Touhou Lore Discussion

[Anonymous No.]

Ok, i start with some points:

>Is Shinki really Lucifer?
>Kaguya is Chang'e
>Mungenkan was the original hell
>Touhou was originally a Fanfiction
>Gensokyo is a fascist society

These are some points i like

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
>Kaguya is Chang'e
I feel like I would have seen someone draw this by now.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558430
Because it already happened

[Anonymous No.]

Do you think the outside world could conquer gensokyo if it is discovered?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558539
I really think it, but it would cause a lot of polemic

Because Youkais are man-eaters, so, there would be a serious discussion of what to do with them because genocide is a serious crime, but it will lead to a war with them

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558539
Certainly. It was always that way, even back when the barrier was created. There were individual people all over the place who could hold their own against youkai, and the subset of those people who were sealed inside the barrier were the founders of the human village.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558430

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558660
Imagine, humans managed to beat them only magic, with technology it would be a massacre

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558662
Perfect

[Anonymous No.]

A few PC-98 things in here.

>Is Shinki really Lucifer?
MS Makai did have a little bit of Dante's Inferno in it, and Shinki WAS the self-declared god of the realm. I don't think that's enough to make her Luciferian, though. She did tell Mima that there were 8 million gods in the human world, and she left Makai just fine to tell Reimu that she didn't have all that much control over the residents of Makai. Shinki also doesn't especially have any affinity toward sin, suffering, or evil. In fact, Yuuka comes in just to bully her and causes Shinki clear discomfort when she starts saying sadistic things about how massacres or genocide are just games for Yuuka.

>Mugenkan was the original hell
It's past Kurumi's lake of blood, which is on a mountain, not really a hell location. Also, Elly states it to be on the boundary between the fantasy world and the real world, which is open to interpretation since the fantasy world could be its own realm or it could be Gensokyo. If it's the latter, then Yuuka is just another resident who lives on the border, like Reimu and Yukari. The outer rim of Gensokyo seems to have the most powerful beings who live there...

>Touhou was originally a Fanfiction
Yeah, kind of, in that it lifted characters & concepts directly from other properties that ZUN enjoyed at the time. Touhou is a "Project" because it started as a student project that ZUN was doing. Of course, he wanted to clean his hands of the clear fanfiction elements when he started to make it into something that stands on its own, and the game going into the Windows era was his marker for that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
>Gensokyo is a fascist society
There's a hierarchy based on power, certainly, but that's also shared with a lot of feudal & tribal societies, so that really REALLY isn't enough to make it fascist. The humans are holed up into their camp by their own will, and they don't stray too far NOT because it's just the order of society but because they'll get eaten. If a human is safeguarded or is simply strong enough to prevent that (like Mokou or Marisa), then they're just fine being outside the village. There isn't some youkai enforcement police out there detaining humans to put into the camp or expel from Gensokyo. They aren't untermensch; they're just weak until they're not. The, there's the thing about border policy, but again, if a human is strong enough to hold their own after they make it through the barrier, then they're just fine. They don't need to know anything about the local fighting style if they can dodge well enough.

Also, there's also no authoritative emphasis on traditional values, as that's really just a matter of preference for anyone in Gensokyo. Reimu has lots of rules that she's supposed to be following as the Hakurei shrine maiden but only follows the rule of wearing the uniform. Marisa is flouting eastern tradition by presenting as a western magician even though it's explicitly stated that she's an eastern girl. The characters do comment on how some things are more "Japanese" than others, but not only do people talk like that everywhere, but the characters go on to not make decisions based on how "Japanese" that thing is.

Additionally, there doesn't really seem to be any sort of fascist authority for all of Gensokyo. There's some political sway held by Yukari, by the Yama, the shrines, the gods, SDM, but no one seems to actually want to take the reins on Gensokyo's policies or enforcement. There are very few rules for everyone in the land to follow, and the rules that ARE in place are mostly for the sake of short-term practicality, aside from the spell card rules, which happened because Remilia was making a stink and there was a consensus among youkai that there should be some ground rules in place. Also, the Tengu publish whatever the hell they want about any of the aforementioned political parties without any expectation of serious retribution. The whole thing is far too decentralized.

Really, Gensokyo can't be fascist because no one with any real power in Gensokyo wants to deal with having the responsibility of running the place. Hell, Yuyuko doesn't even really run the Netherworld; she just orders Youmu around to do all the chores and round the ghosts up whenever they escape.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559219
The Sages and The Dragon God technically hold undisputable authority over gensokyo.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559219
I was thinking it was more about the purity concepts that everyones have towards humans

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
I Continue:

>Marisa is a Sociopath
>Who is "Kage"
>Komachi Predicted Marisa"s death
>All fanworks are canon for ZUN
>The Outside world isn't real

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559111
Touhou is ZUN Kiki Kakai x Megami Tensei Fanfiction was the point

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559896
>Kiki Kakai
Sorry anon, we're Americans here. It's real name is Pocky and Rocky

[Anonymous No.]

How many 2hus are canonically boobhus?

Looking at published art besides ZUN's art obviously, there seem to be a fair few. Examples like Sanae and Hijiri's milkers from the fighting game, to the tengu pinup in the interview. Can't forget Yuugi's kimono.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
>Junko did nothing wrong

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559952
Yeah

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559971
The Sages

Sanae
Wakasagyhime
Byakuren
Yuugi
Utsuho

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559981
I want to worship her breasts and ass

[Anonymous No.]

I want to fuck Junko. I want to habe sex with Junko and creampie her vagina

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560027
>Junko is Chang'e

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560039
I want to give her another son

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560039
you realize that this is a lore thread, right?

[Anonymous No.]

This turned from a lore discussion into a degenerative junkosimp spam, go fuck yourselves honestly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559971
More boobhu.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560106
Shut up Chang'e

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560106
Im worried, please turn it into a Lore thread again

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560128
Kanako
Yuugi
Yukari
Clownpiece
Wakasagyhime
Byakuren
Sanae
Utsuho

And the Gensokyo Sages

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560189
Do they have toilets in Gensokyo? If not, where does all the shit go? You know how the Netherworld doesn't have any bacteria living there, right? No insects or anything else. Considering how much Yuyuko eats, one has to wonder where all that shit is going! It certaintly can't stay in the Netherworld. It would all pile up and there would be no microorganisms to break it down! There has to be some kind of plumbing, but we never see evidence of that!

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560648
Yukari gaps it all to India.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
Okay so we all already know about the whole "humans beat Lunarians in the future" thing right? I would like to expand upon it a bit upon that.

Time and time again throughout canon we're told that Lunarians have a massive technological advantage over everyone, including the Outside World, and are basically the only faction in existence that is skilled in both technology and spiritual matters. With a thousands, if not millions of years headstart over everyone and technology exceeding everyone's wildest dreams, how could they have possibly lost to the humans?

I think the answer lies in numbers, time, and motivation. Reimu describes the Lunar Capital as even tinier than Gensokyo is. While childbirth isn't explicitly described as something that produces impurity in-canon, it does produce kegare in IRL Shintoism, so there's a fair chance that the Lunarians population growth is pretty much stagnant. Exact numbers on how many Lunarians there are is scarce, but if they live in a space smaller than Gensokyo and have no population growth, there likely aren't that many of them. With a low population, small area, no population growth, no influx of new ideas, and fervent distaste for anything not originating from their safe-space, the environment the Lunarians live in isn't conducive for any kind of growth or progress at all, and that includes scientific or militaristic progress.

We know for a fact that at least 1500 years ago the Lunarians had cryonic technology (which was considered cutting-edge at the time). We've had the ability to put people on ice since 1976, and more efficient techniques like vitrification since 2006, but we still lack the ability to revive those we froze. It isn't clear if Lunarians also were in a similar situation, because the guy they froze wasn't unfrozen for 300 years, but roughly speaking the Lunarians had 1976/2006-technology or near-future technology about 1500 years ago.

We also know that Yagokoro left the moon about 1200-1300 years ago, and with titles like "Brain of the Moon" and being the Lunar Capital's founder, was likely one of it's foremost intellectuals and best scientists.

Lunarians also have a fairly laid back lifestyle. They do their standardized tasks and then play shogi and shit all day. With infinite lifespan no one is ever in a rush to get anything done.

All of this combined makes it easy to see why Lunarians get BTFO'd by the humans in the future. The Outside World likely has a far, FAR greater population than the Lunar Capital, and with that population all the varying ideologies, faiths, cultures, etc. comes a far greater pool of ideas to work with, as well as a far greater pool of researchers and workers. The Lunar Capital may have had a headstart but I'd bet the overall rate of scientific progress is much higher in the Outside, allowing the humans to catch up (technologically) with the Lunarians at a far accelerated pace. The Lunarians also don't really have anyone to war with, and their "conflicts" are slapfights at worst, while there hasn't NOT been a major conflict killing thousands if not millions at any given point in time in the past 1,000 years of human history. This is why the Lunarians were blindsided by the humans "modern weaponry" and why the tide of the war was in humanity's favor.

[Anonymous No.]

What are the implications?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560677
youkai disguise themselves as cute girls to kill humans
kill youkai

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560735
they just want to pretend that they want your cock when in truth they want your meat to munch on

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560016
>Sanae
I have my doubts

You also missed Urumi, the only one Zun has actually drawn with tits.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559971
>>41560016
>>41560027
>>41560039
>>41560042
>>41560061
>>41560128
>>41560134
>>41560502
>>41561023
Hang your neck on a rope and snap it like glass, faggot cocksucking losers trying to derail the thread

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561050
Fuck off retard secondary. Play the fucking games and read the printworks if you want the lore. There isn't much. Spoonfeeding you isn't anyone's job.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561050
Genuinely trying to establish who are the boobhus here.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561126
>There isn't much
This is where your retardedness peaks, kys.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560664
That's a dumb answer to my question and you know it

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561212
good post.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
Does anyone know anything about the EoSD true meaning theory? I tried searching for it and got nothing, but I am really really intrigued to learn about it

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561126
>There isn't much.
Yeah, that's what I thought until an anon in the last lore thread listed all of the official works in the series (>>41463816, >>41463893, >>41464081, >>41464215, >>41464258, >>41464343, >>41464399, >>41464432, >>41464620).

Even when you're going through the lore, it doesn't seem like it'll be too much, but then there's more, then there's more, then there's even more. It just keeps going. There's a whole lot of official content, though some entries in the series will be longer (like the several written novels being at least 100 pages each) and some things will be shorter (like the Hifuu Club lore on the music collection being little pamphlets). I could reasonably expect a lot of people here to have played all the games, but I wouldn't expect everyone to have read all the lore. It's the Bible of the entire franchise. ||Albeit, had I known there was that much, I might've been less interested in even bothering, but I've already started and am hungry for more.||

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561711

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
>Is Shinki really Lucifer?
my headcannon is that she is actually Lilith
>Kaguya is Chang'e
No
>Mungenkan was the original hell
if you mean a Beta test, maybe?
>Gensokyo is a fascist society
yes/no, more like Surveillance State

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558728
Very true and you have legends of absolute units that could beat youkai and oni in melees, imagine what a determined man with a bit of planning and tech could do

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560667
also, a curiosity...
>"A Presbyterian elder, Aldrin became the first person to hold a religious ceremony on the Moon when he privately took communion."

one headcannon is that the blessing of an abrahamic Faith could disrupt Magic (because magic is an abomination to the Thelos of the universe), lunarian "technology" may as well be just Magitek, and when fantasy is dispelled, 75% of their tech malfunction

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561711
My point was, you'd be better off playing/reading everything yourself. Yes, you can have the lore spoonfed to you and it'd be much quicker, but doing it fast isn't really a good thing. It's better to take the time to pick through it yourself so you can have a better understanding and more ground to form your own interpretations. You probably aren't going to die in a year or two, so there isn't any rush.
Please learn the spoiler tags and use them correctly. Thank you.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
>Texas is westerner gensokyo
What era is this Texas in?
Which part of Texas would this land encompass climate wise?
What figures and legends would you like to see there?
Would it be comfy even if a bit scary?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41562176

[Anonymous No.]

>>41562762
Saved, also you have a source? Crop so I can't find it easily

[Anonymous No.]

>>41563100
Teddy Plaza - Maple Leaf

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559575
youre thinking of kegare which is entirely different from the fascist concept of purity. and that would be the moon, not gensokyo

[Anonymous No.]

>Is Shinki really Lucifer?
Her wings are heavily based in lucifer's design from megaten.
But iirc Lucifer was mentioned in some manga and Reimu did some ritual every year I think so the seal doesn't break. But I think that Lucifer might be someone else, like maybe a youkai born from the misconception of Lucifer(mornig star) being Satan since they showed Venus in the panel.

>>41561802
So you are impliying Shinki gave birth to all demons instead of by magic alone?

>>41560667
Nice to see someone actually reason this out. I also thought that Hecatia and Junko could also help with the fall of the Lunar Capital in the future.
I also suppose Lunarias would be less advanced specifically in applying technology to war, which makes me wonder if they already had some firearms for the bunnies of if they just started developing guns when humans first landed.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41563812
>So you are impliying Shinki gave birth to all demons instead of by magic alone?

Could it be? Fair implication(although i dont believe for a second that she birth/Create Sariel, Angels Are willed into existence by the deity)

what i mean is that she exhibit a positive character traits to be analogous to a Fallen Angel of pride who is fix on hating all Creation

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561050

Don't worry about my i am OP and also >>41560502, i don't was trying to derail my own thread lol, i was trying to put an ending to the boobhu discussion, if you want to help you can anwers some points

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561711
>>41561745
Can someone copypaste it and save in Pastebin? I am worried for that text

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
I continue

[Anonymous No.]

>>41566323
...And Continue

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560105
>>41560106
>>41561050
Huh man

Thank you for help, but i don't know what was the last good touhou lore discussion

[Anonymous No.]

>>41561050
Alright here's a lore discussion
>Your a faggot secondary

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567277
Finally, can we discuss?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41562176
Lives in Texas, can confirm. I always see Yuyuko at the State Fare

[Anonymous No.]

>Marisa is a Sociopath
>Who is "Kage"
>Komachi Predicted Marisa"s death
>All fanworks are canon for ZUN
>The Outside world isn't real
>Flan's Blue Stage
>USA eradicated Lunar Capital
>Love-Struck Massacre
>IN "FinalC"
>The Vampire Incident
>Lost Touhou Anime
>Time Loop Theory

Can someone answer?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567419
Lore threads are useless nowadays OP, this board has been taken over mostly by cutesokyofags that know jackshit about the series and coom to their waifus daily.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567419
>>USA eradicated Lunar Capital
see >>41560667

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567904
My time has passed'

It's the end

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567914
Thanksfully, that has sense

>>41560667
Do you think Gensokyo can conquer the Lunar Capital if the Earth attacks first?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567992
Nah, for Gensokyo to interfere they'd need the Outside World to be weakened aswell or else they'll be vanquished by the outsiders discovering them, they can't take up the risk.

Youkai are parasites, any situation that turns to their favor will be taken advantage of.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568012
In that chase, what gonna happen if somehow the humans discovers the Lunar Capital or Gensokyo?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568026
Probably want to conquer both of them, humans from the outside world have always been warlike, which in this case would lead to an interesting occasion for the Lunar Capital and Gensokyo to team up against humanity.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568045
Or if Gensokyo is discover, the Lunar Capital can
give a bad image about them or reveal their secrets, and the Lunarians and the humanity would work together to eradicate Gensokyo, and probably enslave they

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568076
Plausible, given that the lunarians have some good technology that humanity could make good use of.

Youkai are youkai, they're inherently designed to parasitize on fear and negativity, they wouldn't make for any usefulness to humanity so extermination is the most likely answer.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568099
What happens if humanity makes experiments with they? They have powers too, they can make weapons with the power of some youkais no?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568120
All I can think of is extracting Okuu's nuclear fusion energy, but other than that, nah, kill youkai.

Or make them into sex slaves, considering their hotness.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568132
Reimu, is you?

>Or make them into sex slaves, considering their hotness.
Sell them as sluts for the Hollywood sects

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567904
Meanwhile this thread is going faster than any of the shell imagedump threads the generals use to bump their generals off the board faster.
The only issue is nobody wants to make threads due to burnout. Build it while cumming, or whatever that phrase was.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568207
Yeah, when i created this thread?

Ah, yesterday

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560648
>>41560648
>>41560648

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568275
>>41560648
Are you german by chance? I can't think of anybody else who can't derive pleasure from a piece of media without everything being explained down to meticulous detail.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560648
Yuyu doesn't poo, simple as
100% efficiency baby

[Anonymous No.]

>>41568132
>Okuu's nuclear fusion energy
Which originates from a god. Extract the Yatagarasu, kill the youkai.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567419
>Marisa is a Sociopath
Marisa is just a little shit. She tries not to really hurt people and only steals or swindles marginally more than the other people in Gensokyo. The Eientei residents steal food right off Reimu's & Marisa's laps, Tewi in BAiJR collects money by posing as a Hakurei shrine donation collector and then lies to Aya during their entire conversation, she and Reimu routinely use Rinnosuke's household goods without his permission, Yukari is loaded with fuckery and occasionally performs domestic abuse against Ran, Rinnosuke trades Marisa's Hakkero furnace repair for "metal scraps" that happen to include a legendary sword (a detail that he doesn't tell Marisa), the only ones who might actually be innocent are Youmu and the oni, who are earnest to a fault. If Marisa is a sociopath, there are a whole lot of sociopaths running around. Her stealing from Patchy's library is sort of halfway justified by her identifying that Patchy can retrieve the books after Marisa's lifespan is over, but considering that stealing is sort of a normal behavior in Gensokyo, I think it's fair to just call it stealing and that doesn't change anything.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41569074
That reads like an episode of its always sunny
which is a good idea for a doujin

[Anonymous No.]

What's the deal with Parsee? Why is she so jealous?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41566323
>Koishi didn't close her 3rd eye intentionally
It is a stretch but I can see this idea actually being a thing, after all her current actions are driven by their subconscious. So there could've been some massive trauma and the eye closing finalized her power change.
>>41569174
Naturally jealous species of guardian deity + Possible lack of healthy connections + Having to constantly see happy people cross your bridge = Unhealthy levels of Jealousy.

Honestly I don't see Parsee's apparent Kindness (Source: Satori during the SA Boss fight reviews) in the Iceberg images and it's kind of a shame.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567419
>Marisa is a Sociopath
Her personality in the games could kinda fit with being a sociopath, but I think sometimes people just start calling a character a mental illness just because they saw symptom

>Komachi Predicted Marisa"s death
Just Komachi telling Marisa that "You are ten years too early to say that you want to die." but I think "ten years too early to..." is kind of a meme in japan so it may not be seriously.

>All fanworks are canon for ZUN
ZUN said that he likes to be as vague as possible to make fans make up their own stories. It's more canon being vague rather than fanworks being canon.

>The Outside world isn't real
I think this is just made up, I haven't seen a single fanwork saying this. It's also unlikellly considering Sanae and Sumi exist unless there is a mayor conspiracy/plotwist in touhou but I don't think that's canon at all.
Maybe ZUN has joked at some point that the outside world/real world is fake but I don't remember that.

>Love-Struck Massacre
Koishi says something like that on SA extra iirc.

>IN "FinalC"
Probably a reference to leftovers of PCB phantasm stage making it look like the game had one more stage/ending but not sure.(ZUN reused PCB code for IN)

>The Vampire Incident
First referenced in:
https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Perfect_Memento_in_Strict_Sense/Vampire
Basically Remilia did as she pleased abusing her power and youkai decided to put a stop to her and make spellcard rules so fights were less one sided.

>Time Loop Theory
Theory were Maribell goes to the past and becomes Yukari.

>Lost Touhou Anime
An anime studio wanted to make a touhou anime that might have been offitial but it was cancelled irrc.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567419
>Time Loop Theory
That's just what happens in Yumemi's PoDD ending, unless this is referring to something else. It also adds a Gensokyo multiverse in order for there to be a base case, since she can't already have been in Gensokyo to face a copy of herself unless she returned to Gensokyo once already (in one of the main endings).

The timeline would be that someone beats Yumemi, she grants a wish before leaving & returning, then Yumemi goes on to beat everyone in her own game route (including the one who originally beat her, which may also result in her reversing the wish she granted), before returning to her vessel, which had been replaced with a copy of itself along with a copy of Yumemi onboard. One Yumemi beats the other, the loser merges into the winner, Yumemi gets kicked out again, then comes back to Gensokyo to do it all over again.

It's possible that when she comes back to Gensokyo, she comes back to an untouched universe where PoDD didn't happen and just leaves the ship herself to collect data by fighting everybody before returning to find that her ship had been replaced with a copy of itself. In this case, the canon timeline is probably this one, where a lady arrives in her ship, beats the hell out of a bunch of girls, and goes back to her ship which isn't her ship, then the ship departs, leaving everyone else otherwise unaffected.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41566323
the con orgy was the best orgy
-sans

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567419
>All fanworks are canon for ZUN
>Lost Touhou Anime

I think these two are connected. I forgot where I read it, but ZUN had this statement that he plans to never endorse a Touhou anime as official canon to the series, since he enjoys there being multiple fan interpretations of the same events.

Fan works are "canon" in the sense that it's how people interpret the series, but the only official canon works are those ZUN says are official. ZUN does give his blessing to the many fan works that appear in a lot of his print works, but he explicitly excludes almost all them from being part of the canon, expressing that those should be enjoyed as fan works even though he does officially acknowledge them by putting them in his books.


Also, there is a lost Touhou fan anime from ufotable, which is pic related. It looks beautiful, but no raws never surfaced.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41563812
>I also suppose Lunarias would be less advanced specifically in applying technology to war, which makes me wonder if they already had some firearms for the bunnies of if they just started developing guns when humans first landed.
They showed that they had guns in one of the SSiB panels, but they looked like WW2 firearms, complete with bayonets and shit. I'm not sure if this is a symptom of everything in the Lunar Capital looking "primitive" like Reimu says, or if they're really behind in weapons technology.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41571140
given their small populace and the militaries general tendency to prepare for the last war they faced its very likely they're weapons were more for small scale engagements and personal defense then large scale warfare and logistical practicality. Not to mention that during the last mentioned war, the Youkai war it would likely have revolved around older Japanese practices of its warrior caste and a good portion of it would have been 1v1 duels against the champions/warrior cast of each side

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558993
ahahahahahahahahaha

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560735
It's interesting how their loli forms are canonically just a look they've all assumed, and that they all have monstrous forms, but you so rarely see any speculative artwork of it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41569412
>>Probably a reference to leftovers of PCB phantasm stage making it look like the game had one more stage/ending but not sure.(ZUN reused PCB code for IN)
Note that IN FinalC and IN Phantasm stage are two different theories in the iceberg (the Phantasm one is in a higher tier). While the IN Phantasm is more well-known (unused associated graphic in the prototype), I really don't recall the FinalC one.
Technically IN, not unlike PCB, has 8 stages in the game data. But while PCB uses from 1 to 6 plus Extra and Phantasm as separate stages as anyone could expect, IN uses from 1 to 5, the two stage 6 each as different stages, and then Extra as the eighth (4A and 4B are considered the same stage).

[Anonymous No.]

>>41569302
I can see what Satori means about Parsee though, her jealousy of others means she holds them in higher regard than herself. She sees the best in others and assumes she lacks that quality.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41572118 (me)
*trial, not prototype
In the v0.02 apparently.
https://detail.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp/qa/question_detail/q14170836634
It was answered here originally.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560667
>Aliens who've never had to go to war before get their shit kicked in.

Reminds me of The Forever War(the novel)
>Time Dilation means that humans sometimes have to fight aliens 100 years ahead, they sometimes still win despite this.
>Humans discover a field that kills everything in it, they build suits to survive and wipe out entire planets with four man squads before the aliens get wise
>Guns don't work in the stasis fields, so humans learn to use primitive weapons again. Aliens can only counter this by throwing exponential(quite literally, they're obsessed with powers of 2) bodies at the problem
>Humans win a space battle when outnumbered and the ship AI could only delay the alien forces via a light-speed kamikaze
>The Aliens are a hive mind with far greater numbers and communication, but because of this they haven't fought wars in forever

[sage No.]

>>41572173
Some more details:
>From the beginning of the war, humans are hypnotized to massacre aliens against their consciousness
>Later humans start having "bottle babies" to curb over populations and are almost exclusively homosexual
>Psionics exist and although the book doesn't depict any war crimes with them it does show the potential for retaliatory head exploding

I want to see what war crimes Gensokyo Earth would commit.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41571732
>canonically
You mean theoretically, and even then, not for all of them. Like, Kasen's "true form" has two arms and horns. Nue says that she considers her humanoid form to be her true form, though there is room to doubt that. Okina's "true form" in the HSiFS extra stage just looks the same as the form we normally see her in. Magician youkai have human physiology but have used magic to keep themselves from dying of natural causes like hunger or age, so they're pretty much just humans. Medicine Melancholy is a doll, Yuyuko is a human ghost, vampires are inherently humanoid, Kogasa is stated to be both the umbrella and the girl like they're separate body parts; there's not much room to say that they would all have monstrous forms.

It's fair to assess that the girls are actually just girls, and Nue even has the specific power of hiding her true appearance, which probably means that other youkai can't do that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41572929
No, it's canon, Byakuren even mentions it somewhere that the cute girl form of youkai is just a shapeshifting form they assumed

[Anonymous No.]

>>41572999
Depends on the youkai
I could see a man eater like rumia needing a disguise but youkai like tengu, tannuki, and kitsunes would have a human form they naturally turn to and could be considered their "true" human appearance sans any personalization they do for fun
Case in point: Ayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayayaya

[Anonymous No.]

Here's is more

>ZUN credited in a porn game
>Lost IaMP Yukari Animations
>Who is Kage
>EoSD Trial version 0.01
>Heaven's Conspiracy
>Crisis in hell
>"The ultimate goal of Youkai"
>Hecatia can kill Hourai Inmortals
>EoSD is a reimaginated telling of MS

[Anonymous No.]

>>41569074
What if this is the true nature of Gensokyo
Superficialy a cute place, and really dark when you think in it?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41569545
Time Loop theory are variety of theories were happens a time loop of Yumemi one but it's ok

[Anonymous No.]

>>41572230
What are the characters that canonically commited a war crime?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
>>41559698
>>41559981
>>41567419
>>41574806
Who are you quoting?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560667
I’ll comment that Kaguya’s view is a bit biased since she was a princess.
There are guards shown in SSiB.
Remember that’s from the character’s viewpoints. It’s similar to asking a noble in medieval times about their life and assuming everyone lived like that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41575331
Nobody, don't worry

[Anonymous No.]

>>41572999
Where'd she mention that?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41575554
Weren't those guards moon rabbits, the servitor race to the Lunarians?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41575925
I believe they were actual lunarians
It’s after Reisen II returns to the moon when she’s trying to deliver the letter

[Anonymous No.]

>>41575931
Yeah, you're right. They have weird white hat things but no rabbit ears. Damn, and practically every other source we have on how the moon works all had privileged positions within lunar society.. besides Reisen II but she doesn't say much about how Lunarians live their daily lives.

[Yukari Yakumo No.]

>>41576129
>Lunarians live their daily lives.
They flex their superiority and eat their own cock to pleasure themselves and their ego

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576129
These are men?! Men?! In my Touhou manga?!

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576165
OH MAY GOD

( Human village flashbacks )

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576148
The thing here is how they are obsessed with war when they don't have nobody to battle, are they making a plan to make a giant invasion to the earth or Gensokyo?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576204
Probably, the plot of KKHTA kinda revolves around that concept

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576258
I know that KKHTA is pretty inacurate to touhou lore, but if something should to be real, is that, after the youkai attack time ago, they really should to be angry, imagine a war like the WW2 between the humanity, Gensokyo and the Lunar Capital

What if Sumireko was helped with the Lunarians indirectly?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576334
Gensokyo is a small enclosed realm with few powerful supernatural beings that could do anything at all to contend with the lunar capital or outside world.

Gensokyans will be caught in the crossfire as I suppose it would mostly be a war between humans and lunarians while youkai occasionally get bombared too.

Meanwhile heaven, makai, senkai, the underworld and hell will be chilling as if nothing's happening

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576399
I think the plan would be something like:

>Gensokyo is discovered
>Lunarians give a bad image about them
>Humans attacks Gensokyo
>Lunarians decide to attack Humanity in the middle of that or once Gensokyo is destroyed
>Lunarians purify (kills everyone) the world

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576504
You forget the part where Junko get enraged and start rampaging throughout the lunar capital

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576521
Why the Gensokyans stopped Junko from destroy the Lunar Capital?
This why shit like KKHTA happens

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576529
Because Reimu&Co are retards and aren't known to particularly exhibit high intelligence in these situations.
Just imagine fighting on behalf of the lunarians and proceeding with their threats, this just shows how idiotic and unloyal they are toward the very land they live in

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576582
Yeah

Seriously, why to help the ones that are attacking you? Why don't help and kill the Lunarians that are pure evil?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576582
Apart of Lunarians, can we discuss on some ponts i cited?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41576529
>>41576582
>>41576644
Junko wasn't trying to "destroy the Lunar Capital" or "kill the Lunarians" with her attack. She was trying to get the Lunarians to flee the Lunar Capital so that they would leave their prisoner Chang'e behind, which would allow Junko free reign to have her revenge against Chang'e for the death of Junko's son. Because the Lunarians didn't have another well-barriered "pure" place to go, they began an operation to purify Gensokyo of its life.

Reimu worked with the Lunarian Sagume Kishin to get rid of the root cause of the Lunarian attack, which was Junko spreading impurity to drive the Lunarians off of the moon. Once Junko stops with her antics, the attack on Gensokyo stops because the Lunarians aren't trying to get off of the moon anymore. That way, Reimu only has to deal with Junko instead of all of the Lunarians. It's not a matter of Reimu being disloyal or stupid; it's a matter of her just wanting to go with the lazier option to solve the problem of the moment. It's very in-character for her to want to be lazy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558539
I thought Gensokyo was known about (and implicitly hidden and cut off from the outside world) by the Japanese government, SCP-style.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577212
Any source?
Could make a good story however

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558539
This is the very reason Gensokyo exists in the first place. Youkai stand no chance against modern humanity. Not even just on a firepower level, but on a metaphysical one. Magic appears to grow weaker in the outside world, since youkai subsist on belief they would eventually starve. Sanae is a good example. She's mostly a normal schoolgirl, though she can perform a few miracles given the energy to do it, but in Gensokoy, sharing the belief with Kanako and Suwako, she is on par with Reimu, and a minor goddess in waiting.

Gensokyo is essentially a youkai nature preserve/old peoples home.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577410
Guess the source was my brain all along!

I thought I read it on the Touhou Wiki page for Gensokyo because I remember it mentioning the date 1885, but it ends up that was just when Yukari sealed it off entirely from the outside world. I thought it was some sort of Meiji Restoration deal with the youkai to force them onto Gensokyo, Indian reservation-style in return for not genociding them.

That's what I get for reading like 10 books about Native Americans recently

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577483
>Youkai stand no chance against modern humanity
The weaker and moderate ones? Sure.
Now, say hello to our beloved Okuu, our bright bird capable of single-handedly nuking a region using nuclear fusion with greater output than a nuclear bomb.
Say hi to our legendary youkai Yukari, she's bright, she's cunning, she might gap one of those nukes the outsiders are sending in right back to their location, she might even gap one of those airplanes right into hell.
You could also be polite and say hello to Flandre, who has more than enough strength to simply squeeze any incoming threat with her hands alone, she doesn't even need to engage in direct combat for it.
Why not say hello to our gluttonous ghost Yuyuko, who, being already dead, is completely immune to bullets or bombs and whatever other silly toys the outside world invented, and can simply wish death upon the soldiers to get it done over with.
Yuugi and Suika would like to say a word aswell, the former is strong enough to cause nearby buildings to collapse from her footsteps alone, the latter can transform into a giant, and do more things.

I could go on more and more, to say that the outside world has the potential to conquer gensokyo is one thing, but to say that youkai stand no chance whatsoever is another.

[Anonymous No.]

Aren't youkai near-immune to attacks without "meaning" behind them? I don't remember where this is exactly stated but PMiSS says this:
>*Youkai have stronger bodies than humans, so even if they're split into five parts, they heal right away.
>*Youkai are more easily affected by belief than humans, and as a result spiritual damage can cause fatal wounds.
Doesn't this mean attacking youkai with non-spiritual attacks won't cause much damage?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577537
But if the barrier dissolves would they have any power? The barrier is what allows them to have spiritual power in the first place.
If the barrier dissolved I would assume they'd fade away in a matter of days or weeks.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577617
They still have the human villagers powering them somewhat, you'd need to nuke the village in order for them to start losing power.
However, you forget one thing, since youkai are powered by belief and fear, the outside world discovering them would not only cause a huge boost in the amount of people acknowledging the youkai's existence, it'd cause a huge upheaval in the very fact that youkai, once initially thought to be mythological creatures, actually exist, and thus empower them even more than before, and also cause other mythological beings such as gods and such to be acknowledged as real, and likewise increase their power.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577673
Before the barrier was created, youkai were everywhere, not just in Gensokyo. However, the youkai outside of Gensokyo have died out with the march of human progress and belief. There's a scientific explanation for everything, and beliefs in supernatural events are contained as folk tales (or in more recent terms, creepypasta).

In the mind of today's person, video evidence becomes CGI, UFOs become secret government projects, mysterious destruction becomes natural phenomena or well-planned terrorism or blunders by the state or even acts of God (or the equivalent for various religions). Youkai would need to assert their presence not only aggressively but in such a way that people can't possibly get the wrong idea even after all the conditioning people have to believe in other explanations.

Such ways of thinking are inimical to youkai, and it's already killed them off in the outside world once.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577747
>Youkai would need to assert their presence not only aggressively but in such a way that people can't possibly get the wrong idea even after all the conditioning people have to believe in other explanations.
Yes, they could and they would, the opportunity to be acknowledged and believed in once again presents itself, and they won't miss the chance to show the Outside World that they actually exist by demonstrating their powers.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577762
>they could and they would
You don't know that they would. The youkai of the outside world certainly didn't.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577673
If that were the case, then Kanako and Suwako would never have came to Gensokyo.
The youkai wouldn't be able to demonstrate their powers since their powers would be perceived as natural phenomenon (like Kyouko). So any shenanigans or displays of power would be explained as scientific instead of paranormal
That's why Patchy mentioned that science and magic are one of the same

[Anonymous No.]

you cannot convince me the downfall of youkai was just due to lack of human belief. it would be trivial to do some undeniable magic tricks and convince people you're real, especially back when gensokyo was made in the 1800s. something or someone else helped with the death of youkai

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577778
>The youkai of the outside world certainly didn't.
They didn't even know that their existence was directly tied to the humans' belief in them, youkai (and gods) used to be very arrogant back then before they wilted away, it was only after Gensokyo was created during the Sages' effort that they learnt this fact, and used it by continuously keeping an eye on the villagers that still believe in them to secure their existence.
Likewise, they won't do the same mistake in the Outside World again.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577784
Patchy doesn't know what she's saying, there's a clear distinction between magic and science, the lunarians are capable of using both of those forces and it's enough evidence for it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577747
>There's a scientific explanation for everything, and beliefs in supernatural events are contained as folk tales (or in more recent terms, creepypasta).
Which is something that always bothered me. You'd think people wouldn't start thinking "oh Phil was just talking shit about that omukade" after seeing a giant fucking centipede rip a man in two. If anything you'd think science in touhou would reaffirm youkai existence since they'd have shit like photographic evidence or cross referenced reports of say, fairies being real or of vengeful spirits.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577799
>They didn't even know that their existence was directly tied to the humans' belief in them
Gensokyo was created BECAUSE they knew this. Why expend the massive effort that required all the Sages of Gensokyo, the Dragon God, possibly the Hakurei God, and maybe even more to create the barrier if it wasn't because they all knew the decline of belief in the Outside would lead to their doom?

Akyuu even says they knew this in PMiSS.
>Around the time humans outside began to become more powerful and deny the existence of youkai, Gensokyo was already in danger of destruction (*3).
>The solution endorsed by the youkai sages was to isolate Gensokyo using a great barrier.
>This barrier is the so-called barrier of common sense.
>This barrier kept the outside world's common sense outside, leaving what lacked common sense inside, in Gensokyo.
>It created a world which embraced the youkai and the world of the night that the outside world denied — a world in which matter and forces flowed as they were denied by the outside world.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577793
Youkai specifically need fear, and as tech got better and communities got bigger, humans were less scared. Why be afraid of the bogeyman if you can shoot him in the kneecaps or gang up on him with your neighbors? Why do you think the human village is kept in a medieval stasis for the most part.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577895
>Why be afraid of the bogeyman if you can shoot him in the kneecaps or gang up on him with your neighbors?
because the bogeyman's knee immediately snaps back into place and he goes back to tearing your family apart. see >>41577604

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577923
Yet youkai like Yamame specifically avoid the human village because they'd get ganged up on.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577872
Funny how now that everybody has a 40000 niggapixel camera on their phones that UFO sightings and blurry bigfoot photos have completely vanished.

I kinda miss the old days of Roswell media and X-Files

>>41577927
Well yeah the "normal" humans there can fucking fly too.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577927
because the villagers use spiritual means anon, and thus are more of a threat to a youkai than a outsider with a gun.

plus the "rules" of gensokyo dictate that you cant kill human villagers unless they become a youkai, so yamame would be ganged up on and wouldn't be able to seriously injure her attackers lest she incur the wrath of basically everyone.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577949
>because the villagers use spiritual means anon,
And so would all the human communities back then, I imagine youkai hunters were becoming more and more organized with the bigger communities, which would make youkai less and less scary.

[Anonymous No.]

>"It's deplorable that some humans have forgotten their fear of youkai and are trying to drive them out of Gensokyo. Currently, there is a state of balance between the humans and the youkai here. In fact, I (being half-human, half-beast) am a personification of that ideal. If that give-and-take balance is destroyed, Gensokyo would collapse overnight. Even if many people now think of youkai as they used to be, these memories can fade in 20 years when the next generation comes about. The youkai are no longer rivals. Despite this, the humans have arbitrarily decided to do away with them. Humans should not be searching for past history, but passing history down the generational line instead. That's much more important."
Reminder that Keine is drowning the humans in pro-youkai propaganda.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577537
With the barrier gone their power wanes incredibly. Its debatable if yuyu can even persist out of the netherworld if the barrier was gone

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577747
Science is a religion at this point. Priests have been replaced with scientists, and the collective Church has been replaced by the government.
Nowadays, people will believe whatever the government says. If youkai can become organized enough to force the government's hand (or impersonate them), they would win.

Whatever your viewpoints on it might be, humanity at large was faced with constant, extreme levels of fear from the Corona as the government said to be afraid of it. If the government would go out and say "yes, mythological creatures are real, have always been real, and they want to eat you and your children", people would lose their fucking minds.
I'm of the opinion that they are but the government knows that revealing this information would cause the world to go into absolute anarchy.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577673
>>41577762
>>41577793
>>41577895
>>41577978
You raise a good point that if youkai would be revealed today it would cause an upheaval and perhaps even a power boost as people rediscover old gods and boogeyman and increase their powers. Now I know /jp/ isn't very religious so you all tend to forget this but in the case of the discovery of youkai being revealed publicly you'd also have a massive religious movement on par with the one of the American great awakenings but much more widespread as the full extent of the horror of reality presents itself. Don't forget that people do wholeheartedly believe in their religions already and use prayer as a means to drive off fear and the monsters in the night already, the churches have exorcists, rituals to drive off demons and other nasty things, and lots and lots of believers and powerful gods even outside of the Abrahamic religions. While purely physical attacks might not work icons and faith will indeed add weight as people will use old rites, holy water and oils, along with other means to allow even their humble weapons to damage youkai.
There is a reason the barrier must be maintained beyond just avoiding conflict with the nation states of humanity and its because there are very large organizations called the church that helped drive them out in the first place and would unceasingly hound them should they find their location.

[Anonymous No.]

Why magic was abandoned in the first place? I mean in a setting where magic comes at a great cost or a low fantasy setting I could understand magic getting lost in time.
But in a setting where magic let's you magically fly at decent speeds and in a controlled way it is kinda hard to think why you would abandon that in favor of 19th century level of technology.

>>41577617
>The barrier is what allows them to have spiritual power in the first place.
I don't know if this was explicitly stated, also before making the barrier their powers seemed to fade with time rather than disappearing instantly.
The only world that was stated to affect magic is Makai(via miasma) and in ULiL everyone seemed to fight nicely in the outside world iirc.

>>41578120
I guess religious people must have more power in touhou.... unless their gods are slacking off and gods only help them if it's completely necessary.
Honestly I have little faith in how much people believe irl since I've seen many people that feel kinda like, dunno posers? Just kinda having some spiritual believes to justify being a jerk and do shit that kinda goes against their believes, this goes for both christians and "alternative" believes....
The vatican doesn't seem to be much more than a big busyness and I'm not sure either if the dalai lama isn't also just corrupt.
I guess that other places like India and Middle East have kept more of their rituals and traditions.

Stuff like Remi not caring about crosses themselves also makes me see this in a more doomerish way.

>>41578108
Science has probably only lasted a few minutes till people started laughing at others for having different "scientific" believes and probably not much until people started slapping science into things to manipulate people and sell more, sometimes rigging studies other times simply calling non believers idiots.
I still wonder how many fell for the "spaghetti growing on trees" film, but I guess it's hard to know since one of the favorite things of "science people" is to mock people from the past for being "so stupid" to feel smart.

Science reached a point where you can no longer check empirically any fact by yourself so you have to believe in things.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577140
A ok, good

[Anonymous No.]

>>41574806
>Who is Kage
I think this refers to a HRtP song, it could refer to the character that ZUN talks in a song commentary that seems to be a shadow(kage is shadow in japanese) used in one of the games he made to learn before making HRtP.
https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Highly_Responsive_to_Prayers/Music#Theme_of_Makai_Levels_16-19
The commentary also references the game Legend of Kage made by Taito and explains why there are no ninjas in touhou I guess.

>EoSD Trial version 0.01
Some version that had some pics in ZUNs page that had some differences like Rumia's spellcard background being red like red mist and pic rel as the title screen but little is known about this version aside from a few low res pics.

>Heaven's Conspiracy
Yukari in Hisouten says that celestials tell that heaven is to full to accept new souls because they want more space for themselves.

>Crisis in hell
Hell has some financial issues acording to PMiSS, iirc there are more references to this in other works.
https://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Perfect_Memento_in_Strict_Sense/Road_of_Liminality

>"The ultimate goal of Youkai"
Some line Kansen was about to say when talking with Yukari about zashiki-warashi spying on humans, but as far as I know Youkai don't seem to have any "ultimate goal".

>Hecatia can kill Hourai Inmortals
Heca and Junko wanted to kill Chang'e/Jouga who is a Hourai Inmortal, so maybe one of them could do it somehow but i think it is just speculation.

>EoSD is a reimaginated telling of MS
Kind of a stretch but EoSD has some similarities with MS and LLS I would say but has different plot, characters, patterns, etc.

No clue about ZUN in porn games aside from him ripping some sprites from eroges for his PC98 games.

>>41567419
>Flan's Blue Stage
Might be a reference to this bug.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyQriK8Gywo

[Anonymous No.]

>>41580051
>But in a setting where magic let's you magically fly at decent speeds and in a controlled way it is kinda hard to think why you would abandon that in favor of 19th century level of technology.
Presumably it was harder or less widespread, considering Akyuu makes it a point to mention that magic research in Gensokyo is advanced enough that most magicians aren't old farts anymore by the time they get to "stop aging" magic.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41580397
>Heca and Junko wanted to kill Chang'e/Jouga who is a Hourai Inmortal, so maybe one of them could do it somehow but i think it is just speculation.
Maybe Hecc knew they couldn't but figured Junko would wear her grudge out after killing Chang'e a million fucking times like a guro stress ball.

[Anonymous No.]

I know this may sound retarded as fuck, but
What is the difference between a lunarian, a celestial, a god, an arahitogami, and a divine spirit? Aren't they all the same divine category of beings?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41582867
>A God
Being that survives from the faith or fear from humans
>A lunarian
Beings that live in the moon and doesn't have earth impurities
>Celestial
Beings that reject the impure humans desires

[Anonymous No.]

>>41580397
Can we discuss how the heaven is more corrupt than we think>

[Anonymous No.]

>>41582867
Celestials are basically hermits 2.0, Lunarians are only immortal because they live on a pure space like the moon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41583818
>Celestial are basically hermits 2.0
True

[Anonymous No.]

>>41577140
Fuck the lunarians, except Eirin and Kaguya

[Anonymous No.]

>>41583651
Heaven is corrupt as fuck and it may be a sign of massive corruption in the Ministry of Right and Wrong. Heaven, or at least the one in Gensokyo, falsely claims that it's "full" and everyone just accepts that? Virtuous souls deserving of Heaven don't get to go there anymore, so where do they go? The Netherworld? How could the Ministry not possibly know that they're lying? The Ministry would either have to be bizarrely incompetent or in on the plan. And if they're outright willing to completely bar people from going to the right afterlife, what else are they doing behind the scenes?

These are the people we trust to handle our souls after we die.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41584246
Fuck Eirin and Kaguya too. Kaguya sent tons of men on death quests (the Five Impossible Requests) for her own entertainment and that's exactly how she got Mokou's father killed, and Eirin is paranoid as fuck and frequently defaults to threatening or outright killing people to get her way. Remember what happened to the family that was harboring Kaguya before Eirin showed up? Remember what Eirin's suggestion for dealing with Mizue no Uranoshimako was? Remember Eirin threatening to kill Patchouli if she didn't reveal how she got the moon rocket idea? She's probably one of the biggest murderers in the series, anon.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41580051
>since I've seen many people that feel kinda like, dunno posers? Just kinda having some spiritual believes to justify being a jerk and do shit that kinda goes against their believes, this goes for both christians and "alternative" believes....
That is true indeed but to say that faith and the faithful don't exist in large numbers is plain wrong. And while yes, a lot of priests in organized religions are corrupt and drown in worldly pleasures does not mean that there aren't those that are true to their vows and employ those that do.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41586003
>How could the Ministry not possibly know that they're lying? The Ministry would either have to be bizarrely incompetent or in on the plan
Don't underestimate the inefficiency of a massive bureaucracy anon. Hell is running out of money so I can't imagine the rest is doing too well. I imagine Eiki wishes she could go up there and go Fist of the North Star on the Celestials though.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
>>Is Shinki really Lucifer?
Heavily implied. Aside from her own asethetic design, you have the fact she's createing life and her own world [kinda spitting in the face of god]; her castle is literally called Pandemonium, which floats in the middle of a field of ice [Which has Mai guarding it, both a firm reference to Dante's Inferno and the 9th circle... which has Luficer in the center] and Makai is literally "Daemon World".

Also; her most well-known attack is named by Byakuren as "Devil's Recitation". "Devil's" clearly being Shinki.

So while it's not 100% been stated, it is very, very heavily implied at Shinki is Lucifer and/or Satan.

> Kaguya is Change'e

Change'e is stated to be imprisoned on the Moon. Kaguya is not.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41586034
>Remember what happened to the family that was harboring Kaguya before Eirin showed up?
What happened? I don’t remember anything mentioned of their fate in CiLR.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41580397
I think the zun in porn games is a joke since all derivative works have to credit Touhou as ZUN’s (and team Shanghai alice’s) intellectual property, even porn games
Therefore he is credited

[Anonymous No.]

>>41586731
That was my favorite game from that Doujin, thanks for posting

[Anonymous No.]

>>41586846
Main discrepancy is of course Makai is explicitly not Hell or even an afterlife.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41578108
>>41580051
>Science is a religion at this point

That really depends on which part of science it is and how you engage with it. Like, I know that a lot of people take it on faith that "this is what the science says," but when you're in it and actually making the observations that add up to the things that people call science, the boundary of subjectivity within science becomes understood.

People will cite the CONCLUSIONS of a piece of research (or even a third-party interpretation of that conclusion) and state that that's "the science," and while the conclusion is a part of the institution of science, the conclusion is the researchers' SUBJECTIVE interpretation of the data. The only really truly empirical part of science, the thing that cannot be distinguished from the true nature of the universe, is that which is OBSERVABLE, or MEASURABLE. You can dispute the conclusions made from the measurements, you can dispute the circumstances (most often, the methodologies) under which the measurements were carried out, but you cannot dispute the measurements themselves. You can add other measurements to refine those ones or to put them into perspective, you can make further measurements to show that the measurements aren't replicable, you can change other variables to show that the measurements changed in response to factors that weren't being considered in the methodology and hypotheses of the researchers, but these are all creating additional measurements instead of actually disputing the original measurement. If one cites "the science" without familiarity with that which is observable, only then does it become religion.

Thankfully, the methodologies, data sets, and conclusions from research institutions are often published in places accessible for public consumption (arxiv/sciencehub/pubmed). Skepticism toward the research is welcome in the sense that it opens the door for further research, but denying the actual measurement is where you're denying something that's indistinguishable from reality, denying that which is observable to the senses. That is another form of religion.

In today's landscape, there are two main opposing religious factions around science: those, correctly identified in your posts, who take the CONCLUSIONS of research and declare utmost faith in that part of the science (although the conclusion is one of the most subjective parts of science); along with those, probably you, who take the PREMISE of research and declare that policy decisions shouldn't be made based on science that was carried out with an incomplete premise (although the data seems to never actually be reviewed & re-measured by this faction before that conclusion is drawn).

Those who engage with science in such a way that it's not a religion are just people we call... curious. They want to know things, will accept what is reasonable based on actual observable data, are able to change their own minds without digging their heels into one conclusion (or will accept that information changes as we get a larger sample of it), read the damn study, and especially carry out experiments or carry out civil contact the researchers instead of assuming one thing or another. A mature perspective is one that can handle several questions from an intelligent opposing perspective without breaking down assuming malice or stupidity from the other perspective. If you can't explain to a person why their perspective is stupid or malicious, then that view is religious in nature. If you CAN do such a thing or if you can reach a point where it can reasonably be assumed that neither of you has enough information to reach a fully-informed conclusion, then that view is non-religious in nature. The latter is going to be the exceedingly likely case for such an interaction, and if you never reach that "I don't know" point with people, you're probably religious in your engagement with the information, as your conclusion is based on something you consider even more foundational than that which is observable or measurable.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41587177
It wasn't described in CiLR I think, I mean in her IN profile.
>Long ago, Eirin was one of a party of messengers who were sent to bring Kaguya back to the moon; the crime for which she was exiled to Earth had been forgiven. For some reason, she helped Kaguya kill all the other messengers instead. To ensure that the earthlings who lived with Kaguya would remain silent, she bribed them with the Hourai Elixir. The elixir had the power to make people immortal. None of those earthlings consumed the elixir, however, and died shortly afterwards.

>It was later discovered that they were murdered.
They don't want to drink her shitty elixir so she kills them? What the fuck is her problem? Oh yeah, I forgot to include that she killed the lunar messengers she was with as well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41588260
The term religion could also be relative I would say and it could even refer to any believe system(even if based on reality) , but I guess here we are talking about stubborn believe without any proof.

>People will cite the CONCLUSIONS
This seems like an easy way to mess with people who pretend to be scientific smartasses. Since as you say people will most likely just think tl;dr with any study and skip to the conclusion at best if they even check sources.

> but denying the actual measurement is where you're denying something that's indistinguishable from reality,
I would say that the measurements could be wrong in few cases, like some external factor influencing that wasn't taken into account, unless you consider that rather a flaw in methodology.

>A mature perspective is one that can handle several questions from an intelligent opposing perspective without breaking down assuming malice or stupidity from the other perspective.
I guess that's what people lack when they ask stuff like "Why would anyone do/think x?" but rather than wanting an explanation they seek affirmation of x being something weird and unreasonable. Like deliberate incomprehension and not even trying to change their point of view.
But hey maybe me thinking that is exactly me not able to handle their perspective...


This post reminded me of a pic that said something like:
-Scientist: "studies are useless if taken out of context"
-Article: "scientist said their studies are useless"

I also draw conclusions too soon to be fair, although right know i kinda gave up and just avoid discussion and just try to go on which might not be the best idea.
Anyways nice post. It's good to see people caring more about the why than what result comes out.

Things like this are exactly what make me hard to believe that youkai going extinct is kinda weird, but I guess that humans with magic could have gone full doomguy on youkai and become so good at exterminating that non-exterminators would never meet any youkai and thus when the exterminators were mostly considered to be senile or died out no one was left to believe in youkai so they became fiction once again.... or I could just say that it is because if not there would be no story of Gensoukyou to tell.
Maybe I should spend more time thinking of real problems that I could physically solve for myself tho but it's fun to "fill plot holes" or whatever you call it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41586715
I guess you're right there, wonder if youkai going out would actually help human society if they get a common enemy.
>>41588670
>They don't want to drink her shitty elixir so she kills them?
Her profile seems more to imply that she bribed them with the promise of the elixir but just ended up murdering them.
>>41587870
What is even Makai? I mean what did even inspire ZUN to have demons and hell separated?
I thought that maybe it is inspired by the asura realm from Buddhism but honestly I don't know much about Buddhism nor if Makai is really something specific in some Japanese myth or Japanese fiction in general.

[Anonymous No.]

From the EoSD Prologue:
>At the rate it was moving, the mist would reach past the shrine and descend to where humans lived.
>[...]
>The lake was entirely covered by the mysterious mist.
>This mysterious energy was so strong that a normal human would only survive for about 30 minutes, but less ordinary humans too would have about thirty minutes.
So Remilia's mist would have actually killed everyone in the human village if Reimu and Marisa didn't go stop her? What the fuck? And she just got a slap on the wrist for it?

And Remilia released this highly lethal mist.... for what? So she didn't have to carry an umbrella around? Killing hundreds, if not thousands, just to remove an extremely small inconvenience from your daily life... yup, she's a youkai alright.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41590574
In PMiSS, it's strongly implied that the mist DID reach the village, which just resulted in people staying indoors.

>この霧は吸うだけで気分が悪くなり、人間達は数日間に渡って、人里どころか家からもまともに出られなくなったのである。
>>Just inhaling this mist made them feel sick, and for several days, humans were unable to leave their homes, let alone their human village.

People weren't going to just start dropping dead directly from the mist; the mist set in such that people could go inside & avoid it. In BAiJR, it's also pointed out that the mist had irregular density, with light being completely blocked out in the areas with the heaviest concentration, where SDM is. It follows that the area around the Human Village had mist that was less intense. Remilia did still have to cut it out, though, since it was a clear disturbance.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41590574
She is a literal Devil.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41589980
>What is even Makai? I mean what did even inspire ZUN to have demons and hell separated?
I guess he wanted Western demons but also an Eastern style afterlife.
>>41590574
>At the rate it was moving, the mist would reach past the shrine and descend to where humans lived
Actually that was >implying it would drift out of Gensokyo, since the barrier wasn't a thing ZUN came up with yet, and drag in outside human attention.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41572999
Basically, youkai in Gensokyo, who have some intelligence, don't look that scary, but if you make them angry or seriously startle them, you'll end up in a terrible situation.
Low intelligence and ugly appearance.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41596237
The fairies can't remember jack shit, and neither can Wriggle or Mystia or Rumia. They're not smart enough to have this consensus to always take the form of a girl in order to put people's guard down (especially since all the youkai keep their girl from even when there's no one around). If they could do it, they might do so because other people do it.

However, Mystia and Rumia both use their powers to hide that they look like young girls, in order to make them seem scarier than they are. That's the opposite of this THEORY that they have monstrous true forms and are concealing it by looking like girls. Also, Rumia's bow is supposed to be a talisman that hides some secret about her, which says that the bow is certainly there and not a transformation but also that she could still have an unrevealed true form if the bow comes off.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41596375
Have you heard of aggressive mimicry?
Even animal predators know how to fool their prey into a sense of security
So do youkai, no matter the intelligence/maturity

[Anonymous No.]

>>41596508
Aggressive mimicry is done by evolution causing predators to look non-threatening to the prey, not by animals just shapeshifting, unless it's the octopus, which is smart and has that specific ability.

In any case, that still makes it a theory. They wouldn't need to hide their girl forms if their girl forms weren't their true forms. They would just use their true forms instead of concealing themselves transforming into girls and then concealing THAT using another technique.

[Anonymous No.]

canon: actual idiots that admit to being too lazy to hunt humans and are referenced by zun to be otherwise ordinary girls that do things like run a grilled food stand

you lot arguing: "how do I make this as grim and unfun as possible"

[Anonymous No.]

>>41597395
>cutesokyofag
You have to go back to your coomer waifu corner, these threads aren't compatible with your delusions, sorry

[Anonymous No.]

>>41597394
>They wouldn't need to hide their girl forms
That's where you're wrong
They DO need to use their cute girl form most of time, if not to make coexisting/interacting with villagers more feasible and peaceful, atleast in terms of business

Also you have to stop being narrow-minded and look it at from their perspective, wouldn't you find it funny that your meaty prey wanted to fuck you because you took on a cute girl form that resembles the prey in a hot way? It'd amuse me all the day

[Anonymous No.]

>>41597540
Cutesokyofag is right you know, aside from a handful of maneaters most other "youkai" from inaba, to spirits, and even tengu don't eat humans and have no desire to attack them.
Only a couple like Rumia or mob youkai care to eat humans at all and even then they're lazy about it since food of other kinds is easier to get and doesn't make shrine maidens mad at you

[Anonymous No.]

>>41597561
Looking at it from their perspective, they'd have no reason to spend any energy looking like girls whenever there's no one else around or when they're only among one another, like in Tengu society. The only real evidence of any of that occurring is the existence of half-youkai, which just further cements the case that the girls are actually girls who can go so far as to have children with humans.

The canon also doesn't give any implied nor explicit sexual tension inherent to them looking like girls; it's more narrow-minded to think that everyone else would come to that thought just because YOU think like that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41596237
Flandre with hyperrealistic eyes will forever stay in my head

[Anonymous No.]

>>41597795
Hyperrealistic? Nah, more like surrealistic

[Anonymous No.]

>>41597540
>these threads aren't compatible with canon, sorry
Weird post but okay.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41597395
Death
To
Youkai

[Anonymous No.]

>>41583611
>>A God
>Being that survives from the faith or fear from humans
If they survive from the fear of humans they're a youkai. Faith = gods, fear = youkai.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41598438
You forget that youkai survive off lust too
There's a reason behind their cute girl appearance and the procreation of half-youkai

[Anonymous No.]

>>41598453
Only certain Youkai i'd imagine but even then I can't imagine a single youkai that feasibly would.

[Anonymous No.]

saving the lore thread

[Anonymous No.]

>>41597795
>Flandre with hyperrealistic eyes
sounds like an AI prompt

[Anonymous No.]

>>41598453
As far as we know there's only one half youkai(wonder if sterile tho), so that is unlikely.
Maybe youkai having a human form is because they are going back to their original form if we can trust Kaguya in IN saying that lunatians/the moon transformed some humans of earth into Youkai, making youkai look more like what they were before instead of looking like the monsters in tales.
Youkai having a human form makes little sense if they wan't to be feared by humans unless they want humans to start accusing other humans of being youkai or want to lure other humans(probably lost outsiders who approach what they believe is a human to ask for help/directions).
As far as I know it has never been mentioned that human form had any advantage to youkai like hands to manage tools being more magic efficient or whatever.

>>41597795
I would say they look like cat eyes when they are about to get their prey, which is fitting for a vampire.

>>41559111
>MS Makai did have a little bit of Dante's Inferno in it
Just know I realize that Judas kiss plays in the frozen lake. Nice reference I have to say.

Also I have to ask how do youkai and stuff work in the outside world with urban legends and such? I haven't played ULiL, put I suppose that there must be something there about this even though only one stage is in the outside world(I think).

[Anonymous No.]

>>41596237
Devils are a scary youkai species

[Anonymous No.]

Personally, I think it's a solipsist thing. Everything is told subjectively and vaguely enough that you can interpret it however you please.

All the supernatural shit stems from what people think of feel which means people can imagine it however the fuck they want/feel like. If I believe there is a youkai that eats my leftovers at exactly 3 am, there is a youkai that eats my leftovers at exactly 3 am. If I don't believe there is a youkai that eats my leftovers at exactly 3 am, then there isn't a youkai that eats my leftovers at exactly 3 am.

If I'm scared that slendercuck will fuck my ass in my sleep, then slendercuck will fuck my ass in my sleep. If I get over it, then there is no slendercuck that will fuck my ass in my sleep.

It's basically the ultimate sandbox, except sprinkle some vague contradictory patterns to confuse people into thinking there's anything objective.

[Anonymous No.]

I feel like lore discussions are severely hampered by the lack of knowledge of events in the endings. PC-98 lore is so wider than people think but so many content is locked behind the endings. I wish more people would play games like PoDD, the endings are great.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41606800
PoDD's endings have the power of self-retconning, since Yumemi seems to catch herself in a time loop with the whole "history repeats itself" line in her ending, but each ending does have a little extra something that can be gained.

>Reimu's ending
I don't think the wiki mentions that they couldn't figure out how Ruukoto was powered, so it sort of ruins the joke by just outright pointing out the one giveaway about her power source. Reimu seems to only try using her to sweep outdoors, which seems like a sisyphean task, but it does become something Reimu is known to do...

>Marisa's ending
Yumemi was willing to prostitute herself before pimping out Chiyuri.

>Ellen
Getting a "super-successful" fluffy magic store might be tied to its location...

>Kotohime
She mentions that there are apparently no criminals in Gensokyo (or that none make it to her prison or that she's just crap at finding them).

>Kana
This shows that she's bound to her haunting site, which can be moved with occult magic (which Yumemi is actually able to perform??), but also that Reimu has the specific power of exorcism, which I don't think is explicitly mentioned again until PMiSS.

>Rikako
This ending has interesting implications, since scientific progress is made off the back of a science book made for 5th graders. If such a thing happened in CoLA

>Chiyuri
Parallel police. Also, this does confirm that they weren't just from a future location, but from an entirely parallel universe, which they're not supposed to do. I also don't think it's ever actually officially acknowledged that the "Dim." stands for "Dimensional" in the title. It's always abbreviated, even when it doesn't have to be!

>Yumemi
In spite of the Christian cross symbology in her attacks, there's a lot of doubt that she actually has any Christian beliefs. However, her ending does make it apparent that she holds religion in pretty high regard, in spite of the academy thinking otherwise.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
So why do we see a lot of psudeo biblical undertones in the pc98 era
But we see a lot less of that stuff and almost an absence of judeo christian undertones in the windows era?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41608672
Because foreign things are cool. ZUN really likes SMT and foreign religion is cool so he put a lot of it into his games. Simple as that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41608672
Same reason for EVA doing it, it was cool. Notice how none of the characters actually commit to anything western wise

[Anonymous No.]

>>41608672
ZUN mentions a few times in the earlier games' documentation that he was creating Touhou with a sense of irony, adding Western elements to an "Eastern" project. This is still apparent in EoSD, which has a Western vampire in a Western mansion being gatekept by a Chinese guard for double irony, after Rumia explicitly mentions that her pose is in reference to a saint being crucified. It was just his personal taste for several years.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
How big is Gensokyo, roughly speaking?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41598453
I want to ejaculate inside youkai panties

[Anonymous No.]

>>41609895
about three fiddy

[Anonymous No.]

>>41609895
A better question would be, "How big are the other worlds that aren't the Outside World?"
Well, to start with, Gensokyo is considerably small, no larger than 10 km square atleast, it's landlocked and has no seas, it's even said that travelling from the hakurei shrine, located on the border, to the human village takes roughly only 2 hours, it's not much.
How big is Senkai? Perhaps it's most likely small, perhaps not, it's a world for hermits so it's suitably spacious atleast
How big is Heaven? So far we haven't seen much of what heaven look like apart from giant rocks and hills in the sky, so it's probably small, atleast bhava-agra is small
How big is the Underworld? Probably large and spacious, but I wouldn't say it's tremendously gigantic, it's atleast large enough for a bridge, for a sizeable population of Oni to inhabit and a palace located near the mantle
How big is the Lunar Capital? Likely larger than Gensokyo due to the cities and skyscrapers within it, along with advanced technologies needing to be housed, I have no doubt that it's big, but it's however smaller than Earth/The Outside World
How big is Makai? This is one of the few realms that I'd give a solid enough response that it's larger than Earth, the landscape is extremely large, distanced, unearthly and separated, with lakes of blood, strange environment, etc
How big is Hell? Very, very big, to say the least, in fact there are several hells, but Hecatia says that they are all close enough make up one Hell, considering the Ministry of Right and Wrong relentless administering the many souls that fall down there, along with the judgement, it's large enough that it needs a complex bureaucracy to function, despite the general chaos, according to Maribel in one of her expeditions, she has calculated that the average distance of hell horizontally is around 150 000 km², which is far bigger than Jupiter

All in all, gensokyo is smoll

[Anonymous No.]

>>41609965
>How big is the Lunar Capital? Likely larger than Gensokyo
Lunar Capital is smaller than Gensokyo. See >>41560667

[Anonymous No.]

>>41609965
Many of these sizes are indeterminate, and they'll probably remain so in order to allow for as much space as is needed for future writing.

>>41609895
Significant information includes geographical features and travel times, though the latter is typically going to be adulterated by the varying length of danmaku battles.

Probably the most notable feature would be the Youkai Mountain, which is going to have a significant geographical area, being based on Mount Yatsugatake in southeast Nagano, Japan, stated in mythology to have been ripped down to create the real-world Yatsugatake mountain range and to have been taller than Mount Fuji before that ripping-down occurred (with its original form now being the Youkai mountain). With the Youkai Mountain being comparable to Mount Fuji, its geographical area must also be comparable (~20000 ha, or about the same area as a 14-by-14-km space).

Several locations, including geographically significant ones like the Forest of Magic, the Misty Lake, the Human Village in an apparently fertile valley, the Hill of the Nameless, the Bamboo Forest of the Lost, and the Youkai Tanuki Forest with a flat plains area where the fighting happens, are all places outside of the Youkai Mountain. There also seem to be other nameless hills or even mountains in many of the landscape shots in official print works and (especially fighting) game backgrounds & endings. In fact, Yuuka's Garden of the Sun is stated to be behind a mountain from the human village but still in the heart of Gensokyo.

All of this does add up to Gensokyo being small as a world but still on the order of a couple tens to a few tens of km across (over 20 by 20 km or 400 km², which is still significantly smaller than the metropolitan area of many proper cities, or about 1/38th the size of Nagoya's metropolitan area). However, Gensokyo seems to be largely wilderness until stated otherwise. It could even be an expanding pocket dimension, which is how other locations can arrive from the outside world.

For now, I'd just settle on it being the area around a Fuji-sized mountain with a mess of foothills, all of which would take a few hours to travel across by foot. If you've ever been hiking up a mountain trail, think of how long that took, and that'll give you a decent fraction of the walking distance across Gensokyo.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41609895
>>41609965
according to WaHH like the above anon points out gensokyo is as big as it needs to be, you can keep flying in any direction and more landscape will present itself allowing for infinite expansion perhaps, but when you head back you'll wind up right where you started in no time. Meaning that ZUN handwaved it and just said lamo, lol even

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

Flandre's wings always have 8 crystals each but only 7 colors. There are two other items nearby in the series that can be associated with 7 colors, those being the 7-color-jeweled branches of Hourai and the 7-colored light from Alice Margatroid's grimoire (mentioned in SaBND chapter 6 and a namesake for her "seven-colored puppeteer" title).

These items were in the 6th, 7th, and 8th mainline games. Might they have been intended to be related? Could they revealed to be related in the future?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41610714
Can't believe the sages put procedurally generated landscapes when you get out of bounds.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
>Is Shinki really Lucifer?
Nobody knows and very little care
>Kaguya is Chang'e
no
>Mungenkan was the original hell
I doubt there is a original hell, unless ZUN goes as it being the hell from the oldest religions
>Touhou was originally a Fanfiction
As much as anything uses ideas from anything else.
>Gensokyo is a fascist society
Less than current society, its mostly based on power as thats what youkai like.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560667
Thats actually a very nice theory

[Anonymous No.]

>>41618189
Flan's wings look kiiiinda like udonge branches blooming, but that would be very weird. Honestly a vampire that's weak to both sun and rain having rainbow colored wings is pretty ironic and knowing ZUN there's probably no more explanation to her wings than his sense of irony like other stuff in EoSD>>41608768.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41608672
Because YHWH is OP, just look at SMT, hell, he is probably even more OP in 2hu because of how faith works.
We may get something christian eventually, we did get Hecate after all and thats quite western.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41618372
If we were to get anything christain it'd likely come in the form of a named angel or something although personally i'd enjoy a cute priestess or nun more

[Anonymous No.]

>>41618383
The majority of the named angels come more from the old testament/jew faith if i remember correctly.
And i'm not sure if there is a named female angel, maybe he do with someone like Lilith or the whore of babylon

[Anonymous No.]

>>41618419
I won't get into the intricacies of the old testament = jew faith but there was at least one named angel(whos name escapes me at the moment) that was described as feminine. Although Lilith could be used she has a long history of other pre YHWH religions as like most religions old gods and figures were converted to demons and Christianity is no exception to the rule of such adaption.
Hence I'd prefer not to tread on christian canon and have a priestess or perhaps nun venture to gensokyo to spread the faith, it'd be much cuter if the nuhu in question wasn't very powerful. Plus, it'd be cuter in her interactions with Rumia since Rumia is known to emulate the saints.
Heres a rare crossover featuring Hijiri

[Anonymous No.]

>>41618452
Maybe some missionary could have got lost enough to reach gensokyo.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41618452
Jophiel is the only angel referred as female iirc, but that is of the "non canonical" angels...

[Anonymous No.]

>>41619639
Just make Gabriel female. It's a tradition at this point.

[Anonymous No.]

The problem with Christianity or every abrahamic religion is that it will be a Game Changer in the balance of power at such a scale that it will Reboot the whole Setting.
>there will be Friction initialy with the Yama, because she have no autority to judge them.

>the road of reconsideration will be a Heavely Contested Zone and not in the danmaku way, because they know that losing a newly revitalized Will-to-live
human here means it will be Dinner for a youkai later.

>there definitely will be initial Conflict with the SDM as the Christians at best want to force remilia to explain if she decisively murder the outsiders that she feed on,
and will demand Humane threatment (Sedating, no more than 500ML of blood for persons plus and/or 60 days of rest, safe transport to the hakurei shrine so they can be
given the option if they want to return to the outside world, or returning them in a sleep state)

>then there is the question of, because of their Theleological and Epistemic View of the universe, they problably will be the most Magic-Disrupting/Negating
of the factions.
so yeah, if we are optimist and concede that this things could be negotiated with the sages, they probably will be pacified for a time being

[Anonymous No.]

>>41621272
> they problably will be the most Magic-Disrupting/Negating
Find this kinda funny considering satanist believe that God is just a fake construct made to steal spirituality from humans and make humans easy to control. But I guess that would make God a youkai in the touhou setting... Although I suppose that ZUN won't at anything about abrahamic religions except maybe a small reference here and there.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41623469
>God is just a fake construct made to steal spirituality from humans.
which is even more funny when the satanist aknowledge implicity that their master got defeated by a social construct.

people forget that by touhou standards ("Gods need faith"), Abrahamic religions should not exist. Just one dude Moises with his alien god in egypt, could not have the sufficient Faith to send the plagues and Dab in the whole Pantheon backed by the state, nor one single Angel of death take all the fistborn in egypt.
an yet, christianity is referenced.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41621272
>>41623469
If anything, such a being would've already been surrounded by a lot of misconceptions and hearsay, like a lot of the canonical beings and locations are. This being may even be synonymous with the Dragon, which is something you never ever want to see appear in the series, since that has a fair likelihood of marking the end of Gensokyo. The story of the Dragon does have a flood myth associated, which itself has a lot of real-world incarnations like the Epic of Gilgamesh, manvantara-sandhya, and the Bible's Genesis story of Noah's Ark. One supreme deity with many interpretations is already a fair enough stand-in for monotheism and universal consciousnesses in different real-world religions.

Any Western priests of this supreme deity would be both uncomfortable for the other residents (as it would be hailing the end times and disrespecting the lesser gods) and at odds with any other priests, who would have their own interpretations. A Western interpretation would see the Dragon statue especially targeted as a symbol of idolatry, as people do worship at the statue to hopefully keep the Dragon satisfied. If anything happened to the statue through the influence of such a priest, their beliefs would probably come to be seen as a genuine threat and banished from existing in the Human Village and therefore all of Gensokyo.

It would either have to remain a very minor faction or remain as a belief that's hidden until the events of Gensokyo convince them that there's something else more immediate out there that they should probably be more concerned with.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41623980
thats a good point, i didn't considered, but the problem of association of "The Dragon= YHWH"
is that the dragon is not a noncontingent being, or a first mover. like the western theologians will point out.
gensokyo is not in a warring state like the sengoku period, so we can't assert for sure that there will be religious sabotage in the beginning, also there is the fact that, even if worship of the statue(Latria) is idolatry, both catholics and orthodox (unlike the muslim and protestants) consider iconoclast heresy, so that situation have to be tackle in a diplomatic manner

[Anonymous No.]

>>41623914
>their master got defeated by a social construct.
lol, good point. got any funny lines like that but for gnosticism?

>people forget that by touhou standards ("Gods need faith"), Abrahamic religions should not exist.
Actually any religion were gods create the world would not exist which I believe are all.
If in touhou gods need faith to exist I wonder how the creation of the world happened because iirc in touhou gods created the world as usual in such a setting.
Unless the gods that made earth work on different rules or got weakened or something when creating the world it's hard to believe that their lives depend on humans.
They could also just be lying about that point knowing touhou.

But I also thought, how is Heca so strong? I mean does power scale really fast with followers or she manages to get faith form the dead.
Also considering how gods work in touhou how is Okina a "secret god"?

>>41618189
I thought that 7 colored grimoire might be related to Patchy since she uses 5 elements + sun and moon for her magic, but i don't remember if Pathy or Alice have ever talked about each others magic in depth.
In mystic square she only used 5 colored attacks from the grimoire though: red, blue, purple, green and yellow.

>>41615486
What's the manga?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41627019
>Also considering how gods work in touhou how is Okina a "secret god"?
Who knows man. How is Chimata a god at all seeing as she has no worshipers?
>As an ichigami, Chimata is sustained by faith like any other type of god. The mere act of buying or selling does not generate faith for her; it has to be a ritualized exchange which honors the traditions of Japanese temporary special marketplaces. The lack of such events and the subsequent loss of faith greatly weakened Chimata.
She seems to be able to derive faith just from people doing the usual market rituals, even if those rituals aren't done with specifically her in mind. Maybe Okina is similar?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41624216
>the problem of association of "The Dragon= YHWH" is that the dragon is not a noncontingent being, or a first mover
That's not really a problem here. The denizens of Gensokyo don't seem to know nor emphasize whether the Dragon is eternal. If someone came out declaring that the supreme deity set all things in motion, then there'd still be no contradictions.

There probably wouldn't be religious sabotage, more because modern westerners do tolerate a plurality of beliefs. However, it also doesn't call for any particular solutions, as religions that are already in Gensokyo don't seem to hold much power anyway. The way things work is that people believing in the existence of things might give those things power, but it does not guarantee that they'll receive anything in return, nor does it assert that that being will even show up. The people in Gensokyo have all sorts of misconceptions about one another; it doesn't make the people conformant to those conceptions, nor does it make the people themselves more or less real.

A Western priest can speak of their deity, then everyone around them can just assume they're talking about the Dragon, just as there are Buddhists in real life who conceptualize this deity as the universal conscious that embodies one-ness with the universe that represents the highest level of enlightenment. Here, it's just the Dragon who is the highest being.

[Anonymous No.]

saving the lore thread.

again

[Anonymous No.]

"Belief shapes reality" makes no sense. Science as a whole relies on objective reality not shaped on human belief. For example, no one would have ever started believing in plate tectonics & continental drift (and initially, no one did; it's maker was laughed out of the scientific community and the theory wasn't commonly accepted for over 30 years after his death) unless there was evidence. By a "belief shapes reality" mindset, this evidence should have never surfaced since it just straight up didn't exist (the world worked exactly as most believed it to work) because such evidence would only surface if plate tectonics did happen regardless of what we believed. So why does Tenshi claim that earthquakes are actually caused by giant oarfish underground? Why does Rinnosuke claim that the shell fossils Reimu found are actually dragon bones?

Another example would be the invention of the airplane by the Wright brothers. Despite almost everyone, including the brothers themselves, having doubts that it would work, it still worked despite everyone believing otherwise. If everything happened only according to popular belief, the Wright brothers' airplane should have never flown. The fact that it did hints to objective rules that govern the world that aren't dependent on or affected by belief.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41618195
I think it just loops in on itself like a complete world, or else space just turns in on itself when you try to move in any direction that leads outward, like in a black hole.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41636397
What if I backwards long jump on the stairs leading to the shrine? Could I bypass the barrier that way?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41635385
As I see it there is a base reality and belief only alters the reality to a certain point, kinda similar to every setting with magic were magic alters reality but the basic rules of reality still apply. Believe doesn't seem to completely overwrite reality since then any megalomaniac would probably get godly powers extremely fast.

How far belief and magic alter reality isn't specified since like most fictional works they don't explain much of how stuff works.

There is the "quantum physics take" of the believed thing to exist but once it gets measured it vanishes.
You could also say that x character lies or maybe both things exist but the more fantastic one only exists in worlds like Gensokyo, Hell, Makai.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41636492
If you do it fast enough to move 4 alternate shrines over, that's how you wind up in grimsokyo

[Anonymous No.]

>>41636492
ask reimu about it

[Anonymous No.]

>>41637562
That's not a BLJ, anon.
That's just Reimu being a dumbass even though I told her about the stairs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41637571
Which direction is she falling

[Anonymous No.]

>>41637576
Down the stairs, obviously.
You can't fall upwards.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41637584
which way is down

[Anonymous No.]

>>41637584
Proof?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41635385
Isn’t that explained already
Belief shapes the unknowns of reality
Once the reason for certain things is found the youkai/gods/whatever lose power
Kyouko is an example of this

[Anonymous No.]

>>41621272
Christians and Muslims would discriminate against youkai, believing them to be demons/jinns, and especially they would discriminate against devils (Remi, Flan, Koakuma) considering their association with Lucifer

[Anonymous No.]

>>41567419
>>Marisa is a Sociopath
This one is true

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
What's the goal of the touhou project?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41647775
To increase the creativity of the population.
>>41560648
>Yuyuko
I assumed she just pretended to eat since ghost tend to keep doing what they did in life.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41560648
Did you not see the poop corner in one of the PCB Marisa endings?

[Anonymous No.]

g

[Anonymous No.]

>>41647775
中出しされる快感

[Anonymous No.]

>>41647775
Communism. ZUN hates capitalism.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41656620
Why does he hate capitalism so much?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41656620
>>41656621
>lecturing a shopkeeper about the value of money
Kinda funny honestly

[Lovey Dovey No.]

>>41656620
>>41656621
He's not wrong, fiat currency is a meme made up by assholes

[Anonymous No.]

Eirin is apparently unable to lift a jar without help.
Does this mean she technically isn't a Lunarian anymore? Lunarians get hermit-like abilities and super strength is one of those abilities. I suppose it makes sense, drinking the Hourai Elixir "taints" you with the impurity of death somehow, and Lunarians need to maintain their purity to be Lunarian.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559971
The Whale

[Anonymous No.]

>>41569412
Are you talking about that one Ufotable 2hu animation?

[Anonymous No.]

How often is “The Dragon” actually referenced within touhou? I remember someone saying the dragon being the supreme god of the setting was wiki fanfic that too many people believed. Ive played all the games and read all the manga and most print works and all the stories for the music cds and I dont remember more than one or two passing references to a dragon god and none of them made it seem like a supreme ruler. If I remember right it was more of a weather deity.

But my memory is kind of retarded and there’s a couple print works I havent gotten to yet so maybe I’m just missing something. But the importance theorists ascribe to the dragon seems incongruent with canon.

Can anyone point me to where the dragon is described as or hinted at being a supreme god within canon?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41657015
Eirin is technically a god, i wonder if the lack of faith is making even her weak.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41663246
If i remember correctly the dragon had to be asked for gensokyo to exist, he "allowed so" or something.

And him being a supreme god may be because in eastern myth dragon are top tier.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41663365
>If i remember correctly the dragon had to be asked for gensokyo to exist, he "allowed so" or something
You dont happen to remember where you read that do you? I’m an autist about checking my sources.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41663406
Not him but check PMiSS, it’s before Kappa in the bestiary

[Anonymous No.]

>>41656620
It doesn't once say that he hates capitalism. He ties it into something more, as Magical Astronomy is all about a couple college students being excited about the march of progress only to find that tickets to the moon are expensive enough that they consider getting part-time jobs.

The part highlighted is illustrating that they live in a time after Japan's present-day real-world population crisis, something that's expected to happen to other countries as population growth slows in other locales (as it did before modern medicine and has been doing again since the 80s). He doesn't dwell on it, and he even seems optimistic about the post-crisis era.

The "final stage" is clearly meant to just mean that after that, things in that world have stabilized for some indefinite amount of time. There ARE complaints in that very work about there not being enough left to discover, that there are "hardly any mysteries left on Earth." It's not uncommon for "end of history" narratives to just be about society living happily ever after in a stable state for the rest of time. It's a world built with the message that a lot of things will happen in the world, but after each crisis is over, everything is going to be okay.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41662298
Yes, but I think it wasn't really official, at least from touhou's side.
>>41657015
Give the old lady a break she is like millions of years old! I guess her strength is about the one of 2 fairies.
Makes me wonder if the Horai elixir overwrites completely what you were before or if some traits remain.
>>41665233
Guess life kinda gets dull once reached that point, but still a comfy life I would say.

[Nostalgia ii No.]

>>41657015
>>41665589
both of you don't understand, she's not weak. Its just that she doesn't like carrying heavy thing and that kind of manual labor so she turfs it to others

[Anonymous No.]

>>41657015
It's stated in Eirin's Imperishable Night profile that she intentionally suppresses her power as a way of respecting Kaguya, since Eirin's actual full power is greater than Kaguya's.

>本当は、輝夜より圧倒的に力を持つ。だが常に輝夜以上にならない様に力をセーブしているらしい。

[Anonymous No.]

>>41609895
pretty big

[Anonymous No.]

>>41651340
>>41631038
>>41599856
Thanksfully

t. OP

[Anonymous No.]

>>41627920
>pic
There's Kasen really far away down there near the bottom, Yukari sort of in the middle, and Okina in the top right, but in the bottom second from the right, that looks like Shinki, which I guess makes sense if she can create a world.

There are eight of them pictured, though, and I thought it said at some point that there were only seven sages? I know it's just fanart, but I can't remember where I got the idea of there being seven of them, or if I'm just imagining it. Were there seven, or do we even know?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41675950
They arent all sages, one is tewi, one other is lord tenma, one may be the Hakurei of the time, on danbooru there is the names of all characters if i remember correctly.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41677825
https://danbooru.donmai.us/posts/208973
Not all are tagged thought, wonder what the ones at the right are supposed to be based on, that is if they are based on any myth or something instead of being just random OCs.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41663246
CoLA chapter 19 and PMiSS page 96 outright declare that the Dragon is the supreme god of Gensokyo.

The association with weather comes from in its ties to the water cycle ("the sky, the sea, and the rain") and how its powers of creation are tied to the Dragon causing dissonance within this cycle and therefore introducing the ability for things to exist outside of the water cycle. It's also stated that the Dragon has the power to destroy Gensokyo with a supernatural flood, something that was prevented by the Youkai sages, who promised on their very lives that there would be peace.

[Anonymous No.]

Greater Heal

[Anonymous No.]

>>41688240
Greater Thread Resurrection

[Anonymous No.]

How many times do we actually see Remilia using her ability to manipulate fate?

I know that in the prologue to PCB, Remilia states, in spite of winter showing no sign of letting up, that spring will return a day after Sakuya leaves the mansion, which is followed by Sakuya ingame commenting that it takes her a day to get to Hakugyokurou to solve the incident. Are there other instances where Remilia is exhibiting some knowledge that she could only have due to her power?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41691587
She ostensibly used it when the meteorite fell in Flandre's Bunbunmaru article, but it could also just be that girl's typical chuuni larping.
It's hard to say how strong Remilia's power really is and what it can actually do when it was never explored in any meaningful way. Early Touhou powers are weird in general, since ZUN liked to give characters really vague and extremely broken powers back then, with later power sets being much more defined and restrained.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41692416
The BAiJR story at least has a little hole in it where it can be explained as something Patchouli did, or that the meteor was an event related to the one that fell at the Hakurei shrine in EaLND chapter 4 and later appeared in CoLA chapter 18, or that it was an otherwise predictable event like what was suggested in her final line in that part of BAiJR where she says it's from the periodic meteor shower known as the Leonids. The PCB thing is something she certainly could not have received counsel on from Patchy, though the BAiJR event does still count as Remi's power, as far as we do actually know..

[Anonymous No.]

>>41669108
thanks for the map

[Anonymous No.]

>>41698479
maps are always speculative

[Anonymous No.]

>>41663246
iirc theres also an entity called ryujin in japanese mythos so theres often debates in the english fandom if the dragon is referring to that one or a general dragon species (both are referenced in lore which doesnt help)
i dont remember how the other language wikis translate it and honestly outside of rinnosukes self masturbatory explanations and akyuus word which is proved to be easily influenced by others, i doubt it's really that important in the long run

[Anonymous No.]

>>41700809
In the adjoining manga to PMiSS, Yukari confirms the chronicle's content before release. If nothing else, the Dragon is at least a story that's being maintained with the sages to scare all of Gensokyo's beings into keeping their world peace in spite of the apparent lawlessness.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41559971
Probably any of them who aren't supposed to look like children, or those who are humans that have aged out of childhood in real time due to the many turnings of the seasons in canon.

For all the memes about Touhou being a bunch of lolis, most of them are actually not. Like, we can just look at the top 30 on the popularity poll to see about what fraction of them are consistently meant look like kids:

Flandre, Youmu, Koishi, Remilia, Satori, Cirno, Rumia, Suwako, Kogasa(, Miko?)

There's some openness to interpretation for a few Touhous, but it is around a third out of the top 30. The other 2/3rds probably have boobs, except for Sakuya.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41707659
Eiki often gets draw loli to contrast with titcow Komachi.
Shion, Kogasa, Kokoro, all kind of depends on the artist.
Tenshi's often drawn flat as a board but not loli, she just has that mesugaki kind of personality I guess.

Patchouli even gets drawn often pretty young in official artbooks despite fanon mostly making her a fat titcow neet.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41619901
This, SMT did it and it's now iconic for that franchise

[Anonymous No.]

Does Youmu ever appear in a work where she's not bullied, or is that just a constant for her all the way through?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41710908
I can't even think of a doujin where she isn't bullied in some way

[Anonymous No.]

>>41608768
I think even Rumia's name is a mistranslation of "Lumia," where ZUN was trying to give her a name that refers to light but wound up Engrishing it.

[Anonymous No.]

I have some more
>How closely related are Sumireko and Renko?
>How far in the future is the "Near Future" where Renko and Maribel live?
>Are outsiders kidnapped and fed to youkai?
>Do all modern technology ceases to work inside Gensokyo?
>If the Lunar Capital is Tsukuyomi's domain, why he didn't face off Junko and Hecatia personally? He's the brother of Amaterasu and Susano-o after all
>Did Sanae had a normal life before moving to Gensokyo?
>Does Marisa hates her parents?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41716089
>>How closely related are Sumireko and Renko?
Unknown. Maybe cousins or something. Maybe not.
>>How far in the future is the "Near Future" where Renko and Maribel live?
I'd say 2050-60s. No real reason for this estimation, just feels about right.
>>Are outsiders kidnapped and fed to youkai?
Yes. See Yukari's PCB profile, and a statement she made to Kasen in WaHH (don't remember specific chapter, sorry), Yukari purposefully causes fluctuations in the barriers to kidnap random outsiders.
>When humans from the outer world wander into Gensokyo, it's all thanks to fluctuations in the boundary caused by Yukari. There is an enchanting element about the phenomenon which people like to call "Spirited Away"; if it is ever discovered that spiriting away is not the work of gods, but the meddling of a youkai girl, the term will lose all of its mystique.
Other sources such as Akyuu say that outsiders are brought by spiritual resonance with shrines and blah blah whatever, but Yukari's profile outright states she's the cause of all outsiders ending up in Gensokyo. Thus, it's not just a natural quirk of the barrier, they're literally kidnapped by youkai.

Outsiders are also kidnapped as part of the Vampire Contract.
>>Do all modern technology ceases to work inside Gensokyo?
I don't know of anything that supports this, so probably no.
>>If the Lunar Capital is Tsukuyomi's domain, why he didn't face off Junko and Hecatia personally? He's the brother of Amaterasu and Susano-o after all
Males showing up to battle is bad, ZUN minimizes male presence in Touhou.
>>Did Sanae had a normal life before moving to Gensokyo?
I don't know much about Sanae or her backstory so I dunno
>>Does Marisa hates her parents?
I recall Rinnosuke mentioning in CoLA at one point that they had a strained relationship? Maybe

[Anonymous No.]

>>41716169
>Maybe cousins or something
>"Sumi it's your cousin, wanna go bowling?"

[Anonymous No.]

>>41716089
>>41716169
>Did Sanae had a normal life before moving to Gensokyo?
She’s a shrine maiden descended from a goddess so I dont know about “normal” life or if she went to school and stuff, but the moriya crew (at the very least kanako, in symposium) have said they’re used to the technology of the outside world and miss having it in gensokyo. Sanae was also a fan of giant robots and presumably mecha anime.

So at the very least, they lived a relatively ‘modern’ life. That’s about all we know.

[Anonymous No.]

x>>41716089
Even though Rinnosuke couldn't get his electronic devices working, there's a panel in CDS that shows Hatate owns a functional PC, so perhaps it's only the tengu (and of course the kappa and Moriyas) that can work modern technologies

[Anonymous No.]

>>41716089
>How closely related are Sumireko and Renko?
fanon likes to say they're grandmother/grandchild and if you think of Sumi as a 10's girl and Renko as a 60's or pre 100's girl it fits
>How far in the future is the "Near Future" where Renko and Maribel live?
they talk of space war on the moon so no earlier then the 50's
>Are outsiders kidnapped and fed to youkai?
Kidnapped? yes. Fed? uncertain
villainous and problematic villagers have situations arranged to get them eaten. You can consider this evil people, people that want to upturn the status quo, progress tech, etc. those are the primary food source. Outsiders are likely brought in for a reason however, whether its for genetic diversity of the village or simple feeding(unlikely) is largely unknown.
>Do all modern technology ceases to work inside Gensokyo?
I think it was WaHH that mentioned that radio waves can't enter the barrier so phones have no signals and internet is right out. but the devices themselves work as long as you have a power source which nobody would except the kappa, I don't remember where but its mentioned that Marisa has a TV in her house although its unlikely it works well but with Kappas? who knows.
>If the Lunar Capital is Tsukuyomi's domain, why he didn't face off Junko and Hecatia personally? He's the brother of Amaterasu and Susano-o after all
no clue
>Did Sanae had a normal life before moving to Gensokyo?
She was likely still a Miko and clearly went to school judging by her level of education. It seems they got transported after she graduated given her visible age. So I suppose it was a normal life as far as a green haired ultra religious girl in a hick part of Japan could lead.
>Does Marisa hates her parents?
No canon works i've seen mention it but considering she lives alone despite her age i'd say they're not on speaking terms at least

[Anonymous No.]

>>41716089
>Do all modern technology ceases to work inside Gensokyo?
Sumisexo literally shows teh Reimers how to use her normiephone.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41716169
>Males showing up to battle is bad, ZUN minimizes male presence in Touhou.
Is Tsukuyomi even confirmed as a male? In touhou iirc there is nothing specifying gender aside from translations calling him "lord" but that's just a translation from -sama.
I also think the gender of Tsukuyomi isn't specified in shintoism either.
Maybe it was because ZUN doesn't like too well known gods in his games to not make it feel to much like megaten( I think he said that in an interview but I can't find it).

[Anonymous No.]

I have a question
Why is Rika always drawn wearing pants, often shorts specifically? The only canon pictures of Rika are her character portraits in SoEW, which only show her head and shirt. This design of very long pigtails, a white shirt and shorts seems to be the default look for her used by fanartists.
I'm pretty sure someone told me the answer to this question already many years ago on /jp/, but I have long since forgotten it and can't seem to find the answer in Warosu. Please help me.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41720827
Maybe a popular artist drew her with Pants and everyone else copyed them?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41720827
Just speculating, I think it's just a tropey outfit of engineer/mechanic type anime girl to wear shorts, it could be a reference to one such character Rika look like or something?

[Anonymous No.]

>>41720827
If you want an in universe answer it would be because skirts and operating heavy machinery is a big no-no.
Then you have the more meta answers like this I guess:
>>/jp/thread/S13338771#p13389425
I mean her sprite is vague as hell and portraits in SoEW barely show anything more than just the face. But I doubt anyone cared about the sprite since I haven't seen her with a cape and stage1 clothing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41720827
Could depend on when & where this started. It at least started before 2010, since the first revision on the wiki that includes the brown pants is from her article on May 8th of that year. There's also a revision note suggesting that fans weren't really making much art of her before then, so that statement is there from a time when there wasn't even an established pattern.

Artists doing this could be in reference to the classic undershirt & shorts for Girl Scout Brownie uniforms. Additionally, there are Japanese kindergarten uniforms that look like this when you remove the blazer, so artists in Japan could've seen the top and completed the outfit.

Looking on old Danbooru art of her, there used to be more of a plurality of styles, between red bellbottoms, military pants (which makes sense for her being a tank operator), and only rarely any type of skirt. There's still some variation in the design of her bottoms, but the consensus is more around those bottoms being brown, which makes sense as a color that can fit both her engineer side and her military side, while also communicating that the shirt may be an undershirt that goes with some sort of matching jacket. It's not a skirt because people who operate heavy machinery, like Rika the tank user, aren't typically envisioned as wearing skirts (downwind from the fact that skirts can get caught in moving parts, which is a safety hazard). This gives us pants or shorts, and artists do still seem to be up in the air about which. Shorts are at least easier to draw with more complicated art styles, though, since there are less clothing folds and no need to outline the form before drawing pants over that form with a whole other set of lines.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41716169
>>Does Marisa hates her parents?
>I recall Rinnosuke mentioning in CoLA at one point that they had a strained relationship? Maybe
I think the Kirisame shop in the human village doesn't deal in magic items, just as it doesn't deal in items from the outside world. Also, she says she can't hear Rinnosuke when he says her father is well, she suggests she might "check out" the cool stuff in the Hiedas' library until Rinnosuke mentions that the Hieda & Kirisame households get along well, she says she doesn't like to think about the past, she insists she won't go back to live with her family, and Rinnosuke made her the Hakkero furnace whenever she left home.

All of this probably adds up to her father not supporting her decision to pursue magic, something that she seems to be really passionate about.

[Anonymous No.]

>>41723242

maybe marisa is a lesbian!

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
A new lore thread is necessary

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
Fascist touhou.
Based

[Anonymous No.]

>>41726329
nah just let it die. lore threads have run their course, all the board should be devoted to waifu threads

[Anonymous No.]

Is Reimu going to die

[Anonymous No.]

>>41728074
The thread is already a general, this is... what, the fourth one? Plus it has even less worth than the forced /vg/ general, with posts being made across both threads and both threads getting made roughly at the same times both originally and when re-made after getting bumped off the board.

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>41728328
This thread happened because the last iteration of that /vg/ thread was being used for lore discussion after the last lore thread bumped off, then when that /vg/ thread was gone, this lore thread was created for that discussion, followed by another /vg/ thread, which is why they were made at roughly the same time. Guess which thread more people moved to, and which thread emptied out.

The /vg/ thread is MOSTLY samefag bump posts, with the only other constant being the puzzles. There's a reason this one's gotten beyond bump limit way before that one, and that's because there have been actual discussions back & forth rather than one person making repeated attempts to circlejerk by themselves.

There have been questions, answers, speculations, connections, and disagreements here, actual discussion. In the /vg/ thread, there are requests (often unanswered), puzzles, the waifufagging that already saturates the board, seemingly zero primary knowledge about the series or its gameplay, people bitching about how pointless that thread is, and samefag OP trying to milk those bitching posts for bumps while trying to act like their thread is the one making more of a contribution to the board than the more dedicated threads & that no one wanting to be in their thread is a personal attack rather than a consequence of their thread being unnecessary. The personal part is that they should've already known it was unnecessary by just lurking more and that they (probably you) only refuse to accept that because it hurts their feelings if you don't give attention to their precious thread.

I refer you to >>41669728

[Anonymous No.]

>>41730897
Sure, but this thread getting to bump limit faster than the other doesn't mean it has a sizable amount of worth let alone as a general. Fangame threads are some of the oldest threads on the board and they haven't been a general for half of its lifetime; because if you want to talk about fangames you just make a thread and others hop in. This thread could have been the same, and to a degree I'll believe you that it still might be able to, but you and I both know the second this one goes off the board there'll be another lore thread within the day.

[Anonymous No.]

not gonna bother reading any of this, but I do wonder how much is glow

[Anonymous No.]

>>41558286
Do Makai demons follow the same rules (existential wise) as youkai?