, UV rays and sun exposure combined with flaws in cell replication did.

>>10423281
>>10423281
I just felt it was completely denying the issue that America has an obesity problem. We have double the portions and drinks here. Remember when 16oz was the average (still is in some places)? It felt like the video was excusing the medical journal studies and FACTS about health, weight gaining and fat. Wasn't there a huge documentary about fast food and weight gain? If anything, THAT is what America really is. We eat and we have little to no exercise. Does fatshaming work? No. And I don't agree with it but the rest of the th ohhh nas she mentioned I thought was just an opinion and little research on the bigger problem here. Are we fat because we're unhealthy? Or are we unhealthy because we're fat? Personally, I will take accountability for my actions and what I put in my body. I'm a fat girl, with a mental illness, a fatty liver and kidney stones. I was perfectly fine when I was younger but somewhere down the road I was overeating due to stress and depression and then went to being lazy and procrastinating instead of actually cooking my own food. Let's not deny that is some people's reality. A majority actually.
People with health issues and are obese need to mentally take care of themselves instead of simply putting it off or moping about it. THERE IS SOMETHING YOU CAN DO AND FIX. Even if you have a disability. There are resources out there, grassroots, organizations and foundations to help the disable, combat their mental illness and get themselves to a different standard. Their own standard and healthy and non toxic ways to achieve their body/health goals.
There's a way to be body positive and still be a health advocate and I feel communities do NOT address this. It's alway an attack on fat people when you mention you're a health advocate despite not saying anything to them. Lizzo for example, is a good model that balances a great diet and exercise.

>>10423987
She's still fat but she's been placing self care and mental health too. Everyone has different body types but I think if you maintain a good diet and exercise, you're good. If you're just eating greasy, fatty junk food like me and not doing any physical exercise, or seeing a therapist, you're not going to get anywhere.You're just stuck in a self loathing loop even worse if YOU KNOW YOU ARE but choose to do nothing about it.

this thread just goes to show that plus sized people are just as discriminated against as POC and no one pays attention to it

>>10423990
Reminder not to respond to bait

>>10423409
Being severely underweight is unhealthy and so is being overweight. I don’t know what that has to do with you saying that “not everyone can lose weight with CICO” when they literally can

>>10423926
You’re dumb as a bag of rocks if you think childbirth was fine for women historically. By all means, go live in the forest without medical intervention, get pregnant and give birth, see how it goes for you.

Also
>ignoring centuries of midwives and how they’ve contributed to how pregnancy and childbirth is treated by doctors, as if it’s always been all men

>>10423908
>Just because we're women doesn't mean we aren't as bad as the men on this site
imagine being proud of this fact. incredible

>>10424082
the average woman 200 years ago had 9 children, if child birth was a coin flip that would not be statistically possible, it isnt rocket science. the cause of mortality during birth was doctor's believing that it was in fact rocket science, forcing labor, extracting babies with forceps, and completely knocking out the mother with high doses of anesthesia. that was primarily in cities during the victorian era and began again after WW1. literally every woman on a farm in the middle of nowhere during the colonial times popped out 9 kids back to back and without access to doctors or hospitals. ur dum!!

>>10423934
>>10423935
>>10423937
Careful or you'll seeth yourself into another heart attack.

>>10423618
>I'm pretty sure you're just using this as an opportunity to be a severe cunt.
They aren't wrong though and you probably know it.

>>10424128
And women died in childbirth all the fucking time. Poor and rich women. On their 1st child or their 10th child. Of course we never hear about the women who died because their husbands would just remarry the next 18 year old and move on with their lives.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_women_who_died_in_childbirth

And it was other women who advocated anesthesia during childbirth, men wanted women to feel the pain because of religious bullshit.

>>10423795
>if fat shaming really worked there would be no fat people.

There are fat people all thanks to those trying to normalize fat people.

>Uhhh, it is ok to be fat.
>Uhhh, fat is healthy too.

>>10423712
I agree with this. Any time I've self posted I get called out as having this illness or to eat more. I'm glad that I've never had thoughts about my weight/appearance because my cousins and older relatives all have had similar body weight to me growing up, so I can easily ignore the comments. But it does make me worry for the other anons who might take it to heart.

>>10423663
Ok, but why this should be our problem? I have never seen a fat person drop school or steal to eat more such as some drug addicts, they are only harming themselves and we already know that shaming them won’t help them so wtf people are still doing it unless the reason is just feeling pleasure from humiliating others?

>>10424217
>I want to be mean to people without repercussions and fat people are my chosen target. and if I tell people i'm just concerned about their health then no one can call me out for being a shitty human being!

>>10423888
Kek'd at that image, and I'm a male, saved.

>>10423926
You sound like my mother, that was one of the wisest things I think I've read on this website in a long time. My mother used to say things like that a lot, she had 8 children, a very strong woman. A real woman.
>>10424082
>Women were never meant to give birth and babies magically grow on trees
Shut up

>>10424315
>we

>>10424430
>I want to be self-destructive, a strain and a leech to the system, a burden for my family and friends and I want everyone to pat my ass for it and want then to deny physics and reality to spare my feelings from getting hurt!

>>10424315
drug addicts end up on the streets, (excessive) fat people end up in hospitals taking up beds nd draining more state resources than a junkie can

>>10424430
I'm not concerned about your health, I just don't like looking at you, go back to the trailer park Bertha

>>10423468
She made this picture to combat fatphobia? That's some excellent 4D chess. That must have done the rounds on Chinese boards.

>>10423828
A woman in my family smoked and still lived to be almost a hundred, I guess that means smoking is harmless

>>10424939
lol right? she's the anon who did the fantastic sugary carnival electric chair pic so i'm inclined to believe the whole thing is just an elaborate shitpost.

>>10423854
Yes anon, go off

>>10424564
>I just don't like looking at you
too bad for you then.

>>10424217
>There are fat people all thanks to those trying to normalize fat people.
No one was trying to normalize fat people back in the 60s but they still existed.

>>10423987
>Wasn't there a huge documentary about fast food and weight gain?
are you talking about Super Size Me or Fast Food Nation?
Both of which are NOT good docs..

>>10423980
>losing weight doesn't always help depression
Fucking thank you. I'm so sick of my ex talking about how working out totally makes him happier when it's clear he still has a drinking problem and still suffers from severe depression.

>>10423969
>Weird, when I scroll up
OP here and I've been in the thread the entire time I've unfortunately read every reply.
There is a lot more defending fat hate than the opposite. Not only that, but the fatties are just asking to be not hated? Why is that so hard?

But instead it's just a bunch of cunts on here being cunts as always and insisting that it's ok to hate fat people. You're blind if you're missing those posts.

>>10424170
wrong again, loser.

>>10424563
>fat people end up in hospitals taking up beds
Pretty sure that's COVID patients these days.

>>10430858
>Why is that so hard?
People have given plenty of reasons in the thread but you just choose to ignore it.
Also, cgl hates on everyone, not just fat people. I'm not saying that I agree with it, I actually hate how vile people on here can be. I just hope you're not only demanding people be nice to fat people because you yourself are fat while you knowingly crap on other people in other threads.

>>10431098
>I just hope you're not only demanding people be nice to fat people because you yourself are fat while you knowingly crap on other people in other threads
The only time I do that is when gulls are being assholes for no good reason.

>cgl hates on everyone
Yea, which is why a lot of anons quickly replied here to defend shitting on someone.