I'm curious what seagulls think of some people calling lolita "Alice-kei" instead? At first I thought it was stupid, but after my millionth conversation regarding the name with a normalfag who refused to believe it wasn't sexual, I wish it would catch on, but I don't really see hat happening.

File: 63 KB, 304x450, 1099ed3354def54f6394204bc4b27ca5e358d6a6_m.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:05:22 2015 No.8443864 [Reply] [Original]

I'm curious what seagulls think of some people calling lolita "Alice-kei" instead? At first I thought it was stupid, but after my millionth conversation regarding the name with a normalfag who refused to believe it wasn't sexual, I wish it would catch on, but I don't really see hat happening.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:10:43 2015 No.8443876 i don't really like alice in general, i prefer just using "dolly fashion" or "dolly kei" when talking to people who probably won't be able to maturely handle hearing it's called lolita.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:13:54 2015 No.8443890 Alice makes it sound like a halloween costume trying to look like alice, which lolita is not. it's be better to just "egl fashion" or use a japanese word like "ningyo-kei"

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:14:03 2015 No.8443891 I really do wish lolita had a different name, especially now that 'neo lolita' is booming. It's getting harder and harder to distance pretty, ruffly dresses from the 'tween slut' aesthetic.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:17:28 2015 No.8443897 >>8443876 But dolly kei is already a different thing, and using the word "dolly" makes it sound fetishy.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:19:55 2015 No.8443901 >>8443864 Well Alice is also sexualized in popular culture. And by the writer himself outside the book.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:26:05 2015 No.8443919 Can't we just agree on calling it ageplay and move on?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:30:00 2015 No.8443933 I know some people don't like 'rufflebutt" yet its what I use when talking to my mom. Its a shame Lolita has such a stigma because wasn't it originally just a French girls name?

Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:31:31 2015 No.8443939

>>8443890
>>8443876
The reason it's "alice-kei" is because waaay back in the day, what we now know as lolita was almost unrecognizable, the biggest way in which being that the skirts were super long. When the transition into what it is now initially took place, the skirts were shortened and poofed out more, specifically to resemble Alice. That's actually the main reason why Alice is the biggest theme in lolita, it's not just because most lolitas like Alice, but because Alice inspired the entire fashion.

Just figured I'd explain because if one isn't familiar with the history, it's natural to assume alice-kei was just picked because most lolita like Alice in Wonderland.

>>8443901
The sexualization of Alice isn't really comparable to Lolita. First of all, hardly anyone immediately associates Alice with sex and if you try to say "it's not a sex thing", they'll believe you instead of question what other reason their possibly could have been in that name choice. Secondly, there's no actual themes of sex in Alice in Wonderland, the people sexualizing her are doing that themselves. Lolita has no role in that book other than being sexualized by the main character and later having a sexual relationship with him. It's literally impossible not to associate her with sex. Lastly, there is no actual proof that Lewis Carroll sexualized Alice Liddell, it was just highly likely.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:32:57 2015 No.8443942 >>8443919 If you look up ageplay, no one actually wears lolita. So, that wouldn't really work.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:34:20 2015 No.8443949 >>8443891 I thought that was differentiated by calling the latter "nymphet"?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:39:26 2015 No.8443972 >>8443939 we all know, but the fashion rarely looks like Alice especially now a days and again the implications aren't really any better than lolita

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:54:33 2015 No.8444014 File: 383 KB, 1080x1920, 1434322500838.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>8443942 You sure about that?

Anonymous Wed Jul 1 17:59:22 2015 No.8444029

>>8443972
>and again the implications aren't really any better than lolita
Different anon, but did you not read the second half of their post explaining to obvious reasons why that's just completely wrong?

Alice in Wonderland is an internationally beloved children's story about a little girl named Alice who goes on a trippy adventure to a strange land.

Lolita is a book about a little girl called Lolita who is the object of lust of a middle aged man that she later seduces.

Yes, there is indeed a world of difference as far as any potential sexual implications.

Also
>but the fashion rarely looks like Alice especially now a days
So, how exactly is the name lolita any better using that logic?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 18:01:50 2015 No.8444034 >>8444014 Well yeah, there's a minuscule number of people who do, but maybe like one out of 100,000 female ageplayers has any interest in lolita. You won't find much more than that girl. I think I saw one other, but she was friends with her.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 18:04:40 2015 No.8444042 File: 124 KB, 500x300, KHv.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>8443972 >people associate Alice in Wonderland with sex as much as Lolita Well, color me impressed.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 19:28:45 2015 No.8444284 File: 31 KB, 329x373, 5950081670840320.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>8444014

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 19:36:03 2015 No.8444297 >>8444014 actual disgust

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 19:41:43 2015 No.8444311 >>8444029 >Lolita >about Dolores seducing Humbert Humbert jfc have you even read the book or do you just not know what an example of unreliable narration is

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 19:43:32 2015 No.8444318 >>8444034 How do you know? If she pulled down her dress she looks just like everybody else. It's only a very small percent that actually post pictures of themselves and their fetish.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 19:49:52 2015 No.8444339 >>8443933 I say rufflebutts and frilly bitches because we are kind of bitches.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 20:39:33 2015 No.8444446 >>8444311 I'm not saying Humbert wasn't the one in the wrong in that relationship, but Lolita does use sex to manipulate him.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 23:55:28 2015 No.8444969 >>8443864 I don't really like that, I'd prefer Neo-Rococo or something.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 23:57:19 2015 No.8444974 File: 14 KB, 240x320, 137593505136.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>8444014

>>	Anonymous Wed Jul 1 23:58:47 2015 No.8444979 >>8443939 Alice did not inspire the entire fashion, what are you smoking?

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:01:10 2015 No.8444983

There is no one name that every lolita will agree with. If lolita was suggested now it would be thrown out immediately with almost unanimous responses but there is no one name you will suggest now that everyone will agree with.

A lot of people would like to change the name (including me honestly) but you will never get everyone agreeing with anything and honestly because of that I doubt the name will ever change.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:04:24 2015 No.8444991 >>8443891 What's "neo lolita"? I've never heard of that.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:08:14 2015 No.8445001 >>8444446 >TRUSTING ANYTHING HUMBERT SAYS

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:20:39 2015 No.8445040

>>8444034
Go on Fetlife and I think you'll change your mind about those numbers. I cancelled notifications from one lolita group I was in because almost all the threads were ageplay and usually lolitas on there were also ageplayers. Lots of lolita sissies as well.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:33:48 2015 No.8445071 >>8444991 Some made up shit RinRin is trying to do, she uses the tag on Instagram. It's not really a thing.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:34:59 2015 No.8445076 >>8445040 Either way, most agelay doesn't actually look like lolita. If you Google ageplay, you will not find lolita in the image search.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:38:31 2015 No.8445080

If I get asked, I say 'it's just my fashion style'. It's short, polite and they can't really run anywhere further with that so conversation over. I don't need to educate some normalfag stranger who is nosey about my clothes for no damn good reason and decides to come up to me in public.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:39:07 2015 No.8445082 >>8444446 Anon, you missed the entire point of the story. He's an unreliable narrator and his perception is that she seduced him, but in reality that's just how he justified his pedophilia. She did not actually seduce him. Please reread the story.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:47:36 2015 No.8445108
File: 1.37 MB, 1361x768, ageplaysearch.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>8445076
Uhhh... I'm seeing two piss-poor attempts at lolita in this image and one passable coord. All I searched for was "ageplay". And yeah, I know I have a lot of tabs open and my first name is visible.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:50:53 2015 No.8445116 I suggest "frillz". With a Z and all.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:56:23 2015 No.8445134 >>8445082 >>8445001 Not that anon, but are you forgetting that she gets him to do what she wants through sexual advances?

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 00:59:21 2015 No.8445146

>>8445108
The "Are All Men Pedophiles" image doesn't count because it's a movie trying to paint lolita as a fetish meant for girls to cater to the desires of pedophiles created by people who literally know nothing about the fashion. Other than that, I don't see anything close enough to lolita to count, either.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 01:06:08 2015 No.8445160 >>8445134 Jesus, you really did take the story at face value, didn't you? You need to learn to read between the lines.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 02:23:16 2015 No.8445337 >>8443949 'Nymphet' is the term describing girls who like the idea of seducing older men. 'Neo lolita' is the name of the fashion they typically admire.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 02:27:11 2015 No.8445346

>>8445082
I wouldn't say that's the 'entire' point of the story. Humbert is without a doubt deluded and we get his point of view but that doesn't mean Dolores was never in a position where she thought she held power. Girls can be manipulative but that doesn't mean that they should be taken advantage of (though I know a lot of people might dispute that).

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 02:36:26 2015 No.8445371 >>8444284 yaaass kailyn reaction pics yaaaasssss

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 02:59:04 2015 No.8445414

>>8445040
A lolita group on Fetlife is a pretty specific survey sample. Also ageplayers who buy things labeled "lolita" and actual lolitas are two different things.
I know a girl who's in one of those ddlg relationships and she showed me some dresses she wanted to buy. They were ebay/milanoo tier trash labeled lolita but she isn't what I would consider a lolita.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 03:11:18 2015 No.8445438

>>8443901
Charles Dodgeson's relations to children was very likely not sexual. Society viewed children and their relations to adults differently and young girls weren't nearly as sexualised as they are today. Charles Dodgeson was just a photographer who happened to have a way with children, something the London upperclass appreciated which meant he met a lot of children while photographing them. He also liked their company because of his stutter, which he felt less anxious about around children than adults. Among all the letters he wrote to the children he formed friendships with (both in their young years and if he happened to contact them later in life, such as with Alice) there's not really anything to suggest that he had a sexual interest in any of them. That's mostly something society of today have decided as a consequence of the sexualisation of younger and younger girls, because obviously children and adults have no reason to spend time together unless one is taking advantage of the other.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 03:43:45 2015 No.8445486

>>8445134
I'm with the other anon. One look at wiki states a minority of critics take Humbert's narrative at face value, and Vladimir stated Humbert was just a shitty guy- not someone to be pitied. And Lolita was 12.... Even though she had a childish crush on Humbert cause he looked like her favorite celebrity, a child cannot seduce an older man. And it's impossible to say she "manipulated" him when he tried to rape her while unconscious initially and indirectly (unless you interpret it another way) killed her mom, then took her out of school to drive around the country and rape her every night and ignore her crying on the daily. But ok.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 04:13:59 2015 No.8445531

>>8445134
More than the unreliable narrator, it seemed to me that Dolly didn't really know about sex and its implications. I kind of like taking things at face value at first, and it seems like she had a silly crush on him, and if she'd fuck some random kid at camp, why not Hum? And it's not until later that she starts becoming disinterested and then even later actively fighting against his advances. I think she underestimates how sex impacts one emotionally. And even when he comes back to give her money for the baby, she's not angry like "you fucked me up!" and I think she still doesn't get how badly she was treated, even though she was definitely emotionally fucked up.
Also, it sounds like a lot of the time, it's Humbert making the offers and her agreeing to them. I don't think she was manipulating him, she was just a kid, and that's how she learned to get what she wanted.
>back on topic
I would be in favor of changing the English name to Alice-style (why would you use kei if you're not using the Japanese name) or something similar. I think something involving Victorian dolls would be nice, too. But being realistic, I think it's way too late to change it in the US, and everything official has the word "lolita" in it, so it just seems impossible.
Unpopular opinion, but I think like AP-style and VM-style should be seperated. The only thing that keeps lolita fashion together is the skirt shape. The colors/aesthetics are all so different. I think lolita should be the umbrella description of a fashion style, not an identity.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 04:16:10 2015 No.8445535 >>8444979 A hookah with a caterpillar friend, why do you ask? :^)

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 09:38:52 2015 No.8445857 >>8445146 >look up ageplay! No one wears lolita! >something actually shows up >that doesn't count!!

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 10:15:11 2015 No.8445900 >>8445108 Shit, another Lolita WoW player, waves

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 10:55:09 2015 No.8445959 >>8444983 Why lolita in the first place, the fashion didn't start before the book

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 11:01:27 2015 No.8445973

>>8445531
I feel like 99% of what I see on CoF doesn't even register as lolita to me anymore. Yeh it's a dress with a orin on it, maybe a bit of lace and chiffon but past 2011 everything seems so normalfag or completely revolving around prints. I'm not a hardcore old school fan either, but I'm looking at this alien style called 'fancy stuff, maybe with a petticoat, looking at my earlier GLBs like what the actual fuck, how are these the same fashion) It should just be called 'mildly historically (any old period or silhouette) inspired fancy shit'

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 12:15:19 2015 No.8446107 >>8445973 I agree with you, I feel as if lots of dresses/ brands are now making cutbacks by making such an extravigent pattern then being quite lazy on the cut/ actual design of the dress.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 12:20:33 2015 No.8446119

>>8445857
I think it's valid to say a documentary where the purpose is to say all men are secretly pedophiles (yes, that is indeed the premise of the film) and tries to depict lolita as a fashion meant to cater to their perversion, worn only by girls looking for older men to seduce doesn't count.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 12:24:31 2015 No.8446126

>>8446107
Also, don't forget the length of some dresses that are too long, shoes at times aren't even lolita and there is too much chiffon and frills that look like a costume and not really lolita imo. I don't really like the latest trend of super extravagant stuff, i love simple items or just prints and this opulent lolita vision with also veils, scepters and so on it's becoming similar to a cosplay. Btw, i like the idea of calling the fashion Alice-kei or other related names.
>>8445040
It's sad how these fetish comms lolitas are into only this ddlg shit. Wish there were more lolita dommes at least. Not into this fetish stuff but i dislike to see lolita people always as subs.
>lolita sissies
ewww

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 12:43:01 2015 No.8446151

>>8444979
Not that anon, but they're mostly right. The bell shaped cut was intentionally meant to be reminiscent of Alice, so it's not far off to say she inspired the entire fashion.
>>8445531
>I would be in favor of changing the English name to Alice-style (why would you use kei if you're not using the Japanese name) or something similar.
I'm fairly certain it was Japanese lolitas who originally coined the term Alice-kei, but Alice-style sounds better.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 14:18:46 2015 No.8446353 >>8445959 http://fyeahlolita.blogspot.ca/2013/11/why-is-lolita-called-lolita-does-lolita.html

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 20:56:01 2015 No.8447214

>>8445973
>It should just be called 'mildly historically (any old period or silhouette) inspired fancy shit'
True, then they could have bustles and floor length skirts and whatever the fuck and then they'd stop whining about "the rules". Like salopettes, they're from lolita brands, but they're not quite lolita.
I admit that I do dress in that style sometimes for big events (no veils or shit tho) but I also print-whore and then have some old solid btssb pieces. I think a lot of people have "normal" lolita coords too, they just only post their pimped out innocent world shit on CoF, because it's more impressive.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 21:26:19 2015 No.8447282

>>8444969
Neo Rococo and Neo Victorian are my favorites and the ones that I've been meaning to start using (but haven't yet because I'm having a bit of a fashion identity crisis and have worn Lolita in a while), absolutely no sexual subtext to be found and the fashion takes inspiration from both.

Anonymous Thu Jul 2 22:08:59 2015 No.8447453

>>8443901
Not really. If you say "Alice in Wonderland" the first thing that comes to mind to people in the west is Disney's movie - at best, people will just think you're parading around in a costume.

To be honest, though annoying, I'd rather people compliment me on my "costume" then give me a weird look about my "lolita outfit" when their brain goes to nabokov.

I just have been calling it "japanese street fashion" and most people get it and leave it alone. One time someone asked if we were harajuku girls, lol. I have yet to come across anyone who demands a specific name or anything like that but I usually just explain it's inspired by victorian and rococo fashion and whatnot (which like, is the truth, so). Dolly/doll fashion still sounds a bit weird to me personally because I think people then get the 'living doll' idea and if not that they think it's weird you want to dress like a doll specifically, so I guess calling AIW-inspired fashion/alice-kei is my next go-to. Perhaps wanting to dress like a children's storybook character is also weird sounding but for me personally I think I would feel more comfortable saying that I think for a name?

>>8444969
Neo-rococo is a good one though, I'll have to keep this up my sleeve next time someone wants a name.

I think I'd only explain the name to someone if I felt in that moment that they weren't going to misinterpret, would actually listen to my explanation, and seemed legitimately interested enough in the fashion to want to go home and find out more.

Most people don't give a shit, they just wanna know why the fuck you're wearing a poofy dress with lace all over it then be on their merry way.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jul 2 23:37:36 2015 No.8447737 Rococo-kei Pls

Anonymous Fri Jul 3 18:35:31 2015 No.8449815

I don't think rococo-kei is a good name because modern lolita looks nothing like actual rococo fashion, save the fact that they both feature poofy skirts. Same for victorian/edwardian. Everything just looks more like 50s novelty prints these days.

I do agree that the name is unfortunate, especially because the lolitafashion tags are being invaded by wannabe nymphettes posting caps from that shitty 1997 movie and pastel rompers. Annoying as shit.

I'd just call it EGL, honestly. Or Maiden kei, since Otome kei is already taken.

Anonymous Fri Jul 3 18:48:56 2015 No.8449852

>>8447453
I just call it "Japanese street fashion", too. When someone seems genuinely interested I tell them the name of the brand I'm wearing or if it's something handmade, the name of an established brand that most resembles the style. If they want to know more they can google the brand and discover more from there.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jul 3 18:58:13 2015 No.8449872 >>8443864 I remember an RC discussion brought up the name Quaintrelle. I like it, if not solely for the fact that it would sound foreign enough to modern Americans that they'd get bored and hopefully stop asking questions.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jul 3 19:02:11 2015 No.8449884 >>8445337 Nymphet is just a fashion style. It has nothing to do with seducing old man. And otherwise Larme kei is a real problem.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jul 3 19:05:28 2015 No.8449889 >>8449884 But all the nymphets have a daddy kink tho

>>	Anonymous Fri Jul 3 19:11:14 2015 No.8449901 >>8449884 Regardless, Nabokov fangirls tag their shit with nymphet fashion AND lolita fashion.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jul 3 19:11:37 2015 No.8449905 >>8449852 I do this as well, very good success rate

Anonymous Fri Jul 3 19:45:09 2015 No.8449969

>>8449889
>>8449901

Nymphet is about looking desirable and flirtatious by using a innocent feminine look, which can be consider very sexy (and you can definitely give it a sexy feel to it, if you want to).
However, it's not meant to find creepers, playing out on kinks and stuff like that. But than the darkside of tumblr discovered it and took it over.

So yeah... maybe I should with the others also come up with a new name for that style.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jul 3 20:38:27 2015 No.8450137 >>8445438 thank you.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jul 3 20:48:29 2015 No.8450175 >>8444014 why the fuck is her diaper over her tights that is dumb

Anonymous Sat Jul 4 02:50:14 2015 No.8451045

I don't think Alice-kei is a good name for it because then people will think we're all Alice in Wonderland cosplayers. I also feel like lolita fashion has so many different aesthetics depending on the sub style that Alice-kei doesn't really encompass that.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 4 02:55:32 2015 No.8451055 >>8449884 One issue of Larme directly references Nabokov's Lolita complete with quotes so...?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 4 03:17:51 2015 No.8451074 >>8449969 Wasn't nymphet used in the book? Or at least one of the movies? Either way, you sound like you're in denial.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 4 05:58:59 2015 No.8451305 >>8451074 Lolita is the name of the book but we're all passionate to disconnect the two for good reason.

Anonymous Sat Jul 4 07:08:05 2015 No.8451413

These are all terrible names
Alice- make it seem like you guys are cosplayers
Lolita- normies immature as stated, reference the book
Nypmhet- already a different style
Dolly-Sounds age play
Maybe if we change it to Lolita>Lollita instead? Confusing the two would be like confusing Red with Read.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 4 07:09:23 2015 No.8451414 >>8451413 Or maybe Rolita instead of the L (Since L and R are the same in asian moon speak)

Anonymous Sat Jul 4 07:14:24 2015 No.8451424

When asked what I'm wearing, I refer to my clothing as "victorian neo-punk" because lolita started as a movement with ideals similar to punk, and well lolita was inspired by victorian frilliess. It tends to make people go "Oh my God that's so cool" and want to know more, instead of the disapproving stares and straight-up disgusted faces you get when you refer to the fashion as lolita.

Anonymous Sat Jul 4 07:43:43 2015 No.8451459

It's way too late to change the name now, and it would only divide the community and make it disorganized. It would also further divide the west and japanese communities, which nobody really needs. We're already divided as is, we need to keep together, if we change the name, japanese lolita and western "alice-kei" will end up like two different styles in the end.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 4 07:45:47 2015 No.8451460 >>8451424 >victorian neo-punk this pleases me.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 4 15:25:31 2015 No.8452091 >>8451413 Who the fuck wanted rename it Nymphet? That name is even more closely related to the book. Larme can have it.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 05:00:59 2015 No.8453543 >>8452091 Well you didn't even comment whether Changing the way it's spelled would help. >Lollita >Rolita

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 05:12:49 2015 No.8453551 >>8451460 try calling AP sweet whatever "victorian neo-punk" plz

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 05:20:38 2015 No.8453557 >>8453551 Dude, if glitter/neon goth exists, I can't see a reason not to call pastel vomit "victorian neo-punk"

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 13:32:24 2015 No.8454120 >>8445116 this. this one.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 14:00:09 2015 No.8454175 >>8445857 Just because someone else claims it to be ageplay doesn't mean it is. especially if your only judging it by a picture and not asking if they participate in it.

Anonymous Sun Jul 5 14:41:16 2015 No.8454252

>>8445040
Eh I love Fetlife but I keep my interest in lolita off of there entirely. Most of the groups on there are ddlg, you're right, and that stuff squicks me really hard even when I try not to judge people for it.

Anyways I just use tumblr or cgl for lolita times and stick with my regular fetishes on fet

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 14:46:47 2015 No.8454259 >>8443933 I thought it was Spanish?

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 14:48:22 2015 No.8454263 >>8454259 Yeah, it's the diminutive form of Dolores. Means "pain".

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 14:54:31 2015 No.8454272 Honestly I call it Otome when I'm around people who don't know or don't care about either fashion >However it's always lolita fashion when there's another gull

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 14:56:00 2015 No.8454277 >>8451414 so why not just call it "gosu rorita" or just "rorita" then\

Anonymous Sun Jul 5 16:06:52 2015 No.8454369

>>8454272
I like the idea of referring it to "maiden style" and for some reason I've never thought of that before. I used to use "old fashioned inspired" but maiden style feels like it fits better and it's a lot easier to say. Thank you for saying you call it otome, from now on it's maiden for me.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 16:09:21 2015 No.8454377 >>8453557 I guess the only reason not to use it is because victorian neo-punk already exist

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 16:39:24 2015 No.8454438 >>8454272 I also just call it Otome, much easier to explain. And the pictures when searched up are similar enough to Lolita.

Anonymous Sun Jul 5 16:50:22 2015 No.8454456

>>8454438
I'm >>8454369, I would rather call it maiden style instead of otome because I live in an area that is made up entirely of anime weebs and rednecks, so I feel like it's best to avoid the Japanese words unless someone is genuinely interested. Do you think maiden still works just as good, or is otome better?

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 16:57:10 2015 No.8454468 >>8444446 Just saying, the closest thing to manipulation through sex that Dolores actually does is start to ask for money in an attempt to save enough to escape. And throw her friend at him to try and get him to stop abusing her.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 16:58:43 2015 No.8454470 >>8454377 Wait no, I was thinking about Rococo punk. Nevermind then

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 20:01:23 2015 No.8454862 >>8454470 wait is that real?

Anonymous Sun Jul 5 20:15:11 2015 No.8454899

>>8451074
Humbert in the beginning described the girls he wanted to fuck as Nymphets. The issue with the word Lolita came from that, people took the meaning of nymphet and put it to the word lolita instead.

>>8445346
Lolita was never in a position of power. She was 12-14, and figuring out that she can get icecream or some allowance through rape is not really getting the upperhand.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 5 22:16:01 2015 No.8455208 >>8454263 It specifically refers to the pain the Virgin Mary felt during birth. Lolita dies giving birth. I feel like that had to have been on purpose.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 6 09:07:34 2015 No.8456468 >>8454862 I Google Imaged it and it appears to be so, but like with any fashion, the results show a bunch of shit from different fashions. There was Steampunk stuff and a brand lolita coord in there.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 6 09:10:44 2015 No.8456470 File: 71 KB, 600x400, a1b215365e42e1af36e3d09a8b301112.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>8454862

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 6 09:13:42 2015 No.8456473 >>8456470 I thought I've seen the worst of the trainwrecks alt. fashion can offer, but this has taken me to a whole new layer of Hell.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 6 09:21:10 2015 No.8456486 >>8456473 I can't help but wonder if this is what lolita looks like to normies. Steampunk I can tolerate but this looks stupid.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 6 20:25:03 2015 No.8458099 >>8456486 Nah I think to normies lolita reminds them of older-style porcelain babydolls with big frilly dresses (especially if it's anything light-colored). Nothing so bright and brash.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 7 11:02:16 2015 No.8460226 >>8458099 Well, I just asked my friend and she can't tell the difference

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 7 11:22:35 2015 No.8460265 >>8453543 Both of those are retarded.

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/cgl/ - Cosplay & EGL