/lit/ - Literature

Tractatus Logico-Philosophus.

The Foundation for Exploration

>>14140897
Nothing by Nietzsche.

Neetch would've given up and become Christian if he could see the present and knew that we'd become a society of Last Men.

For three thousand years in the West, ten thousand years in the East, philosophers have been struggling to find the truth, and not a single philosopher has been able to find it.

“The way of philosophy does not go with truth at all. It is just rational gymnastics. So one philosopher can argue against another philosopher, and they go on arguing for centuries, but they have not come to agreement on a single point. Philosophy is the worst wastage of human intelligence that is possible.

https://www.osho.com/highlights-of-oshos-world/osho-philosophy

>>14140897
Any significant tome that was written by the genius Immanuel Kant

>>14142182
>For three thousand years in the West, ten thousand years in the East, philosophers have been struggling to find the truth, and not a single philosopher has been able to find it.
Excuse me?

>>14142202
Still didn't prove God existed.

>>14142173
The point of this comic falls flat and the only meaning that is conveyed is how fucking stupid most people are. Take note of that old guy's reaction to God being dead. Instead of any profound thought being generated in his retarded little head, he instead bows down to hedonistic society and finds joy in the loss of divine suffering, without embracing the creation of new morals and ideas, he succumbs to basic bitch Greek hedonism because it's easier.

Any behavior you have is consequence of the genetics you have and the chances you have to propagate it

if you are good, ascetic, simple, humble, thrifty, then it means your body knows deep inside that you are worth jack shit so it just provides to others who "really deserve it through nature", everything else is just mental gymnastics to cope with this fact

>>14142219
fuck your morality
death to society

>>14142222
sociopath cope

>>14140897
Fanged Noumena

>>14142226

even god gave me the digits, you just can't compete with the fact, we can rise spiritually above this but it's not through just morality and being good, virtue is sometimes beyond good

>>14142173
How does Christianity solve modern problems?

>>14140897
Nietzsche is absolutely the end game of Philosophy. We need to be working towards the creation of the ubermensch. It amazes me that people still worship, like slaves, old morals.
>>14142225
Yes yes, death to traditional morals and society. I would agree.
>>14142202
Embarrassing post. As >>14142207
said, he never demonstrated God's existence. In fact, no one has. Shocker. If anyone could reply to this post with proof, It would be appreciated.
>>14142222
This type of post has always frustrated me. Placing meaning on propagation of genes without explaining why. It's hilariously immature, emotionally and philosophically.

>>14142202
>Aristotelian
>Christcuck
Is it possible to be more wrong?

>>14142240

>Placing meaning on propagation of genes without explaining why.

Yeah, go ahead and do some semen retention and tell me how your behaviour changes and thus your philosophy will adjust

>>14142234
Nihilism is the root of modern problems. Christianity solves nihilism.

>>14142240
>he never demonstrated God's existence
But he did. Almost 1000 years on no-one has been able to refute even one of Aquinas five ways. It causes immeasurable butthurt to fedora tippers so they try to claim aristotlean metaphysics has somehow been "debunked" by modern science and make themselves look like idiots in the process.

>>14142253

No, catholicism is the source of nihilism, humanism politics like fascism and communism try to solve nihilism, but catholicism is fucking dead and can't answer jack shit about the modern world, they don't even have an answer to the fiat problem or anything really, it's just the spirit closed and stagnant in some rituals who solved a problem before but not today

christianity can solve nihilism but not in the way catholicism does

>>14142253
christianity is a death cult

>>14142173
He says at the beginning of will to power his philosophy is to run its course over the next two centuries. There's still time.

>>14142260
Begome Orthodox

>>14142173
>if Nietzsche was given evidence he was right he'd change his mind

>>14142250
Why would I do that? Self denial that doesn't benefit me is pointless.
>>14142253
You don't know what nihilism is. Read Nietzsche before you criticize. Your whole post reeks of misunderstanding. Please explain how Christianity "solves" nihilism.
>>14142259
He clearly has not. I believe Schopenhaurer has refuted causa prima, for one. And what have our own worthy, honest German professors of philosophy been doing in behalf of their dearly beloved Cosmological Proof, since Kant dealt it the death blow in his Critique of Pure Reason? — they, who prize truth above everything. They were, indeed, at their wits ends, for — as these worthies well know, though they do not say so — causa prima is, just as well as causa sui, a contradictio in adjecto, albeit the former expression is more generally used than the latter. It is besides usually pronounced with a very serious, not to say solemn, air; nay, many people, especially English Reverends, turn up their eyes in a truly edifying way when they impressively and emphatically mention that contradictio in adjecto: the first cause. They know that a first cause is just as inconceivable as the point at which Space ends or the moment when Time first began. For every cause is a change, which necessarily obliges us to ask for the preceding change that brought it about, and so on in infinitum, in infinitum! Even a first state of Matter, from which, as it has ceased to be, all following states could have proceeded, is inconceivable. For if this state had in itself been the cause of the following ones, they must likewise have existed from all eternity, and the actual state existing at the present moment could not have only just now come into being. If, on the other hand, that first state only began to be causal at some given period, something or other must have changed it, for its inactivity to have ceased; but then something must have occurred, some change must have taken place; and this again obliges us to ask for its cause i.e. a change which preceded it; and here we are once more on the causal ladder, up which we are whipped step by step, higher and higher, in infinitum, in infinitum! (These gentlemen will surely not have the face to talk to me of Matter itself arising out of nothing! If so, they will find corollaries at their service further on.) The causal law therefore is not so

>>14142260
>humanism politics like fascism and communism try to solve nihilism
The fuck? Communism is an explicitly materialistic and thus nihilistic system. Humanism is also nihilistic. Nihilism can only be overcome by worldviews that recognize transcendent aspects of reality beyond the material world that are objectively real and have value. Humanism doesn't do this, nor does fascism or communism.

>>14142271
>Why would I do that? Self denial that doesn't benefit me is pointless.

Yeah, you don't know shit, go ahead and keep writing, literally cope, novels > philosophy

>>14142281
Begone, denier of the body.

>>14142270
Nietzsche was an atheist but an honest atheist. He admitted nihilism would give rise to a society of hedonists and materialists. Small souled bugmen. He attempted to provide a way to overcome this with his "overman", but ultimately failed because man doesn't live by philosophy. Only God allows man to overcome nihilism, both transcendent and imminent. Nobody lives by Nietzsche's ideals, even Nietzsche couldn't live by his own ideals. They're pie in the sky nonsense.

>>14142259
The Five Ways:
>prime mover MUST be god
>prime mover MUST be god
>we see things disappearing so everything must disappear by now
>literally just the platonic forms but with god
>things are beneficial for us so that means they were made that way
All btfo by evolution and literally just saying "prove it's God"

>>14142293

you don't even understand how the body even works and you think you can specifically say what is to deny it or to cultivate it, how can you say indulging in fucking cuming and depleting your life essence is ""denying"" your body? your philosophy is pathetic

>>14142307
What do you mean "life essence" lol. Your body spurts out come when you dream if you don't jerk off anyway. Not particularly life essence.
>>14142305
Based. All you need to do to dismantle a religion is by asking a religious person to prove their god. No one can do it. It's hilarious. It makes them so mad.

>>14142326
When their arguments that "prove" God amount to "dude just look around, it HAS to be God", then yeah, they do need to do more work to prove it

>>14142253
Wrong.

>>14142253
Christianity is nihilism.

>>14142295
Fool. It is christianity which leads to nihilism. It is Christianity that curses curses life for everything it is, its chaos, irrationality, suffering, pain, and then supposes something higher to compensate. Christianity always leads to nihilism. The bug man is the christian secularist par excellence. He says "life is horrible! it is suffering! why would I ever have a child in this freaking clown world!" He still believes in the christian morality, just not the god. His epic rationalism was only able to go so far in destroying his christianity.

The bugman is a product of nihilism being exorcised from our spirit. If the bugman was forever, we would die, simply of infertility. One day man will see the irrationality of the bug man and not return to Christianity, but affirm life.

this thread is pure nu-/lit/

>>14142380
fitting that you would post in it then faggot

>>14142253
https://youtu.be/hFlctCuUV28

>>14142431
we can do better than that

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mY61wP9as94

>>14142253
It breeds it by first placing value outside of life and then providing a metaphysics that, when logically followed to its end conclusions, refutes itself and leaves the believer left with nothing but skepticism for reality itself.

>>14142207
how can you prove a belief?

>>14142736
>providing a metaphysics that, when logically followed to its end conclusions, refutes itself
Actually that's naturalism, which forms the basis of the atheistic worldview. Christian metaphysics in comparison are entirely coherent and perfectly in line with our experience of reality.

>>14142756
Naturalism stems from Christianity, so you're wrong. Everything mistaken stems from Christianity, which is itself mistaken.

>>14142765
>Naturalism stems from Christianity, so you're wrong
Naturalism is a mutually exclusive metaphysical worldview from theism so this is as retarded as saying simulation theory stems from Hinduism.

>Everything mistaken stems from Christianity
Edgy nonsense.

>>14142771
The view that "the material is all there is" couldn't have existed prior to the view that the "immaterial" exists. Why would it ever occur to anyone that "the material" is even a thing, unless "the immaterial" was first a thing?

The Moral Landscape by Sam Harris

>>14142781
The acknowledgement of the existence of a transcendent spiritual layer of reality preceded Christianity and developed independently in many cultures. The modern desire to reject transcendent aspects of reality beyond the material has nothing to do with Christianity and everything to do with the rise of cynicism and solipsism.

>>14140897

Plato's Symposium.

>>14142803
Well, when I said naturalism stems from Christianity, I meant the modernly concise and institutionally-backed form of it which adheres to the concept of the material as something deliberately juxtaposed against the Christian metaphysical notion of the immaterial.

>The modern desire to reject transcendent aspects of reality beyond the material has nothing to do with Christianity
Not true at all, because Christianity overtook Europe's intellectual elite for centuries, training them to view the world in a certain way. It was this education that led to the modern sense of naturalism. Naturalism at all, any view that pertains to the so-called reality that "only this material world exists," MUST come after the view that pertains to the equally so-called reality that "there is an immaterial world." Prior to the latter view, there was no former view either. Nature was viewed nondualistically then, and the "immaterial" or "transcendent" aspects were not viewed as such.

Any book written by Kant.

>>14140897
The Ego and its Own

>>14142810
The Christian view of reality is holistic, encompassing both material and spiritual in an intertwined whole. The idea of a strong delineation between material and spiritual only began with enlightenment philosophers who were explicitly anti-Christian in their thought. The idea that naturalism stems from Christianity only makes sense if you're saying that people who were anti-Christian and wanted to undermine it wouldn't have existed if Christians didn't exist.

>Naturalism at all, any view that pertains to the so-called reality that "only this material world exists," MUST come after the view that pertains to the equally so-called reality that "there is an immaterial world."
Complete nonsense. Just because naturalism rejects immaterial aspects of reality doesn't mean that it needs to come from a worldview that does accept immaterial aspects of reality, this is utter stupidity.

>Nature was viewed nondualistically then, and the "immaterial" or "transcendent" aspects were not viewed as such.
Yes, the dualistic view comes from Enlightenment philosophers who were attempting to formulate ways to discredit Christianity. Your opinion is nothing more than the recognition that the parasite can't exist without the host, however to claim that it's the hosts fault that the parasite exists is a non sequitur. Materialistic enlightenment philosophy is a parasite, let us blame the parasite for the problems it creates.

Corpus Hermeticum

>>14142835
The Christian view of reality leads to an untenable morality. It's based on an understanding that is backwards in every way possible. There's no sin, we're all innocent in everything that we do, and there's no cause to the universe as we would understand it, because we invented the concept of causes and effects along with the concept of subjects.

>The idea that naturalism stems from Christianity only makes sense if you're saying that people who were anti-Christian and wanted to undermine it wouldn't have existed if Christians didn't exist.
Yes, that's what I'm saying. You have Christianity to blame entirely for the movement, but Christianity is no more correct on the matter and it's because it was false to begin with that it led to more false views of nature and history.

>Just because naturalism rejects immaterial aspects of reality doesn't mean that it needs to come from a worldview that does accept immaterial aspects of reality, this is utter stupidity.
What's stupid is not understanding that there's neither material nor immaterial things and this dichotomy is perpetuated by the falsehoods introduced by Jews which were later culturally appropriated by Christians.

>>14142871
>and this dichotomy is perpetuated by the falsehoods introduced by Jews which were later culturally appropriated by Christians.

Actually, Jews aren't dualistic. The Persians were however, and dualistic views which later influenced Jewish and Christian thought came from the Persians.

People forget that while Christianity was becoming the dominant religion in the Roman world, their neighbours of which there was constant cultural exchange already had a culturally dominant religion, which also was quite evangelical for the time.

However, the Arabs absolutely fucking stomped the shit out of the Sassanid's and the Sassanid population was getting over that family even before the Arabs finished them off. The removal of Zoroastrianism took a lot longer than people realised, and Zoroastrian thought continues to have a lasting influence in theology for all three Abrahamic faiths.

>>14142871
You're a brainlet. Christianity is the most accurate, complete and sublime worldview we have available to us. The fact that there are bad people like yourself who attack it while parasitically benefiting off it's immense cultural contributions isn't a refutation of Christianity, it's a refutation of you and all materialists who bite the hand that feeds them and end up being proven wrong, time and time again.

>>14142891
>the most accurate, complete and sublime worldview we have available to us.

Five dollars tells me you've never read a single Neoplatonist.

>>14142891
Intellectuals haven't been adhering strictly to Christian metaphysics for at least a century now. Quantum physics wouldn't exist otherwise.

Care to explain how God can exist in a universe with no beginning and no things-in-themselves?

>>14142894
Neoplatonism is a subset of Christian philosophy. Read Augustine.

>>14142914
HAHAHHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAH AHHAH HAHAH HAHAHAHH AHAHHA HAHAHAHHA HAHAHA AHHAHAHA

>>14142914
AS IF AUGUSTINE WASN'T JUST CONSTANDLY BASTARDIZING PLATO HAHHAHA HAHAHAH HAHAHAH HAHAHAH LITERALLY JUST SHITTY PLATONISM BASED ON PUTTING "TRUTHS" WITH NO BASE ON SOME FIRST CAUSE BULLSHIT HAHAHHAHAH AHAHHAHA SOMETHING OUT OF NOTHING CANT HAPPEN READ FUCKING NEWTON HAHAH

>>14142921
Retard. Neoplatonism was completely subsumed by Christians and utilized for Christian theology exclusively by the 5th Century. Neoplatonism informed early Christian debates as much as Aristotlean philosophy informed scholasticism.

>>14142948
>informed

That's a nice word for "ripping off"

>>14140897

>>14142914

So two hundred years before Augustine was born Plotinus stole Augustine's commentaries on Plotinus?!

Neat!
>pic semi related

>>14140897
art of the deal

>>14143300

>>14142305
It's god by definition you cretin. It's is something that must be, and something you may choose to call god.

The Grounding of the Metaphysics of Morals by Immanuel Kant

>>14142357
Christianity doesn't lead to nihilism; it is an expression of nihilism. Everyone else was spot on imo.