/lit/ - Literature

cringe and tinybrained, take it to /his/

>>17121852
>>>/his/

People use this contrived argument for every single position.
>Hmm, leftists are morons, but they are ruining the world? How peculiar.
>Hmm, Nazis are stupid, but they are the greatest threat in the US? How peculiar.
>Hmm, Republicans are evil morons, but they are destroying America? How peculiar.

You can literally apply this to anything where there is an 'enemy'

>>17121852
If you want to understand the philosophy of national socialism you have to read Gottfried Feder. It also makes the answer to this question clear.

Italian fascism isn’t racial and doesn’t have a superiority fixation, the one that does would be the Nazism and other racial based adaptions of fascism.

The national socialist answer would be that practically speaking, though the Nazis were on average much more successful (they really did in terms of pure efficiency of killing) there was errors in military strategy and simply that the numbers were too much against them.

Realistically the axis did perform pretty well considering how many powers handed against them, I don’t think that takes away from how effective they were. If you claim a man is superior to 20 other men, if those 20 men band together to beat him, is that 1 man truly inferior? The war doesn’t actually change the theory, the government structures advantages or lack thereof or even comments on the quality of individuals.

Realistically I find national socialism, the racial heavily variants of fascism to be unrealistic, we will see and we are seeing a rise in white identity politics and I think in the future a white racial politic will be common and even perhaps as accepted as holding a black racial politic in the USA, but I don’t believe something like a national socialism will ever be possible or a white ethnostate if we are being realistic. ( I myself am not white but I love European culture highly)

I think those type of white nationalists however are definitely producing a momentum which will accelerate us to the point where it’s normalized to have a white identity politic, especially if they keep producing mass media like that image in your OP. In general they were making great strides prior to siege’s boom in popularity and prior to trump actually taking office. It’s likely during Biden’s presidency we’ll see another boom in this racial youth right wing again.

>>17121852
https://www.deviantart.com/uthp/gallery/74409255/ant-farm

>>17121859
>>17121862
>>17121880
>>17121884
I am not talking about some transcendental spirit overcoming subhumans or inferior peoples etc. I know of that I am asking how do you justify this 'objectively' in a material sense when you got BTFO'd in WW2

There is nothing I see wrong with cultivating myself but only strictly myself, trying to 'objectively' bring this cultivation IRL against people that arn't me seems like a terrible and ignoble idea looking at WW2

All facism feeds on the narrative of being historically wronged and downtrodden.

>>17121933
They were badly outnumbered.

>>17121852
i LOVE murdoch murdoch guys!!!

>>17121933

That’s not quite the core of the fascist or even Nazi thought. The core is that there’s a unity which pervades the nation which can unify them and that this is a spiritually and historically important event but has also been done historically, the main historical example being literal Rome (which is why Mussolini did Caesar larp)

The idea being in fascism that the absolute idea, the universal concrete, the synthesis of the most general population of the nation and the most particular individual can only be done through the state, that the state is like God’s will and god’s face on earth and by uniting with the state (which is not the literal government but rather a spiritual concept which manifests as the government ) all men may be harmonized and unified into a common goal and will and power.

The racial forms of this doctrine replace the state with “The Race” saying this is the most universal and actual thing, and this has various ramifications.

It isn’t about conquering the world to usher in the transcendental end, it’s a pragmatic goal and question, which again sees itself as having already manifested in the older models of places like Rome. Germany didn’t remove the non Germans because they were on a global purification mission, they did it because it was ruining the harmony of the nation. Same reason they removed my people (Gypsy) while still counting us as aryans, because we disrupted the harmony. This is also why some Jews and Gypsy and other such which seemed to help Germany were allowed to stay.

You gotta actually read the lit and not listen to random people on what fascism is, because the modern representatives of fascism are more in love with the cultural myth and aesthetic than the actual theory.

>>17121852
>Having that image saved

>>17121971

>>17121852
>before WW2: Our enemies are subhumans, our natural superiority will triumph
A niche view much more common in Hollywood fascism than real fascism.
>after WW2: It was impressive that we lasted this long, we are clearly superior despite losing
Never even heard this.

If you look at the majority of actual accounts from the actual period, it's very clear that most people felt that war is always a gamble that can go either way, and is only to be engaged in when inevitable. Half of Hitler's general staff were having borderline nervous breakdowns when Barbarossa was decided on.

>>17121901
The italian and german takes on it were bound to failure, since they both ended up provoking WW2 to some degree

The question is that all these criticisms placed on the nazis are somehow devoid of race, yet if these criticisms were put on the soviets, it would be easily depicted as the 'evident proof of the subhumanity of the russians'

The whole kdr arguement is embarrassing, entering the conflict they were very clear about being outnumbered, yet persisted because evidently they saw that they would overcome the subhumans, how can they then have the face to say that they 'made an error' in this regard? Does that not mean they were not quite so 'superior'?

The problem with the whole ethnoarguement is that on a wider scale of time we see that what truly remains immortal is the legacy of culture, how many ethnicities have even LARPed as the cultures they have conquered? In this regard, even Kalergi's pragmatism about at least preserving a future elite make more sense

>>17121852
What kind of software do they use to animate? I see videos like this all the time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Od2C_6VRu7M

>>17121933
>objectively
>material

These are the fruits of semitic intellectualism.

>>17121852
>"We're the good guys and that's why we are superior (because we are the good guys) and also the good guys always win!"
Do you unironically believe that's what fascists think? Hitler was betting on the Germans being strong enough to win the war and knew that if they lost, their civilisation and strength would be forfeit. It's that simple.
>>17121901
>Italian fascism isn’t racial
Cope.

>>17122017
>The italian and german takes on it were bound to failure, since they both ended up provoking WW2 to some degree

Ehh you can also blame the Anglos for it and as for Italy, they were pressured partially by their relations with Germany to go that route. It’s a complicated affair the entire war.

> The question is that all these criticisms placed on the nazis are somehow devoid of race, yet if these criticisms were put on the soviets, it would be easily depicted as the 'evident proof of the subhumanity of the russians

Yeah but that would be a basic tribalism method of uniting the people and raising their spirits and harmony. Fascism knew what it was doing with its propaganda.

> The whole kdr arguement is embarrassing,


I don’t think it’s embarrassing at all, we know the us military in Vietnam literally thought the best method would be to have a high KdR. It’s a valid though crude way of asserting power and force.

>entering the conflict they were very clear about being outnumbered, yet persisted because evidently they saw that they would overcome the subhumans,

Ehhh, it was originally for largely German lands and then spiraled out of control when the Anglos got involved. You can’t just give up once you’re in a war friend.

>how can they then have the face to say that they 'made an error' in this regard? Does that not mean they were not quite so 'superior'?

Eh, saying they didn’t have the power to not conquer the entire world which wasn’t even their objective doesn’t really seem like a big deal to me. Also hold back the pathos a little bit.


> The problem with the whole ethnoarguement is that on a wider scale of time we see that what truly remains immortal is the legacy of culture, how many ethnicities have even LARPed as the cultures they have conquered? In this regard, even Kalergi's pragmatism about at least preserving a future elite make more sense

I mean the Italian fascist argument was cultural not ethnic because they were fundamentally Hegelians.

>>17122036

Most of the fascist intellectuals weren’t racial, example the chief philosopher Giovanni gentile wasn’t.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manifesto_of_Race

They implemented racial policies as an appeasement or Germany, that’s just the historical reality.

>>17122029
It does not matter how 'racially superior' someone like goebbels might be, no ammount of racial superiority is going to help him getting pummeled into the ground by some African hunter gatherer

>>17121965
but according to them ideologically that should'nt have been a problem

>>17121983
Did they have a poorer understanding of history then? Clearly even they understood the growth of rome came from not only roots of italy but also that which was imported from the hellenistic world, so the whole purity in culture or race aspect can't really be applicable, even some of Rome's most important leaders were more 'romanized' than purely roman genetically.

I am still largely unconvinced at the irrationality presented by them beyond the aspects about cultivating the self

>>17122036
it's literally the most popular cope expressed

>>17122009
I suppose internet fascists are not a reputable source but that is usually their biggest cope

The thing about his general staff is alot of memoirs were written post-war to try and distance themselves from hitler, but I agree again the second cope is something more spouted online

>>17122076
That's just bullshit libtard revisionism - revolutionary right-wing Italians engaged extensively with race both before and during the Fascist era. That they disliked specifically German racism is understandable, as a lot of it was just nonsense and larpshit.

Weren't there explicitly anti-racist fascists in Brazil?

>>17122102
>it's literally the most popular cope expressed
In your head, maybe. I've never met anyone who believed that, nor did the Nazi leadership historically believe that.

>>17122102
>Did they have a poorer understanding of history then? Clearly even they understood the growth of rome came from not only roots of italy but also that which was imported from the hellenistic world, so the whole purity in culture or race aspect can't really be applicable, even some of Rome's most important leaders were more 'romanized' than purely roman genetically.
>I am still largely unconvinced at the irrationality presented by them beyond the aspects about cultivating the self

Italian fascism wasn’t racial and didn’t have a fixation on purity, Italy being mixed in terms of ethnicities and races was key to why fascism even developed.

again you’re confusing what people say and what the actual theorists had in mind, they had a fundamentally Hegelian thought and wanted to make a neo-Roman empire with the same treatment (largely ) of multiple ethnicities and races the same way Rome did so. There was never a “purity” element the key is the dominance and totalitarian integration of all individuals and subgroups within the “state”-cultural construct.

I understand where you’re coming from, genuinely, but internet fascists are people in love with transgressive imagery, and the pop cultural myth of the devilish racism of Hitler and so forth. They see him like a devil figure and themselves as the edgy satanist. It doesn’t really relate to the actual history for this philosophy, and yes it is a philosophy along with a political ideology. Read Giovanni Gentile’s work, the political ideology is an application of his form of idealism (which really doesn’t change much from Hegel)

>>17122107

What would liberals get out of making fascism seem non-racist?

Why did A. James Gregor (who was the absolute leading fascist scholar prior to his death) consider China to be the closest approximation of fascism in the current political scene?

>>17122061
I mean more like how they still tried to revive the whole roman empire thing, so war was still bound to occur

Yeah but like, you can't say you'll overcome the odds even if they're stacked against you because of some innate superiority, and then cry about how the odds were stacked against you when you lost, at least that's how I see it commonly represented in discussions

Looking at this mess I cannot help but conclude that funnily enough it was Kalergi that represented sanity and reason in those times

>>17121852
30 Jan 1933: Hitler is appointed Chancellor of Germany
March 1933: International Jewry publicly declares war on Germany, which takes the form of an economic boycott as they have no standing army. [1] [2]. This war continues until the eventual destruction and occupation of Nazi Germany by foreign powers.
Sept 1939: Germany and the Soviets invade Poland. Hitler’s primary motivation being wanting to bring home all ethnic Germans under recent foreign occupation to the Reich. It’s no different to what happened in Austria, Sudetenland, Bohemia and Klapedia. All of which were widely celebrated by the residents of those areas, and allowed/tolerated by the international community.
Sept 1939: France and the UK declare war on Germany ONLY (with the (*false*) stated intention of freeing Poland from foreign domination.
6 October 1939: Hitler makes public peace overtures to France and Poland. They reject it.
June 1940: France capitulates to Germany. Hitler, who could have obliterated the British army, shows mercy at Dunkirk. To further show his peaceful intentions West.
June 1940: Churchill gets paid off by Jewish millionaire Henry Strakosch to continue the war.*
14 July 1940: Hitler makes another, public peace overture to Churchill. He asks those fighting against him to sit down and talk. They refuse, under instruction from their Jewish owners.

Millionaire Jews in America push Roosevelt to join Churchill in destroying Germany.

The war continues for 5 years, with inexplicable loss of life, all because Churchill had debts to pay off to fund his hedonistic lifestyle. The Cold War/Iron Curtain, the collapse of the French and British Empires, the loss of 50,000,000+ human lives. The genocide of Germans east of Germany. All of these are the direct result of Churchill needing to be bailed out of his debts. The Holocaust atrocity black propaganda campaign was created to justify aggression toward Germany.

Nothing can explain the Capitalist-Communist alliance apart from Jewish financial and political clout and power. Roosevelt made clear to Churchill that US involvement was dependent on the collapse of the British Empire. The Axis counted on the UK not suicidally giving up their Empire, they counted on being allowed to BTFO communism in the West in exchange for the maintenance of the British Empire. That would have been the logical move. But Churchill’s personal debts needed to be paid off. And Churchill was a sociopathic hedonist who had no values and cared for nothing but his own personal good.

>>17121859

>>17122153
>I mean more like how they still tried to revive the whole roman empire thing, so war was still bound to occur

Eh I don’t think it was bound to occur, Italian fascism wasn’t even explicitly pro war, it was neutral to war and argued for an absolute pragmatism. It just so happens War was calculated as the best option.

> Yeah but like, you can't say you'll overcome the odds even if they're stacked against you because of some innate superiority,

They didn’t think it was because of innate superiority nor did they think they were going to war with basically the entire earth.

>and then cry about how the odds were stacked against you when you lost, at least that's how I see it commonly represented in discussions

That’s the problem. This is about the aforementioned non-reading “fascists”

>>17122170
Every German move was logical. They just didn’t understand just how corrupt Churchill was. And even though the Allies had cracked the encryption the German leaders were using to talk to each other, even though they knew every move the Germans were planning on making before it had been made, it still took the entire world, the entire financial system, the force of the globe’s military 5 years to destroy what had been a broken country just 7 years previously.

Literally the only reason Germany lost is because they UNDERESTIMATED the extent of Jewish control of the globe, Jewish control of Western politicians, and Jewish hatred of Germany. They UNDERESTIMATED the corruption of democratic politicians and the decadence of the individualistic, me-me-me, hedonistic Western culture that allows a man like Churchill to rise to the top.

Proof that WW2 had nothing to do with "saving Poland from foreign domination" and everything to do with destroying Germany can be found in its results and it's origins. The declaration of war was limited to Germany, even though both German and the Soviets invaded Poland. At the end, the Soviets took over Poland completely, as agreed with Churchill LOL.

Sources on Churchill being a Jewish-owned prostitute heavily in debt during his campaign against Germany:
>https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/europe/.premium-churchills-debts-and-the-money-men-who-saved-him-1.5437629?v=1609003384977
>https://www.telegraph.co.uk/books/what-to-read/no-more-champagne-churchill-and-money-david-lough-review/

Further reading
Churchill, Hitler and the Unnecessary War by Patrick J. Buchanan
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Elmer_Barnes

>>17121901
>If you claim a man is superior to 20 other men, if those 20 men band together to beat him, is that 1 man truly inferior?
yes, because facing 1-vs-20 odds exhibits terrible judgement.

When your ideology has next to zero universalist traits in regards to outgroups, it's unsuited for imperialism like that of the third Reich.

>17122170
I mean this is a very good example of what I mean, before the war the attitude is of the 'eventual victory of the superior' against the 'deceitful and inferior jews'

But then the war is lost and the argument turns into a pity party about how nazi german din do nuffin we wuz innocent cryfest these niggas have no shame

>>17121852
Why don’t the /lit/ jannies ever do their fucking job? This thread belongs on /his/ and undoubtedly OP is one of the tourists who comes here to shut post about philosophy he’s read the Wikipedia pages for and politics he’s learnt from YouTube videos

>>17122195
No, I'm the guy your quoting and I openly agree and state that Jews are superior. WW2 proved it. And the current of European history does too. As does the current geopolitical situation.

It's evident that if there is indeed a "master race", the Jews are it. The Germans were destined to perish in the face of a stronger, more intelligent foe.

>>17122201
shutup pathetic gatekeeper we are talking books

>>17122227
what is the point of conjuring up racial hierarchies exactly? is there a non-emotional justification for it?

>>17122146
>What would liberals get out of making fascism seem non-racist?
Because it gives a slightly less "politically incorrect" and "normal" option for the more morally and intellectually cowardly to identify with, thus sabotaging their political efforts by funnelling their energy into a pointless dead end view.
>Why did A. James Gregor (who was the absolute leading fascist scholar prior to his death) consider China to be the closest approximation of fascism in the current political scene?
Without spending too much time reading into this, probably because he's a libtard and smearing all forms of "totalitarianism" as one unified and "evil" position helps with legitimising liberal plutocracy in the West.

>>17122177
Then the problem of pragmatism occurs, even if they calculate right about how they may make gains, there is no guarantee about holding them, and the event of losing these gains may even result in the emergence of anti-fascism in the former territory

I think I should clarify, I think what I see unsolved is that fascists of a more 'neutral' stance argue something of a national-unity (as you said) for each nation shows that fascism need not lead to cataclysmic war, but because of how stronger nation-states often pragmatically take advantage and even invade weaker ones, the formerly 'ideologically inclined' fascist states war with each other, which may even result in the end of fascism in all the states involved

To put it bluntly, I do not see how fascism has convincingly argued that it is not a self-eating snake which history has shown it to be, resulting in the greatest harm to the ethnicity it claims to be 'preserving'

>>17122241
It's a bit of fun. I guess having fun is an emotion. Nobody does it seriously and anyone who's not a moron treats every individual on his/her own merits. Lighten up.

>>17122201
why then even subscribe to this? not even jews like to subscribe to it with how often leftist and rightist jews argue with each other

>>17122227
why then even subscribe to this? not even jews like to subscribe to it with how often leftist and rightist jews argue with each other

>>17122278
just having fun with my buddies lynching negroes haha. lighten up we're just beating this chinese man to death.

>>17122306
How many lyncher Klanmembers have you met in your life, anon? What about Chinese beaters?

>>17122305
I said *if*. I don't believe in ranking races in any way. It's creepy. Plus there are always problems inherent in making (subjective) value judgements like that and treating them as objective.

>>17122306
>this is your brain on Americanised education

>>17122318
>>17122322
non-arguments

>>17121901
What ethnicity are you?

>>17121939
All politics*

>>17122029
Damn that makes sense, let's make a Deutsche Mathematik and we'll really put it to Semitic intellectualism starting w Einstein

>>17122275

Again fascism was never about preserving an ethnicity. The account it would give you is historical Rome.

>>17122261

Why not read the dude first before dismissing him outright?

>>17122331

I’m a Gypsy, roma, you know. I have no emotional feels About how their regime treated my people because I understand the logic behind it. But I strive to be logical friend.

>>17122331
He's a gypsy use warosu he's a smart guy

>>17122327
Do not throw stones in a glass house, anon. No argument was necessary, as you made no argument yourself.

>>17122385
How do you figure wn is on the rise? It seems to have no answers, I see it falling if anything and however far it rises it's sure to be rubberbanded down harder

>>17122385
>Why not read the dude first before dismissing him outright?
I don't have the time and energy to bother with this guy right now, I have already read plenty about fascism. I took a guess in the event that it might be helpful for you to contextualise your already existent knowledge.

>>17122394
non-argument

>>17122385
>why not read the dude first
Because calling China fascist shows how ridiculous the term is

>>17122397

On the rise in terms of youth popularity not political power or politicians. It’s definitely gaining in terms of social acceptance. 20 years ago how rare was it to find someone with white identity politics in the youth vs how it is now? How common is it?

>>17122421
The only argument you deserve is a crying onions wojak.

Is /leftypol/ a glow-boi fuckery to make people hate the left, or are they just incompetent?

>>17121852
>natural superiority
not fascism

>>17122463
non-argument

>>17121933
Nobody gives a shit what you are talking about, you are on the wrong board, flatliner

>>17122305
>not even jews like to subscribe to it
Most jews subscribe to it, just not publicly.
Because openly proclaiming racial superiority when you're 2% of the population is kind of dumb.

>>17122185
>Every German move was logical
Lolno, invading the Soviet Union was the peak of idiocy.
They saw Finland win, so they got cocky, and then they got really successful early on.
But attacking Russia was retarded.
>Russians were totally gonna invade bro
They had massive economic issues, major unrest, and just recently got fucked up in Finland, they weren't gonna fuck with a much larger country that just rekt all their neighbors just because.
Stalin was shocked and totally unprepared for the betrayal.

>natural superiority
not fascism

>>17122565

I do not understand why people so often do not read gentile even self proclaimed fascists, but I guess I do because it’s mostly just that people are looking for an aesthetic and not ideas.

I guess that’s why D'Annunzio is mentioned all the time but gentile isn’t. It just feels very shallow to me. It’s the type of people basically masturbating off to statues of strong men with no concern for anything deeper than their aesthetic sensibilities.

>>17122601
Neither fascists nor anti-fascists constantly run their mouth about fascism without bothering to read the central thinker of fascism. It's astonishing. I'd make a joking metaphor to people discussing Marxism without having read or even heard of Marx, but I see that constantly as well.

>>17122654
Scratch the "neither", I'm retarded.

>>17121852
/lit/ - Literature

>>17121852
Occult History Of WWII
https://esotericawakening.com/occult-history-of-wwii

We Fought The Illuminati – Champions Of The People
https://esotericawakening.com/we-fought-the-illuminati

>>17121852
If you want a serious answer see The Forced War: When Peaceful Revision Failed by David L. Hoggan. It's a very tenuous reading of events but not much worse than the comic book Judeocentric accounts that are so popular today.

>>17122170
Hitler knew invading Poland would cause a reaction. Hitler was very clear in his public speech's and writings he wanted to humiliate France and made his Anglophilia very clear (more so than his Zionism).

>Nothing can explain the Capitalist-Communist alliance apart from Jewish financial and political clout and power
Are you literally mentally retarded? Hitler literally created the condition for that alliance by his actions. Stalin wasn't going to start a war to defend British imperialism, only Hitler would do that.

>>17122185
What do you mean by "German move"? Hitler was making the decisions and most of his advisors weren't super in agreement with what he was doing.

>both German and the Soviets invaded Poland
Please elaborate on any "Soviet invasion" of Poland

https://msuweb.montclair.edu/~furrg/research/mlg09/did_ussr_invade_poland.html

>>17121852
Just because it's not /pol/ does mean you belong, nor does it make you welcome.

>>17122433
I meant within the past couple years it seems to have died off

I shaved my pubes today and ate a box of cookies my nan made for me.

>>17122913
You are a good boy, anon. I have to shave them too, especially since I have spare used razor I should throw out soon.

>>17121880
Yes because dipshits have to have an enemy and an enemy wouldn’t be threatening if they’re not strong, but you also have to make them appear weak otherwise dipshits will think they will lose

>>17121859
>>17121862
/lit/ is just highbrow /his/ so stfu

Any books about post ww2 nazi? What happen to them etc

>>17121852
>how do fascists explain WW2
Goys vs. Liberated people

>>17123384
No it isn't you pol faggot fuck off

how do ideologues explain the crisis of overproduction of 1914?

>some serbian guy killed a man and somehow the entire world went to war
fetishists are insane kek

>>17123843
>"omg the first world war was a heckin overproduction crisis problem!!! :OOOO"
Retard grade take.