/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>11886542
Looks good. Post crumb if you’re up to it.

>>11886542
>say something mean about it
Brush off that excess flour.

POST CRUMB

looks good anon

>>11886542
What's your fursona?

>>11886639
>>11886715
I think my yeast is getting old, I didn't get as much loft as I'd prefer

>>11886790
LOoks tasty anyway

>>11886727
Kek

Made my first loaf a few days ago. Here's the second attempt at Hokkaido milk bread, this time doing it with less sugar for a savoury bread. My girlfriend was around and desperately wanted me to try adding jalapenos and olives to it. I went with my gut and kneaded them in before the last proof and I'm glad I did as the dough didn't rise as much. The bread came out much more dense than the first attempt, but still fluffy and quite nice.

Things I did differently this time
>Used a smaller pan for the roux as I lost too much to it sticking in the bigger pan last time
>Used condensed milk for the 1/2 cup milk bath I added the roux to after cooking
>Weighed my ingredients more autistically
>Watched my shitty oven for a more even cook
>Attempted a rough shape for the top of the loaf to create a rough sort of aesthetic
>Used a pan filled with hot water for steaming in the oven

Thoughts?

>>11886746
soda bread maybe?

>>11886963
still looks pretty fluffy to me, good job anon
do you think the jalapenos and olives inhibit rising?

I have yet to feel powerful enough to try doing yeasted bread but here is my second attempt at soda bread. Last time I made it with yogurt and this time it was buttermilk, I don't know if that explains the slightly more yellow color of the inside or if the slightly longer baking time of this recipe did that.

I got a pizza stone recently and made this sourdough-crusted pizza last night. The pizza stone is a game-changer.

>>11886790
Not bad! The flatness could be because of old yeast or poor shaping, maybe try shaping it tighter next time.

>>11886963
Looks pretty damn good, I've never made Hokkaido milk bread but I'm tempted to try it.

>>11888623
Yeasted bread isn't much more complicated than soda bread. Give it a try sometime!

my second ever sourdough, turned out pretty good!

I need to work on getting a rounder boule, they always spread out so much when I'm proving them before baking.

>>11889791
nice, did you make your own starter or use a commercial starter?

>>11889962
Thanks, I made my own, it's about 2 weeks old at this point

>>11886542
I have the same oven mitts.

>>11886790
Still could make for some good bruschetta.

>>11886542

Looks bretty gud. Try to get your shaping down a little better and try to make the scoring marks at a really severe angle so they can form a little bit of an ear. Pic should demonstrate what plane I mean.

>>11886727
>fursona
not here, please...

>>11886542
nice pizza lever

How do I get into bread baking?

>>11889024
pizza stones are awesome!
keep it up, Anon.

>>11890021
You've inspired me to make my own starter.
We will see how it turns out...

>>11890162
Easy.
Learn to make dough.
Bake.
?
Profit.

>>11890162

>>11890162
Seriously, though...
Flour
Water
Yeast
Something to feed the yeast like a sugar / honey / whatever

Knead it.
Let rise.
Cook.

>>11890162
look for a "no-knead" recipe. you'll have to invest in a dutch oven. Don't fall for the Le Creuset/Staub memes, I found an enameled dutch over brand new for $20.

>>11890172
it's a lot easier than it seems. You'll find a lot of seemingly complicated guides online, but the basic is equal parts flour and water, say 300g flour, 300g water. Each day, dump 100g of this mix into a new container, and add another 200g water/200g flour.

>>11886542
Is no-kneed bread a meme? I tried it and I just can't make my bread rise very well during baking. I let my dough ferment over night, shape and let it rise for 2 hours then bake in a dutch oven at 430 F for 25 mins with lid on and ~10 mins with lid off.

>>11890191
Thanks!

I have a friend who's got a starter from his family that got it going in the 1940s during the gold rush and I've always wanted to do one but just haven't, yet...

>>11890197

What temperature are you letting it ferment at overnight? Are you folding it all during the fermentation process?

>>11890203
Not that guy, but folding during fermentation?
Hmm...
Learned something new.
Thank you for that.

>>11890197
>430 F

That's your issue. You need it super hot, like 500 deg, And preheat that dutch oven for at least an hour before putting your bread in.

I dump the dough in, get the lid in my left hand, and a spray bottle in my right. Spray the dough and all over the inside of the dutch oven, slap the lid on, and put it in the oven.

>>11890199
that's awesome, I know 0 people who have a starter. If you can get some of that, most of the hard work is done for you already.

>>11886542
It looks like a fucked up butterbean

>>11886542
Post Crumb or GTFO

>>11890216
It's kind of funny; the people I know who have starters are the kinds you would never expect. Dudes who are white-trash mechanics, etc... I always figured it was the housewives, but NOPE.

>>11890238
agreed, but, easy, Tiger...

here's some no knead bread I made a while back- store bought yeast

>>11890216
Most people I know who did a starter would just put it in their window-sill and just wait.

I guess it had to do with the natural yeast floating through the air? I don't know.

I guess that works in places like coast lines (San Francisco, etc...) but would that work in a place that's Mediterranean in climate?

The online stuff seems to eschew common sense.

>>11889791
get some wicker proofing baskets this will help with the shape a lot..

>>11890262
>Most people I know who did a starter would just put it in their window-sill and just wait.
>I guess it had to do with the natural yeast floating through the air? I don't know.

I used to hear this a lot also, but lately it seems that everyone agrees the yeast mostly comes from the flour you are using for the starter.

>>11890266
Thanks, I was kind of thinking that would be the next thing I needed to try

>>11890238
calm down there … you don't need to get your panties inna wad

>>11886790
Do you use fresh yeast or something? Instant Yeast keeps indefinitely in the freezer.

>>11886542
Nice, bump for a thread of people actually making good food

>>11890270
yeasts are everywhere floating about and on insects ect… it is just very few people have the patience to start a culture or even keep it alive afterwards .. having a starter is like having a pet ..you have to feed it, groom it and if your don't use it often throw half of it out and let it just grow again … they just cant let it alone to get happy ,
people who bake breads know what I am talking about .. I am always having to give it away because most cant be bothered to do it themselves...

anyone ever tried using brewers years in their baking? I homebrew and i've always wondered if that would turn out well or have interesting flavors. I usually just toss my yeast after one use since most beers i tend to make use different yeasts and i'm lazy.

I've tried to make bread 3 times now, and every time it comes out incredibly dense, not fluffy at all, and the crust is not nearly what I want it to me (isn't really brittle/crackly). I don't really know anything about baking, so I was hoping yall could help out. Is it because I'm using AP flour? or that I don't have a mixer? or am I deflating the dough after it's risen (is that possible?)? Maybe someone can link a really good bread recipe

>>11888563
Thanks anon. I believe they do, to a degree. After adding the olives and jalapenos the dough physically felt more dense, and a more dense dough rising slower makes sense to me. I'm interested to try proofing it for longer, see if I can't get a larger rise from it.

>>11889024
Cheers, yeah, give it a go. It's quick to make and I've been able to give a lot away as gifts. Pai's kitchen has a simple recipe for it.

>>11890381
Using bread flour definitely helps. You don't need a mixer. Get a dutch oven, and try a no-knead recipe, it's a pretty simple process, and you can get some encouraging results fairly easily.

>>11890162
Check out the library on baking books. I learned a lot from In Search of the Perfect Loaf by Sam Fromartz. 52 Loaves was also an entertaining book to help some baking inspiration.

>>11890296
it's instant yeast, but I keep it in the fridge and it's at least... 7 years old? I found it in the fridge of a house I moved into in 2012

>>11890449
i would not use 7 year old yeast my man.

>>11890280
Either that or your shaping process isn't adding enough tension, you have to be as forceful as you can to get a good tightness without de-gassing. I messed it up for awhile

>>11886790
The yeast is fine its your shaping or baking vessel

>>11890270
>>11890325
Thanks for that.
And knowing is half the battle.

But really, good to know.

>>11890270
I WANNA EAT THAT NOW! Just rip into it.
Dang.

>>11890325
When do you throw out the half of it (or give it away)? Just when it doubles in size?

Or is it a time-frame?

>>11890886
they are correct that yeast are everywhere, however they are not necessarily going to make something that tastes good. you can get lucky but usually not. you could go into a forest and harvest some yeast (i.e. wave a jar around) and see if that produces something good.

>>11890421
>Sam Fromartz
My man.

>>11890916
http://www.chewswise.com/

>>11890464
Does it go off, though?
I always thought of it like spores that can live forever in outer space.
But then again... ergot mold in France was quite the event, wasn't it?

>>11890486
How do you tighten it without de-gassing?

Seems like that would just happen inherently.

Genuinely curious.

>>11890928
there will only be a fraction of live cells left anymore. unless you had a good starter to build them back up the fermentation process would have been very strained and much slower than usual, which can lead to off flavors and poor crumb

>>11890913
Rats.
I'm still gonna try.
I know I'm not going to get the result of a coastal sourdough but, well... I'm gonna try the process, at least.

>wave a jar around
I just might put a jar out and see what happens.

>>11890938
Christ, I need to learn more science...

Thank you for that.

>>11890938
I always use a jarred-packaged version of yeast and go through it fairly quickly so, no matter. But I remember my mother getting foil packets and freezing them. Do you think that would make a difference in the yeast-life (when coming up to room temp)? I never noticed as a child what my mothers cooking amounted to compared to my own. Just interested in anybody's thoughts on this.

I know, there's Google and stuff but I'm listening to a radio program and I can't pause that.

>>11890949
i'd give it a shot. depending on the environment it can turn out quite good

>>11890990
yes, freezing the yeast will make it last a lot longer. thaw it slowly and it'll be fine. liquid yeast should last in the refrigerator up to 2-3 months before needing to make a new starter. freezer can be a 1-2 years. if you keep feeding it, it can last until you contaminate it. from what I understand, liquid yeast in the refrigerator loses ~20% of the remaining active cells per month. so after 6 months from the manufacture date you only have 25% of the original cells. Often it's probably fine depending on the scale of the operation but a starter always helps. I really don't know much about dry yeast but it lasts a lot longer in general, though once opening the packet i'd question that longevity for much more.

>>11891011
Thanks for the encouragement. Will do.

Also, I guess my mum knew what she was doing by freezing.

I always figured that once I'd opened a jar of yeast it was already exposed to moisture inherent to the atmosphere and then my time with it was limited.

I had no idea that the cells could last so long being frozen. Interesting. I've never kept liquid yeast in the refrigerator as of yet and never suspected it would last so long (at least viable).

This is an amazing thread for me.

Thanks for all the replies.

Can anyone tell me what I did wrong? I thought I followed the recipe exact. This is like, my third loaf ever baked but I'm determined to get better at this.

From my first two attempts:
>loaf one used yeast that I thought was regular yeast, overworked it
>second loaf I didn't proof my yeast because I'm a fucking idiot, apparently
>third loaf I ran out of all purpose flour and used whole wheat but I proofed the yeast until it had bubbles/foam and let it rise twice so I'm lost now on how it turned out so thick.

>>11886542
something mean about it

>>11891054
hmm....

Letting the dough rise long enough? In a warm temperature?

Proof your yeast, though... It doesn't take too long if you use wrist-warm water and some honey or sugar. Only about 5 to 20 minutes, you can tell by the bubbles.

I use a bit of fat, like olive oil or butter to help with the "rising" if that's what you're into (less dense).

>>11886542
I'm currently trying to optimize parameters for baking baguette.
So far I've tinkered with:
-The amount of water
-The duration and temperature at which I let the dough rise
-Baking temperature and duration
-Flour type

Currently my recipe goes like this:
-Knead 500 g of type 550 flour, ~350 ml of water (flour:water weight ratio = 10:7), dry yeast, 1 tea spoon of salt, and 2 tea spoons of sugar into dough
-Let the dough rise at room temperature for ~1.5 hours
-Divide the dough into 3 small baguettes
-Bake at 220 °C (428 °F), two-sided heat for 25 minutes

How much of a difference does using fresh yeast make?

How much of a difference does mixing the yeast with sugar and water first make compared to just mixing everything together?

I've seen recipes where people use half the normal amount of yeast and let the dough rise for 8 hours in the fridge.
After that they put the cold dough straight in the hot oven.
I've noticed that this influences crust thickness, but does it also have an impact on flavor?

Are bread baking thingies useful?
Do I need one?
Is a gas oven good enough? I used to make croissants and it worked fine for them.

>>11891054
whole wheat will always turn out a lot thiccer than white flour- you probably didn't do anything wrong

>>11891662
I think that doughs taste much better when they've been fermented for longer

Is baking a whole-grain oatmeal baguette a good idea or will it turn out shitty?

>>11890906
I use mine every day , but I also have several to use … if you make bread just once a week... if you have a quart mason jar full of culture...about every ten days or so, take out about half and either give it away or throw it out in the garden , then fill it back up with a 50/50 mix of water and flour and add a table spoon of honey or sugar give it a little stir and put it back in the cooler....


if you use it every couple of days ...then just add back what you take out …. if you use 300 grams of starter then add back a 50/50 mix of water /flour and pour back into the jar...honey or sugar is optional and bing you are good to go next day …

just don't use it all and you will be fine I never use more then half a jar, but I also have 20 mason jars that are happy because I collect cultures from where ever I go...

>>11891747
put the oatmeal in a food processer until it is a powder , and it is not bad tasting but is very heavy ,

>>11891745
look up 'poolish'

>>11886790
>>11890524
It's either this or you didn't develop the gluten enough

>>11891744
>>11891054
This, only way to get bigger bubbles is to use more water but that can be very challenging to do in whole wheat dough.

>>11890257
>>11890261
How does the inside look ?

I made no-knead bread recently, and while it's not quite as good as my usual sourdough, it takes so much less work that I will probably convert to this method.

>>11890990
You can freeze an entire jar. I don't bother with "thawing slowly" like >>11891011 suggests. It's just a dry powder, add it without bothering to thaw or anything.

>>11891769
Holy crap, 20 jars?
That's awesome. I've got about 10 that I can spare right now. Those are easy to get though.
Love the idea of getting different cultures from around. I would think they'd all just adjust to your local eventually, though...

>>11891718
I have a bread machine but only use it to mix the dough when I make pizza because I'm lazy and that makes it a big help. I don't use it for the cooking part even though it does turn out a decent loaf but I prefer a traditional oven loaf style.

>>11892937
not really the yeasts are very good at segregation and don't let others take hold in the separate jars … they choke out other rival from establishing a colony in their jars..
and as long at you keep them healthy and happy ..they thrive and that makes it really easy ..

when ever you go to a place seek out the bread maker man and ask for a bit of their starter most of the time they will give you a jar full...but bring you own pint jars ..they will be more willing to fill it to the top for you …

and trust me when I tell you the bread I make with my favorite starter have very distinctly different flavors ...I really love my german and dutch sours … but my SanFran starter also has a great personality as well...

>>11886542
Looks like a fucked up sweet potato

>>11893066
OK. Didn't realize that about the rival colonies.
Interesting. Dang, you are a wizard with all those different strains.

Also, I never even though about just asking a baker for some of their own starter. Me just being lazy and dumb... San Francisco has always been famous for their sours. I hear that Sacramento has good stuff, as well. And Seattle and all the way up to the Alaska coast. I don't think I've ever tried Dutch but perhaps have had German by default in a restaurant.

How do you rate the differences personally?

>>11893107
>*thought*

>>11893107
that is somewhat difficult to do :
for me it depends on what type of bread I want to make that in turn determines which of the culture I might use …
the cultures and the types of flours you use make all the difference …so that being said I prefer my german for sourdough...and the next would be the SanFran..
if you want a really sour starter use rye flour exclusively.. “The secret to sourdough is in the amount of flour and water (and only flour and water are used), then in the time allowed for fermentation. A stiffer dough is required, so 50% hydration is what you’ll want to mix, ie. twice as much flour to water, by weight. I’ve now mixed together 12 oz. of flour with 6 oz. of water and the resulting dough is indeed stiff. Now, if I leave it sit for a few days and don’t feed it, I should have a highly acidic starter that I can then add to a bread recipe, and will hopefully be rewarded with a stronger taste

>>11886542
hydration?
Also maybe u didn't form it well enough and thus got flat...

>>11890189
this sougar honey meme has to stop. Yeast likes complex carbs more.. also sourdough can't do shit with sugar, even worse honey is antifungal and bacterial thus sloving your proofing down

>>11893223
you ridiculous knob , you really need to do some better research .. WE ARE NOT making sourdough breads with fucking candida …

Sourdough bread is made by the fermentation of dough using naturally occurring lactobacilli and yeast. Sourdough bread has a mildly sour taste not present in most breads made with baker's yeast, and better inherent keeping qualities than other breads due to the lactic acid produced by the lactobacilli

However, honey does not remove the normal Lactobacillus

>>11891054
Underbeaked bread.. that oven temp is low, maybe your oven is not calibrated. You should have left it in for 20 min more and everything would have been fine. Or you were a cheeky bugger and peaked and you've let the warmth out.
Also after baking obligatory 45 min cooldown. The Best would be an hour
Can't quite understand what u are trying to say with the proofing here.
Greentext should be in thrid person dummy, lurk more

>>11891389
>sugar, honey
this is stupid, yeast feads on starch. Honey kills yeast also...

>>11893196
Hey, thanks for responding. I'm learning lots here. Rye makes perfect sense after thinking about it. I guess I'm just gonna have to practice to get the feel of the stiff dough. I get the ratios, I've just got to have patience for the acidity.

>>11893223
I've always used a touch of honey to get the water / yeast mix going. I would boil a mug of water in the microwave and just put the dough-ball in there and it's doubled in about thirty minutes.

Having said that, what you wrote makes total sense. I'm just going to have to hunker down and be patient.

>>11891389
Rich doughs slow rising u dumb fag.
An oily doughs will loose moisture slower, thus not get dry as fast as a regular loaf because oils/fats don't evaporate.

>>11891662
Hey normalfag 550 to 350 is not 70% hydration. It's around 67%. 7:10 would be 350 water 500 flour
Geez have you tried dividing by 2.. Are u a woman ?

>>11893327
Gotcha.
But when I make dough it's almost always for pizza so the oil helps me on that front.

Now if it was for sandwich or table bread the oil would have to be on the table after baking. Although, I have seen a restaurant where they'd stuff olive oil and garlic in the middle of a loaf before baking. Never tried to do that but I guess it's not really the same as mixing it in with the dough.

>>11891662
A longer ferment is simply better. Easier to digest more aroma etc. I tend to cut down yeast in yeasted dough from 7g dry yeast to 500 g flour to 2g. It will take more to proof taste wise will be better also. With a baguette I do a poolish sometimes. Also you can ferment a yeasted dough for 5 days in the fridge. But only ferment it there no 2 hours outside then in the fridge bullshit. The same applies with sourdough, but after 3 day it will taste a bit to sour if you go past that.

>>11891864
nice loaf

>>11893320
the stiff part is the dough you made that has the added culture to it that WILL BE ADDED to the sour bread dough that will in turn proof
that you will knead in the loaves you want to make ….
just want to be clear here ...

>>11893383
Why no outside room temp ferment then into the fridge? Does that shock it?

>>11893311
Honey slows down any bacterial growth period. If you are into that fine. Your loaf will rise but a begginer will be confused by the time difference. No bakery should use honey or sugar for a regular loaf, simply not needed.

>>11893350
He said 500 grams of type 550 flour. 550 is the type of flour, not the weight.

>>11893392
well simply put no, but it will overproof in the fridge.. if you did half the bulk ferment outside. Your fridge temp won't kill yeast it will just make them work harder for food and it will slow down yeast multiplication. Also an overproofed bread is not the end of the world, shape it if that happens make a clumsy flatbread.

>>11893417
All right. I did not know that about overworking the yeasties.

Crackers, it is!

Just kidding, I haven't done that, yet.
But I was serious as to how to treat the proofing process.
Thanks.

>>11893400
Why do so many recipes for simple breads call for sugars to get the dough started? Are they just being lazy?

>>11893400
uhhm I think we may be speaking about different things … you are correct that it is not needed in the actually bread dough... but to start that first little bit of starter culture it can be helpful in keeping out unwanted yeasts

>>11893388
A stiff dough is either an under or over proofed bread, or under or over worked dough. Or bad forming, also not enough hydration can cause a stiff crumb(inside of the bread), or you didn't score the bread so an ovenspring couldn't happen. A good bread for beginners in my opinion is a dough above 65% hydration, strong white flour (that has 12g protein) well kneaded, proofed, shaped, proofed then baked.

>>11893440
No clue.. but sugar helps with the browning.

>>11893449
>unwanted yeast
then don't keep your starter in your vagina. Simple

>>11893454
you should go back and read all of the conversation before you post …. otherwise you are going to gag on your shoe laces

>>11893479
u zo funeh
hurr hurr hurr
now go be immature somewhere else , the adults are talking.

>>11890931
yep.. it degases, proof it again a bit then bake, cheers!

>>11891769
Your sourdough will cross-contaminate and you'll have 20 jars of the same stuff

>>11893066
God do you hear yourself.
>my sours

>>11893494
Ahhhhh...
I see. Yeah, I guess I was too much into my wine before thinking out my post.

>>11893493
>>11893480
>>11893479

Lincoln's birthday so school's out in America tomorrow... get prepared for it.

>lost penny day

>>11893508
but you close the lids, though

>>11893516
it's slanguage
and it's on 4chan
I think we all know what Anon was getting at

>>11893411
Excuse me my aspergers got the worst of me.

>>11893493
go bek to plebbitif it hurts

>>11893522
>slanguage
I am uninstalling the interwebs ...

>>11893508
wow you are really naïve and have very little understanding of how things work,
you would get cross-contamination ONLY if you cross contaminated them.
otherwise a clean wooden spoon and keep the jars closed and they keep seperate for decades …
also on a side note if what you say is true , then the sanfransico sour dough would have died out a centuries ago... what the Basque original brought with them would died out after a few months ….yet some of those bakeries have had the same cultures for the last century or more...

>>11893552
Aspic loaf?
That's a high protein flour you've got there.

>>11893552

That word has been around since the 1750s.
Way before the interwebs.
So, uninstall away, Merrill.


>slang is thrown language – a quick, honest way to make your point

>>11893562
Are the Basques the ones that got the starter "culture" going?

I was always told that it was the miners in California that kept it in a pouch strapped around their necks and that the body heat and sweat kept the starter living as they moved around but that always seemed sketchy to me.

>>11893613
I do know the Basques had a population explosion in California about the same time the miners were active but they were more into shepherding. I don't doubt that they would have passed on that kind of technology.

>>11893613
apocryphal legend says ..they brought it ( the sourdough starter) with them when they immigrated here during the gold rush era...
however there are a few others who claim this bit of history also … bread starters have been around for at least 5000 years and each region has its own … that makes theirs unique to them,
they (the miners )did keep it in a bag on their bodies to keep it warm in the winter monthes so it would not die … it was common for things to be done is a very peculiar way back then that would seem down right disgusting now...

>>11893669
heh... disgusting but practical.

It is interesting that most of these starters seem to come from European areas.

Speaking of apocryphal, I've often wondered how the Sumerians made their beer / bread.

>>11893686
lol the same way they made wine … they had a saying " YOU strain out the gnats ,but gulp down the camel" which was a way saying you pay attention to the details but lose the big picture..... so that being said ...the gnats they were straining out were in thier wines and beers and other things that were fermenting...

>>11893705

I've never heard that saying before. Tree for the forest kind of thing...

"Gulping down the camel" could have a double meaning in that part of the world.

Much like threading the needle or driving a camel through the eye of a needle.
Gimmel, the letter.

Well, so long as the gnats were in alcohol, I'd assume that's just extra protein, right? And not a concern for disease. Kind of like the Europeans mostly drinking ales and wine instead of water when they migrated to North America. You know, giardia and stuff (also getting drunk).

Is AlexFrenchGuy's video on no knead bread (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r6jV-MaQuc&t=35s)) any good? If not, whats a good resource for my first loaf?

>>11893740
well yes ,, but it was the gnats and other little insects that actually started the fermentation in a lot of things because ...you know that they had (yuck) bacteria and yeasts on their bodies when they landed and got caught in the wine ,beer , and (ick) bread dough.

>>11893758
I tried it and it ended up being very dense (too dense). Albeit I probably did something wrong since it was my third ever loaf, and my two prior loafs had been failures.

Made a sourdough focaccia

>>11894037
Crumb

And yes its a repost from >>11891103

Anyone have any experience with making naan or pita bread? Tried making a flat bread using left over pizza dough from this weekend. Turned alright but not exactly what I wanted.

>>11894044
Crumb

>>11894037
this looks tremendous!

>>11894055

I've gotten pretty good at making pita bread. It makes for some great pizza dough and dipping bread.

I got the recipe from "the bread bible."

>>11893758
That feel when my Dutch oven was stolen...

It was my great grandmother's, too.
Ungh.

whenever I search for crusty bread recipes online I get nothing but no-knead results. I have no problem with kneading but can't find any recipes that involve it because if I include that word in the search it just brings up a mountain of no-knead recipes. help please

>>11893829
Eh, the circle of life.
I don't mind the eating of bugs unless they're (you know) poisonous or disease-ridden. I guess parasites should be avoided...
Anyway.
I can see them being a catalyst for fermentation rather than letting your liquid / batter setting out.

>>11894079
Love your use of herbs, there.
God, I can practically taste that from here.

>>11894299
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZqJyalYqKU

>>11894055
Been wanting to make naan for a while but haven't started it yet.

Is that what you made in the pic? Looks pretty good.

>>11894123
"Bread Bible". I need to check this out.

>>11894468
Photo is my attempt at naan using pizza dough I made

>>11894526
Looks like naan to me!
What's the big difference than pizza dough?
Adding yogurt?

>>11893758
I just watched that guys episode on making butter and it's straight up porn.

>>11894569
I have no idea what the difference is. Do they put yogurt in the dough mix? I guess I'll have to try that

>>11892201
like this pretty much >>11889791

Although i typically had better results with the no-kneads crumb wise, since I'm just getting the hang of sourdough and trying out some different techniques.

>>11894594
The recipe I remember seeing was flour, water, yeast, baking soda, oil, yogurt.

When I do pizza dough, I get the yeast going with sugar in the water then salt the flour then mix it all together. When I get a ball, I will cover it in some olive oil with my hands and let it rise in a steamy environment. Then punch it down and toss it.

Your bread looks good, there.

>>11894658
Thanks! That's pretty much what I did for this pizza dough but no sugar. Also did around 40% whole grain flour. I'm goin to have to look up a naan recipe

>>11894674
Oh yeah, I almost forgot, another thing I found out was mixing flours and then spiking it with a bit of cake flour which is really like powdered sugar in texture. But it does help with the "chew".

I got that tip from Cooks Illustrated magazine years ago before that guy split from the Test Kitchen TV show. Kimball, I think was his name.

>>11893758
I always eyeroll at this stuff as an American (FUCK YEA) when I hear their goofy accents and see them drive their gay smartcars
but in the end that video was extremely smart and redpilled

>>11894753
I just got done watching the pizza one (best pizza in the world) and it was pretentious as fuck but I would have loved to eaten some of that stuff.

Also, the video production was Academy Award Oscar level which surprised the hell out of me for a YouTube video.

But yeah, that bread one was actually pretty good. And as a fellow American (FUCK YEAH!) I have to concur but I've never cooked with a Dutch oven before. Gonna have to try that, or something similar.

i want to make some banana bread for a shindig tomorow, but the only issue is that the host is a v*gan
does anyone know what can be used instead of egg/milk to make the flour and banana mixture moist/liquid/not-dry/sticking-together? is water to beta?
not to fussed about it turning out as an actual bread as much as it being edible and simple

>>11894055
need to properly preheat the oven
also rolling it out paper thinly to some kind of wrap thing is way superior to thick naan/pita type imo

>>11894814
good to know.
Sounds like the same process as crafting a tortilla.

>>11894806
>v*gan
just lie and say it's vegan food, sneaking some animal products in may at least alleviate their malnourishment for a little bit

>>11894299
you can knead a no-knead bread, no problem. getting a crusty loaf comes from cooking it with some steam in a very hot dutch oven (500F). Preheat a dutch oven at 500 for at least an hour, drop in your loaf, spritz it down with a spray bottle of water and slap the lid on, then throw it in the oven.

I usually turn it down to 450F after about 15 min, and after 30 total, you can take the loaf out, toss it on a rack and continue to bake until it is as dark as you want it.

>>11894037
jesus that looks great; i just want that whole thing to myself with a bowl of olive oil.

>>11894037
>>11894079
both times I made focaccia on a half sheet pan, drowning in oil, it still stuck to the bottom of the pan. what's the secret to getting it not to stick? the dough is so wet it still pushes oil out from underneath it and adhears to the sheet pan. could I use a silpat underneath?

>>11895037
the more malnourished the better anon, that way she cant run away from me :^)
i did some googling and found out that v*gans use oil in place of eggs/milk/butter, kind of diabetic but ill give it a go

i need help baking general. my grandma died last summer and i've been using her pie recipes lately. i'm doing them wrong so far and getting better but they are still delicious regardless because she was a genius. However, because it's old fashioned her recipe is in weight. i have no idea how i convert measurements to weight with baking so i need help.

crust= 1 cup+ 2 tbsp flour
.5 tsp salt
.3 cup oil
2tbsp water
add oil if too dry (i add 2 tbsp because it is always dry for my taste

and then for the filling .6cups sugar, 4 tbsp flour, .25tsp salt and .5tsp cinnamon. and then of course what i dont need converted, 4 cups of berries and 1 cup cream or half and half.

since i posted the whole recipe i also might as well mention 425 for 50 minutes to cook, or until bubbly in the middle. i just need help converting grammys old recipe to modern cooking units. if you make some please post a picture and tell me your opinion on it. blueberries are the intended berry but most any fruit works well.

>>11895206
i meant her recipe is in cups and shit and i need it converted to weight, my bad

also if you truly intend to make the pie you put the crust in the piepan, then lay the berries in, then mix your dry ingredients for the filling and add the cream and evenly pour. yum

>>11895206
There's no need to use your grandma's crust recipe, I would just find one online that's by weight from king arthur or something. I think crusts made with oil are probably easier to roll, but butter or shortening makes a better crust.

>>11895206
>sugar
>anime
sorry about your grandma anon, but dropped

>>11895206
throw out her recipe.
3 reasons not specific to your grandma, but generally true trends:
>1. It's old, but old doesn't mean vetted like modern high traffic internet recipes are. There's guaranteed to be better out there.
>2. Commercial products that were relied upon back then have changed from the commercial products that are labelled the same now that are different from the products that we KNOW we should be using now.
>3. Her recipes are likely inaccurate representations of what she really did and were for self-use only. ie. 2 tbsp was never accurate, it was just a heaping piled cup of flour she was using with a particular measurement and she just assumed the extra was 2 tbsp flour.

>>11890162
Buy a big bag of high protein flour from a restaurant supply store and look up recipes for things you want to try. Tweak to your liking after you see the result. Most of the quality difference in bread is due to how it's handled. That's really the secret to a great bake.

>>11895206

This anon gets it:
>>11895250

Crust basics:
Oil = Easy, but almost no flavor.
Shortening = Flakier, but little flavor
Butter = More Flavor, not as flaky.
Lard = Whole package, but it's lard.

>>11890261
>>11890257

Where does one find a mesh tray like this ?

Made my second attempt at a lemon meringue. Filling set up well but I think I should have pre baked the crust longer. The first meringue I tried included salt and I think I overdid it. This one did not and more or less just tasted like whipped cream. Does meringue traditionally include anything except egg white and sugar? The pie seemed to "sweat" when refrigerated, droplets in pic. Is that expected or indicative of a mistake?

>>11891054
If it's 100% whole wheat flour then it will always have a tighter crumb than a mixed flour loaf. Try a slightly higher hydration percentage for the recipe. Mix it to combine ingredients and then don't knead it at all. You really need to gently fold in air multiple times during the proof for wheat loaves to form a more open crumb. Here's a good example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hO8Kt0r00lo
Make sure you're giving it pleeenty of time for the final pre-bake proof both in the bowl and on the baking sheet. Bake with a high heat to get that big oven spring and have strong scoring so it can open up as much as possible. Good luck

>>11895395
Looks delicious, anon! Yeah, I can see what you mean about the crust. Bet it was still bomb, though.
Traditionally, there is a pinch of salt in meringue, but easy to overdo, as you know. The recipe that I generally use has a little cream of tartar and vanilla extract in it, too (though I don't always include those).
Yeah, meringue can sweat like that, no biggie, basically just normal condensation mixing with some of the sugar.
Fuckin' curd looks dope, too!

how does my sandwich bread look?

>>11895075
That sounds like a good solution.
Sometimes, I'll just open the oven like a sod and take a spatula to move the bread around.
I know that's bad form but it does help with the sticking.

That and corn meal on the bottom.
That way, I can shake it around.

>>11895206
Sorry about your grandma.
I'd keep the recipe and refine it to my own version like some folks here have said. I have a book that I've been amassing old recipes from family tradition and writing them out in calligraphy. But then I'll include my own updated version. No need to toss Granny's. I still use my great grandmother's basil noodle recipe and people love it. But she was pretty fast and loose with the measurements.

I think after cooking for a while it just becomes an automatic feel.

Your recipe looks OK. I'm afraid of lard but it really is the perfect ingredient for pie crusts (heart reasons keep me away from it regularly).

>>11895481
crumb pics b4 we judge

>>11895574

>>11895584
airy enough without giant bubbles
great success for sandwich bread

>>11895606
Thanks anon. I can see myself making bread more often. Cheaper and better than store bought

>>11895256
Ha.
This is pretty accurate in the sense of self-use measurements. At one point I would use measuring spoons and then dump the ingredients into my palm and figure out where the lines in my hand were for each measurement while cupping. Now, I can go out hiking for a week and do a fairly decent job of measuring stuff for communal meals without all the extra utensils.

But without repetition, I'd never be able to do that. Probably the same for granny's recipes.

>>11895206
There are basic converters online for these kind of measurements. I've never had a scale but the great bakers swear by them.

Recipe saved, by the way...

It's weird. I used to be able make pretty good bread consistently. All types of bread would turn out well, and when making a regular white loaf I didn't even need to weigh the ingredients. I just paid attention to how the dough was developing and added more water or flour as necessary. Then I stopped baking for five years, and now I can't get anything to work out at all. I haven't changed altitudes. The part of my brain that was good at making bread just seems to have died.

>>11895705
ambient bacterial cultures can change drastically and have a huge impact

>>11895715
Huh.
I'd have to say the same.
Check out what that Anon said about starters and stuff like that earlier in the thread.

But it seems unlikely that you'd lose that kind of technique unless you dropped tons of acid and got wet-brain or something like that.

Maybe slow down the process?
Seems weird.

>>11895075
Honestly, I used a deeper cake pan. Came out not sticky

>>11890372
I rarely miss the opportunity to bottle some left over yeast after brewing. It's not always quite as active as fresh baking yeasts but totally doable. The biggest thing to consider is really the flavour left over from the beer. Hoppy flavours are really hard to work with in baking so a yeast from an IPA batch might not be the first one to try. That being said the dough will get significantly different flavours from different yeasts during fermentation. Wheat beer yeasts have been some of my favourite ones since they are kind of similar to regular baking yeast.

>>11896349
In terms of getting a sourdough type culture no.

Eventually the native candida will outcompete the brewer’s yeast

>local place stopped selling whole dark rye flour
Man, keeping a wheat starter alive is just such a pain in the ass. I used to leave shit in my refrigerator until it was a solid brick three weeks later and then feed it twice and she'd be alive and pooping again.

>>11895388
Amazon

>>11889791
Can recomend a proofing basket. Did wonders for me. How did you get such a nice bubbly crust? Did you bake it in a cast iron pot, or do you have a steam setting on your owen?

>>11896480
The basket really upped my game. no more prying it out of bowl and ruining it

>>11886542
If this is sourdough (no dry yeast), it looks like it was over-retarded/overproofed. Keep in mind cold retarding generally can't exceed 16 hours, but it also depends on the strain of yeast your levain picked up (unless you started your levain from dry yeast, in which case pls stop.)

For your crust, try baking it in a dutch oven that was preheated with the oven. Use a basket lined with a floured kitchen towel to transfer it in. Your crumb will also dramatically improve if you follow all the aforementioned steps plus deeper, 45 degree angle scorings. gl

>>11890207
Yeah after you mix the dough (no salt, very important), allow it to autolyse around 2 hours. Give it two three-latter folds, sprinkle on the salt after the fold. Repeat (minus the salting) a few more times until your dough is the literal consistency of chewed gum. Also pretty important to have your dough be at a minimum hydration of 70%, anything lower is difficult to fold.

>>11890262
Natural yeast is literally everywhere, but every region has a different strain of yeast. It can come from the flour, but the flour is mostly there to serve as starch food for the yeasts. Best way to start a levain is to use fruit peels from whatever grows from your area. You should see results after 2 days at room temp, after which you'll need to constantly feed.

>>11894055
>need to roll it thinner
>dough is over-retarded, yeast basically died and most likely used up all the sugars and starches in the dough
>pan needs to be fucking HOT, no oil necessary

>>11889024
All my pizza stones crack. No matter how much I spend on them or how well I treat them. It drives me crazy.
I've been considering getting a thick piece of steel for awhile now.

>>11897261
After my second stone cracked I was fed up and got this cast iron griddle. Works better than the stone imho.

>>11886542
>live in asian country with almost no baking culture
>love baked goods, cake, bread, macaroons everything
>live with parents
>parents won't let me buy an oven because they don't want me to waste money, and only concentrate on my career

I have a great job, its not like I'm living from paycheck to paycheck, why are thai parents such fooks

Tried my hand at baking cookies for the first time. Cooling right now. Used chef John's gingersnap recipe

Repostin old sourdough.

Got bored one day and did a sourdough hokkaido milk bread as well as some boulès

>>11897504
And some pizza from my sourdough

>>11897504
>>11897506
If y’all want any tips or anything feel free to dm me on normiegram

Shoot me your insta on ckanon@guerillamail.com

>>11897509
More bred

>>11897514
>>11897509
Am jelly, that's some nice looking bread.
I used to bake amazing sour dough, then I moved to a new house and was never able to get it to turn out. It either never had any oven spring, or it was undercooked in the middle. I think the oven was fucked. Gave up and haven't made sourdough in over a year.

>>11897524
Use a dutch oven. Control temps, always adjust and never follow recipes, just use it as a guideline

>>11897532
To add, what I mean was that flours tend to hydrate differently depending on the age of the flour etc, so best way is to control the hydration by reserving some of the total water and adding after autolyse if dough still is a bit dry

>>11897532
I used a dutch oven in both places. It worked great in my previous house though.

>>11896480
Baked in Dutch oven, I spray down the dough and sides of the pot with water from a spray bottle, then quickly put a lid on to trap the steam

baked this basic bitch white loaf this morning.

>>11897232
Chewed gum, I like that description.
Seems like it'd be hard to get consistency at %70 hydration but I haven't tried it yet, so there's that.

Thanks!

>>11897245
Fruit peels... this idea is great.

>>11897261
I started out with normal hardware tiles (not the glazed) and those worked fine at first. Then got a stone and that works better. I guess I've been lucky; I've had it for about 15 years or so.

>>11897408
Hmmm... Now that you mention it, all the Thai baking I have seen has been related to desserts.

Conventional ovens / toasters aren't that expensive, take up little space and can work in a pinch. You wouldn't get big batches but they cook.

>>11886963
I used to make a lot of milk bread, shoku pan type at home then moved closer to asian bakeries. The best thing for it was buying a covered loaf pan. And autistically measuring

>>11898104
>The best thing for it was buying a covered loaf pan.
I want to make milk bread and Pullman-style white loaves. I gotta get a covered pan. Do you have a recommendation?

>>11897506
Oh damn! THAT LOOKS GOOD!!!
I'm craving a simple pizza, now...

>>11897514
Oh what I'd do to that bread.
Fill it with clam chowder, probably.

>>11895206
This article might help some:

http://www.wildyeastblog.com/weigh-your-ingredients/

Not QUITE the same of what you're asking but might get you on the right track.

>>11897499
Measure better. Go buy a four dollar 2oz/4oz/6oz cookie scooper on amazon. Thank me later.

>>11898771
Yeah i will grab one when i make them this upcoming day, i just didn't wanna go out a third time in the same day.

Although tbf, my enjoyment of these is not affected by the shape

>>11895233
i prefer the easy, mostly tasteless version. the star of the pie is the filling really. thanks though.

>>11895256
thanks for the advice but the few pies i've made so far have been good, so i'd like to continue with them

>>11895292
thanks for the advice. i'm curious since i haven't tried another way, why does oil make it easier than using butter? and if i use butter can i melt it first or will that hurt the pie integrity? should i use the same amount of butter as i do oil 1/3 cup?

>>11895537

thanks for the advice anon

>>11895687
thanks for the heads up, i'll google. please post a picture if you end up making the pie, the crust might need refining but i promise the filling is amazing

>>11898269
thanks anon

>>11898114
USA Pan makes the best ones, if you can find them with the lid. Sold out on Amazon RN. I got one without a lid, and it did wonders for my banana bread and milk bread. No more flat wide loaves!

>>11899073
>and if i use butter can i melt it first or will that hurt the pie integrity?

You can melt it but most people use cold butter because of the way it mixed out and in and within. I often will just use oil but I'm particular to more of a pizza style pie crust rather than dessert light and flaky.

And I do plan on making this because that filling is preposterously looking good (I love berries in pie better than anything else).

This thread will probably run out before I get to it since it's already been going for 2 days continuously. But the information has been great. I've been holed up inside because it's crazy storming here and I expect our power to go out probably tonight and then last until 3 days from now so baking might be difficult.
Sometimes I miss the days of having a wood stove that we could cook on. Now it's half gas top burners and electric oven.

But when I do, I'll post and reference you. I'm saving this thread for multiple advice reasons. Starters, in particular, but Grandma's recipes are always welcomed on my end.

>>11895584
That looks divine. Do you happen to have any tips or a recipe?

>>11898933
It's not about shape, it's about baking evenly. If one of your cookies is 4oz and another is 7 they won't be the same cookie. They can't be. One will be raw and one will be dry.

>>11900210
You don't stand over the oven with an eagle eye and rip the door open and drag out a cookie with your bare hands as soon as it's done?

>>11900224
I eagle eye all of my measurements so when and if something goes wrong or a recipe is retarded I can make reasonable conclusions about how to fix it.
If all your cookies have margins of errors bigger than a communist assault rifle then you won't really get consistency.

>>11900237
>margins of errors bigger than a communist assault rifle

This made me smile.
I have to do this with those fluffy style steamy biscuits or I'll get exactly that result of one being fairly raw and one being like hard tack.

>>11899314
Used to have one of these. I still do... but my sister scratched the hell out of the non-stick surface while cleaning up her stupid meatloaf (slimy and crusty and burnt at the same time -- I swear she can fuck up ice-cubes).

It still works just fine but it was the principle of the thing that gets to me. Doesn't have a lid though. You could just put a cookie sheet over it like a lid though, right? I mean, it wouldn't be fitted but better than nothing if you wanted more steam, I'm guessing.

>>11900237
I read that as "margarines" of errors.

Made these a few days ago.

Used Chef John's no knead pizza dough recipe

>>11901787
I'm so cold and storm-ridden right now, I'd devour those in a few seconds.

What'd you stuff 'em with?
'Cuz that's the point of a calzone, right?

Also, nice board.

>>11901811
Didn't have much, but I used baby portobello mushrooms, red onion slices, soft mozzarella cheese, and grated parmasean. Also lightly seasoned with some salt and black pepper too before sealing it.

That was the first time I did calzones without putting sauce inside it and that's how I'll do it forever now. The calzones made with sauce inside it literally never get crispy in the oven, at least for me.

Baked and decorated this for a friend's bday cause I was broke at the time and I used all the ingredients I had on hand at the time. Sponge is a chocolate espresso with a basic dirty iced cream cheese frosting and ganache.

>>11901836
Duly noted!

And also, I would savor it, not devour. Something with effort put into it needs to be acknowledged.

Interesting... whenever I've either had one in a restaurant or made my own it always had the sauce inside. I suppose with mushroom and soft mozzarella you'd get plenty of moisture needed for the innards. Oh yeah, onion as well. This thread is awesome; I'm learning lots of good things that I plan on implementing. I am surprised that's it's been going since Sunday.

>keep bumping with real baking info

The calzones I've made in the past were slimy inside. Now I know why, though it's plainly obvious. Good call.

>pic not necessarily related... but oh well.

>>11901873
Looks godly
They'd need to wheel me out after I eat a slice though from the sugar

>>11901873
>cause I was broke at the time and I used all the ingredients

Jesus Christ, do you know what this would run i a place like the Bay Area of Santa Cruz, California or Portland, Oregon?
You wouldn't be broke anymore, I can tell you that. Especially if you didn't refuse service to the gays like those weirdos did in Oregon.

I've always liked the espresso sponge and iced cream cream cheese ideas. Though I'm not into cake those ideas are pretty good and useful.

Nice arrangement, too. When it comes to cutting these things up for serving I've always had a problem. Do you just let the birthday friend do it as an "honor"?

>>11901903
>*in a place*

>>11894037
mine isnt a sourdough one, but it was good nonetheless

>>11901925
bro you forgot the tomato sauce on your pizza

>>11901925
I see what you did there with those olives and herbs.
And I quite like it...

>>11901932
Looks like a good sauce to me.

Meaning, when I cut through it to serve up, I don't want a runny mess. That's for Chicago Pie and stuff like that.

>>11901932
I would substitute tomato for those peppers, though... The burps from peppers are nasty.

>>11901948
those are half dried tomatoes, not peppers, but yeah hard to tell with my terrible camera

>>11901903
I've thought about making it into more than just a hobby but I live in Toronto and it's a seriously cutthroat environment that I'm not totally sure I'm cut out for at this moment. I have a pretty good unrelated job at the moment but I might start taking commissions for birthdays and small events like that just to pad the wallet. Here's an apple pie I made a lil while back too.

Hi, it's the grandmas pie crust anon from here >>11895206

asking for people's good pie crust recipes. i prefer the oil as opposed to shortening or butter, as the star of the pie i use it in is the berries and cream filling. since i don't really want to convert her recipe to weight since it's resulting in several decimal places of precise measurement i just thought i'd ask you all for yours.

>>11902162
Just use the one on the side of the crisco tin. There's mostly nothing special about pie crust recipes, making shortcrust is about the technique of cutting in the butter/shortening and adding the right amount of water.

>>11902162
the recipe I'm giving out was only used because I had some self rising flour and I don't usually buy that flour.
I also use lard instead of shortening.
basically you can just add the flour, lard, and salt, cut up the fat and flour a bit and keep it in the cupboard until your ready to make a pie. then just measure out some of the stuff and add some Ice cold water
6 cups self rising flour
2 and 1/3 cup lard or 477.5 grams
1 Tbsp salt
when you want a pie
1 and 1/2 cup of above stuff
3 Tbsp cold water

>>11901967
Ha! I was wondering about that because they look so similar. I've just had experiences with folks who get nasty burps about an hour later after eating bell peppers that TASTE like peppers so I figure that was the cause. I've found that sautéing doesn't always work but cooking over a fire (gas burner) works fairly well to dispel that phenomenon. I've no idea why, though, regardless of color (red, yellow, orange, green).

I've even had a problem with that. And only with that ingredient. It might have something to do with drinking hard alcohol ahead of the meal, which I suspect, what with an acidic gut later on and all.

Your camera is fine, they just look similar and I had to throw my weirdo opinion in...

It's strange, though; marinated peppers don't have an issue later, either. Just the fresh ones.
And it's only the bell peppers, not things like serranos or jalapeños which I don't understand since the latter are more "spicy".

And onions are notorious for that but once cooked = no problem. Caramelization?

>>11897514
do you bake for a hobby or a job?

Im trying to make naan, but did i do it correctly? It looks a bit rough. I just stopped kneading it, so it is starting to raise.

I used this recipe: https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/14565/naan/?internalSource=hub%20recipe&referringId=233&referringContentType=Recipe%20Hub

>>11902280
I couldnt find brrad flour, so i used rye flour. Now that i translated the flour into english, i think i fucked up.

>>11902190
>>11902242
These are all correct for pie crust.

But...
>>11902162
If you want that kind of liquid to hold up I'd go with the oil (personally). The reason for that is because it will hold up like a chicken-pot-pie kind of thing. If you want light and flakey crusts, go with theirs FOR SURE.

You can always get a store bought one and dissect the ingredients accordingly and adjust for that. I had to do that with a girlfriend I had with thyroid cancer who couldn't have any store-bought items because of iodized salt so I'd just write down the important ingredients in things and make the stuff from scratch based on that.

I think your grandma already had the basics down but I wouldn't rule out trying to experiment with her recipe and a weight scale for the dry ingredients and keeping rigid notes over multiple tries (because, hey, too many Grandma's pies? Really?). Also, that filling is the bomb and I wouldn't want to adjust that part of it.

>>11902190
This.
But if you want something more sturdy for moisture, even olive oil can help with a kind of tough seal.

>>11902037
Oh yeah...
Toronto, I've been to, and they don't mess around.
I see your point.

But that apple pie looks pretty commercial-viable. For me, at least. I'd get it, personally.

I've seen small businesses spring up just on word-of-mouth but mostly when they specialize on a particular dish. Especially for occasions.
For instance, there was a bakery where I used to live that would do fruit-tart-type-things that were larger for one person but perfect for 3 to 4 people and folks would get them for office birthday parties or whatever and then have a kind of private get-together for just a few select persons.

>I do miss the fact that in Toronto I could just flip a loon to the bartender and get a cold beer... Like in the old western movies. There was something about a single coin that made it romantic.
Hey! Like a small pie!

I have no space for kneading anymore

What do I do, goyim, I don't know how to make bread any other way

>>11902308
Rye shouldn't rise as readily so that shouldn't be a problem. Just make sure to flatten it out enough and I think you'll be good. Besides, rye can verily add quite a difference to whatever dish you're making to use it with whereas traditional recipes are kind of bland.

Which, of course, depends on what you're serving it with. I could easily see where both could become overwhelming to the faint of heart.

>>11902388
The Italian way: in the air and stretch by gravity.
Prior to that, on your lap.
Like great great great great grandma used to do.
Or find a rock...

>>11891662
Made two batches of baguette today, see picture.
The left one is from dough that I let rise for 1.5 hours.
The right one is from dough that I let rise for 3 hours.
Because of my own clumsiness the shapes between individual baguettes vary.

I prefer the baguette from the 3 hour batch.
This is, however, to a large extent due to the 3 hour batch having a better, crunchier crust.
Does fermentation time have an influence on the crust or was this result due to the varying shapes?

>>11899073
see this recipe link for what melted butter can do:

>>11902280

>>11902433
based on the previous posts, I would a bit of both the fermentation and probably the shaping due to steaming

I'm new to this, so that's my guess.

>>11902539
>*I would guess a bit of both*

>>11902433
Fermentation does to an extent. I would reccomend an overnight, low yeast dough for a baguette, and then bake it with your oven cranked as high as possible with a tray of water added to the bottom and misting the loaves with water before putting in the oven and repeating twice per 5 minutes. Should only be a 15 minute bake. That’s how I do it and they get a nice crust

>>11902556
Not that guy but thanks for the advice.
Noted for future reference.
I'd love to make some quality baguettes for family (but, granted, for myself).

>>11902556
agreed, longer and colder fermentation give you that shardy crust, steam in the oven makes sure your baguettes get some more oven spring and have a more open texture while also improving the crust

>>11895292
What if you used olive oil, wouldn't it give the crust more flavor than plain colza/canola oil ?

And what's wrong with lard ?
I don't think they sell it here, I've never had any.

>>11902790
The difference between veggie oils is almost always too subtle to notice on their own

I think they might disparage lard because it's off an animal's body rather than from its milk or vegetables? I think it just has a bad rap in the public consciousness as being particularly unhealthy

>>11902796
The difference between olive oil and colza oil is pretty damn obvious if you eat a spoon of each, but I guess it might not be as much when diluted in the dough.
I will have to perform a blind taste or something.

It's grandmas pie anon. Made another pie today. Here is how it looked before the oven. I put on a few blackberries on top.

>>11902906
And the finished result. I'll taste after dinner this evening when it's cold (but I know it will be delicious).

>>11902911
YUM! Give recipe please!

>>11902926
See >>11895206
If you make it please take a picture and post and say if you liked it.

>>11902250
Hobby.

I'm a medfag and I need a good outlet or else it'll end up with me hooking up with thots/nurses/middle aged desperate single women doctors

>>11890150
Is there a practical reason for wanting an ear to form, or is it purely aesthetic ?

>>11902954
Aesthetic

>>11902954
Aesthetic plus the oven spring is more even. Shitty score marks make the loaf spring uneven

>>11890150
New to baking, what is a bread ear?

>>11903025
I assume it's what the bread uses to hear the airhorn.

>>11894055
Naan is made with lots of butter (or ghee if you happen to have it) and yogurt which give it that rich flavour and texture. To bake it, you heat a pan as hot as possible and throw in one stretched out piece at a time, then flip. The butter guarantees it won't stick

>>11897506
How did you bake it? Looks amazing

>>11902819
I actually proof my white breads coated in olive oil, and it has a huge impact on the flavor of the crust. As for fat in the actual dough, I prefer lard.

made a loaf with bacon, first time ive had it more than tripple in size

>>11903361
yeast loev lard

>>11902934
baking will definitely get you a better class of women , as will knowing how to really cook in general..for whatever reason women love it when a guy can make good food

>>11903380
yeast always fren of hoomanity since day 1, provied hoomans with many types of tasty bred and many type of liquid bred that maek hooman act funneh

>>11903451
I've been a brewer and mead maker longer than I have been a baker. At some point I realized that I was just a yeast trainer.

>>11902796
If you have a heart condition it will make a difference. That's about it. Clogged arteries are nothing to joke about but lard does make for a better end result in baking.

>resources: my dad's quadruple bypass surgery and my annual blood test cholesterol levels after switching to olive oil, etc...

>>11902819
I did a taste test of local olive oils and they were all different. Even though they came from the same region, they all had different attributes, much like different scotches have a different feel or taste on the tongue.

Blind taste tastes are a good way to go!

>>11902911
Dang!

I want some! Will make according to Grandma's recipe... What's her name so I can write it down? I'd rather not write down Anon's Grandma.

I'm doing this, regardless of those measurement discrepancies.
Did you figure those out, by the way?

>>11903025
The rising along the score you've sliced into it.
I assume.

>>11903540
No
Not a big deal though you can adjust to taste. The filling is non negotiable but you can fudge the crust. Her name was elizabeth so call it grandma Elizabeth's berries and cream pie. In the summer months you can sub berries for peach wedges and hoo boy it is delish.

The pie need to cool completely before cutting or consumption. Best eaten without ice cream

>>11903358
This is correct, though I don't use lard. But the oil on the outside does help the bread to rise because there is no resilience.

And helps with the flavor of the crust, like you said. That's my experience, anyway. I'd like to use lard more but I don't.

>>11903361
I wonder if the bacon fat had any hand in that. (?)

>>11903470
Trainer? Or wrangler?

>>11903451
Is that you, Art Bell, calling from the past?
Or just Joe Rogan?

>>11903559
use beef renderings instead of pork aka (lard)
boil down some fat in a pot with water, let it cool stick in the fridge overnight let it harden , then pull if off the top in the morning....clean the bottom a little with a knife if you have to...cut it into chunks ..put in a Ziplock and toss into the freezer , use it when you need it ...should keep for a good year or so...

>>11903557
>summer months you can sub berries for peach wedges
In the summer months we get blackberries that grow wild like crazy around here. Will use those at that time. My family always uses ice cream with pie and I hate it. It just melts all over the place... Don't get me wrong I love both but I like my ice cream fairly hardened and I don't like my pie soggy.

Granma Elizabeth's Berries & Cream.
Sounds like a decent drink name.
I'm writing your recipe down, Anon.

I absolutely love passed down recipes and don't mind switching things around so long as the original is still around for reference. I will figure out a crust and post it when I make it.

You work fast, by the way.

>>11903572
I would say that brewers are trainers, because it's a longer process that lasts weeks or months. Brewing pre-dated baking, so the short form wranglin' came second.

>>11903596
According to current medical science, there is no significant difference between pork and beef drippings.

>>11903596
This is good to know since we use more beef than pork in our home. Also, I find the flavor probably would be better suited to a rustic bread. I don't know, pork is a good flavor, too, but I always loved that beef stock from pho over the Mexican pork based stuff.
Thanks for the tip. It's gonna be hard to keep it in the freezer, since my sister is always throwing those things out when I'm not looking (like the bones I was trying to keep -- the bitch).

>>11903429
Because most guys are shit cooks or try to show off to be like Gordon but end up fucking up their dish.

I'm fairly autistic about technique

>>11903604
Ah, right. The ancient beers. I wonder what the stuff Gilgamesh drank was like. Probably thick and not as alcoholic as what we get in bottles these days, I'm going to guess.

Trainer has a better ring to it, anyway.

>>11903557
*smile*
grams always make them best stuff..
a suggestion I would make is ...mash just a few of the berries to make the other berries wet , then mix the flour and the sugar together and mix with berries in a bowl evenly coating them...then pour into your crust then pour your cream slowly into the crust at a single location so it doesn't rinse the sugar and flour off the berry mix ...

>>11903637
https://allmesopotamia.wordpress.com/category/recipe-2/

>>11903624
All that cussing like Gordon probably doesn't help, either.

>>11903610
I was thinking the same thing, but the flavors might be different. Store bought lard is pretty bland. I figure it's been rendered and processed so much that it's lost that certain "umfph". I also suppose that any fat that I obtain from drippings would already be spiced to a certain degree, either way, pork or beef.

Anybody tried chicken or other fats?
I'd figure lamb and camel would be common for middle eastern baking. Providing they hadn't already eaten it around the fire...

>>11903652
Lol, that filename.

Looks more like a hookah from a Zechariah Sitchin book.
Thanks for the link, it's bookmarked now. For research purposes -- for a friend.

>>11903653
I only use lard I render myself from bacon, so yeah, anything rendered and bought in store is crap. Make your own pork or beef drippings

>>11903653
Eh, most chicks don't mind a bit of cussing. Its more so trying to show off like cutting shit while not looking at what you're cutting, the retarded effort to try and flip food in the pan, trying to meme cook hard shit, the autistic plating where veggies, carb, and protein are separated evenly

>>11903653
Schmaltz is pretty great. More "light" in flavor compared to pork or beef.

>>11903610
medical reasons were not on the list concerns when I made the suggestion ,
beef fat was used alot in bread making in the old days because it is get a hold of
and easier to get in quantity ,,, just ask for just at the meat counter in the grocery store..

>>11903685
I'm just saying that it will be chemically equivalent, the only difference is up to your tastes.

>>11903665
Mmmmm... Bacon...
I can see that.

>>11903670
Schmaltz -- forgot about that since I've only really seen it used in Jewish cooking. I guess the French use that stuff, too, like goose fat. But I don't ever remember seeing it in baking recipes.

I guess fat is fat but the French seem to prefer butter. Availability? like >>11903685 said. Easier to procure?
I always laughed at the Food Anthropologist in Alton Brown's Good Eats show but now I am fascinated.


>>11903685
>>11903610
Would there be a difference between getting it from a butcher or grocery store and getting it from your own previously cooked renderings? I'm thinking mainly medically but either way, just wondering.

I think you just answered my question, I see.

>>11903706
no no , you BUY the Fat from the grocery , and then YOU render it at home ..I do this ..I also Use my crook pot I fill my 6 quart up with beef fat then pour water in till about 2 /3 s up ..put it on high for about 4 or 5 hours ..and bammo ..take out the chunks let it cool enough to refrigerate , next morning clean , cut , and store... you can even re-warm and fill up ice trays and freeze them them you have ready made blocks that are pretty consistent for baking , cooking ,

>>11896480
You can steam your oven at home, anon.

https://www.theperfectloaf.com/baking-with-steam-in-your-home-oven/

I use a shitty lodge grill pan with some rocks I found in a river somewhere in the bottom of my oven for the first source of steam. It comes out very good.

>>11903729
Gotcha!

That makes more sense, now that I think about it. Oh man, this is going to change my world.
I want to do this right now so bad but I'm snowed in but I will as soon as I can.

Do you have a preference for which kind of fats, in general, from your experience?

>>11903751
>a shitty lodge grill pan with some rocks I found in a river somewhere

That's some Jeremiah Johnson stuff right there. Nice. Gotta love the old-time tried-and-true tricks.

>>11903755

I just get beef fat ,, it is good and not very expensive ..
during the war years and when my grandad was kid that used to spread beef fat on toast because butter was to expensive or non existent because of the war

>>11903787
My setup is
-aforementioned lodge pan with rocks
-8x8 pyrex with full of water with water saturated dish towels in it
-generic spray bottle from Ace with water
That's all you need to get blistery shiny crust without using a dutch oven

>>11903799
Yeah. My grandad did the same. As did my great-granfather who fought in WW1 & WW2. My great-grandmother's cooking was very basic but very tasty and hearty. We had a small farm so there was livestock and NOTHING went to waste.

It's interesting... my mother was raised by my great-grandfather who grew up during the American depression and those tendencies have spilled over onto me, now. Like, I never toss tupperware packages because they can be re-used, whereas my sister (who is younger) thinks they are clutter and tosses them whenever she can get the chance. If it were up to me, they're used for storage or leftovers, if up to her they just end up in the ocean, I guess.

But I do recall, as a child, they would use beef fat from the slaughtered cow for multiple uses. One of them for morning toast.

Also, they lived into their 90s which leads me to believe a lifestyle is more important than just diet alone -- they were very active.

>>11903814
And the dish towels don't get burned?
I'm guessing their at the bottom, in this case.

This is good info since I don't have a Dutch oven.

>>11903862
>*they are*

>>11903600
another great thing about this recipe is it's easy and quick as fuck. as a busy and lazy fulltime wagecuck and near fulltime student it's nice to be able to whip up a pie in 20 minutes. let me give you a more readable recipe:

Grandma Elizabeth's Berries and cream pie

Crust:
1 cup+2 tbsp Flour
1/2 tsp salt
1/3 cup oil
2 tbsp cold water
add flour or oil taste if too dry/wet/ not enough to fill your pan

Filling:
4 cups berries/fruit
2/3 cups sugar
4 tbsp Flour
1/4 tsp salt
1/2 tsp cinnamon
1 cup cream (i've never used it but half and half is a-ok too)

Bake for 425 for 45-50 minutes or until bubbly in the center. let cool until fully cold before eating.
side note, careful taking it out of the oven, it's really spilly
enjoy anons and please post pics if you make it!

>>11903853
lol
yeah I grew up like that also...I save glass jars and various containers ,,because I built a re vacuum sealing machine for jars so I could save food , medication , ect ..to save things from going stale ...and to freeze stuff..
well old is a state of mind ...but you just cant win against time..

>>11903853
>>11903979
people like you are going to be needed when the world melts down.
These kids and millennials are going to starve to death and then 4chan will be mostly silent

>>11903652
contrary to that article brewing pre-dates that article and Sumeria about about 5-10k years. We are pretty sure that brewing pre-dates baking archaeologically.

This is some of my bread a while back using some starter and dry yeast. Anyone know how to make the bread really sour. I've tried overnight ferment and proofed for 12ish hours in the fridge but it still isn't strong enough. I did start a new starter so maybe it's not mature enough.

>>11890391
Careful not to over proof or it won't rise at all.

Just made my first loaf! Pretty good, this thread inspired me.

>>11904982
Another pic

>>11903892
I like your description of "spilly" because I know what that means. Seems like a lot of sugar but I shall follow that for my first attempt.

Thank you for sharing. I will try and use cream. I wonder how the differences would be if I just used evaporated milk instead of sugar since it's already so sweet... No. I will stick to the traditional first and then adjust. I shall not sacrilege your grandmother's recipe. Not at first, anyway.

>>11903979
I have a lot of mason jars around because of this notion. They are GREAT for all kinds of things. I'll even save shit like hard candies in them with a desiccant to keep them from going off. All sizes of jars but not too many in quantity. I also find them great for drinking out of. Fill one with ice and pour a standard can of soda or whatever and it's the perfect amount. Profit.

After this thread, I'm going to use some for starter(s).

>>11904055
I didn't actually appreciate all the wisdom I had been bestowed until I gave a eulogy at my grandfather's memorial. Everybody had already addressed the things I had written out so I just went improv and winged it. It was all small stuff but important stuff that he and his father had taught me.

I'm not sure if I'm interested in millennials starving to death but we might need somebody to keep 4chan operating on some kind of battery source.

Shit, if they just read this thread, they wouldn't starve to death!

>>11904239
I saw some news article about basketry being used for brewing / fermenting that was dated pre-Sumerian. Also I recall some pottery being discovered with wine residue around the same date. Like you said 5 to 10 thousand years. It's crazy that we can even find that stuff, anymore.

I mean, I just heard a segment on the radio where an Afghan village was built out of undetonated Russian missiles and didn't even know what they were dealing with. That part of the world is always building and then erasing themselves.

I guess if prisoners can figure out how to make pruno, it shouldn't be a stretch to think the ancients could craft a beer.

>>11904982
I would totally dip that in some olive oil spiked with minced garlic!