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/cgl/ - Cosplay & EGL


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9872268 No.9872268 [Reply] [Original] [rbt]

Lurking through the Local Lolita Comm thread, it became apparent most of the concerns anons had were to do with lack of meet up attendance, or members.
This is a lot different to what I was used to - primary discussion being about the drama.

Has lolita died? What do you think has caused this?
Is it society, economics?

Lolita fashion should be more accessible now that there's more options on Taobao, heaps more secondhand for sale, and most dream dresses from early/late teens should be affordable to those with jobs by now.

>> No.9872270
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9872270

>>9872268
I would wager it's obesity and young people being broke AF. Can't fit into those dresses when they don't make them in "Western" sizes.

>> No.9872271

>>9872268
This debate has come up so often in the last few decades; iirc people were debating this on EGL back in 2006 too.
In my opinion lolita hasn't died, but it seems that people are more reluctant to wear it outside of "safe" spaces (i.e. conventions or meetups at closed areas like cafes, museums, the host's house, etc.).
There's also the fact that some people look down on the possibility of wearing the fashion casually, outside of meetups, and while they may be a minority, they're loud enough to make this view common with people outside of the fashion; whereas in previous years participants in the fashion would routinely call it a street fashion when explaining it to outsiders.

TL;DR: The fashion isn't dying in the sense that there are no new releases or new lolitas joining; but you see it less in the streets and more in "safe spaces" and social media, which gives off false impressions of it which then lead to people not taking it seriously as a fashion.

>> No.9872272

>>9872271
Also,
>inb4 no one is taking you seriously when you're wearing a frilly dress lel
To clarify, I mean seeing lolita as a legitimate alternative fashion style rather than immediately assuming it's a costume. Obviously goths get comments like "it's not Halloween" too but they're generally more recognized as "a thing", if that makes sense.
Case in point: Wearing toned down lolita coords in black is easier because black blends in the crowd better than pastel, and also because people just assume I'm a goth so they usually don't pester me with questions.

>> No.9872273

>>9872268
I fucking wish anon, I really do. We can only profit from being a small community again.
But it only dies as far as it went with subculture. The community is nothing more than materialism anymore - coords and who own's the most/the best pieces and most of the subculture aspects are just repeating and copying things of the past (see lifestyle and old school). Social media killed blogs and lolitas barely bond over vk and other related music anymore, there hasn't been any new ideas or creative projects in years. All we have is coords in neatly arranged rooms, haul videos and yet another dumb uninformed interview.

>> No.9872277
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9872277

As other anon said, lolita has been dying at least since 2006.
And may I say it, lolita is dead. Look at old snaps, than at OTT classic and taobao brands. Old school lolita still has many fans, but it's not just "lolita", it's "old school lolita".
Style evolves and few years in future we will have new trends.
The community is dying because of coslitas and annoying members who want to put politics everywhere. I think some lolitas are just lonelitas, who don't want to insert themselves into the drama.

>> No.9872281

>>9872268
No

>> No.9872294

>>9872277
This. My comm got a wave of people who just barely where able to vote this last election and it’s been absolute hell. So many people “offended” and protesting in the fashion on the streets that I just said nope to meets and started being a lone lolita. I don’t wear it nearly as often as I did. Mainly just with my wife when we go out to a nice date night together or to places with beautiful settings like gardens and museums. It’s not something I can wear daily any more because of the heavy tones of feminism and politics going on with the lolitas in my comm.

>> No.9872306

>>9872294
>It’s not something I can wear daily any more because of the heavy tones of feminism and politics going on with the lolitas in my comm.
How are people's political stances relevant to what you choose to wear daily? Genuinely asking.

>> No.9872314

>>9872306
Nayrt, but in my country we had some insufferable pro-abortion feminazis whose thing was they wore all black. As someone who wears gothic on daily basis, it was annoying as hell.

>> No.9872317

>>9872314
That still doesn't mean much. Did they wear anything remotely resembling lolita? Did anyone and everyone who wore all black while this group was operating, was harassed for supposedly being associated with them?
Maybe I just don't understand the impact this group had in your country but it kinda sounds like a bullshit excuse.

>> No.9872336

>>9872271
I think it's harder to wear lolita casually now because what is considered "casual fashion" and "alternative fashion has changed." Due to the rise of athleisure/leggings as pants/etc., the fashion world has shifted so far in the casual direction that wearing even a simple jersey dress will get you "what're you so dressed up for?" when no one would look twice at someone in a dress in 2007.

Even casual lolita is this to an extreme. I don't have sympathy for people who are uncomfortable with stares, but being stopped every 15 minutes isn't fun, even if the people are nice or just curious. I didn't get anywhere near as much attention in the late 2000s in casual lolita because it blended in more with what people are wearing.

>> No.9872338

>>9872306
Ayrt they have been wearing the fashion to the political displays and protests. A group of them even got into the news and paper with signs that say “I wear these dresses to stand against social oppression”. It’s annoying.

>> No.9872347

>>9872338
I hope you took a pic of that newspaper

>> No.9872356

>>9872347
Who reads the news paper other then old people?

>> No.9872357

>>9872336
>the fashion world has shifted so far in the casual direction that wearing even a simple jersey dress will get you "what're you so dressed up for?" when no one would look twice at someone in a dress in 2007.
Having been into lolita since 2007 - Bullshit. Sorry, but it is. Casual mainstream fashion isn't remotely new like you make it out to be, people have been wearing jerseys, jeans, tracksuits, and t-shirts, and generally have been dressing like shit in the name of comfort since the 80s if not earlier; what the general population considers casual isn't a reason to not wear even the simplest lolita coord when your life permits you to.
>b-but people think it's too fancy and ask me why I'm all dressed up for
If you're this uncomfortable with the most benign attention you get, maybe alternative fashion isn't for you.
Sorry if I come across as too aggressive, I'm not baiting or trolling or shitposting or what have you; but this attitude is what's killing alt fashion in general, not just lolita, and it's incredibly frustrating to see people who claim to love it be so cowardly when approaching the idea of wearing it like actual clothing.

>> No.9872358

>>9872356
Everyone with a job. Anyway, pics or it didn't happen.

>> No.9872362

It has kind of died in my city. We used to have an active comm with monthly meets. But most members are now are 25+ with steady jobs and less time on their hands which has forced many to become lone-litas or do small private meets out of convenience. And there are hardly any newbies anymore to fill up the spots of those who left over time. Newbies used to discover the fashion via local conventions but those are also slowly dying and losing in popularity. As a result the local scene comes accross as some sort of secret club these days. If you are not part of it for years it's hard to step a foot in it. And Instagram has given lone-litas a platform to promote themselves, which gives less incentives for being part of a comm.

Another reason might be cultural changes in the west. Young people have less money to spend and are more scared of the future as the political climate changes and job uncertainty is on the rise. They are worshipping minimalism and simple lifestyles, which doesn't leave much room for excessive hobbies like lolita.

>> No.9872376
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9872376

>>9872358
Ntayrt but it happens.

>> No.9872387

>>9872376
That's just someone wearing lolita to a protest, not someone connecting lolita to what they're protesting.

>> No.9872391

>>9872387
Yeah but >>9872338 said they were directly relating wearing Lolita to social justice.

>> No.9872394

>>9872338
That's pretty unfortunate, I'll agree with that, but I still don't see why you can't wear lolita daily on your own because of this. If someone approaches you and says something that implies they think you're associated with those girls, can't you just deny it?

>> No.9872396

Don’t take a few gulls bitching as signs of Lolita dying. If you live in a small town/area then of course attendance won’t be huge. My comm has the issue of too many people, and finding areas that can fit 40-50 easily. It limits meet ups in a way because you want to accommodate for people but a lot of cute places don’t hold that much.

Private meets here are a thing, but it happens because it keeps the numbers a bit lower and you don’t have to deal with idiots. Being in charge is always a struggle and I think many people just don’t want to deal with the issues of people who are flakey or snowflakes. This is a bigger issue I find because current members who plan don’t want to anymore and newer people aren’t experienced enough or involved to step up. I don’t want only private stuff but I fear this will happen because my friend group is fed up.

>> No.9872423

It's pretty dead in Japan, that's for sure.

You just don't see it around anymore. So many great lolita brands have died in the past few years because there just isn't a market for it. Nowadays when you go to the old alt-fashion meccas like Harajuku and Amemura, you see a bunch of kids dressed in Wego or Uniqlo. The only visible lolitas are whities and burando store clerks.

Occasionally you see people get their frills on for a concert or something, but that's about it. Visual-kei is pretty dead too, and that was a genre that had a lot of influence on alt fashions in Japan.

>> No.9872445
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9872445

>>9872391
There’s been a few people posting on COF over the last two years with coords they wore to protests. I don’t really know much about the other anons comm but tried to google it. And although didn’t find what they are probably referring to, but have found some pretty hilarious shit. Most of the lolitas are ita so im not worried.

>> No.9872446
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9872446

>>9872445

>> No.9872448

>>9872446
What happened to not wanting to look like a doll?

>> No.9872450

>>9872448
You get touched and played with anon.

>> No.9872456

>>9872423
Luckily China is propping up the Japanese burando industry.

>> No.9872466

>>9872268
Lolita isn't dying. It's healthier and more accessable than ever.

Are you talking about it as a street fashion dying? Blame lolitas that buy into the OTT thing and pretend it's not clothing, particularly the Chinese market is at fault. In their culture, they're using it as a symbol of "rich girl clothing". It's just a way to flaunt wealth, so the more OTT the better.

As for the West, it's pretty healthy. I'm not sure what you're talking about lack of attendance. Just look at gyaru in comparison, especially worldwide and tell me again how "lolita is dying".

>> No.9872499

>>9872268
If you're actually judging Lolita fashion as a whole from one thread you really don't know much. People come to the comm thread to vent. If you actually read it more often you learn that there are a ton of other comms with a lot of members.

Also this is just a Western board. Lolita exploded in China in the recent years and brands have begun catering to that market. The people complaining about of lack of memebers and attendance are either the middle of US comms from flyover states or a poorer country.

>> No.9872515

>>9872268
Drama killed the comms. Lolita has become an online fashion and less of a community based fashion.

>> No.9872519

I wish we had someone to translate and act as a "bridge" from the western comm to the Japanese and Chinese comms. That way we could get a better view of the whole community.

>> No.9872526

>>9872445
>asking to get made fun of

>> No.9872527

>>9872515
I second this; especially as the idea of "boycott people from hobbies who aren't of the same political alignment as you" has really caught on. People are getting shunned in situations where they never talk about their politics at tea parties, but people check their social media and dig up stuff.

If you want to not be shunned at some point, you have to go as far as to scrub everything on social media first, then never talk about stuff in other circles if there's any way it can be linked back to your lolita stuff.

I wont rant too much further about this, but I'd like to just add that this has gone as far as online lolita news outlets not getting traffic because the investor / backer for the site was a cis male.

>> No.9872546

>>9872396
My comm is having the same issue. Are you in Europe too?
We’re having less and less public meets not because interest is dwindling but because there’s so much interest that it’s hard to accommodate everyone. I also think that a lot of us don’t really like having 40-50 people meetups all the time, I prefer much smaller ones where you can actually talk to everyone and don’t get people treating you like a travelling circus group on the street. I used to love picnic meets with my comm but it’s impossible to have privacy in a public park and when we’re with a huge group we attract a LOT of onlookers, some of who are really rude.

I’ve noticed it’s mostly the older/more established members who prefer doing small meetups with friends over big public ones, and younger/newer (incl ita) members who go to the bigger ones. So from the outside it looks like the established lolitas are becoming less active and fading out. But that’s not necessarily what’s happening.

>> No.9872548

>>9872527
I was gonna say you sound paranoid but then I remembered this girl in my comm talking about how she found out some other lolita’s reddit username and went through her entire post history to see if she was ~problematic~ or not.

>> No.9872562

It's on life support in my area.
Drama caused most notable names in my area to leave our community, and I haven't seen any of them since. There's a few girls still hosting meets, but they're massive cunts, and two of them are buddy buddy and batshit insane. (They gang up on people they don't like. One's a mod. Explains itself.)

I'm considering moving cities in the next couple of years here, but it seems like the comm in the city I want to move to is more of the same shit.

Bad communities can ravage people's perception and enjoyment of something. I haven't dressed up in months, and I'm considering selling off my stuff since I don't see the point in wearing it to the grocery store or out to dinner. I can put that money towards more important things.
I don't feel I'm alone in this sentiment.

>> No.9872586

>>9872562
I wear lolita to the grocery store, to dinner, for all sorts of things. if you're wearing it just for meets, then it is a costume and not a fashion

>> No.9872596

>>9872562
Seconding this >>9872586
Wearing lolita just because you want to is so much fun, in my opinion it's actually even more fun than wearing it at meetups. I suggest you give this a shot before you sell your frills.

>> No.9872605

>>9872586
It looks like a costume. Almost the entire population will see it as a costume. Unless you're wearing something toned down, wearing it out "just grocery shopping" seems stupid to me.

I wear it out to stuff like nice dinners, festivals, full days out, museum trips, ect. You know, stuff that normal people dress up nice for in general? You can enjoy wearing your frills to the grocery store, but some of us want to get our errands done in a reasonable amount of time and live in the real world.

>> No.9872611
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9872611

>>9872268

I believe the original lolita culture is long dead. What we have is something else now, sort of echoing the past. I don't think it's just lolita, I'm also interested in gothic fashion, and in general that's going a similar way. In the past alt fashion people found a way to bond over their way of dressing, the music, the mentality, it wasn't very polished but it was for themselves. I feel like today everybody is just much more united by social media, the standard for what looks good is sky high, and we all can instantly browse every dress from every brand. Its not really mysterious and revolutionary when you can buy anything and look at everyone else's outfits in the world. Much more of our lives are public, so we struggle with perfectionism. Because of the way social media works, we see the best of the best and the most perfect lolitas, as opposed to digging around in the dark and finding random lolita blogs.
Dressing a certain way was also to express that you were in the "club". Maybe that you liked the music or mindset or aesthetic or whatever. Now we can do all that with our Instagram page, and there isn't much need for the mentality or music when we all agree we have wildly different tastes in other aspects. We can also just go to meetups or cons and find lots of like minded people. People can get so much stuff easily on the second hand market or from China for a fraction of the price that the original brands were in Japan, we don't really have to save up for it as long as we have some kind of income. Not that I hate lolita culture today, or social media, it's just different to the original culture, and it's a byproduct of lolita becoming global and more popular than it ever was just in Japan. Globalization makes things homogenized, but also ultra accessible, which is good. Rant over.
Tldr.. I think it's dead in it's original form, but hopefully it will keep going forever so I can continue to buy my cute dresses.

>> No.9872616

>>9872605
You know it's possible to wear lolita without a wig and three layers of makeup, right? If someone wears lolita as a daily fashion, wearing it to do errands like grocery shopping isn't stupid.

>> No.9872623

>>9872605
Ntayrt but it does sound like you don't enjoy it for itself anymore. Most days I just can't resist the pull of my closet, even if i go blouseless or without a petti I wear one of the dresses/skirts I adore. That ends in me running errands or food shopping in lolita. I doubt most of us who wear it day to day are thinking "oo yes I'm going to the post office today, I need to wear lolita". It's just wearing what you love because you love it, it's not really stupid.

>> No.9872626

>>9872605
>It looks like a costume. Almost the entire population will see it as a costume.
Same goes for all other alternative fashion styles, the entire population's opinion on it is irrelevant, what's your point?

>> No.9872646

>>9872268
It can't die, it's just clothes. Unless somebody burns every dress out there it won't die.

>> No.9872659

>>9872423
Have you not been to Shinjuku? There's always some hanging around there. I saw them randomly in the subway in other cities in Japan too.

>> No.9872662

>>9872546
Why not do an event at two different times in succession to split people up? That way the people who are always late can choose the later time, and friend groups can just decide what time they'll go together.

>> No.9872663

>>9872357
My god, how autistic can you be. You can wear clothing for special occasions and not every day but still be treating it like "actual clothing". Not every one lives the same lifestyle as you anon, and harassment is much harsher depending on where you live. Grow up.

>> No.9872667

>>9872663
How is your comment relevant to anything I said? Do you not think it's bullshit that wearing dresses was perfectly acceptable in 2007 but suddenly a decade later even a simple skirt gets attention? Because it's a load of bullshit imo, even if we're not talking about lolita at all.

>> No.9872671

>>9872336
What kind of shit area do you live in where people think a jersey dress is dressed up

>> No.9872674

>>9872667
Did you erase the second half of your comment entirely from your memory or are you just retarded?

>> No.9872675

>>9872674
Again, how is your comment relevant to that?
Anon said it's harder to wear lolita because mainstream ideas on what casual is have become more extreme, and I don't understand how in the world that's relevant to wearing lolita at all. So people comment that you're dressed up when you wear a simple dress... so that means you can't wear lolita? How does that make sense? Is it so offensive to be asked "Why are you so dressed up"? Because if that makes you uncomfortable then alt fashion isn't for you, I'm sorry if that hurts your feefees.

>> No.9872676

>>9872268
Good riddance, you people are fucking blight on society

>> No.9872679

>>9872268
>Is lolita dying?

You're bought your first dress this year, didn't you?

>> No.9872689

>>9872394
I think the point is they'd rather people didn't come up to them or make that connection at all?

But people are stupid, so unfortunately it's not likely to stop

>> No.9872696

>>9872675
Okay, so just retarded is the answer then, apparently.
If people have stronger ideals about what is casual and acceptable, harassment is intensified when you wear something out of the norm.
You seem to not understand that harassment extends beyond "Why are you so dressed up?" And even at that level, being stopped frequently to have a conversation with strangers is neither convenient nor enjoyable.
Did you understand this time, or should I repeat it again slowly for you?

>> No.9872700

>>9872273
This so fucking much.

>> No.9872708

>>9872696
I understand that, but unless anon lives in a dangerous area where dressing up can be potentially risky, or if she needs to keep a certain image in public due to her career, or if there are any other circumstances in her life that prevent her from wearing lolita then it's obviously better to avoid that; I'm not trying to argue that she or anyone else has to wear the fashion no matter what; but otherwise, it's really not a big deal.
You can tell people you're in a hurry if they try to stop you, you can ignore people who yell shit at you, you're a mature adult and don't have to grace every stranger with your time when they demand to know why you're wearing a frilly dress. Sure, it's tiring to be constantly approached and badgered about what you're wearing when you're trying to go on about you day, I'm not denying that, but it's the kind of thing we have to deal with when we wear this fashion, or any other alt fashion for that matter.
Again, if dressing up is ill advised due to your lifestyle/career choice/location etc. then you're definitely better off not doing that, but otherwise, if wearing lolita is "hard" and distressing for you because you hate the attention, you might want to reconsider your involvement in this subculture.
You can continue calling me names if that makes you feel better by the way, it doesn't make your arguments more compelling.

>> No.9872733

>>9872456
For real. If you go to any bigger chinese city you'll see a few just walking around going about their daily business.
>>9872466
Chinese lolitas do wear a lot of OTT, but there is still a lot of normal/casual lolita.

>> No.9872742

>>9872519
Me too,
I would try but I don't know where Japanese lolitas post.

>> No.9872775

>>9872742
I've seen lots of them on ig. If you follow the "Lolita fashion" tag in Japanese(can't bother to search for it to paste it here) it's easy to find them.

>> No.9872778

>>9872466
>more accessible

Just because more Americans are making OPs in size XXXXXXL on Etsy doesn’t mean the fashion isn’t dying. Companies are closing, meet ups are getting smaller, thems the facts.

>> No.9872781

>>9872742
To add to this >>9872775 Twitter is quite popular too.

>> No.9872782

>>9872696
Holy shit, have you considered than a fashion that stands out might not mesh with your basement dweller lifestyle and functionally retarded social skills?

Just hide under an oversized sonic the hedgehog hoodie like the other artists who have panic attacks over normal human interaction.

>> No.9872784

>>9872742
You can learn chinese or japanese? it's not hard. You can do it on your own with free resources all over the internet.

>> No.9872785

>>9872782
*autists, who usually think they’re artists anyway so lol

>> No.9872787

>>9872742
Maybe some anon could translate threads on girlschannel.
>http://girlschannel.net/topics/593958/
>http://girlschannel.net/topics/826623/
>http://girlschannel.net/topics/1024137/
I have no idea what they talk about I just searched for "ロリータ"

>> No.9872788
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9872788

>>9872787
>http://girlschannel.net/topics/593958/

>> No.9872793

>>9872696
>If people have stronger ideals about what is casual and acceptable, harassment is intensified when you wear something out of the norm.
No one is saying otherwise, but it hasn't gotten worse as time went by like anon claimed; if anything you and her and anyone else who cries about wearing lolita outside of meets being "hard", are just more afraid of human interaction than you should be.
Standing out always draws attention to oneself, either positive, negative, or simply neutral and curious; if you can't handle that then don't stand out, stick to your comfy F21 shit because lolita isn't for you.

>> No.9872795

>>9872788
Well, that's certainly something.

>> No.9872825

>>9872793
ntayrt, but I wear lolita daily and 99% of the comments I get are super sweet and the people are genuinely nice and curious.

And for all of you saying lolita isn't practical daily, stop wearing ott all the fucking time. it's no less practical for a lot of things (going shopping, going to school, banking, dining, enjoying a walk or going to the library, etc) than normie fashion. Sure, I wouldn't garden in my lolita or wash my car or anything like that, but the point still stands. A cute blouse or cutsew, maybe a cardigan, a not too fancy skirt of jsk/op, a smaller petti if you're worried about taking up space, a bigger one if not, and some nice comfy lolita shoes and socks and you're good to go.

>> No.9872837
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9872837

>>9872787
>all these girls complaining that at 28-30 they are too old for the fashion even though they now have the money
>tfw I just started buying at 28, now almost 30 because that's when I got a promotion and had cash to blow on burando every month

Well you gulls are certainly more supportive of oldlitas than that Japanese board.

>> No.9872838

If you get harassed in lolita that's not a problem with your clothes, it's a problem with the area you live in. Stop wasting your money on brand and move out of whatever shithole you're living in and things will be better

>> No.9872864

>>9872272
>Wearing toned down lolita coords in black is easier because black blends in the crowd better than pastel, and also because people just assume I'm a goth so they usually don't pester me with questions.
This is legitimately why I switched from pastel sweet to just general kuro lolita

>> No.9872874

>>9872838
>I wouldn't wear lolita in a ghetto

>> No.9872884

>>9872837
I think it's because Japanese culture expects women to grow out of specific fashions. I get people thinking I'm in my teens in Japan quite often just because I wear Liz Lisa and that's a teen brand. Friends even commented that their daughter used to wear LL when she was in school.

>> No.9872886

Oh fuck off already, it's changing not dying

>> No.9872889

>>9872423
They just look waaay different than what you're expecting.

>> No.9872901

>>9872837
I started Lolita when I was 29 and I'm gonna be 32 this year. I am determined to wear my frills until I'm old and grey. I'll support you amon

>> No.9872908
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9872908

The rest of lolita is dying so Moitie can live.

>> No.9872928

>>9872837
It’s because the Japanese board hasn’t had the tumblr hugbox invasion.

Past 28 you’re too old for it and just look pathetic and desperate.

You don’t look as young as you think you do.

People telling you otherwise are being polite because they can see your thirst and feel sorry for you.

>> No.9872943

>>9872782
>I don’t like being harassed
>Y-YOURE AN AUTISTIC BASEMENT DWELLER!!!!!
kek

>> No.9872952

>>9872793
>If you don’t wear it how I think it should be worn, it’s not for you!!!
Yea, you’re retarded. You can wear a fashion that stands out without needing to wear it every single free moment of your life. Wearing comfy shit to do errands and lolita to special events doesn’t make it less of a fashion, just like how wearing a nice dress to a wedding doesn’t make it less of a fashion. Trying to tell people that they have to weear lolita ALLLL the time otherwise they should just get out!!! sounds stupid as hell.

>> No.9872956

>>9872838
It may be hard for a minimum wage worker like yourself to understand, but some people have jobs that they can’t just drop and move away from.

>> No.9872959

>>9872928
nayrt but I feel really sorry for people with your worldview. Aging happens to everyone and there isn't much we can do other than wear sunscreen, eat healthy, and hope for the best. I'm only in my early 20's, and I'm not looking forward to aging either, but denying myself something I love just because of a few wrinkles seems silly. After all, I dress up for me, not anyone else. Life is short enough without forcing myself to give up my hobbies because someone else is bothered by my age.

>> No.9872992

>>9872778
No, it's also not the facts that "meets are getting smaller". Where are you getting your ~facts~ from? You can stop pulling things out of your ass.

>> No.9872999

>>9872928
God, you're just proving you're some kind of retarded newfag with things like this and this thread itself. Most the actual designers and backbones of the fashion are not a bunch of early 20 year old itas running around. If people over 28 would all actually quit, you seriously wouldn't have any brands or your fashion as a whole. Not everyone wears ddlg sweet style and thinks 22 is like the end of their life.

>> No.9873001
File: 236 KB, 682x1024, F467E2AC-95DE-4BDB-B2CF-ACF4A73BEA2F.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9873001

>>9872959

>> No.9873004

>>9872663
Definitively depends on where you live. You can get away with being less causal in a more populated city, or a quirky city.

>> No.9873008

>>9872423
do you actually live there or are you talking out of your ass? i went to tokyo/osaka on vacation and saw 10+ lolitas just going about their day-to-days. In shibuya, harajuku, shinjuku, and some in Osaka too, even.

>> No.9873037
File: 112 KB, 500x745, tumblr_mbwalyKYp31r9572l.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9873037

>>9873001
>implying lolita is similar to slutty club wear.
older people can dress with style and still not look like they're trying to be 20 anon

>> No.9873068

>>9872788
Who’s Becky

>> No.9873079

>>9873068
with the good hair

>> No.9873099

>>9873068
I think it basically meant, that the girl taking the poll thinks it looks fine on other girls, but wasn't for them. the original question was something about wearing lolita

>> No.9873103
File: 5 KB, 530x71, Untitled3.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9873103

pic related

>> No.9873111 [DELETED] 

>>9872908
Next thread pic and title, plz

>> No.9873124

>>9872952
It's been repeatedly said in this very thread that you don't have to wear it every moment of your life, especially if your lifestyle doesn't allow it; no one said or even implied otherwise, only you did. The point of this inane discussion is that if you don't wear lolita casually, even if only sometimes, specifically because you're uncomfortable with attention then it's not for you, which is completely valid; you shouldn't wear something you're not comfortable in. It just goes to show that you don't have what it takes to be involved in alternative fashion.
Yet you're clinging onto an argument that not a single anon except for you has said because it's convenient to you.
So either you're deliberately shitposting to get a reaction or you're severely illiterate.

>> No.9873137

>>9872928
I think that the reason these Japanese people feel that wearing Lolita past mid/late-twenties has to do with the responsibilities of being an adult,and not ageing. I remember reading a translated article(at fyeahlolita iirc?) Written by a mother,very concerned about his child because she saw their teacher wearing lolita on a free day.

>> No.9873144

>>9873137
I remember that. The responses were mostly in favor of the lolita, saying it's harmless to wear it on days off, also iirc some comments said the mother was irrational for being so concerned about it.

>> No.9873149

It's not dead, it just feels that way because it has changed for the worse in some ways.

>> No.9873157

>>9873124
Except that's the entire point, can you even read? You can keep lolita to special occasions and not casually and still be treating it as a fashion. Just because you don't want to attract unneeded attention in your everyday life when you're running errands or shopping for groceries doesn't mean you can't be comfortable with the attention at other more suitable times. Do you understand, or do you need another repetition?

>> No.9873161

>>9873037
Lolita fashion is not a hobby you can maintain separately from your body(unless you're rather a collector, that a wearer). You wear it to adorn your own appearance, the whole history of people commenting on other lolita's outfits proves it. Once you have nothing to adorn it's not for you. Also people say a lot, that lolita is not costume, but look how people discouraged from wearing non-lolita stuff or things with misrelated theme, so you have kinda make this "princessy doll" image. It looks fun for young person, but when you get older you can't pretend you're cute dolly ugguu.

>> No.9873172

Lolita may die but /cgl/'s autism will live forever.

>> No.9873189

>>9872273
It hurts so much because it's true.

>> No.9873190

>>9873161
For someone who says lolita isn't a costume, you sure have a costumey view of it.

>> No.9873193

>>9872268
The opposite's happening in my area. We're actually experiencing a huge upsurge of newbies, and we've gone from maybe planning a meet once a year to having one at least once a month. Feels good, man

>> No.9873194

>>9873161
says the conlita
you're basically saying
>hurr its suppose to look like a costume you dont have the option to wear it because you like it/not for attenshun
7/10, you actually triggered me enough to reply

>> No.9873208

>>9872928
That's funny, most of my lolita icons are past 28 and I pesonally don't like posts on CoF because of their youthful baby face but based on how well the coord is put together.

>> No.9873226

>>9872928
>Past 28 you’re too old for it and just look pathetic and desperate.
I'm only in my early twenties but one thing lolita has thaught me is that if I care what others think and stop doing the things I love because of it I'm the only loser and imo that's pathetic. I will do it as long as I feel like it with confidence and if it's pathetic and desparate for you then let it be. I'm not going to stop now because some rando thinks it's weird and pathetic and it doesn't bother me more few years later.

I think lolita community as a whole is too worried about what others think. It's easy to just say mean people are preventing one from wearing it out alone, being creative and what not but I doubt much have changed actually from the "golden era" of lolita. People could just admit they don't want to wear it daily and treat it as a costume or that they are not creative.

>> No.9873234

>>9872928
what makes you think the japanese board is full of actual lolitas lol
they're always bitching about some no1curr lolitas tweets and never post coords

>> No.9873247

>>9872423
This isn’t true at all. I constantly see lolitas. They just don’t dress like the girls in western comms.

>> No.9873253

>>9873226
I love you, anon.

>> No.9873256

>>9873247
Nayrt,but I'm curious as to what "not like the girls in the western Comms" means? No petti? Longer dresses? Or what?

>> No.9873282
File: 127 KB, 683x1024, 89A9947-683x1024.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9873282

>>9873256
Look no further than KERA snaps. You'll have to search through several more experimental outfits, but there are few lolita coords.
They are wearing lolita, it doesn't look that different. Pic related

>> No.9873302

>>9873282
That's ...exactly like the western girls. Unlike >>9873247 said.
On another topic(but similar),does anyone know anything about Fanatic magazine? It's run by 4 girls from Bunks Fashion college. I think it isn't sold physically,just distributed freely, so it's almost impossible to find it outside of the distribution points.

>> No.9873358

>>9873161
You’re not a lolita, are you? It’s just obvious how you talk about it. gtfo shit-stirring LARPer.

>> No.9873360

>>9873358
I am and I'm as heartbroken about aging in lolita as yall are. It's just something we all should admit, people can't expect looking appealing as they age.

>> No.9873375
File: 212 KB, 500x368, 1429364528246.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9873375

>>9873161
>once you have nothing to adorn
Fuck I had no idea that your body vanishes from the physical world once you turn 30! You'd think someone would tell us these things!

>> No.9873385
File: 61 KB, 500x563, momoko.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9873385

>tfw 29
>tfw not even 5' tall
>still regularly asked where I go to college

pic related just try and pry these dresses from my cold wrinkly hands.

>> No.9873386

>>9873360
Have some fucking self confidence. You're going to wind up being one of those people that just gives up and looks even worse in normie clothes.

>> No.9873403

>>9873375
Misako has actually been dead for years and the Japanese government had an android built in her likeness to continue promoting kawaii across the globe.

>> No.9873415

>>9873360
>as yall are
Speak for yourself, judging by the comments so far anons don't give a shit about their age so you're in the minority. Enjoy selling your taobao for peanuts when you turn 25.

>> No.9873435

IMO it’s dying as a street fashion. Lolita’s roots have always been alternative and counterculture, it looks strange to normies so you have to have balls to wear it in the general public. Conlitas and meetlitas are more prevalent today because technology and the ease of acquiring it has changed, so the attitude with Lolita has changed. It’s a safe space/hug box in its own sense, girls who are otherwise too scared to wear it can do it with their community and not feel as ostracized directly by society. Lone lolitas, people who wear it regularly but don’t post to social media, people who wear it for themselves do exist but because the target age demographic for getting INTO and DISCOVERING is younger than 30, we get a lot of people who are insecure/ need validation/still learning about themselves joining and following the herd in terms of how it’s worn/how you have to look etc. My take on the western community, feel free to shit all over this
> :^)

>> No.9873448

These threads are always so weird to read, the fashion has exploded in popularity in my area in the last few years. Meets have gone from 4-5 people to 20+ regularly.

There was no golden age of Lolita Fashion. I love oldschool but nobody wants to go back to 2004. There's nothing of value to be had on Livejournal anymore. We're either looking back through rose tinted glasses, or we're part of the problem by treating it as occasion wear instead of daily fashion. The fashion has changed, and will continue to change. Lolita has survived so much longer than other jp fashions because it has adapted to so many changes.

Only we can keep the heart of Lolita fashion going. Only when we stop being afraid of the term "subculture" can we really say we're trying to keep the life in what we love, and you can't complain about meetlitas or conlitas and then bitch about people who want to take part in the lolita lifestyle or subculture, whatever that might mean to them.

Buy some casual pieces, get those skirt and cutsew combos out of the back of your wardrobe. Lolita won't be dead until someone puts their petticoat away for the last time.

>> No.9873452

>get high paying job at 22
>0 motivation to wear lolita or do anything fun with my life
>lay in bed on my days of because why

This sucks and I need to try to push myself to be social again. I could buy so much lolita and just enjoy myself, but I feel like it's lost its magic.

>> No.9873458

>>9872362
>Young people have less money to spend and are more scared of the future as the political climate changes and job uncertainty is on the rise.

Most people I know who are broke are that way because of bad decisions they made based on feelings (dropping out because college is too """hard""", etc.), I don't know if it's completely correct to blame the political climate. I came from a relatively poor family and through basically just doing exactly what program directors told us to do in college managed to get myself a job that's good enough to where I now live by myself and still have extra money to finally get into cosplay.

>> No.9873461

>>9872778
>Thinking that accessible lolita means indie Western designers.

Your newfag is showing. There was a time when getting brand was nearly impossible, a time when getting shitty Bodyline from Cosmates was special, a time before Brand had stores in the west or would even ship there.

Now it's so goddamn easy to get it straight from the brand or shitty con resellers or Taobao resellers. The fucking world is your lolita oyster.

>> No.9873465

>>9873435
>>9873448
Agreed on all points.

>>9873452
Maybe you need to rekindle your spark. What made you love lolita in the first place? What made you want to wear it? What substyle do you currently have in your wardrobe, and in what colors? When was the last time you tried something new? Not just in the sense of buying and wearing something new but also doing something new - Have you ever worn lolita in doors just for fun? How do you usually wear your pieces? Can you mix them up somehow, wear them in new ways?
Before you jump into buying new things in new colors or styles, I suggest you start wearing the frills you already have indoors and experiment with new coords. Don't think about it too much, and for the sake of trying new things, don't concern yourself about the end result and whether it's ita or not - Just mix and match, go by trial and error as if you've discovered the fashion yesterday.
If consuming media inspires you too, I suggest you also do that: Music, movies, articles, blogs, videos; not everyone is into lolita-related media but it might be additional help when trying to find that magic again.

>> No.9873483

>>9873172
‘Age is only a number, all that matters is how old you ~feeeeel~’

it’s a bunch of 30 year old women talking like 46 year old dance moms trying to justify their belly shirts and tramp stamps lmao

>> No.9873485

>>9873465
>Have you ever worn lolita in doors just for fun?

Hey >>9873452 it's >>9873448 here, this sounds weird but this really helped me remember why I liked wearing the fashion. I got to a point once where dressing up just felt like it was sucking the energy out of me because I didn't make an effort unless I was meeting friends. I'd go through that cycle of pyjamas - work clothes - pyjamas and it's hard to break out of. Wearing a simple cutsew dress or a really low-effort no-ironing op and putting on a little light makeup can be a huge mood boost. The longer you go without wearing Lolita, the harder it is to go back because it seems more and more distant and foreign. For a while, I thought I didn't love it anymore, I thought the spark was gone, but I just wasn't wearing it and the hole it left was starting to close up.

It's weird to explain, but don't give up. If, after that, you really don't feel like you love it anymore, it might be time to let it go, but don't rashly sell off your wardrobe or anything like that. Even if lolita ends up not being for you, I hope you can find a hobby you love so you don't feel like you're wasting your days off.

>> No.9873490

>>9873282
This is how the designers intend it to look. Not like the conlolita ott cluster fuck.

>> No.9873574

>>9873256
i'm >>9873008 and at least half that i saw were AP sets (British bear and holy lantern twinning and starry night theater I remember off the top of my head), and the girls were usually in pairs

>> No.9873938

>>9873256
No petticoats, less matchy, rarely see any wigs. A lot of people wear straight up sneakers with lolita. I see lots of girls with crazy colored hair and piercings, but a lot just use natural hair basically unstyled. “Street snaps” are actually planned so the outfits you see in those were picked out specifically with the intention of getting their photo taken.

>> No.9873964

>>9872270
It's literally because of people like you kek

>> No.9873969

>>9873964
t. butthurt fatty

>> No.9873973

>>9872611
I agree with you, and now all I personally see is body shaming and crit over silly things and insane gatekeeping and it scares me from even wanting to be a part of a local community. I see what people post and it's gross to think that me or one of my friends will end up on a thread making fun of how our coord isn't right or my colored hair doesn't match or my friend is too tall, etc etc. I want a community that cares and actually wants to discuss the fashion and our personal interests and hobbies, not a fucking episode of americas next top model

>> No.9873997

>>9872423
Am I having deja-vu or did you copy and paste this comment from a post like a year ago?

>> No.9874017

>>9873973
You can always wear the fashion and not join the community. Community interaction is nowhere near mandatory like people make it out to be.

>> No.9874023

>>9874017
This. I'm a comm mod and I didn't get this for a long time. Some people just want the do their own thing. Some people aren't into meeting up with relative strangers just because they wear the same stuff. Some comms are close-knit, some are not.

I think local communities are great for people starting out. It's a great help for younger newbies to build confidence and coord skills, but it's not necessary at all. You don't need a license in the form of a local comm to enjoy the fashion.

>> No.9874042

>>9872527
I definitely agree. I would classify my views slightly right of center, while not being alt right but definitely as far from the left as possible and I certainly feel ostracized for my beliefs despite loving lolita.
Recently I disagreed with some thread on Rufflechat that being transgender was a medical condition and not a gender cononformist political label and I was very quick to recieve of backlash from plenty of SJW Millenials just for having a different opinion. We are living in times of great division in today's current political climate if you ask me.

>> No.9874045

>>9873282
This is a curated street snap. Not really how people dress when they are just going about their business.

>> No.9874051

>>9873973
Stop visiting cgl and BtB and all of that goes away. Most comms are tolerant to the point of being hugboxes, and in my comm the only people who get “body shamed” are skinny girls who become targets of passive-aggressive jealousy. I’m pretty sure that calling someone fat would result in an outright ban. The only people in my comm who get posted here are the annoying drama llamas who are probably selfposting anyway.

>> No.9874058

>>9874042
No offence anon, but thay had the right to express their opinion as much as you do. That discussion shouldn't exist at all. Not in rufflechat at least. Just don't take part in these.
>>9874045
Old school snaps also weren't really what they wore daily, but we take them as a prime example of what lolita is. Fruits chose outfits they liked the most. Lolitas knew where they shot the snaps, so they dressed up and sat there. Maybe it's curated, and it's not "daily lolita" but it says what japanese lolitas think "proper lolita" is. And it's not something different from westerners.

>> No.9874073

>>9874042
I’m a filthy lefty and have had a similar experience. At this point I feel like gender politics is a separate issue altogether, but I’ve been accused of being right-wing and ultra-conservative for saying that I don’t like the idea of giving hormones to children who might just be going through a phase. I was a self-hating gay tomboy in middle school and probably would have wanted T if that had been a thing at the time, but as an adult I’m very glad I was left to grow up and develop normally. Apparently this makes me a Trump-supporter. I’m not even American.

>> No.9874075

>>9874073
Forgot to mention that this was in my comm. I don’t touch RC with a ten foot pole.

>> No.9874076

>>9874058
Like >>9873938 mentions, sneakers and mismatched stuff is way more common in Japan. I see lolitas here wearing stuff that people get torn apart for on cgl.

>> No.9874080

>>9874076
Never said they weren't. It's just that general idea of what lolita should be isn't different at all. First anon said that lolita isn't worn "like in the west", but it clearly is. Lolita isn't just CoF, it's daily coords that aren't posted, cause thay would be torn apart. So they have their more casual outfits, but they still have proper coords.

>> No.9874089
File: 53 KB, 500x750, d34cc6258eed34118c7cb44f69322569.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9874089

>>9873161
I would say you can wear a more mature style once you get older, if you are looking older. I do think, if you can not pull off super sweet OTT past a certain point, you should try a different substyle. I think you can wear lolita until you are in your 50's honestly, so long as you make it work for how old you look. Classic lolita, looks fabulous on older women.

>> No.9874091

>>9873385
anon you're so lucky, I'm 24 and my eye wrinkles are so deep set I look like Misako.
Most embarrassing behaviour.

>> No.9874092

>>9874080
>but they still have proper coords
Yes, in planned photoshoots for magazines. Lolitas in the US emulate that for daily wear and meet ups.

>> No.9874094

>>9872376
well
she does look like she needs liberating.

>> No.9874096

>>9872268
I discovered Lolita from a weeb magazine in 2005/6 when I was a young teenager. I loved the fashion but there was no way in hell I had the confidence, or means of access to, anything to do with the fashion besides sometimes looking at LJ during lunch on the school computers. I had a job, and in retrospect I'm kicking myself for not saving up and just buying the damn dress.
Now I'm in my mid-20's and a teacher, so I'm able to get fairly decent dresses nowadays, with no time to wear them!
Sorry for blog post, I don't think it's dying necessarily but the nostalgia of it being almost a 'secret' fashion club has definitely disappeared with widening internet accessibility. That being said, I'm able to actually be part of a comm now, despite rarely being able to meet up with them, I can arrange something at the click of a button.

TL;DR: internet has definitely made the fashion more accessible (hello closetchild), but perhaps working somewhere that you can't wear Lolita (and then when the weekend comes you just want to become a human shellsuit) has synthesised a death of sorts

who knowssssssssss

>> No.9874133

>>9872423
aside from "some brands have closed" this is just not true

>> No.9874144

I don't get why would you try out of your way to prove that lolita is dead. Especially when it's clearly not true. Noone posted any pictures of supposed japanese lolitas wearing sneakers. On KERA's website there's a photo of a meet in Hiroshima, and all of them wear normal lolita.

>> No.9874162

>>9872519
I swear you used too with the drama, but they were kicked and went to lolcow for a short while.

>> No.9874175

>>9874144
Either because people think it's true, or they're worried it might be true. Imo the only people truly concerned about this aren't really involved in lolita, or they just don't play attention closely enough. Even if your local comm isn't really active anymore, your local comm doesn't reflect the entire international community and subculture - While some comms might be on the decline, others are thriving, and it's not an indication of whether lolita as a whole is dying.
Meanwhile anons posting from Japan either have vastly different experiences from one another, or might be shitposting, for better or worse.
I think that as long as there are designers out there making more lolita clothes, as long as we support them with our money and not just our good will, and as long as each and every one of us wears her frills, lolita will continue to thrive, so there's no real reason to worry.

>> No.9874547

>>9872277
>annoying members who want to put politics everywhere
I'm just thinking it would be really funny if it one day got hijacked and become a fringe political movement. Like the next skinheads except it's with gangs of girls in frilly pink dresses roaming the streets and beating up immigrants

>> No.9874637

>>9872446
this is so cringey what the fuck

>> No.9874641

>>9872446
She's a strong independent woman who plays with herself.

>> No.9874642
File: 536 KB, 1280x1912, 3423.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9874642

>>9874637
I used to think these pictures were satire

>> No.9874665

>>9872268
What dress is this? The details are beautiful.

>> No.9874689

>>9874665
https://lolibrary.org/items/ap-antoinette-decoration-op

>> No.9874703

>>9874144
Japanese lolitas don’t usually want to be bothered for pics so it’s hard to get them. I could try to take some sneaky pics next time I’m at an event that’s not a photo opportunity but phones here make a shutter noise that you can’t turn off so it’s pretty rude.

>> No.9874705
File: 150 KB, 900x1200, DcmuL5GV0AALnja.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9874705

>>9874703
Here, have a fresh Japanese Lolita image straight from Twitter.
Enjoy.

>> No.9874714
File: 947 KB, 1330x2048, ADB56914-29B1-4BEA-A20F-DA437113EA2A.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9874714

>>9874705
Here you go

>> No.9874715
File: 224 KB, 1024x1024, 764C81D4-D311-4DEC-949F-9384F8322154.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9874715

>>9874714

>> No.9874716
File: 255 KB, 683x1024, 309035C9-4165-4635-846A-1D9201751682.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9874716

>>9874715

>> No.9874718

>>9874705
>>9874714
>>9874715
CUTE
U
T
E

>> No.9874724

>>9874689
Thank you kind anon! Pity I don't like the rest of the dress, but that bodice is insanely beautiful.

>> No.9874726
File: 215 KB, 768x1024, 2DBB87FC-4492-4005-85AA-F944CF352BD5.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9874726

I think someone misunderstood my original comment about lolita being more casual in Japan to mean it’s dying. But I meant the opposite, I think it’s thriving because there are a lot less rules. I don’t really see many images online that represent what I see daily but I’ll try to find some more. A bit different, but here’s an indie fashion show image that I think is interesting.

>> No.9875882

>>9872908
Underrated post

>> No.9875886

>>9874665
I mean if you googled antoinette deco angelic pretty, it would have come up you lazy shit.

>> No.9875991

>>9874042
nobody did ask you. gtfo, nazi.

>> No.9875995

I wonder if people feel hesitant to participate in meetups on a local comm level because of BtB secrets and the culture of this very board. We'll be posted to the internet and anyone who says they don't care what other lolitas think is lying or in denial. I want to feel like I'm PART of a community if I dress in this street fashion.

>> No.9875999

>>9874073
Sorry anon. It's really fucked up. I firmly believe that in 10-20 years people will look back on this trans kids shit as what it is, child abuse.

>> No.9876140

>>9875995
It's not uncommon to see people bitch about the community being full of elitist bitches and how scared they are to join, without even trying to interact with us or understand us on a deeper level beyond what they see on cgl or btb; it's not exclusive to anonymous spaces like this one either.
Honestly, with all the garbage riffraff we get these years - Cosplayers who see lolita as another form of cosplay, special snowflakes, lolitas-at-heart, fucking ageplayers - I think the community isn't bitchy and elitist enough.
>anyone who says they don't care what other lolitas think is lying or in denial
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but not everyone is insecure like you.

>> No.9876153

>>9876140
>any one who says they don’t care what other lolitas thinks is lying or in denial.

Soo true. They only get like this when someone posted them to BtBs or a thread here ( usually themselves ). You can’t make a pubic display of how you don’t care if you don’t care. That’s the thing about not caring, you don’t draw attention to how you don’t care and don’t make snarky remarks in your later posts about the “haters”. It’s just proof that the shit being said about you gets under your skin that you feel the need to let others know you saw it.

>> No.9876301

>>9872423
Are you kidding? I see a few every week, if they’re not decked out in a full cord they are wearing brand pieces. And I’ve been to a few events here in Kansai and there are so many lolitas.

>> No.9876308

>>9873938
I second this. Hardly any makeup, what we’d call limo hair and casual shoes like doc martens. And general less matchymatchyness. It just looks like real fashion, not like costume. I like wearing lolita here because I do the same and I know I won’t get called out on it.

>> No.9876320

>>9876308
You can do the same thing outside of Japan too, do you think no daily lolitas exist in the west? And if someone calls you out on not looking photoshoot-ready when you're out dressing for yourself, they're the ones making an ass of themselves.

>> No.9876381

>>9872270

You misspelled "whale" sizes.

>> No.9876386

>>9872270
how does that even fit in her stomach

>> No.9876461

>>9872270
>spouting this bullshit and then posting a girl who literally eats fast food and throws it up

>> No.9876651

wow this thread is depressing

>> No.9876703 [DELETED] 

>>9874714
I guess this is a good image to ask this. Is lolita really good for amusement parks? What kind of rides, in your experience, are okay for wearing lolita?

It just makes me nervous seeing wigs and hairpieces getting potentially caught or falling off on some rides. There's often water related areas (some rides don't disclose they have something water related to them) and it can also be sweltering at these parks during the summer. Some rides require you take things off or put things like shoes, purses, or extra objects aside. What's the best way to coord, in your experience?

>> No.9877007

>>9874042
Your first mistake was thinking identity politics are worth a moment of your time desu. Like another Anon said identity politics and political leaning are two different categories. I agree that these discussions aren't appropriate for a lolita group.

>> No.9879108

>>9874092
This

I'm in Tokyo/Osaka for a second time and seeing lots of Lolitas. It's so much more casual/easier/relaxing to wear it in Tokyo than back home, I know if I got a pic posted of me wearing IW with my sneakers and basic hair I'd get eaten alive, but I do 10x more walking/commuting, so it's just not feasible to wear a wig/bangs or Lolita shoes out for 12 hours personally.

>> No.9879119 [DELETED] 

>>9874144
No one wants to take a photo of their coord with sneakers for obvious reasons but more Lolitas in Tokyo wear sneakers with their coords more often than not with their daily wear based on what I've seen.

>> No.9879836

There are no more subcultures, kids these days only dress up for instagram, and never do anything social in person out of fear of being cringed at.

There is nothing in life worse than an instagoth, I see one maybe once a month around uni and just think to myself 'this idiot knows that she's not on the internet and that there's no filters here right?"

>> No.9879840

>>9879836
>kids these days... never do anything social in person out of fear of being cringed at
>this idiot knows that she's not on the internet and that there's no filters here right?
How do you say these two things and not realize you're a part of the problem? Let people wear what they like.

>> No.9879854

>>9879840
>Implying that I'm not bitching anonymously on the internet for a reason.

I think the problem is that people implicitly think about the internet differently. When I was growing up the internet was only instrumental to social activity. Most people used it to organise social events, and no one took internet culture seriously because we were aware that people acted differently online. Your assumption that I actually say this stuff in person is common among younger internet users for whom internet interaction has by and large replaced real world social circles.

It is always difficult to take those first steps into reality, especially amongst the older cultures associated with crime and hard drugs. My bitching is simply that if those kids took the time to hang out and see each other in person they'd realise just how silly they look in real life and either slink back to their instagram followers or actually develop something practical for the modern audience. I don't go around hunting these people down and telling them they look like clowns.

>> No.9879862

>>9879854
I never said you specifically targeted these people or said this stuff in person, but you did say
>hurr this idiot doesn't know there's no filters irl and she looks dumb lol cringeeeee
while whining about subcultures being dead because kids are afraid of being cringed at. In fact, while kids are afraid of attention irl they're also afraid of being targeted online, and people freely and openly cringe at subculture-related content online, without the safety of anonymity. Like I said, you are a part of the problem.
I think you're projecting so much you completely missed my point.

Also, solely for the sake of discussion,
>actually develop something practical for the modern audience
What do you mean? That people should show more toned down looks in their social media, to give others a more accurate idea of what alt fashion actually looks like? Not trying to argue here, rather genuinely trying to understand what you said.
I will agree that certain looks, like current drag-like makeup trends, just look terrible in person; but at the same time, maybe I'm too forgiving in the sense that I get genuinely excited to see another alt person in public that I don't care to nitpick their appearance, I'm just glad to see some sign of something different.

>> No.9879886
File: 79 KB, 340x255, 62740_600.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
9879886

>>9879108
I wear sneakers with Lolita all the time,usually the puma bow sneakers(I wear sweet lolita),but never post it online. If people stopped wearing Lolita only for the gram...things would be different. We need to bring cutsews back,and maybe brands could even release sneakers/comfier flats?

>> No.9879903

>>9879854
>when I was young people used the internet for social events organization

So you where born what? 1998? You’re still young. When I was young, we had dialup and social media was still just a thought. Internet was pretty much for sending emails and chat rooms. That’s the level of social media I grew up with.

>> No.9879904

>>9874091
Get yourself some retinol. I was starting to see some wrinkles around my eyes. But being consistent with retinol for about a year has reduced a huge percentage of it. I'm in my 30's and don't look it. Also, never skip on sun protection.

>> No.9879922

>>9875995
I agree with this. The moment someone is annoying in my comm people will complain about them here without hiding their identity so everyone knows who they are talking about. Even if they are being vague about who the annoying person is others that will recognize them will ask if its a specific person in the comm. This likely makes people feel like shit even though a lot of these things could have been suggested in person saving them from online scrutiny over being loud or having bad make up skills. It really reminds me of high school bullying. Stop singling people out!

>> No.9880003

>>9879886
i refuse to wear normie casual shoes with lolita, but would absolutely wear some sneaker-influenced shoes if brands released them. also, like 80% of my shirts are brand cutsews (daily lolita) and i can't believe they're not more popular. so comfy!

>> No.9880039

>>9879903
*waves cane* Back in my day, the internet was the thing you could use in the library for 10 minutes to research for a school project. But you usually used some encyclopedia CD-ROM. We organized by calling each other on landlines or passing notes. Ahh the lost art of college ruled origami.

If you looked like a clown, you'd get called out. None of this so-called internet bullying. You'd get gum in your hair. You had to be tough in the wilds in those days. If only I had a petticoat and a rainbow vomit jsk to make myself look more dominant. No, I was stuck with vinyl platforms, jncos and crushed velvet baby tees, armed to the tooth with fluffy pens and tamagotchis.

You kids have it easy.

>> No.9880061

>>9880039
Nayrt, it sounds like a really good time. Internets basically killed the subcultures, they killed indie music as phenomenon because now you don't have to share it by re-recording stuff on tape through your music player. It'skinda boring time to live in.

>> No.9880068

Have you noticed how many girls on youtube make unboxing videos with total poker faces like it's just another pair of normie jeans? Apparently, it's not such a struggle to buy brand this days and honestly, I couldn't be more thankful for that, but at another hand it's pretty depressing to see people treating it like something casual.

>> No.9880070

>>9880061
>Internets basically killed the subcultures
The internet is what brought lolita to the west's attention, isn't it? It's not all bad, really.
I think easily accessible, widespread social media and instant gratification killed subcultures. You see similar shit in other hobbies; newbies want to be a part of something, they want to have a shiny, special thing that'll get them attention and validation online but they don't want to commit, not even a little bit, so the thing in question is cheapened, whether it's lolita and how it's supposedly only OTT and only for special occasions, and anything and everything can be lolita as long as a shitty Chinese brand made a print out of it; cheap Chinese-made shit and softcore porn in cosplay; bootlegs and similar crap in itabagging, etc.
Maybe I'm just a salty oldfag but I do miss the days when participating in lolita required just a little bit more effort and dedication.

>> No.9880078

>>9880061
So here's me as an old timey internet person (>>9880039)


If it weren't for the internet, we would not have lolita fashion as it stands today. It would've died out a long time ago. The internet in itself isn't a terrible thing. In fact, it's been extremely beneficial. As a kid, I dreamed of having my own computer just to fuck around on MS Paint. These days, most everyone has smart phones and the wealth of all human knowledge at their fingertips.

Social media has killed a lot of really great things about the internet. If you wanted your place on the internet or your voice heard, you had to learn how to make websites. Some of us made awesome ones. Remember character shrines? I still make them. I run an AP fanlisting (yes, those are still around if anyone even remembers them). For awhile, basic HTML was taught to everyone. Now, most people don't bother. They don't need to. Social media is king. It's made sharing on the internet accessible to everyone, and it's made this a lot more open.

No longer is it the WWW, a life totally separate from IRL where you could make usernames and graphic avatars of who you really wanted to be. Today everything is nearly fully intermingled with society. It's been interesting to watch the progression.

Instead of creating pseudonyms in the old internet days, you are you and you are the way you present yourself. Not to say that there wasn't some form of this going on early on. I was always pretty good at photoshop and I did edit my old cosplay photos to post on my own cosplay site back in the day. But now, instead of having a visitor or two in a week only accessing your site through webrings, links or your forum signature, we're sharing everything through social media and everything is run through an algorithm which is usually based on user activity on said content being shared. The more content you create, the more followers you get, the more followers you get, the more your content is shared. (cont..)

>> No.9880096

>>9880078
Basically, it opens the doors to popularity that wasn't possible back in the earlier days of the internet. Your content can go viral easily with enough followers or even the right content. It was harder to do back in ye olde times, and usually it was some old meme like the Rejected cartoons or GI Joe PSAs, where a lot of work was put into creating something really great. Now you just create something, check the right boxes, and there you go. Insta-efame.

Suddenly big outlandish OTT coordinates are the norm. While Julie Nobody from Arkansas wears her simple coord to get bubble tea and do some thrifting with her bff gets no comments and only critque "needs more accessories". You get it. We all know not every occasion calls for a cone of shame bonnet and a scepter to smite the haters. But that's what is trending on social media and that's what we do.

But yeah, at the same time, if it weren't for social media, most of us wouldn't be here or would've stuck around. Our comms would've died out with LJ as newer generations never caught on.

The best you can do is try to make yourself more visible in everyday lolita fashion rather than post the OTT coords. I can't say I've really shared much either. I'm not conventionally pretty, I'm obv. older, and I've been on a weight roller coaster over the last few years, and I prefer not to show my face without it staying locked down. But others might be in a better position to do so. Still, we can all go out and like the simpler coords, give praise for them whether we want to show ourselves online wearing them or not.

It's not a solution to the problem, and nothing may ever be. But hey, it's a tiny step in that direction, right?

>> No.9880195

>>9880096
>>9880078
This is so insightful but also made me feel a little sad

>> No.9880198

i hope lolita dies it's so hideous

>> No.9880261

>>9879836
Wow what the fuck. You are complaining about people not dressing up irl and then making fun of someone for wearing their clothes out. Fuck you

>> No.9880278

>>9880198
Your opinion is invalid.

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