/cgl/ - Cosplay & EGL

This is probably my favourite picture of all time.

Why does /cgl/ romanticize old school so much? Some of these coords are really nice, but there's also a lot that don't even look remotely lolita (I'm looking at you, >>7870115 >>7870117 >>7870120 )

I originally fell in love with old school lolita, but I think I prefer where the fashion has come. Very put together and elegant (ignoring the horror that happened to sweet lolita)

>>7870165
Those look very lolita, tumblr newb. Those pictures were from 80's-90's, the fashion has changed a lot. I like oldschool because it was mostly handmade. It just made it so much more expressive as a fashion imho. It's focus was more on the spirit than the aesthetic.

>>7870165
its the tumblr hipster "I was there first so I must be better" style of thinking. Old school is therefore good because it's old.

>>7870176
I disagree, tumblr lolitas hate oldschool. Hipster isn't about expressing your true self, it's about impressing a crowed and setting in your image. A hipster would never admit to being a hipster. This is why hipsters hate oldschool, it doesn't match their own aesthetic. Same reason they created shit like "pretty punk" "soft grunge", and "pastel goth". Not to say that all oldschool is good, it just annoys me when I hear tumblr lolitas say shit like "omg this is ita, her bloomers are showing". Stfu, you don't know shit about lolita.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3xe-Wxio1o

I thought above video was pretty spot on when it comes to hipster.

I like old and new lolita, I friggen hate prints, though. Not that they don't look good, more that people focus on it and have it consume the entire outfit. I miss the days when lolita focused on the design of the dress. I also miss the massive amounts of lace, we're at a lace deficiency as of late.

>got really high last night
>window shopping on the internet
>stumble on Maxicimam and all their old skool shit
>almost bought over $500 worth of stuff I probably wouldn't like on a sober basis
>bf came over and distracted me
That was close. I like some of their stuff but I just wouldn't spend the amount they ask for on most of their items. Doesn't seem worth it.
They want 24,624 yen for pic related and it almost looks like a Bodyline getup..

(Sorry for the wall of text!)
Old school shouldn't be dismissed entirely by people that dislike the way it looked, this is where the fashion came from after all and without it we wouldn't be wearing lolita at all.
Not saying all people do this, but some surely do. You don't *have* to like it of course, but don't trash it.
I'm biased and nostalgic as I've been in the fashion for over 10 years and started with old school when it was still new iyswim.
It's more trend driven these days, and more central around prints and wearing a lot of accessories, where old school had less prints, more solids and was less OTT.
It was more creative and fun imo. Experimenting was ok, we learned from the mistakes.
Simple and dressed down co-ords were not looked down upon unlike they do these days. Simple & dressed down is not ita when done right, it can still be bold and rather a statement.
I liked the hair tutorials from GLB's, and the use of natural hair instead of wigs.
The aesthetic of the "old school" co-ords just speak more to me than the all decked out in the newest most popular AP print + matching accessories.
Velveteen was pretty popular back then, and I'm still a sucker for it now. I like the all black, white or pink co-ords, or striking black x white (deemed ita these days) or red x white.
I love rhs, platforms and the clunky shoes, these were all amazing to me.
Sweet was also very different back then, personally I think it was cuter.
Old school gothic is to die for, to me it's just perfection and this is where I still get my inspiration from this very day.
It just all comes down to personal taste and tastes just differ. Which is ok!
The newer things are lovely too. I think I prefer a bit of both worlds really.

>>7870165
i got into lolita in 2004/2005 and have been more or less accompanying the trends since then. i like the new lolita because it managed to evolve from a silhouette that was pretty basic. prints are everywhere now and that's great, but sometimes i miss the old, "more plain" outfits, and especially the aprons and headdresses.
i think the more time passes the more you distance yourself from the old early 2000s and start seeing good things in it. it can be romanticizing but i genuinely miss the velveteen, the lace, the black and white. sure it has a lot of potential to become ita, but so does sweet these days. heck even classic can be ita when badly coordinated and stuff like that. i've noticed a few old school-ish things making a come back (dresses that evoke that simpler feel, the velveteen meta never gave up on, crosses, black and white) and that makes me happy.
it's like >>7870182 anon said, prints can become the whole focus of an outfit after a while and it can get tiring, so it's natural you'll want to see more simple, but still well done, coords.

Quite a bunch of Taobao brands seem to do old school sweet pieces lately.

>>7870239

i started looking at lolita and tokyo street fashion when i was a kid when i got the fruits book. i find old school so much more original and doll-like than designs today. even tho i really enjoy newer designs from AP, old school meta is just goooold

>>7870239
>>7870242
Jeez, the dresses are cute but
>that human-swan hybrid wig head

moon kana mmmm

>>7870242

this fuels me

>>7870254

>>7870258

>>7870130
dream dress

How far we have ventured.

I love these old Meta collection and ad pics.

>>7870281

>>7870287

>>7870288

This is heaven. I keep going back to looking at older pieces. Is it ok to wear this stuff outside of an "old school meet"? I've been in the fashion for less than a year so it wouldn't be legit, but damn I love this. I know there are always going to be people that get it confused with ita though.

>>7870291

>>7870294

>>7870226
This is my favourite Meta collection. I own two colourways of the op. A dream item of mine is the matching bonnet or headbow.

I like both old school and current releases. I believe lolita did evolve but that there is also a lot of underrated dresses due to their age. The details and materials used in old school lolita is stunning and sometimes superior to modern day brand.

any old school dbz or sailor moon? was it always gothic?

>>7870296
this is so perfect

>>7870165
are you the same person who was shitting up the ero loli thread?

You have no idea how much I fucking miss aprons. Props to all who are brave enough to wear them. If lolita witch is acceptable, then I wanna be a loli maid.

>>7870292
Ita=looks bad. If it looks good, then it's not ita. And I agree, people like to pull the whole, "If I don't like the style, it's ita" thing.

>>7870328
Aprons have a little comeback since a while, even at printed dresses.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPzNGqJcgwo

Hnnnggggg, nostalgia. ;_;

>>7870345
oh hey it's chigothloli! How have I never seen this before? Glad to see some of these girls are still around too!
>goddamnit alice is only getting cuter with age

>>7870328
this is so cute oh goddd

>>7870340
where can u buy this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGJpV5A2OAs&index=79&
Does anone remember this report?
Back when lolita was rare in the media my comm watched it over and over again...

Over ten years and I still haven't found out the name of the background music

>>7870114
I miss old school so much.
I miss the times where forums and lolita communities on LJ were still active and that lolita wasn't so popular. I miss a bit of everything except for the fact that my favourite brands were so hard to get because the internet wasn't what it is today. I really miss the old lolita aesthetic for some parts especially sweet, now it's a lot of pastel vomit and colorful wigs and cupcakes and rainbows and there's all that social status bullshit in lolita now.
What happened to just dressing up and feeling pretty and enjoying it? Now it's like a contest to who's the most popular and shit,there was that kind of shit before for sure but a lot less.
I stop ranting now. Sweet nostalgia.

>>7870120
Oh god the time where Angelic Pretty was just called "Pretty". Some of these coords aren't "lolita" but i still feel nostalgic about it,makeup was so much more natural too it was so much cuter.
feelsoldmang.jpg

>>7870437
oh god please someone translate this it looks like solid gold.

>>7870495
Well popularity used to be more based on how much brand you had considering it was much harder to acquire. Remember gotlolita?

>>7870281
What an amazing collection. I love Meta's school series. Any of them.

>>7870335
I have seen a lot of people get it confused because it follows a different aesthetic in some ways, the whole natural hair/makeup, the use of black and white, and less poof. I don't really care about those people but I do wonder if it's ok to wear it, or if it's like digging things up from the past too much

>>7870255
>>7870134
>>7870227
The one thing I can't stand are the weird lumpy sleeves.

Like, one lump would be fine, on the upper arm to poof the top a little bit or for where there would be detachable sleeves, but all the way down is just too much for me.

>>7870655
I kind of like them. Totally forgot they were a thing.

>>7870263
I am in love with this! Anyone know where it's from/more info?

>>7870683
http://www.qutieland.com/product.php?id=703

>>7870655
Always reminds me of either fat baby marshmallow arms or catapillers. I can get behind cute catapillers but it's hard not to think of chubby baby arms instead

>>7870296
may i have an ID on this collection?

I love this so much. My favorite style of lolita dresses are the really plain ones that are all one color, have full shirring and like two layers of ruffles and a tiny bit of lace. Especially old school in red and sax... I also really love pieces like>>7870330. They are just so wearable and cute.

Once I am able to I will get a few of those on Mbok and closet child, I heard they are really cheap.

I am a lolita noob but this style still makes me feel nostalgic as it has a really cutesy forest girl feel! And I know it isn't mori but I always feel like certain parts are, I imagine old school lolitas living in tree houses in the forest and playing with the forest animals all day long.

/r/ing old school hair tutorials!

>>7870270

Best drug deal ever.

>>7870416
the url is literally on the picture

>>7870726

It's from 2004 I think?

>>7870756
my bad lol

>>7870227
I love this coord so much. Old School means a lot to me, I discovered lolita in about 2005 when I got into J-Rock/Vkei, and stuff like >>7870140 were the first things I saw that made me fall in love with the fashion. When I actually came back to it many years later and started wearing it, I was surprised by how much it changed.
I like prints and "modern" lolita fashion, but I feel like a lot of the "street fashion" aspect has died a bit. I wish brands released more non-print stuff, and promoted it as much as they did some of their prints (like the pintuck frill pinafore meta has, I love that shit).

>>7870957
Sorry for the huge file, damn it. Pic related is the meta dress I mentioned.

>>7870963
ohh this is my ultimate dream dress but I need to lose more weight to fit into it. I really love this dress in this colorway. Red is my absolute favorite old school color!
Do you know what material it is made of? I forget..

I really want to do a medieval coord with it and a princess sleeved blouse and themed tights and taped hair and gold accents. So much want.

>>7870963
Is this dress old school? I see it pop up ever so often. Unfortunately, not in this color. This colorway is on my dream dress list.

I can't say I know too much about old school. I do not wear jsk/ops with prints (which I guess distinguishes old from new?), but at the same time, I am on the fence with the old school look. I finally got to watch kamikaze girls last weekend, and I think I would have only worn may 1-2 of her looks.

>>7870977
I don't have it, unfortunately! It's one of my dream dresses too. I remember it being some synthetic material though? The pictures look very soft.
>>7870978
Not sure I'd call it old school (they've been releasing pretty much this dress in different colorways regularly for a while now, the earliest I found was 2007), but it gives me that feel you know? Non-print and with all those details.
Momoko in particular had some great looks imo, but looking through the old GLBs and such, there a few atrocious ones as well. I guess it's hit and miss, but the hits are really great for me.

>>7871001

I guess I should clarify. I don't know if I could wear old school, but I Iike when other people wear it. I guess I should go back and look at her outfits again, while not also trying to watch the movie.

I think people judge black and white coords to harshly (which seems to be common in old school.) I wish I could see more of these coords. I went to a gigantic lolita meet in the summer (about 90 lolitas) and I only remember one girl wearing old school. She was so cute with her her black and white coord, headpiece and rhs. One out of 90.

>>7870291
I feel like meta was the best in the era of oldschool

Now probably VM/MM
I'd put ap or Baby, but I feel lately there isn't as much attention to detail and construction. Not that it's near bad, but I feel VM/MM up the notch a bit more.

From one of this year's Kera issues.

>>7870263

>>7871100
waiting for my hair to be long so i can make nice thick twin tails like this...

i love how lolita is still introduced as old school

>>7870384
>they tried to bury it (jk) but they still look kawaii as ever

>>7871100
I love this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV5FAkyAg_M

more nostalgia~

>>7871115
Good luck with that considering that's a wig. Length doesn't matter as much as thickness, I've never seen anyone with nice hair thick enough to get that result

>>7870734
lol

Also does anyone remember when we used to talk about lolita biker gangs on LJ?

>>7871100
>my old dream dress with that cute maxipad headdress and blouse and all that pretty lace
>one of the first dress i ever saw when i discovered the fashion by being interested in VKei and Jfashion in 2005
old school feels i miss those carefree days where i was still a bit of a weeb ; _ ;

>>7871019
I'm also with you anon, Meta is my favourite for oldschool. IW is quite detailed now and I also really appreciate the details of Moitie items.

>>7870171
Ugggh can we bring back long drawers? They look so great.

>>7870188
Marry that man

>>7870278
Fucking love shirring princess

This is still one of my dream dresses. I'd love to have the emerald green version some day.

>>7871823
I just received the emerald green version and it's gorgeous. I'm looking for the wine version next or the headwear for the green or black. I hope you can find it anon. I'd check the secondhand sites (mainly maiden clothing and fururun) aswell as y ja/mbok. Good luck.

>>7871883

Thanks anon. You are so lucky!
Can you tell me the approx measurements of the op (bust and waist)? Can't seem to find them anywhere.
Meta is usually quite generous with their OP's so I assume that this will fit.

>>7871883
Did you get it off Alice+Fururun? Damn youuuuuu

does anyone like it when bloomers show? i dont know i find it to be so cute and doll-like, i wish it wouldnt be so heavily frowned upon now
>>7870171

>>7872223

>>7871019
I live for oldschool meta. I feel like baby had maybe 2 cuts in different colorways, although they were cute.

>>7871100
>>7871111
Fuck I love this so fucking much. I NEED a wine jsk and matching headdress like this, no question
>>7871157
Agreed, it's not going to work out. Just get clip ins that match your hair, it's not hard to find or expensive.

>>7871893
Your welcome and thank you. It takes a bit of time but it's worth checking those sites fairly regularly. I don't know exact measurements but as there is a bit of space left when I wear it I'd say max bust 94 and max waist 74. It can fit a lot smaller though.

>>7872019
Yes I did and found the black version on Maiden clothing. Hopefully you'll find it too!

>get into lolita at age 12 in 2004
>had plenty of loliable pieces by 2009
>17 at the time, decided I grew out of lolita/weebism and donated some of my wardrobe
>22 now, wanting to get back into j fashion
>my aesthetic is still very much inclined towards old school goth and classic, now considered ultra ita
>/cgl/ is plastered with ATOMIC CUPCAKE OTT SWEET PURINTSU
>velveteen is ded
>at least I have the last bastion of resistance in otome and natural kei

>>7872532
This means you should be able to pick up old school pieces secondhand for much cheaper! And also check auction sites. They aren't as popular, that is a good thing.

>>7872535
Thanks anon, I live in a banana republic so I go to second hand stores often and try finding loliable pieces. Ordering online is hella hard because of crazy importation taxes and stuff, but perhaps one day I will have gorgeous vintage meta in my closet.

Thank you for this thread.

>>7872548
The only people who think well done old school is ita are noons

fuck 'em, do it

>>7870655
that is so funny. I was just thinking how much I really loved them.
One of those things that love/hate.

>>7871823
I love those shoes and always have. I was really happy when Meta released new ones.

From the 劇場版 零~ゼロ~ horror movie which was produced this year, dresses were sponsored by BTSSB.

>>7871134
This is fairly recent. Do you mean to post the one featuring some former Chicago lolitas? This is a little older.

http://youtu.be/rPzNGqJcgwo

Now this here is old school:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cidzsgJ2g18

I still want to go to that shop and get myself a gothic lolita make over.

>>7872532
same, i hate the sweet print shit
but i think that velveteen is coming back, meta released a dress that looks reaaally like old school style

>>7871167
I think so. Just about any mention of LJ gets me nostalgic.

>>7870315
No.

>>7870165
I prefer the new takes on oldschool. They take all the best parts (velveteen, one color, simple jsks with lace) and modernize it and get rid of some of the fug that inherits some of these older coords.

>>7872742
This. But some legit old school is cute too. Brands have come a long way and designs today somehow seem less costumey and more tasteful. I wonder how much of this comes from the traditional "ita" being a copy of the old school style though...

>>7872720
>mfw I own this in black
I would love to find it in this colour though

>>7872715
I love old school Moitie.

Catherine Cottage makes some old-school pieces but they mainly aim for lolita-moms these days.

From some BTSSB collab from october 2013, don't know its name anymore.

>>7872715
Oh Jesus. I just realized that I dropped the video I intended to post

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGJpV5A2OAs

eh, either way, both are old school as fuck.

I kind of wonder what happened to each of these girls.

Also, I'm pissed that I can't find shoes or headgear that matches this jsk. I'm done with combing the auctions.

>>7870114
is there an old school version of ouji/boystyle? the old GLB scans i've seen didn't have anything that looked ouji-ish, more vk/aristocrat.

>>7872848
Oops, I did it again. Does anyone remember that video when some Japanese tv station went inside the Moi Meme Moitie flagship, and they interviewed some lolitas there? Most of the girls were wearing gothic lolita, two were in sweet, and I think one was just wearing Japanese goth. One of the goth lolis was an illustrator and visited a doll shop, and I think Kokusyoku Sumire had a segment, too.

>>7872857
You mean this I guess:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_O_W7BYD-E

>>7872928
And the girl with the doll painting, she is a famous artist now, married, got a daughter and hardly wears lolita anymore, then it usually is classic. I visited her exhibition in Paris last year.


Her FB is aran.rosy

What I miss most about oldschool is how simple the looks were. Now it's like "Oh you should wear 4 bracelets, 5 rings, 2 necklaces, 15 pins, at least 2 bows, preferably a wig, wrist cuffs, sock cuffs, etc etc etc to make the outfit complete!"

>>7870165
Nostalgia. I love to see how the fashion evolved, and I have a lot of respect for the girls who started wearing it and built the foundations for us youngsters.

>>7870328
I daydream of when I move out and get married and can wear stuff like this around the house while I cook for my waifu

>>7872972
this

>>7872663
WHAT? Baby sponsored a movie? How come CGL wasn't all over that

>>7872663
>劇場版 零~ゼロ
The fuck

is this a fucking project zero/fatal frame based movie?

My life is complete

>>7872520

Thanks for the info. I'll have no problem fitting that, now I know I even want it more.

>>7873595
I'm happy to hear that anon. The dress is a bit short on me both sleeve length and overall length but most dresses are short on me. If you have broad shoulders it may be a little tight across the shoulders otherwise it should be perfect. I hope you find it anon.

>>7873504
They've provided some clothing for several movies

>>7873608

I'm 5'1 (155cm) so luckily I never really had any length issues.
I really hope to find it, if not in green maybe in blue or black. Meta's velveteen pieces are just gorgeous and I can't get enough of them.

This jsk is one of my favourite pieces, the lace is so nice. I have it in black.

>>7872580
I love them too, especially if they're made out of more luxurious fabric. You have to have thin arms to pull it off, though.

>>7872928
I'm slightly obsessed with this video. Sometimes when I'm feeling down I just have it play in the background. I don't even understand Japanese, but it's calming and makes me feel pleasantly nostalgic.

>>7872946
It says on her FB the likes tumblr. Do you know if she has a tumblr herself?

>>7873680
*that she

I think this co-ord is just too cute! Sweet was so different a few years ago, and much better imo.

>>7870123
That's an interesting fabric.

Handmade you reckon?

>>7872928
Hiyoko is so cute and cool omg

>>7872928
This video makes me feel so nostalgic

>>7873700

Moitie actually, seen these pop up on y!auctions a couple of times.

Wished they still sold this wig at GLW but now they only have the longer style which isn't nearly as nice as this wig imo.
Would buy the shit out of this in like 4 colours man, I love ringlets. This wig is the perfect length.
My hair is super long and doesn't hold curl longer than 15 minutes so if I want ringlets I'll have to wear a wig.
All the other ringlet wigs I've seen don't look very natural, very plastic and shiny unfortunately.

>>7873713
cut it

>>7873714
Not the ringlet loving anon, but a long ringlet wig would not look the same as a short one when cut, because the structure is different, basically, the way the wig has been sewn prevents the short look.

>>7873714

Yeah, I was thinking of getting it cut (it's buttlength now) cause the ends are a bit split. But even when it's shorter my hair won't hold curl, I really hate my sleek hair.
>dat feel you'll never have perfect ringlets

>>7873680
Don't think so, at least she doesn't list it anywhere at her Homepage like her Twitter and FB.
http://lune-croix.com/

>>7873658
I wish there was a list of them

>>7873817
I know, right? I've tried to compile a list of movies and TV shows featuring lolita fashion, but it's kinda difficult, especially since a lot of it is not readily available in the west.

>>7873674
That's one of my dream dresses anon, I'm jelly

Praise this thread

Just out of curiosity, what do you all think of more modern dresses paired with oldschool accessories? Not so much print dresses (though feel free to give your opinion anyway) but like pic related.

>>7874954
dropped pic

>>7874956
Why not? It's not like if brands wouldn't do rectangle headdresses and platform shoes anymore.

>>7873674
It would fit you perfectly then anon. I'm on the complete opposite end of the height scale as I'm 5'8. I have never seen any worn pics of the blue dress besides the stock photos. I wish there were more. I hope you can find the green and I shall post a link in the dream dress thread if I see it. You have great taste, the velvet they use is often quite thick and lovely. That's a gorgeous dress. Besides old school do you wear other styles?

>>7873951
>dem sausage curls

>>7872928
omg, lolitanon, I love you! Thank you so much!

>>7872946
Thank you! I'm glad to hear that she's doing well. I like that she focuses more on her child, but still makes room to enjoy her own pleasures and hobbies. She's living the dream.

>>7873680
Right?!

>>7872928
>tfw video is not available in your country

>>7870114
Would this dress be considered old school or is it too frilly?

>>7875212
It's timeless.

Seriously though, Baby's been re-releasing that dress for a good while.

I think that it can be fairly old school depending on how you coordinate it.

>>7872972
this is so true. they spam accessories these days and it takes away from the quality of the actual dress. i guess the sweet vomit dresses arent enough for today's lolitas

>>7873676
ah wow i adore these sleeves, theyre so cool!

>>7872532
>velveteen
>dead
Are you even looking at the same fashion as me? Or did you just come back in summer, where of course most people aren't wearing velveteen...

>>7875072

I really hope I can find the green some day, or maybe the blue. I do wonder how hard it's going to be to find the matching headwear though.
Besides old school I also wear Gothic and (very rarely) Classic in darker tones. I also like Sailor, another thing Meta does best imo!
I'm also thinking of taking lessons so I can make handmade stuff, I bought all the Gosu Rori's and Otome no Sewing books quite a long time ago and they have really cool patterns.

>>7875700
Hnnng that dress. That's actually the EXACT dress I've been wanting to make with this fabric I have laying around but I have no idea what the main pattern pieces would look like to keep the skirt bell-shaped but the bodice from being too bulky.

>>7875700
I've been searching for the matching headwear and had no luck so far. Meta's recent velveteen release would work for the black or red though. It seems our taste is quite similair I also wear gothic (the most), classic in dark tones and general classic. Sailor is very cute.

>>7875707

Not sure I understood exactly what you meant (English isn't my first language) but here are the scans of the illustrations and pattern instructions. Maybe this can help you?
It's from Gosu Rori 3.

>>7875712
I've seen velveteen headwear pop up on auctions before, hopefully they will again.
Thinking of asking a SS to visit or contact closet child's physical shops on Tokyo to see if they have some lying around, I wouldn't mind paying a fee for that. Might also be an option for you?
It's funny how similar our tastes are! Did you also start out around 10 years ago?

>>7875733
Ohh thank you! I should've known the skirt and bodice were separate pattern pieces.

>>7875792

Glad I was able to help!

>>7874704
Or even worst, no one can find copies online

In other news, you can watch Deka Wanko with subs on youtube

Why do old school lolitas never smile? It makes their faces look gloomy as fuck.

>>7873674

That is SO pretty! I've always wanted to try lolita fashion but I have no clue where to start. I do find myself drawn to solid colors over prints though. What would you guys recommend to an anon who wants to get into lolita fashion without breaking the bank as it were?

>>7875870

Since you're just starting out, I'd suggest you'd look at secondhand western sales communities first like Lacemarket, EGL sales comm, (Facebook) Lolita sales in English.
Older garments and especially solid non-printed stuff can be bought quite cheap because it's not as popular as i.e AP's chocolate themed stuff.
There are also mentor groups on facebook that were created to help out fellow and new Lolitas.

What makes an outfit old school? No prints? No accessories?

>>7875926
-no print (or a screen printed one)
-harsher colors
-LOTS of lace and detailing
-little accessories
-platform or rocking horse shoes
-knee socks
-bonnets and rectangle headdresses instead of head eating bows
-lots of velvet

>>7875926
There were a few prints in old school, but they looked more basic and the focus wasn't on the print like it is now. Stuff like florals and tartans were used sometimes. The focus tended to be on the details of the clothes, like pintucks or the placement of the lace. Old school outfits need a few well-placed accessories, but definitely not a bunch of OTT crap piled on. No big wigs or gigantic headdresses either, and natural-looking makeup.

>>7876086

What has also changed about prints it's how it focuses on a border print I think? It used to be a more simplistic and subtle all over print.
Though there are exceptions. Those that did have the border focus, mainly had flowers and/or fruits featured and were generally less busy looking than what we have now.

>>7875926
the inspiration was a different one. people tried to look more like creepy little dolls than a sparkly pink Marie Antoinette.

>>7876023
very much this, and I'll add: less gigantic animu wigs
also lace monsters aren't necessary, there are plenty of old school outfits without much lace

>>7875870
do your research. Cannot stress it enough.

>>7870132
This dress is gorgeous

>>7875208
use proxtube addon; or just a normal proxy

>>7870182
>>7870176
>>7870171
Oh my fucking god, can we just go 5 seconds without throwing in the word tumblr?

>>7876127
we're on /cgl/, probably the tumblr-friendliest board of ALL.
>also posts from three days ago

>>7870975
Oh god, flashbacks. I remember drooling over this coat in an old Kinokuniya

>>7876127
Our board is currently infested with tumblr, we have a right to be angry. Now go back to tumblr.

>>7876130
>>7876200
Not every single thing we hate comes from tumblr, though. Just sort of sick of seeing that. It's not accurate, for one. Second, it just feels like we're beating a dead horse. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth when I'm reading a pretty decent criticism of the community or post about where the fashion's headed and tumblr's just tacked on.

Love this thread, though

>>7876127
On 4chan, calling someone a tumblr user is like calling someone a hipster. Tumblr has it's own "culture", which has generally been bad for every subculture it gets its hands on. Tumblr culture is hipster culture. It's a hipster site that's used by hipsters, though they will never admit it, because that's how hipsters are. They latch onto things they think are nerdy so they can self identify as nerds instead of hipsters, but in reality, they're just hipsters. That's why tumblr is taboo around these parts, people don't like what tumblr has done to their hobbies/subculture. /cgl/ especially is filled with tumblr users, to the point where you get banned for saying something that wouldn't appeal to this demographic. For example, we have specific rules, you can go look at them. And yet, many posts that don't violate these rules get banned/removed. This has made /cgl/ more appealing to tumblr users, which just causes a further decrease the quality/fun of the board. The new janitor of this board is a Scandinavian tumblr user. She disregards the rules and removes posts that could encourage new discussion, not because it's offensive, but because she disagrees with what is being said. I'm not talking about obvious troll posts, I mean things that are unique and could really spark some interesting debate. /cgl/ has now become an "X general" board, as opposing viewpoints or anything janitor dislikes gets removed. This is why so many users on /cgl/ are angry with tumblr, it hurts every community it's a part of.

>>7876253
On that note, why do our motherfucking secrets threads get deleted?

>>7876023
>>7876086
>>7876104
Thanks! I have >>7875212 but in black and was always wanting to do an old school vibe with it.

Are chiffon blouses too modern or can it be passed off as old school?

>>7872205
It used to be standard. :( Lolita was much more doll based back then, now it's more "pretty" based. Idk, it's hard to explain. Mainstream fashion trends have been integrated a lot as of late, and it's actually pretty disappointing.

>>7876259
Because this is one of /cgl/'s rules
>Singling people out maliciously is not tolerated and will result in a ban

meanwhile the 31869th Jessica Nigri hate thread is in full bloom because the janitors are cosplayers and love their drama and don't give a shit about lolitas on /cgl/

>>7876276
But we aren't singling them out, it's a general thread about bitching.

>>7872205
I love long bloomers! I think they're so adorable, although they don't work with all that many sweet outfits anymore

>>7876200
Tumblr has become an umbrella term for "something stupid/something I disagree with/not being a sandy bitch", people use it for everything. It's getting out of hand.

>>7876265
Which trends?

>>7876281
I was b& for "singling someone out" even though the post did not mention anybody's name and the person in question is being talked about all over the Comm --by name and with definite disdain lol. I was OP so that's why that thread got deleted. Sorry y'all.

>>7876332
Basically, trends have converged.
- 'vintage' is cool instead of being some edgy hipster thing
- lots of crochet and cotton lace in normalfag stores
- pastels
- florals - they aren't 'nana' any more
- 'fit and flare'/50s inspired silhouettes
- chiffon, velvets
- round collars/peter pan collars are actually a thing on jackets now

>>7876371
Well that is mainstream fashion. It will get over it - it's a trend.

> mfw I bought kneesocks, a headdress, and RHS after reading all of this

>>7872720
deets on this dress/blouse???????? omfg

>>7876253
m8, what the fuck are you smoking

>>7872532
Uhhh... Cgl hasn't been "plastered with ATOMIC CUPCAKE OTT SWEET PURINTSU" in fucking years. 2006-2010, yes. But now? No. Cgl mostly hates on ott sweet and rarely posts it in a positive manner(mostly because it's hard to pull off and look good in)

>>7876093
Border prints also had very few colors. Look at Osanpo candy chan and pastel ala mode for inspiration. Also, appliques. Does any brand even do appliques anymore?

>>7872946
This is awesome! She still has a killer sense of style and her art is quite remarkable. Thanks for posting anon!

fucking love prints on old school dresses

>>7877499

Embroidery was also pretty popular, don't see that very often anymore unfortunately.

I have this set, but it's teeny tiny. It doesn't even fit my mannequin which is a size s/m.
The bustier is just hggggnnnn, maybe I should get a replica made? I'm usually no fan of replica's but with something like this it's ok right?
This set is from 2004 I think.

>>7877835
Will you sell it anon? I might be interested

>>7877848

I'm not sure, but I'm thinking about it since I don't think it will ever fit me (I'm in progress of losing weight).
You have to be really small to fit it, the waist of the skirt is like 56cm and has no shirring.
The bustier has shirring but it's tight and doesn't fit the mannequin which I think has a bust of 88cm or something.
The reason it doesn't fit isn't just because it doesn't stretch far enough but also because of the straps which are too short
It also comes with a matching bonnet.

Originally fell in love with this bustier a few years ago and thought I hit the jackpot when I finally found it, despite it not being the black version I wanted. It's so detailed and pretty.
Wished Baby would do a re-release, a bustier like this is timeless.
Here's a good pic of the black I found.

>>7877499
>>7877827
I was about to pipe up about my favourite 'modern' Baby JSK but then I realized it's from 2006. Dang.
Appliques and embroidery are still used but really only for accents, not as a main focus. Maybe printing fabric is cheaper than embroidering it?

>>7877861
I'm really tiny and I have trouble finding new releases to fit me. So anything that I don't need to get altered immensely (I'm looking at you AP and BtssB your sizes are getting bigger and bigger), is a dream for me. Plus I've always loved the set, it's so beautiful!

>>7877865

Prints seem to be more popular, I think they mostly go with what sells best?
I don't know if printing is cheaper, but the embroidery was probably not done by hand but by machine.
By hand is of course more expensive and time consuming. I do love embroidery a lot and wished it'd make a comeback as main focus, not just as accents.
Personally, I'd take beautiful lace, solid colors and embroidery every day over a busy print but it's obvious I'm in the minority here. Most people probably want prints.
On the other hand, this beautiful op (pic) sold out very fast recently and it's a solid colored op with lace. It was nearly 50k yen, but people didn't mind spending that on a nicely detailed piece like this. This has an old school feel to it too imo.

>>7873696
I adore oldschool sweet, back when it focused on being feminine and cute overall, not just ott prints, pastel vomit and pandering to peoples nostalgia fetish.

>>7877879

Wow that must be so annoying for you. Brands *do* seem to make things bigger and bigger.
They can't really win in this situation because people will complain when it's too large but even more people will complain if it's too small.
I like that IW is one of the few brands that releases things in different sizes (mostly their non-shirred stuff). Instead of a one size fits all kind of mentality they truly try to cater to everyone.
Taobao brands do this as well, even with shirred pieces. So if they can do it, why can't the popular brands do the same?
They should at least update their sizes to S/M & L/LL imo.

I can't make my mind up right now, but if I decide to sell it will be on Lacemarket.

>>7877909
This year I bought an Angelic Pretty JSK that I literally (and I mean literally, not exaggerating here) could fit twice into. It made me so sad.

Juliette et Justine does multiple sizing on printed items, if they can do it, a super popular and big brand like AP can surely do it - especially sicne their stuff is made in China.

>>7877451
?????

I'm so confused by this. OTT sweet is still as popular as ever. Just because the shitty two toned wigs are finally out doesn't mean that OTT sweet is suddenly not OTT sweet. Theres more to the style than just the wig. I feel like everything is exactly the same, over accesorizing, general styling, print obsessed, only the wigs are out.

>>7877917

Angelic Pretty has the largest sizes of them all I think, Baby is large too but AP takes the cake.
I own the Coat of Arms Tartan OP which is only suited for people under 90cm bust which is considered small (probably still large on you). But their JSKs are huge compared to their OPs.
It's nice that they are listening to their average,chubby and plus sized customers but I feel they are completely forgetting about their small customers.
Personally, I think a once size fits all size is lazy and they need to step away from it.
The larger sizes sell better, so why not make a small "batch" (sorry lack of better word here) of XS/S sizes and more of the M,L &LL's? That way, no one feels left out.

>>7877928
Don't forget Meta, some of their stuff is crazy large.

>>7877928
I always thought of Meta as the "fat girl brand". Their stuff is very forgiving.

>>7877917
If you don't mind me asking, what are your measurements?

>>7877974
78-52

>>7877977
Woops sorry, those are my old measurements. I gained some weight in the last few months, now it's about 80-56

>>7877928

>tfw you're 94 cm bust, 73 cm waist
>tfw all dresses become high waisted because boobs

>>7877991
I once tried on an Angelic Pretty dress with a 120 cm bust, my boobs fit in the the dress but my boobs took up the whole bodice because it was too short. My waist looked fine but that fucking bodice man. I got a new binder so I'll try again but I'll probably just get boob loaf.

>>7875733
I'll have to keep my eye out. I know that both Tokyo pirates and chibi tenshi will do that. I acquired a dream dress that way! I should update that list and include headwear. You could also check the closet child blogs (as those items aren't listed on the website) and get an Ss to purchase it if there is something you like. It is uncanny. Sadly no I've been interested in the fashion for about five years but didn't get into the fashion until a few years ago.

>>7877944

Yes, Meta is pretty much known for it.
They've always been like this though, but the other brands have started to become bigger only a the last 5 years I think.
Baby, Aatp and AP had much smaller sizing compared to today. More and more items are shirred today too compared to 10 years ago.

>>7877979
That is very small, may I ask how tall you are?
Have you ever considered making your own clothing? I know that's not the same as wearing brand but at least it won't be so baggy.
Moitie has pretty small garments but if they have a 62cm waist it will probably still be huge on you?

>>7877991
I know how you feel. The bust of some things my stretch a lot but if the bodice is short it still won't look nice on a large chested person, had this problem myself.
I'm in progress of losing weight and I do hope mine shrink quite a bit by the time I hit my goal weight.

Is it silly I buy things that don't fit yet?
Having them in my closet somehow motivates me to keep going, to step on that treadmill and work hard.

>>7878011
Yes, Tokyo Pirates and Tenshi do that. I know you can send in a wishlist to TP and they will check regularly for you. I still need to send in mine actually. it's only a small fee too I think?
I check the blogs, 2ndhand shops and auctions regularly, but tbh not seriously enough. I procastinate too much lol.
Surely there are some treasures in the physical CC shops to be found though?

>>7877827
>>7877865
>>7877888
Lots of Taobao brands actually do embroidery dresses and they are usually even cheaper than their prints so I doubt it is more expensive to get manufactured.

>>7877998
This is the problem I find with so many dresses that have more plus sized measurements, and not just from AP. They increase the actual fabric around the bust but don't lengthen the bodice to allow for a normal looking waistline. Drives me crazy.

>>7877888
I will trade my first born for this dress

>>7878029
I'm actually kinda tall, but all the size has been put in my hips, luckily pear shape is perfect for hiding in lolita! Moitié is actually kind of big too, so are VM and Mary Magdalene. I can fit JetJ because they can alter orders, which is great! But lately they haven't been putting out nice things.

I guess I should just focus on older releases. I have some really old pieces that fit me like a charm.

>>7877888
10/10 would wear at wedding/be buried in

>>7878228
Looking fab for the Skeleton War

>>7878235
Funeral meet with open casket
u mirin
u mirin hard

>>7876261
no, sheer fabrics like chiffon weren't really acceptable back then. Your best guess would be a cotton one, preferably with a big peter pan collar.

>>7878237
Bury me in Iron Gate pls

>>7878211

I figured those brands might be quite large on you, despite them being known for having the smallest sizes. I can't imagine how difficult it must be for you to find things that fit you well.
Thank goodness for secondhand old school garments.

>>7877700
I love the red version of this! It has also a cape the velvet version
>>7877918
I think i see OTT sweet going with brown tones like chocolate prints lately and less pastel stuff.

>>7877918
I think styling terms need a change? The term "OTT sweet" was relevant when lolita still looked like this, but now days the entirety if the fashion is now OTT. Gothic, classic, everything, is now OTT, over accesorizing, wigs, the make up etc is not unique to just sweet either so people need to stop thinking sweet every time the word OTT is uttered. We have since defined not OTT as "old school" I think we can drop the term OTT all together at this point, honestly?

>>7877918 #
I think styling terms need a change? The term "OTT sweet" was relevant when lolita still looked like this, but now days the entirety if the fashion is now OTT. Gothic, classic, everything, is now OTT, over accesorizing, wigs, the make up etc is not unique to just sweet either so people need to stop thinking sweet every time the word OTT is uttered. We have since defined not OTT as "old school" I think we can drop the term OTT all together at this point, honestly?

Also, let's keep the pictures coming?

>>7878667
I disagree, just because something isn't OTT doesn't mean it's old school

>>7878684
Doesn't everyone see this as "casual" though? I swear the last casual thread everyone agreed evrything in the IW site was a casual coord. I'm not saying if its not OTT its old school, I'm saying at this point it's almost standard to the point where it's the variation that needs a name (which it has)

>>7878696
That is not casual at all.

>>7878696
Eh...I dunno if I disagree. Maybe I'm out of the loop because I left the scene for a while, but I wouldn't consider my previous picture to be casual. To me, casual is like a skirt and a cutsew or something.

>>7878696
>casual
Do you happen to be new to lolita?

>>7878710
I agree 300% but the fashion has become so OTT that this is a casual coord now lol

>>7878696

No, it isn't casual. That's fairly formal. There's a difference between dressing up nicely for high tea and putting flowers+crowns+five necklaces for a convention or major event.

>>7878731
No no you're about a month late. It was really hard, it required a lot if same fagging for which I then got banned but I think I steered their opinions to calling this "basic" or "simple coords" I even saw a "basic bitch" thread a bit ago. You're welcome.

>>7878743
Well, this is great news then! As I was raging so hard at how stupid the last casual thread was that I left cgl for two months.

>>7878731
Sorry, it doesn't work that way.

>>7870226
I hate to ask but does any one know what the op or jsk are going for.

>>7878667
You don't seem to know what OTT is then because it refers to an outfit where the person went overboard with the accessories, that's why people called it deco lolita first but prints don't make something OTT.

>>7878777
I'm the anon above who owns the green and black ops. I bought the black for 10,000 yen and the green for 7,000 yen. On the western market I've seen the green go for around $300-350. I haven't ever seen the blue or wine for sale. Nor the jsks.

>>7876496
Aw, that's so cute. Please post pics when you get them?

>>7878951
Prints tend to go hand in hand with OTT and idk what you're even whining about, seriously.

>>7879118
Prints are as old as lolita on its own so, no.

>>7881670
Not prints like today, lurk moar I think it was already talked about in this very thread. I'm trying so hard to be patient with your bitchy newbie ass for fucks sake uuugh

>>7882402
Newfags acting like they know it all and are so confident about their knowledge they get snappy is hilarious though

Like, I love watching newfags trying to guide other newfags in the fashion. When they give shoddy advice and put other newfags down like they know it all.

As far as entretainment goes, I think I like them better than the newfags who are more humble and "i-is this lolita?" Idk I never feel good about laughing at those girls, but the annoying kid who's been doing it for 6 months and is walking around like they own the place are fun to laugh at.

OTT is Over The Top. It just has to do with the outfit being extra fancy. You can use the styles of the age to determine if an outfit is OTT or not. Back when "oldschool" was standard, the OTT would be about the same as our standards if you count things like needing accessories as standard.

OTT doesn't mean deco loli or w/e, it's just a super fancy outfit, so it can apply to any time period/style as long as the outfit is fancier than the more basic ones.

>>7882428

I wasn't aware of any recent changes to the general consciousness the last time I checked in was not so long ago and this is what everyone thought.

http://4chanarchive.net/threads/cgl/Casual-lolita-otome-kei-thread/7730671

And this is the way its been for 2-3 years now (maybe more?) If basic outfits are casual wear that makes OTT the standard/not casual and like I was saying, it's pointless to call it OTT then it's the standard it's just...what the fashion is now.

Now if shit has changed recently then by all means disregard.

>>7882465
Basically what I was saying is that OTT back in the day, was equal to our current basic outfits, while our OTT didn't exist and was just too fancy(maybe okay for the runway). OTT is a sliding scale based off of what the norm vs a vamped up version of said norm, whatever the norm may be.

i've always wanted a vivienne westwood bag because i see them so often in old school coords... too bad they cost a lot

>>7882578
VW bags are like 350-800€ or something, not that much for mainstream fashion standards.

>>7882578
>Rewatching Nana
>Getting all these VW feels

>>7879099

Sure!

>>7876496
that is not a jigglypuff.

>>7878667
What? Lots of people wear not OTT lolita. Plain IW, AP skirts with simple cardigans, etc you look at too many convention/rufflecon pictures

>>7882402
>thinks everyone is the same anon
kek

And no, it still isn't prints that make an outfit OTT, OTT classic for example hardly every got prints.

>>7882835
I'm assuming the post was made before the clarification so I'll disregard, but in all seriousness where does one even look for rufflecon/convention pics? I haven't been involved with the community for a while and I never have anything in common with lolitas so I don't fallow any blogs or anything. Cgl is as close as I come to being involved in the comm since the fall of LJ and all we ever get are ita threads, I'm so down to see some cute outfits but...where?

>>7882947
Maybe I still have too much faith in humanity and don't wanna belive multiple people are this annoyingly new.

No one ever said it was the print just that OTT goes hand in hand with print. Print dress almost always worn in an OTT way otherwise it ends up in the ita thread with people whining about being underwhelmed.

>>7882594
You can get great bags easily for 150-200 max, most under. So yeah, it's quite a bit of money for what it is.

>>7882948
Usually people post their photos to the event pages on Facebook, or if you know some good loli bloggers they'll usually post stuff on their sites.

>>7882956
But it doesn't, end of the story, don't even try to hide your newfag.

Somewhat inbetween old-school and today's sweet lolita.

>>7883156
Oh for fucks sake kid. It does, that's a fact. lurk more, or gtfo with your newfag shit.

>>7881670
Prints only really came around like two years after I started getting interested in lolita do idk what you're on about. That shit used to be rare.

>>7883184
>those stripper heels
Oh Meta

>>7883226
>>7883225

>>7883225
Oh, so Misako is wearing OTT the whole time? Totally forgot that!

>>7882956
>Print dress almost always worn in an OTT way otherwise it ends up in the ita thread with people whining about being underwhelmed.
>Print dress
>Always
>OTT

>>7883226
>not knowing about 90s printed otome dresses that were used for lolita before lolita brands were an own thing
Oh you.

>>7883238
Nigga u being stupid on purpose, I can't belive I'm taking your bait.

>>7883184
I came in in 2004 so this is my kind of lolita.

I do get annoyed at people putting everything in one huge lump. The "Its OK to wear black shoes with anything because old school!" Thing is annoying to me, 'cos we DID have different standards back in my day. even seeing notorious race monsters we used to laugh at in 06 showed as good examples of old school is annoying lol

But if Lolita's can't grasp old school now, you can't grasp what was old school to the old school girls lol

Pic related, THIS was old school to us.

>>7883257
Another.

>>7883254
I think she probably meant prints as in AP/Baby themed prints. Lolita has always had florals, maybe 'cos I'm an old fag but I don't really think of those as "prints".

>>7883248
Not replying not because you won the argument newdfag, but because I can't handle the amount of dense and I hate repeating myself. Go back and read through my replies until you understand what is being said, stop convinently skipping over key words.

>>7883266
More hella old school…

It's too bad I don't have my files anymore. I had a lot of old school to my gen. In there.

>>7882677
NaNa is my favourite series and I love the use of VW and fashion in general in the film. It also makes me want a VW heart jacket.

>>7883307
Last one I managed to find.

Anyways, lolita has evolved slowly in to what it is now, and its history is a lot more complex than lolita now and old school.

I'm from generation "wigs are costumeish and gross." Still not happy about the comeback, but I like them better than hella old school wigs.

>>7883325
No I lied one more.

Its also really humbling to live long enough to see your style deemed ita or whatever. We where no better back then, all the girls I'm posting would have ended up in Loli fucks. In fact you guys 300% more understanding than we where, but I think that has everything to do with lolita having no history in the west up until that point.

>>7883350
It's cringe worthy to say the least to think about some of the stuff that happened/where said. We where really not accepting or probably not even aware of lolita outside of what it was at that very moment.

And people would come in "egl I know were not supposed to wear wigs but the Japanese wear wigs what about *post street snap*" and our reply would be "WELL FUCK THERES JAPANESE ITAS TOO YOU KNOW" and looking back on it now I can see that person wasn't ita, she was just keeping it old school.

I'll stop spamming, talking to myself and leave now but not before posting hawase doll. At some point I had a folder full of pictures of hawase doll. Because, hawase doll yo.

>>7873713
I love old school but god do I hate this hairstyle. It looks like something a little boy would've had, or a bowl of noodles. It's just so costume-y and weird.