/lit/ - Literature

Hah! More like c/lit/

I've read some of Plath but there's something I don't really understand. There's some connection between Plath and feminists, correct? I'd been on the lookout for some kind of underlying gender conflict or something, but I couldn't spot anything. Is it that feminists just like her because she had a tough life, and they think they can relate to that because they think women have it tough?

I realise there are some feminists here. I'm an anti-feminist, but I promise this post has nothing to do with that. I knew these awful twins back in secondary school who big into the modern feminist buzzwords and treating women like helpless children to be protected (this was an all-male school, by the way. They might have changed their opinion after more exposure to the opposite sex in uni), and they were always talking about how great Plath is. That's why I'm asking what the relation is between Plath and feminists.

>>6055952
Christ man... Are those LGBT flags? Unless gays are actually discriminated against under law, these trivial issues should really take the backseat and let people actually reform the economy. Looks like left-wing populism to me. God, I'd love to see some true communists coming to power so we could actually witness a country completely FUCK the EU. Would be beautiful.

Also, does anyone else reread lines from a text multiple times if they feel they weren't concentrating when they read it the first time?

This one could be OCD-related, though...

Does everyone do this when reading? Is it realistic that I could teach myself to stop, without listening to some shitty speed-readers tutorial?

>>5894070
Why don't you have a seat right over here...

>>5893366
National socialism wasn't conservative. Hitler radically changed German society. He challenged religious authority and forced a eugenics programme onto the German population. I can see where you might get conservatism in regard to gender roles (men work and go off to die in Russia, women stay at home and raise the children), maybe even conservative in his rejection of Germany's (relatively) democratic new government, but overall I'd argue that he's not a conservative. It's difficult to have a discussion on this as it really comes down to the individual's opinion as to whether or not the conservative policies outweigh the progressive ones.


I'm saying all that when I could also just as easily brush your argument off by saying that the Nazis most certainly were not communists and did not claim to be, making what you've said here irrelevant.

>>5893318
I have never met nor have I ever heard of a communist that doesn't want to uproot social norms and radically change how society functions. It seems incompatible to be both a conservative in relation to a capitalist society, and still be a communist. This would be a communist that for some reason doesn't see why it would be necessary to work towards a socialist society. Again, maybe I've never met someone who honestly claims to be a communist and is hostile towards political or social change within a capitalist society.

>saying you're a communist proves that you're economically retarded
As of yet I haven't heard a legitimate argument against a communist economic system functioning. I'm not going to create arguments for you and proceed to debunk them. It's your job to provide the arguments.

>>5893226
Thanks, buddy. I'll look into that.

>>5892962
I'm in the same boat as you, bud. Except I DON'T support their (radical feminist's) cause. Luckily I haven't been shouted as, but if it's anything similar to the angry feminists I've seen on the internet, you really shouldn't take that. That's awful.

>>5893182
If I'm being honest, I have no idea.

>>5892635
I might actually try /pol/ as they're probably more into countering social justice warriors. I just really doubt they'll take it seriously over there.

>>5892604
At its core, identity politics seems to be the advocacy of viewing the world through a lens of different identities based on a combination of race, sex, gender, sexuality and sometimes weight or disabilities. That's my understanding of it, at least. It follows that the class structure's role in inequality is heavily downplayed in favour of differing privileges ranging from "white privilege" to "male privilege". Identity politics also results in a shift from the labour movement away from major international problems in countries such as Africa to minor issues such as gender or racial representation in the media.

>>5892577
Yeah, ok. I think I'll just leave the thread and come back in an hour or two to see how it turns out.

>>5892581
I'm not sure if you understand what I'm looking for... Did Lacan write anything that could be applicable to a modern analysis of identity politics? I've never been exposed to this sort of stuff. Where should I start with Lacan? Thanks.

>>5892573
You honestly believe a thread with a specific topic of discussion can't get hijacked by infiltrators? Have you never experienced a "threadjacking"?

Does anyone know for sure which Zizek book discusses identity politics? I'm heading into town in a couple of hours.

The content of the discussion has deteriorated since that guy linked the Friedrich Hayek video. Stop hijacking it to debate "libertarianism" vs "statism".

>>5892550
>>5892558
Seriously, I don't know if you guys were arguing in another thread and you decided to bring it here, but please stop it. This is completely off-topic.

>>5892304
>>5892325

You're actually correctly assuming that I need outside sources to legitimise my own views. It's more of an intellectual comfort than an aid. As someone who engages in political discussion regularly, I often feel isolated as all of my coworkers and family, and even some of my close friends, would generally distance themselves from me if I press the issue. I can't have proper discussions except with a few odd people here and there.

I already have my own arguments for and against. Whenever I do have a debate, I crush the opponents arguments without difficulty. It's not about that, though. Much of the discussion surrounding these issues is plagued with emotions, and as such I can still alienate myself even if I word my arguments perfectly.

I know I should probably just not take any of it seriously, but that's impossible for me. And so I'd like some reading from respected authors so that I can at least have some company to reassure me that I'm not going insane.

>>5882893
Why don't you have a seat right over there?

>>5891161
I've seen the film version "Saiyūki".

>>5892256
>I didn't really understand what you were trying to imply that I believe in some Jewish conspiracy or not.

Oh God... that was awful. Sorry about that. I'll rewrite that -

I didn't understand whether you were trying to imply that I believe in some Jewish conspiracy or that was suppose to be someone else talking.

>>5892176
I haven't presented any arguments (discounting the pic, which I got from Googling "identity politics". I chose it because I found it funny), I haven't told you anything about my background or political stance on anything. It obviously annoys me that you call me retarded, but it's simply incorrect call me a "right-winger", not only due to the fact that I'm more "to the left" than anyone in the elected government of my country, but also because you need to know the current makeup of the government of my country to even make a judgement as to how "right" or "left" I am. Right-left politics isn't applicable on an international level and changes every 4 years (or however long a term is in your country).

I didn't really understand what you were trying to imply that I believe in some Jewish conspiracy or not. Please clear that up for me.

And "conservafag"... I'm a communist. Do you believe I'm living in a socialist society and so my brand communism is conservative relative to other, more progressive, communists? Or are you just making baseless assumptions again?

>>5891958
At least tell me WHY I should fuck off...

>>5890814
Social sciences aren't scientific?

Some of you might remember this thread I created a couple of days ago: >>/lit/thread/5880284

I read it all. It generated some interesting discussion but I don't really feel satisfied with the results I got. People turned me onto "Authority and American Usage" by David Foster WIlliams and "at least one of" Zizek's books (possibly "First As Tragedy, Then As Farce"). I might have forgotten others (I read the thread last night), but there definitely wasn't much there.

I'm not condemning anyone for having a discussion rather than the thread being dedicated to providing information for me. I'd like to reopen the discussion, just with a slightly bigger emphasis on the reasons for the thread's creation.

To outline for anyone who doesn't want to click the link, the last thread was aimed at sharing information on critics and general criticism of identity politics. The only modification I am making is an inclusion of the background info telling all that I have created this thread so that I can pick up a few things while Crimbo shopping.

Thanks everyone.

>>5883587
Oh my God... That's fucking brilliant... That's fucking brilliant...

Seriously, that cheered me up after a very rough day. Thank you.

After reading the first few replies, I was worried as to whether this thread would only entail me defending myself from accusations of homophobia, transphobia, etc. It looks like a good few people are now getting in on this and they're not focusing it on me (which is good). Thanks all.

I'm not going to be keeping up with this thread for the next good while so don't expect replies from me. I'd greatly appreciate it if you could continue this thread and I'll be back later to note all the recommendations.