/lit/ - Literature

I don't hate Ayn Rand as much as I hate Objectivism. Nor do I hate Objectivists as much as I hate Objectivism

Her readers.

Because morons think objectivism is a good way to live your life.

>>1541784
So what exactly is wrong with it?

Because her philosophy is considered obsolete among post-modern intellectuals and her popularity popular among brain dead republicans.

I can't actually hate an idea which is so fundamentally based on individualism.

>>1541777
Nice triples and that's all.

People hate any ethical theory that divides stupid, lazy idiots from smart, succesful and intelligent people

everything

I just hate her complete lack of empathy.

>>1541813

What about Nietzsche ?

Someone summarize objectivism for me.

I read the fountainhead, I didn't really come out with any clear idea of what Objectivism is, though.

>>1541773

For plagiarizing L. Ron Hubbard.

>>1541813
It sounds like you're a fan of Rand, why do you like her?

Because he''s the someone who isn't a spineless, subhuman degenerate

>>1541800
let's not get ahead of ourselves, modern intellectuals also rejected her

>>1541830
This was an answer to this:
>>1541822

>>1541825
Nietzsche isn't people

To think that any man's accomplishments are solely his own, and not in even a small part due to outside factors, would be an untruth.

oh look here comes the sciducks to tell us what proper philosophy looks like

I didn't care for Anthem. Don't hate her.

I've been trying to figure this out myself. Her philosophy seems mostly (MOSTLY) sound, even if her supporters are the scum of the earth.

>>1541798

Alright, here are the acceptable premises of Objectivism, which is to say those that bear scrutiny, not those that should be automatically accepted:
1)That people ought to consider the world in terms of actual truth and objective reality, defined by and for the reason that it is universally visible and incontrovertible.
2)That people ought to act in their own interests in all cases.

But this doesn't sound like Objectivism, does it? That's right, because it isn't Objectivism. It's the foundation for Pragmatism, a much larger and more comprehensible philosophical movement, about which there is much to say, both in support and derision. The Objectivist philosophy, on the other hand, leaps off here and starts making all sorts of patently absurd claims that are logically incoherent (when they are not inconsistent) with those basic premises. We go from "man should be an individualist" to "Fiscal success is equivalent to virtue" without the slightest intervening argumentation. We assume for no stated reason that a person has no personal interests which coincide with those of others, and we dismiss out of hand the possibility that a person might be influenced by social or physical forces, and therefore undeserving of full credit for his actions.
The idea that a man can live in society without benefiting from its services is patently absurd, as is the idea that selfishness and self-interest are the same thing, and without a very compelling argument to the contrary, there's no reason to take a philosophy seriously which takes such principles to be obvious.

>>1542020
>jumps off

Have you actually read it? It sounds as if you are making quite a big jump. Can you quote a book that does that?

>>1542020
>2)That people ought to act in their own interests in all cases.

dats not what pragmatism is about. pragmatism is a descriptive theory about truth/knowledge practices, and from that draws some applied lessons


rand doesn't even know how loaded a simple phrase like "own interests" is, so she garbles different parts of philosophy together. her philosophy is like a 5 year old caught with a can of paint.

don't mind onionring guys he is only a wind-up Daniel Denett toy

she plagiarized atlas shrugged from garet garrett's the driver

she took social security money under an assumed name

she was anti-libertarian on spurious grounds

her books are creepy (kira and leo's entire relationship in we the living, the ghoulish train tunnel gassing in atlas shrugged, dominique getting raped and enjoying it, and roark dynamiting a homeless shelter in the fountainhead)

she was a cult leader

>>1542070
nah i dont really like dennett entirely

>>1541798

It suggests that it's best to better yourself at the cost of everyone else. It believes altruism is wrong, and that even if you can eliminate the suffering of millions without sacrificing your lifestyle or personal power you shouldn't.

Coincidently, Reagan was a big fan of it and look at the atrocities he visited upon the world for the benefit of himself and his friends.

>>1542152
You mean the Reagan who secretly funded wars, started the drug war and curb social liberties? If Reagan liked her he misunderstood her as much as Hitler misunderstood Nietzsche. Say what you want about Rand, but she would never pass a law prohibiting what you put into your own body as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else.

>>1542196

Implying Rand didn't love atrocities. She was in love with a serial killer, because he was a serial killer.

>>1542196
Lol, and Sarah Palin said Screwtape "touched her"

Any fiction writer that feels the need to slam their philosophy straight into your balls over and over and over until you get the message probably shouldn't be writing fiction.

Ａｙｎ　Ｒａｎｄ　ｉｓ　／ｌｉｔ／’ｓ　Ｓte
ｐｈａｎｉｅ　Ｍｅｙｅｒ．　Ｔｈｅｙ　ｏｎ－
ｌｙ　ｈａｔｅ　ｈｅｒ　ｂｅｃａｕｓｅ　ｅ－ｅｒｙ　ｏｎｅ　ｅｌｓｅ
　ｄｏｅｓ．

Ｂｕｔ　Ｇｏｌｌｙ　ｔｈｅｙ’ｒｅ
ＳＭＡＲＴ　ＡＢＯＵＴ　ＩＴ

>>1542242

how u do dis?

I wouldn't hate her with such an awe-inspiring passion if she stuck to philosophy, instead of trying to write horrible fiction. What's especially striking about her is that, if anyone else wrote a fifty-plus page philosophical treatise in the middle of a novel, they'd be drawn and quartered.

Pst. Ayn. People have been writing novel length philosophical works for centuries. What makes you think that you're so much better than them that you can't do likewise?

Ayn Rand wrote tributes to the great free spirit of serial killers.

>>1542264
The way I know how to do it is by writing in full-space Latin script using the Japanese IME for Windows.

Just didn't like how crudely she portrayed people that oppose her ideas.

It was either due to her complete misunderstanding of any view but her own, or an intentional misrepresentation used to make her own views look better by contrast.

Either way around it, she's a fraud, and I only read Atlas Shrugged when somebody recommended it and hailed it as great. I respect the person who gave it to me, and I wanted to like it, but I just couldn't.

Don't know if anything else she wrote is any better, but after reading over 70 pages of John Galt's radio speech, and realizing that she wrote without using logic (Did she honestly expect us to believe that "the ignorant masses" would sit through a 70 page speech? most of them would turn it off, even if they did agree it's a bit long winded).

I saw the gorilla and I thought this was going to be about Ishmael...

I like Ayn Rand so much

Oh but we don't.

>>1542378

And you probably like Neil Gayman too.

>>1542385

What does Neil Gaiman have to do with Ayn Rand?

>>1542395
They're the same person

>>1542395
Self-absorbed high school students with over-inflated egos are obsessed with both.

>>1542385
What does Gaiman have to do with any of this?
I...really like Gaiman, haven't read Rand.

>>1542403

As far as I'm aware, there isn't a cult of personality constructed around Gaiman. He's just a really good popular author. I doubt anyone really thinks more of him than that.

>>1542420
ah ha ho ho hee hee ha ha

I will give you this, though, goths and nerds aren't the ugly cancer in the soul of the American dream

>>1542427
American Gods wasn't bad at all.

mods love rand

>>1542385
I like Sandman but not American Gods.

>>1542432

...wow. That's...Draconian.

la bampa

Because every other philosopher brought a decent sports car to the race, while she brought a unicycle

>>1542436

>>1543181
dint lol

>>1542382
Every time I look at this pic I find some new detail.
Its amazing how much effort was put in to it.

>>1543383
By effort I mean thought.

>>1543383
Who posted it originally? I love them

>>1541843
ayn rand's philosophy seems like it stems from her sexual desires, coupled with her private life. she was sent to america to send back money. when she got here, she decided she didnt have to and wrote books explaining why. being a woman, she became enveloped in the situation.

she was a rather ugly woman that probably didnt get much attention, so its easy to assume that she fantasized of a man like her protagonist to agree with her, make love to her and take care of her.

she was obsessed with the idea of a man like rush limbaugh. he is a self-obsessed, rich, ignorant republican with the corpulance to match.

she suffered from imaginary friend' stockholm syndrome. of course the author of the fountain head and atlas shrugged was an immagrant woman. it could be no one else.

>>1543643

>>1542382
This is like a masterpiece in funny, nerd-made pictures. Fuck the Salt Maze, fuck the Balloon Scorpion. This is the pinnacle of the fucking form.

The notion that selfishness is something that needs to be taught in the western world, or even the human species, is laughable, and the only person I could see basing a philosophy off of this would have to be someone of supreme narcissism.

>>1543161
and whenthe world ran out of gas, man could still find balance on the unicycle

>>1543643

this about says it all really

>>1542382
Cool pic, shittiest of wines.

>>1544680
that is not wine

bampers

one last bump

>>1546359

one last sage

>>1546545

>>1542020
the step between what you said about individual action and fiscal success is filled in by her definition of money, which I believe to be spot on in AS

>>1541773

Because she's successful and I don't like her ideas much. I mean, they don't include me being successful.

>>1542063 tripfag

what, or who's, parts of philosophy are garbled?