/lit/ - Literature

>>17331082
>LOTR
Lots Of Tiresome Reading

should i read the firefall sequel or continue with malazan?

>>17331121
https://justflipacoin.com/

>>17331082
>What are your thoughts on LotR?
10/10, however I feel it was more enjoyable when I was a teenager.

From going to the player of games to the first two book of the Lazarus long series I'm left with a bad taste in my mouth thinks to the lack of moral openly expressed openly on the books. Don't get my wrong I'm not a purist but even then they were way to blaze about sex and marriage even for my tastes. My question is, is there any books dealing similarly with "long lives", the reason I started the culture series and the Lazarus long series in the first place, without making it seem like they MUST fall into complete orgies of people where any for of lasting relationship is rendered meaningless? or simply not touching on the subject at all?

>>17331165
After reading the first two books of the Lazarus Long series I'm left with a bad taste in my mouth thanks to the degeneracy openly expressed in the books. I'm not a prude, but they were way too blasé about sex and marriage. Are there any books about living for centuries without falling into complete decadence, degeneracy, and nihilism?

I've fixed your post for you.

Go to the 17th Shard and bring something back.
>https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/95260-leshwi-and-kaladin-potential-relationship/

>>17331287
>https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/94590-stormlight-healing-getting-really-op/
Actually a decent point. I am curious how Sanderson wants to have Radiant deaths in the future.

>>17331132
malazan it is

>>17331092
based

>>17331287
>https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/95260-leshwi-and-kaladin-potential-relationship/
based. Singers are MADE for the BHC
But I still believe that Syl is becoming physical
>already saw that shit being attempted at the ends of RoW
>the chapter art for syl has her wearing a backpack, which I find really fucking odd

>>17331211
It's kind of late, I'm sleepy and I just got to a "bad" part in one of the books that made me consider dropping the series as a whole so I had to vent... so thanks?...also, if you have any recommendation please do share.

>>17331121
Echopraxia stands well in the shadow of Blindsight, I'd pass on it unless you really, really want more

>>17331411
Wasn't she the first Honorspren to defect back to the Radiants? Makes sense to wear a backpack if you view it as a 'her leaving home' scene.

Do you actually feel like you get anything out of sf/fantasy aside from fleeting, escapist enjoyment?

>>17331714
good book make brain big-brain

>>17331736
What's the last sf/f book you read and how did it make brain big brain?

>As for himself he found Dr. Mary Rittersdorf physically attractive. And he wondered—idly—if the fact that she had arrived without her husband signified anything. She was, in fact, sexy. As an inexplicable incongruity, considering the purpose of this meeting, Dr. Rittersdorf wore a distinctly feminine outfit: black sweater and skirt, no stockings, gilded slippers with turned-up elfish toes. The sweater, Baines observed, was just a fraction too tight. Did Mrs. Rittersdorf realize this? He could not tell, but in any case he found his attention drawn away from what she was saying to her well-articulated breasts. They were admittedly small but quite distinct as regard to angle. He liked them.
>I wonder, he wondered, if this woman—she was, he surmised, in her early thirties, certainly in her physical, nubile prime—if she is looking for something more than professional success, here. He had a powerful affective insight that Dr. Rittersdorf was animated by a personal spirit as well as a task-oriented one; again, she perhaps was not conscious of this. The body, he reflected, possesses ways of its own, sometimes in contradistinction to the purposes of the mind. This morning, on arising, Dr. Rittersdorf might merely have thought that she would like to wear this black sweater, without thinking any more about it. But the body, the well-formed gynecologic apparatus within, knew better.
>And to this an analogous portion of himself responded. However in his case it was a conscious reaction. And, he thought, perhaps this can be turned to our group’s advantage. This dimension of involvement might not be the liability for us that it surely is for our antagonists. Thinking this he felt himself slide into a posture of contrived defense; he had schemes, automatic and plentiful, by which to protect not only himself but also his colleagues.

>>17331714
yes, plenty of ethical and philosophical debates in non-capeshit sci-fi
and if you didn't retain any new science after reading Red Mars, you're an idiot

>>17331640
eh, it makes more sense to think of her becoming a physical creature and the backpack is full of sex toys she wants Kaladin to use on her

>>17331744
Blindsight radically expanded my idea of other forms of biological intelligence, and the nature and role of consciousness

PLEASE RESPOND

>>17331714
I gain long-lasting enjoyment via mentally charting out the development of various authors careers in relation to the genre as a whole over time

>>17331878
Nice. Who are your favorites?

>>17331947
Silverberg
Barrington Bayley
Philip Jose Farmer
PKD
Stapledon

I'm hoping to start checking out Asimov soon

You might not like it, but this is what peak modern sci-fi looks like.

>>17331287

Pretty sure Sandaro is heading towards KalxSyl

>>17331823
Never thought I'd see a well established SF name write web novel tier trash.

>>17332065
>book 9

Welp, I'm probably going to drop this series. Maybe. I don't know.

The second book has not been very entertaining. The main character gets sidetracked endlessly, so he makes no advancement to a goal. Just hopping from one random scenario to the next.
I'm still only 3/4ths through this one. But I just finished what I assume is a super important chapter. Where Severian recounts the script of a play he was a part of. When he began, I thought it was going to be a short little recounting, that hinted at something in the lore of the world. But after 10 minutes of boring as fuck script reading, I check the time on my audio book. And discovered the chapter was 44 minutes in total. And the author really spend the entire 44 minutes going over this *super*boring script.

And I'm sure the play is supposed to be important to the lore. It's probably explaining all kinds of important events in the form of metaphor. And I'm sure it will make a whole lot of sense later, when revelations come. The play is just dripping with significance... However... I didn't absorb any of it. I just listened to the poor narrator try his best to sell this script. But it all sounded like static to my ears.

The problem being: I just plain don't enjoy when stories are inside of stories. I'm already reading a story. I don't then need there to be stories inside of the story I'm reading like some kind of russian doll. I can't completely blame the author for this. As it's probably just some weird psychological thing unique to me. But if any of you can understand what I mean about hating stories inside of stories, then let me know. It would be nice to have some support on this.

But anyway, I feel like I just zoned out during one of the most important chapters in the book, and I'm NOT going back to re-listen to it. I'm probably going to finish out this book, and then forget about reading the rest of the series. I don't know. Depends on how well it finishes off.

>>17332578
>listen
ngmi desu
BotNS demands your attention in a way that people typically don't give audiobooks
it's my favorite series but i can't imagine listening to it
anyways the play is only important in that it foreshadows certain events, but it's meant to be confusing and disjointed

>>17332578
>As it's probably just some weird psychological thing unique to me. But if any of you can understand what I mean about hating stories inside of stories, then let me know. It would be nice to have some support on this.
No, I totally get you. I'm fine with something short, like a little anecdote one character tells another to illustrate a point. But I dislike mid-story flashbacks as a general rule. I can't really think of any examples where it didn't annoy me, and made me wish this was put in a side story somewhere, or conveyed in some other way. Very rarely is the flashback more interesting than present events. If it were, it would have been its own story.

>>17332605
>but it's meant to be confusing and disjointed
this is the worst cop out for badly written dreck

>>17328883
What do you think of the theory that Severian forged the orders for her torture after being offended by Thecla saying he was just a boy after he became a journeyman.
It was brought up on Alzabo Soup and initially I thought it made sense, but made less the more I thought about it.

>>17332578
>>17332605
also i've written about this before but the science wolfe is most interested in (and i claim it's largely what BotNS is "about") is storytelling itself. there are lots of stories within stories and they usually only serve to tell you something new about the main story if you get the references to classical myths. it's a theme in his works. Peace makes you really see that.

>>17332636
if i were going to direct a short film about BotNS i would pick the section where he's with Thecla and have it so that he does do that, because a very dramatically compelling premise and there's nothing to disprove it
there's not much evidence for it either, though. all that comes to mind is a part (after the whole merging thing) where i think he says Thecla is angry at him and doesn't give much of an explanation. you could either interpret that as her having seen that he did do it, or her being angry about some of the other weird shit going on.
but it's a compelling enough theory that a lot of people are willing to take it as their interpretation just because it's plausible, is what i think.

>Wolfe's deliberate use of exotic words is meant to manipulate the reader and force upon them a certain visualization of the story, but he does not mean to confuse the reader. He compares the narrator, Severian, and the reader to an English-speaking person and a German-speaking person building a boat
This has been in my backlog for a long time now. I'm thinking I should try it next.

>>17332620
You just have shit reading comprehension. Cope

>>17331346
For real. It is one of the most unfortunate choices in SA's magical world-building. Incidentally, as I remember, the other "magic fuels" on other planets don't have this healing property.

>>17332620
if you say so. it's just that one section and whenever Hethor opens his mouth, though. everything else in the book (on the surface level) is very straightforward.

>>17332677
don't get too hype on the language stuff, it filtered some casuals back in the day but now you can just google everything to get the references, whether or not you took greek history classes. nothing else i've seen written about the book overrates it, though. i have seriously yet to find anything else in the genre that compares.

>>17332578
I'm curious. What exactly were you doing during those 44 minutes of the play? Were you driving someplace? Chopping onions? Filling spreadsheets? Carving wood?
I will never understand people multitasking with audiobooks. They should just stick to easy books that don't demand a lot of attention. When Wolfe describes a scene with an obscure word, I used to ponder on the meaning of the word, how the object might have looked like, its purpose, etc. I would probably have to check a dictionary to enhance or reshape my understanding of the scene. This process would take a few seconds up to several minutes. I would go back and reread the scene. How the fuck you would do this with an audiobook when the narrator goes on at his own pace is probably why it's a terrible book to listen to.

I love BotNS and all the stories, I got most of them through rereads, except the play which, I'm not afraid to say so, feels a bit pretentious. A party of amateur actors just acting out some random script from a shady guy in the middle of nowhere, with profound implications and the most obvious of foreshadowings. How is this supposed to be an entertaining act, with that stilted dialogue is beyond me. It's both a puzzle and a window into Urth's culture, not to mention it's so full of meta and selfreferential stuff it should, perhaps, be more accessible.
It's not supposed to make a lot of sense unless you know a bit about the Bible and what will happen later in the books.

>>17331714
Sure, it's not like I'm spending my fantasy time with Sanderson, Jordan or Bakker. There's plenty of quality literature out there in science fiction and fantasy.

>>17332578
>Pay no attention
>Notice nothing
>Not engaging with the story
>Expect to be entertained by the plot

It's a work of art, it's not a Schwarzenegger movie. If you approach it like passable entertainment, which it is not, of course you aren't going to like it.

>>17332772
>pic
Do you have the original? I saw it once years ago and didn't save it

>>17332793
Wait, no need to spoonfeed me, got it from google

I think I couldn't find it again because I didn't remember what the anime girl was saying

About to finish The White Luck Warrior. The editing seems not as polished, caught some mistakes. The writing has a few passages that felt too modern and style wise out of place, one saying "no mean something" stood out.
That Serwa and Moenghus scene. Why? It's a nice parallel but completely unnecessary and all it achieves is making me hate that faggot shit herder and his dumb whims a lot more.
I'm missing Kellhus PoV a lot.
It does feel like it should have been 100 pages shorter and I'm guessing the latter two books will be that way as well.

>>17331082
Reading LOTR for the first time. Same cover as the one in OP actually-- made out of a very nice moleskine-ish material. I'm liking it a lot as someone who was never super into the movies or even fantasy in general. I definitely see the criticism of it being tedious and long-winded, but Tolkien's fervent autism for his world is rubbing off on me.

Is Bakker really good or just a meme here?

>>17331714
Good books at the very least usually broaden and inform my tastes in literature, and given I really like reading and think of maybe writing a book someday, that's more than good enough.

>>17332849
He’s one of the very few non YA fantasy writers that gets post here.

People are either too stupid or too triggered by his prose and contents.

Best fantasy writer I’ve read.

>>17332849
He's really, really bad. You should be able to tell from his character names alone at this point.


>>17332827
I never understood what's supposed to be tedious in LotR. Maybe for people with a tik tok attention span?

>>17332758
Jeez, I typed that post just before going to bed. Now, I check the thread while in bed and I'm surprised to have gotten more than 1 reply.

Well anyway, I was drawing while listening. It's true, drawing is a minor distraction when I have to make decisions. But as long as those decisions are quick, I won't miss anything. 98% of the time, I'm not thinking about anything except the book. And if I do feel ike I've missed something, then I simply tap the 10 second rewind button, a re-listen.

And, yeah, I agree this book is a little more demanding than others. Which is why I found myself rewinding frequently. I don't see what's so important that it takes you minutes to ponder over the meaning. Only a few points gave me pause. But not break out the dictionary and study pause. That sounds uneccessary to me.
I've also slowed the narration down to 90%. Either the narrator reads fast, or the recording is spead up. Because 90% sounds like normal cadence to me.
Oh, and I know a lot of words. I doubt Gene could find one that I wouldn't know.

>>17332880
>You should be able to tell from his character names alone at this point.
Kek, exactly like >>17332876 said.

>>17332720
>healing property
Literally feruchemical gold.

>>17332880
> the author is bad because I am a monolingual cuck that can’t memorise and pronounce names with ä,ï,ö,ü

Every book is a YA book if the kid can read.

>>17332907
His names are randomly generated fantasy gibberish by a person with no feeling for language.
Don't pretend Bakker is somehow a writer who requires attention, he's the type of author you read while shitting.

>>17332935
I've unironically done this before.
Doesn't everyone keep a toilet book in their bathroom?

>>17332880
Tolkien's prose is sure-footed and sometimes lyrical, but it doesn't register very much at an emotional level or strike you as some marvelous feat of artistry line-by-line. His language is antiquated in weird ways and he seems to lose the thread of the plot a bit too often and too visibly without that seeming to serve any thematic or structural reason that couldn't have been achieved by other means. This is from a person that actually likes Tolkien.

>>17332893
>feruchemical
>gold
Two very specific conditions.
There is no such thing as "I swallow any metal and heal my wounds"

>>17332935
>with no feeling for language.
>English “sounding” names should be the only ones allowed in a made up universe that stretches between multiple continents and cultures.
I accept your defeat.

>>17332907
Yeah, I'm sure you memorized the dozen names of the Believer Kings and their Princes.

>>17332935
>His names are randomly generated fantasy gibberish by a person with no feeling for language.
t.monolingual anglocuck

>>17332952
>very specific conditions
Did you not read era 2? Do you not know how FTL travel works yet?

>>17332989
>There is no such thing as "I swallow any metal and heal my wounds"

>>17332962
These don't sound like they belong to any language, fantastical or real.
>>17332984
Srećom nisam jebeni anglo. Odi u kurac, pička ti materina plebejska. Jedina stvar za koju su bakkerovi fanovi sposobni je gutanje sperme.
Nisam postao na ovoj ploči godinama, nakon dva treda mi je jasno zašto.

>>17332935
Based anon telling it like it is.

>>17332984
I speak 3 languages fluently and 4 others well enough to travel in their respective countries, Bakker's names are ugly gibberish that he probably thought up on the fly and then just kept because he's too lazy and contemptuous of his audience to bother with writing anything pleasing to the eye.

>people getting filtered by names
You literally can’t make this shit up

>>17333039
Based Bakker filtering brainlets is not surprising desu.

>>17333014
>These don't sound like they belong to any language, fantastical or real
>fantastical

I don’t think you understand what “fantastical” means, but ok.

I love Bakker's names. They're influenced by his study of ancient Greek, Germanic, Byzantine, Mesopotamian history as well as what appears to be very deep study of Tolkien's invented languages and early sketches (viz. the Book of Lost Tales). They're the exact opposite of generic, pretty sounding, mass-consumable Sandershit like Shallan and Kholin.
Bakker's personal names are great. They're fun to say.
>Ikurei Conphas
>Coithus Narnol
>Obwë Guswurân
>Sasal Umrapathur
>Carindûsû (curse him!)
>Vûgulharsa
>Anasûrimbor Nau-Cauyuti
His placenames are also great.
>Kûniüri, kingdom of the ancient North
>Auvangshei, fortress on the border of Zeüm
>Orovelai, stronghold of the Swayali
>Nilnamesh, opiate princes of the South
>Plains of Gâl
>Vogga Hall, Royal Seat of Sakarpus.
I just like them, you don't have to.

A word or a name has two properties. One, its appearance (the way letters are arranged and it's length) and the sound attached to that word. When reading without subvocalization, your eyes perceive the arrangement of the letters, telling your brain the letters apple correspond to the word apple, not angle or able, and of course not the sound apple. There's a fun exercise where you can rearrange or switch the letters on a word and as long as you don't mess with the opening and closing letters too much, you can recognize appie as apple. For simple sentences, you can read this dyslexic shit and still make sense.
Bakker is hit and miss, mostly miss, regarding both aspects. It demands a bit more of an effort, but why? With a long string of forgettable names of people and places, it does strike me as not quite polished. It's Tolkienesque but poorly done. For example, Húrin and Túrin look somewhat similar, but they sound quite different (the aspirated h and the t before the accent) and the H and T symbols are recognizable at a glimpse.

>>17333013
No, because you can just touch an unkeyed gold metalmind and do the exact same thing.

>>17333086
>>Ikurei Conphas
most based character in the entire story

>>17333086
Oh no no no no, we got too cocky Sandersoys.

>>17333086
Bakker may be creative, but Le Guin is the true sensei of strange worldbuilding names.
>O
>Gont
>Iffish
>Roke
>Lorbanery
>Wathory
>Wellogy
>Rood
>Toom
>Hur-at-Hur
>Wasny
>Uny
>Ully
>Borth

>>17333087
>It's Tolkienesque but poorly done
Tolkien is poorly done. Also stop saying Tolkienesque. It's cring. I've read LoTR recently after many years. It's just a children book. Everyone is bland and Tolkien narration is uninteresting.

>>17331082
hi /lit/ newfag here
i am looking for certain books released in polish language
i was looking for them on PDF drive but was unable to get all that i needed
are there any other sites that i can try for free books ?

>>17333167
Just start reading in English.

>>17333174
they are not for me tho
and author is polish actually that book was not released in english

>>17333167
docer.pl doci.pl

>>17333199
oh shit, thanks anon
i'll try there

>>17331082
>What are your thoughts on LotR?
Seinfeld effect, it was genius at the time but it's success has had a negative impact on the broader industry over time

>I feared what I might find here.......

>>17331121
I disagree with the other comment.

Blindsight is a fantastic standalone book, but Echopraxia is potentially one of the best direct sequels I've ever read. It's an incredible continuation and challenge to the themes, plot, characters and signature meta-context of Blindsight. It's the same high-level Watts but also much more.

There's also a third book in the works currently, so might be worth continuing the series. Really depends how much you rated Blindsight though, as you might be able to tell I'm a big fan.

>>17333333
CHECKED

>>17333145

>>17332578
>The problem being: I just plain don't enjoy when stories are inside of stories
What a shame! I adore internal stories and myths. Some of the BotNS ones are a little dense, but Death's End in the 3BP books has some really great sub-stories.

>>17332620
do you only appreciate everything you immediately comprehend? I can understand re-listening is daunting compared to briefly re-reading, though. If it's any conciliation, the play is much more enjoyable upon a second reading because you are able to read much more into it in the context of the broader narrative.

I do understand your position. I think this is ultimately an audiobook problem, I don't think Wolfe really takes to then, definitely not BotNS anyway.

If you are willing to give Wolfe another chance, and you can find it on audiobook, I would suggest Book of the Long Sun. It's still signature Wolfe, but it's a much more conventional (~straightforward) plot and cast, while retaining an interesting, mysterious world. Standalone to BotNS too, so no need to finish that series if it's not clicking.

>>17333333

The /sffg/ roiled. The very extremity of their passion, wailing as old women one moment, whooping as young boys the next, oppressed them, and for all their frantic gratitude the Anons found themselves turning, as all manly souls turn, to anger and contempt. Anonymous posting is never so cheap as when executed for the lulz; and they were, in the end, cruel, spiteful, bitter shitposters.
Sinners.
So they began baying for the blood of their foe. Anon could feel it as much as they, the need to affix their sin to disposable Sanderfags.
“Brothers!” he called, hoping to gather them once again within the harness of his voice. “Broth—!”
"I feared what I might find …"
Their Holy Bakker-Shill had returned from his three day ban.

>>17333086

Ikurei sounds like a weird mix of Greek and Japanese when I first read it in The Darkness that Came Before

>>17333111
>>Borth
lost my virginity in Borth

>>17333024
>I speak 3 languages fluently and 4 others well enough to travel in their respective countries
>implying

>>17333024
>>17333530
Ok. Then I'll just read Bakker and have fucking fun. Shill and whine about names for 3 hours more please.
No language is good enough for properly saying what losers you are.

>>17333341
i enjoyed it but i'm gunna take a break and read the third malazan then switch to echopraxia when i'm done

>>17333555
>reading comprehension

>>17333693
>faggotry

I don't think I have ever spewed any hate here but fuck me is the foreword to Lensman by John Clute the most disrespectful pile of shit I have ever had the misfortune of hearing. It's like having N.K. Jemesin write the foreword to "A Throne of Bones".

I wanted to hear a nice and light sci-fi instead I had to listen to 8 minutes of this vile human being berating Doc's work.

>>17332065
lol even the cover makes it obvious that this is mass-produced mil sci-fi schlock.

>>17333341
Eh, kinda. Blindsight was kind of a really dark version of Solaris and had a much more focused plot. Meanwhile you don't even get to know or see who the big threat is in Echopraxia until they get to the sun station.

I want to write a fantasy story. I have the setting, the world, the characters and the vibe of the story. But I have no plot. How do I get a plot?

>>17334047
>he fell for the worldbuilding meme
Anon, anon... Your world serves the story, not the other way around. What's your world "about"? What is its, as you say, its vibe? Plot something along those lines.

>>17333111
They sound like names in a children's book.

>>17331823
>the malignance that exists between me and chuck
is that why he sold the suck and fuck to sneed?

>>17331082
>cyberpunk = FUCK HIPPIES AND FUCK REDNECKS
t. Rudy Rucker

>>17334052
From the fantasy material I have read so far, I am not a fan of how wizards are depicted. They are too bright, too kind, and too close to humans. They are too modern. I want to write about the older, more traditional, and scarier form of wizards. Being a wizard makes you far more powerful than anyone else, especially in a pre-historic setting. Power corrupts, therefore wizards are generally evil and sick fucks. All wizards should be feared, and no wizard is good, just less evil. The story I want to tell is also heavily inspired by themes presented in the Psychedelic Doom Metal genre. Just like Doom Metal, I want to invoke a sense of despair, dread, and impending doom.

It feels natural to me that there is going to be a conflict between my protagonist and a wizard. But literally everything I come up with is pretty cliched and just ends up being a copy of LOTR and Saruman/Sauron or Harry Potter vs Voldemort.

>bad wizard wants to destroy the world, good protagonist must stop him.

>>17332578
He simply doesn't tell an interesting story. It's well written but besides that it has very little going for it. Contrast that with Watts, who manages to tell an interesting story, and gives you plenty to think about on top of that. Wolfe is mainly for those that like to feed their ego. I have never seen anyone give him credit for anything relating to the actual story told.

>>17334261
>From the fantasy material I have read so far, I am not a fan of how wizards are depicted. They are too bright, too kind, and too close to humans. They are too modern. I want to write about the older, more traditional, and scarier form of wizards
This makes me think: Who is the most popular/known 'dark' wizard in fantasy? One of my first thoughts was Raistlin.

>>17333333
M-master?!

>>17334261
I like this idea. maybe look into robert howard's depiction of wizards in conan and bran mak morn. it's pulpy, but I recall those wizards as being corrupt and lecherous figures of superstitious fear.
>Psychedelic Doom Metal
my nigga

Is this still the best book about leadership? still the comfiest fantasy you can read?

>>17333024
>many of his names are historical names with a vowel changed
>ugly gibberish thought up on the fly

>buy bunch of books in anticipation of comfy winter reading
>spend all the time drunk playing games or shitposting instead
help me pls

>>17334261
This actually sounds kind of interesting. I'd recommend reading Eyes of the Overworld if you want to get a sense for how you could approach depicting a dick ass wizard and a protagonist that opposes him without retelling a well trodden story

I'm halfway through Abercrombie's first trilogy and something about his writing style just irritates me. Might make it to the end but it's on doubt. And I'm surprised that his character work gets routinely fellated, it's bang average if that.

>>17334585
It's pretty damn good, certainly shits on nearly all modern fantasy. Also one of the few 'all ages' books that actually is.

>>17331714
Fleeting enjoyment is the only reason I do anything.

>>17334598
Sounds like me desu. If you're neeting or off work due to covid/working from home why not try to get a bit of a schedule in your life?

Have a timed slot for when you're supposed to read. It helped with me, and by then I'd normally get into the book and read for longer anyway.

>Get up for 9am
>Breakfast and shower till 10am
>Fuck around on the internet till 11am
>Read for an hour till lunch
>Video games till 2
>Go for a run, bit of exercise till 3
>3-5 maybe some more Vidya
>6-7 dinner
>7-10 video games or watching a movie
>10-11+ read for a bit more.
That hour reading in bed is so much better than watching TV for falling asleep afterwards. This was basically my covid routine for 4 weeks when I was off work due to the Kung Fu flu. (When I actually had the flu I sacked off the exercise obviously). Maybe something similar will help you lad

>>17334391
Listen I would suck Peter Watts' dick all night, but Wolfe tells a damn good story. Ignoring his superb, evocative world-building (which he achieves even in his short story works), the plots of his stories are very strong.

Even in BotNS, when he is at his most diffuse, the characters and their motivations are realistic and engaging, and fit into the story occurring page-by-page and the wider stories of the world. Every chapter of BotNS works as an independent story about what Severian is doing at that immediate time, and as an individual part of the overall narrative of the series. It's layered, yes, but the quality of the story and world means you can both enjoy it at its most literal (an alpha chad fighting cunts and fucking bitches), or as a piece of a wider puzzle (religious metaphors and allegories).

Wolfe's more recent work, like Long Sun and Land Across, gets a lot more focused while retaining this multi-tier structure. Go read one of his short stories like Tracking Song, and you'll get a similar experience.

However, I can certainly appreciate you might not enjoy this bicameral approach to storytelling, where the attention of the narrator (or plot, if you will) fluctuates between the small and the large. Someones one just wants to read a book about a story.

>>17334711
you've got 6 hours for vidya and 2 hours for reading. that seems like the wrong balance to me.

>>17334750
None of his characters are realistic from what I've read so far. They all become far too attacthed to each other to quickly

>>17334528
>Raistlin
Same. I can't really think of any other "dark wizards" that aren't just generic villains.

>>17331082
>sad_apu.jpg
Reading Children of Dune at the minute... why did they do my girl Alia so bad?
Devoted so much to Paul in the previous book and now it's all of a sudden our of nowhere it's oh yeah the possession and shit, she is a total dictator now lmao.
Where was Jessica in all this? Surely they all knew the support needed for this character?

>>17334753
Yeah maybe, but it's not exactly set in stone. And if everyone on this board actually got two hours reading in every day, there wouldn't be so many shitposts. Even an hour a day is good. Aiming for two is good discipline for me considering I used to struggle to do 30 minutes

Fuck E William Brown

>>17334528
Voldemort and Saruman are the first I think of, and they are pretty good in my opinion as far as evil wizards go, but also kinda childish in a way. Voldemort is more like a ridiculous boogeyman, and Saruman is too clean. Saruman is an evil wizard for children.

>>17334562
Thanks, will look into those wizards. In my opinion, The works by Electric Wizard and other doom bands really nails the depiction of wizards and fantasy.

>>17334644
Thanks, will check out that book. So far I am thinking that the protagonist befriends and is trained by a wizard into fighting another, but that wizard just wanted to get rid of the other wizard for his own gains or something and doesn't actually give a shit about the protagonist, but for now the story is very undefined. And it's also kinda what Dumbledore does to Harry.

>>17331082
Even if you don't like Tolkien or LOTR you gotta give respect

Why isn't there a modern scene for epic poetry? Why does everything have to be a fucking series of novels, a doorstopper, it both?

>>17333145

>>17335101
Why you gotta be a lolicon?

>>17335264
>Discharge Ignite Elementalist.
.... So anytime she has a discharge, it's napalm?
She has a napalm vagina?
Is this copying My Hero Academic? With the glycerin sweat?

>The Unholy Consult opens with fucking Black Sabbath lyrics
What a fucking chad. So far this series has been fucking great, thanks /sffg/

>>17334391
>I have never seen anyone give him credit for anything relating to the actual story told.
Lmao.
So what do they give him credit for? Type setting? The titles of his books? His time in the army? His choice of publishers and cover illustrators?
>muh stoked ego
Some keep saying this but it makes no fucking sense. It's like a dumbest excuse they can come up with to justify the fact they just didn't get what's so good about it. The god damn epigraph suggests it's not a purely cerebral book, but okay
>A thousand ages in thy sight are like an evening gone; Short as the watch that ends the night.

>>17331082
What a weird coincidence. Last night I had the urge to re-read LOTR, as I haven't read them since I was 10. But I've never read the other writings of Tolkien, in what order should I read Silmarillion, etc in order to build a timeline prior to trilogy?

We always talk about lotr. What about the other early giants of sff, like Dracula and Frankenstein?

>>17335392
Silmarillion -> Hobbit -> LOTR is the chad reading order, even for first timers

>>17335397
Dracula goes to shit after the POV switch from Harker but is excellent before then
Frankenstein was so much better than I expected, maybe not quite as good as Dracula; it's also pretty obvious that it's written by woman but in a good way a la Le Guin

>>17335397
Dracula is a great tale. I really enjoy it every time I reread it.

Frankenstein I’ve read once, maybe because it was way more depressing than I expected. Still strong though.

What are the other classics? Is A Christmas Carol a time-travel story? Is Talos not the first robot?

>>17335410
What about Children of Hurin+?

>>17334261
Maybe it'd be easier for you to start with short stories than a whole novel. Short stories you can just kind of imagine a scene and flesh it out, rather than worrying about a whole plot. Here's something that you may be interested in, seems up your alley: https://www.reddit.com/r/fantasywriters/comments/j9iv7q/the_common_tongue_magazine_is_calling_for_dark/

unholy gonsult wins

:DDDD

>>17335266
Because children are sexy

>>17335335
https://youtu.be/idn50Xj_CiY
>And when you walk in golden halls
>You get to keep the gold that falls
>Fool, fool! You’ve got to bleed for the dancer.

>>17335467
The Tales are pretty much alternate/expanded versions of certain chapters of the Silmarillion

>>17335492
So, Eärwa is fucked right? After Kellhus suicide charged their biggest armies AND most of the sorcerer schools into Golgotterath, do the Three Seas even stand a chance?
The Consult have 5 fucking dûnyain ruling it now, which is a total of 4 more than what it took to unite the Three Seas against them, AND the No-God is back

>>17335564
>>17335492

Learn to spoiler faggot

>>17335364
You had the opportunity to elaborate on what makes him good beyond his prose, and sell us on it. But that would only work if that notion had any merit. Your post is more evidence it doesn't. There are plenty of interpretations of the his works floating around all gushing and full of themselves how they managed to notice something or piece something together on their umpteenth reread. But when I look at the bare story, well there is not much to it. It isn't all that compelling, nor can it be.

Complex subjects like those found in say Egan's work require language that is as clear as possible because the ideas themselves are complex enough. There is no need to obfuscate them. Wolfe utilizes the methods of conmen to create something seemingly more significant and intelligent then it is by the way he tells the story. His unreliable narrator can excuse weak characters and nonsensical interaction, because hey Sev just unreliable.

And unlike Egan's work anyone that puts in effort can feel smart and come up with their own unfalsifiable explanation, where as in Egan's work there is a single answer and no matter how much work you put in, how elaborate your pet theory is, it can ultimately be shown to be wrong.

>>17335442
I consider Connecticut Yankee to be the first isekai in the current usage of the term. Man from Present dies from blunt trauma, wakes up in pseudo medieval magic land, uses modern know how to create technological progress and rise through the ranks of the nobility

>>17335564
Thanks fren

>>17335564
Isn’t only 4? I thought kellhus dusted one of them

>>17335624
another hylic filtered by wolfe

Thoughts on Schismatrix? Holds very well in 2021 imo

>>17334528
Maleficent from the old Disney Sleeping Beauty comes to mind. She was kind of archtypical.

Also, Thulsa Doom.

>>17335429
>Dracula goes to shit after the POV switch from Harker but is excellent before then

I *love* the opening Harker sequence of Dracula, and read about 50 pages beyond that before losing interest. Does the book ever regain its mojo? Any standout chapter(s) in the last two-thirds or so?

>>17335825
>does the book ever regain its mojo?
No.

Did Kellhus actually go completely insane?
What if Moënghus could have actually prevented the resurrection of the No-God?

>>17335825
it's all about how these guys are the best friends ever and their friendship will conquer everything.

>>17335624
>But when I look at the bare story, well there is not much to it.
I don't really follow - this is the lynchpin of your argument but I feel it doesn't hold up. Sev's adventure is diverse, action-packed, at times funny and emotional. In addition there is the story of the world, of Urth. Maybe it's just your personal preference

Re: Wolfe versus Egan. This is a bizarre comparison. Egan's work, which I love, exists to be understood, and by extension solved. Thus it is written as you describe. Wolfe's work is written to be experienced. The obfuscating language could exist to cultivate a sense of mysticism, to better portray the protagonist and world Wolfe describes. If you were not receptive to this stylistic choice, that's again your personal preference.

>>17335624
You're not worth a lengthier exposition on Wolfe's merits as a storyteller, sorry.
Suffice to say I did like the books without understanding too much of them on my first read, quite like a fever dream, and was drawn to its atmosphere and weird setting from the start. That powerful first impression couldn't truly be a cerebral one, as you claim. Every corner of that world hints at thousands of years of culture and forgotten knowledge. How not to feel awe from the scale when the very material used by random artists is multicolored sand, substances made of the passage of time itself?
And I did feel the writing wasn't too spectacular, even dry at times, as his digressions were a bit preposterous all things considered, maybe because I had read much of outerlit's canon by the time I first read BotNS, so I had some notion that even on par with other writers, it was mostly a stylistic choice to embellish and convey the tone of the story and the paradoxical personality of its MC. But it's full of hints of Wolfe himself. When Severian unshods his feet to walk on sacred ground, his passions, his love of the stories within stories, the hints of the Godly wonder of the new sun proper, all those obscure references from Wolfe's life.

And when you claim the obfuscation is just a cheap trick, it ignores the true nature of that unreliability, how it relates to memory and what storytelling can be. Severial doesn't really lie. The workings of his memory add a new layer of meaning, and you might call it a gimmick, but most forms of storytelling rely on gimmicks from simple things as standard dramatic structure, to manipulate and affect the reader. You'd have to be profoundly ignorant to scoff at any such attempts in any literary tradition.
>There are plenty of interpretations of the his works floating around
That speaks more of your poor critical thinking and perhaps, insecurities. First of all, who the fuck cares what these alleged people say? Can't you think for yourself?
And secondly, you're literally searching for those interpretations, narrowing your scope. You didn't look at reviews, or you think those impressions are one and the same with the solving of puzzles? How retarded can you be? You're explicitly looking for answers to the many questions in the book. I'm sure you've seen random redditors, boomers from the mailing list or anons discussing all those particulars. Why would such topics be accompanied by impressions (even though they often are, since I can both discuss wtf happened in the mines behind Saltus and think it's a great sequence)? Could it be, that those particulars can be interpreted more objectively? That it's easier and less redundant to talk about it instead of "I really really liked this part in the book"?
>Realistic characters
That is a meme and you're a fool for holding that retarded standard as a rebuke.

Random question: My cousin is an author that is trying to find a new artist for their jacket/covers. The book series is Norse High Fantasy and they are leaning toward poster/print art than the characters they have been using. Here are some examples of what they are looking for. Any suggestions of artist or other authors that they can reach out to for their artist are appreciated.

>>17335624
>sell us on it
Who are you speaking for, newfag? I don't even read Wolfe but nobody in these threads needs to be "sold" on BotNS, unless you're a gaping newfag like yourself.
Stop posting

>>17335624
>And unlike Egan's work anyone that puts in effort can feel smart and come up with their own unfalsifiable explanation, where as in Egan's work
And this is truly the saddest part, your materialistic autism showing.
A Wolfe story leaves you with impressions, questions, information, a framework of things to rearrange in your mind's eye. It never leaves you because you can always change it. The story lives WITH you. The writer opening his doors, welcoming you into the creative process. That, imo, is the greatest form of story telling. It's pure fuel for your imagination and not easily digested food for your intellectual fancies or 'tism.

>>17336162
https://www.instagram.com/vargasni/
https://www.instagram.com/steveargyle/
https://www.instagram.com/caiosantosart/

>>17335866
Khellus didn't go insane per-se, he just reached an impasse where his ultra-rational and deterministic worldview was empirically disproven, and he was forced to improvise and reinterpret the Absolute. The Dunyain of the Consult obviously saw this as him going insane-and Moenghus saw it that way too, since at the time the notion of what Kellhus had witnessed was incompatable with their worldview.

We saw the same effect with the Survivor, except that his journey on the path was accelerated both by his own accumulated trauma, and by the Space Cocaine Mimara gave him. If the truth can be dragged from the darkness of what came before in the manner of the Judging Eye, it categorically BTFOs the Dunyain's entire philosophy.

>>17335866
He went as insane as anyone forced to grasp the magnitude of divinity when merely seconds before he had been an athiest. Too bad that the Erwa gods all suck ass.

>>17336336
Yatwer honestly seems based.

>>17332849
I've read his entire series, that's 7 thick books like a nubian queen's hip thus far, more than once. It's not my favorite fantasy series of all time, that goes to BotNS, but it's up there with Dune, the aforementioned BotNS and LotR. I'm saying this very seriously and very unironically. The metaphysics of Earwa are my favorite out of fantasy and here we see, perhaps along with the likes of Gandalf the White, true powerful mages. Seriously, the mages in Second Apocalypse are probably the strongest mages in fiction, not counting shitty DBZ fanfiction where dudes throw galaxies at each other.

All in all it's very solid but I can see swathes of people being filtered. I've recently started to re-read Aspect Emperor, but only reading Achamian's chapter. Not bullshitting, among the first things mentioned is sranc fapping to the idea of killing humies. It's edgy and grimderp as fuck but also interesting. The Gods in this universe are among the scariest entities I've ever had the chance to read. Up there with the hierodules in Baldanders' tower.

>>17332885
>I don't see what's so important that it takes you minutes to ponder over the meaning.
Ngmi
God forbid you at least digest a book properly and not rush it out.

>>17332885
>Oh, and I know a lot of words. I doubt Gene could find one that I wouldn't know.
Hierodule

>>17336104
>his digressions were a bit preposterous all things considered
I read these sections as when Thecla's personality had taken over and she was writing through Sev

re: the fever dream, in total agreement. all about that wolfe mood

>>17332885
>Audiobookfag

idk why ya'll even bothered arguing with this plebian

>>17332935
I'm afraid of this opinion desu
I KNOW some people have been filtered by the names I use in my fiction, but I always considered it's because most of my friends don't really read books.
Do you people seriously hate weird naming? For me, one of the biggest let downs was Dune's protagonist name, Paul. I mean 100000 years into the future, a literal messiah is born and he's named.... Paul.

>>17336570
It's peak midwit opinion, name your characters whatever the fuck you want

>>17336599
What did you expect from a fag posting SnK?

>>17331082
First time i read it in the ussr translation and publication. Years after i found out that this edit was heavily changed and cropped and had lots of differences from original.

>>17336360
>Dread mother of birth
She probably forces you to have sex with ciphrang until your cock melts off and your balls explode like meteors for eternity if you get in her grasp once you die.
Still better than chewed like chewy gum by Ajokli tho... maybe

>>17332849
If you can get past the edgy self insert it has some interesting ideas. Personnaly I couldn't so I gave up half way through

>>17336771
How is Achamian edgy?

Is it cheesy or based that Bakker basically copy-pasted everything from the real crusades?

On top of everything before, He’s now describing Shimeh and it’s exactly like Jerusalem.

>>17336793
Kellhus is obviously the self insert

>>17336823
>character is powerful so he must be a self-insert

tvtropes pseuds were a mistake

>>17336840
>He's so smart he can read minds by looking at your expression
Exactly the kind of story I told myself when I was 12

>>17336874
In a world already full of actual wizards, gods, dragons, and cumbrain sex-goblins

>>17336823
Nah bro, Akka definitely holds at least some part of the soul of a self insert. Bakker obviously likes and romanticizes the idea of the struggling, tortured scholar, so immersed in his studies and his own thoughts that he becomes a hermit. Though this is only more obvious as the series go on. In Judging Eye you see exactly what Bakker "wants" to be, for the lack of a better word.
"He smiled a sad upside-down smile. Some small memory winced at the
barbarity of the place, for he had spent a good portion of his life travelling
the fleshpots of the South. But it had been home for far too long to seem
anything other than safe. For nearly twenty years he had slept, studied, and
supped in this room.
He walked different roads now. Deeper roads."

Bakker wants to be the archetypal hermit scholar, mysterious and deep, hateful of the lesser, real world and insane with arcane knowledge, unwashed but wearing his dirt with pride against the blank of the world.

>>17336891
Whenever I see the coomer wojak I think about sranc
>white, bald, grimacing, coombrain
It's like the meme of the bald pale unwashed coomer permeated into the "real" world.

>>17336554
Probably correct, and the legion of autarchs probably seeped through Severian's speech as well. Severian's pristine self is not particularly wise, mostly educated and manipulative subservience probably. His coming of age, intellectually, was taking the soup(s). The other interesting aspect is his faith and piety. I would need to reread if it was always there, or if it just grew on its own, through experience and revelation (which would echo Wolfe's own conversion to Catholicism). So many other of his MCs automatically go through the steps of ritual belief, for appearance's sake so to speak, until something truly humbles them and they start believing.

And speaking of games and puzzle solving, the other day I read that Wolfe confirmed that one of the books Thecla asks for while in the oubliette is a copy of BotNS. It's such a subtle hint at how Wolfe shapes circularity into something original that escapes the whole "mechanics" of the plot, which that other dude argued against.

>>17336874
meanwhile severian gets drugged with magic mushrooms then pisses himself, and still manages to beat some cheeks

wolfe haters destroyed yet again

>>17336617
oh how so? was it translation-wise, or more critical-of-russia-wise?

>>17335475
I am considering just writing some short stories set in the world that I have built, with the aim of later weaving them into the general main story.

>>17336906
>Bakker wants to be the archetypal hermit scholar, mysterious and deep, hateful of the lesser, real world and insane with arcane knowledge, unwashed but wearing his dirt with pride against the blank of the world.
Is this why we haven't heard anything from him for almost a year?
Has he finally embraced the hermit life?
Is he working on the No-God trilogy on a mad Nonmen coke binge?

>>17334694
>something about his writing style just irritates me
>it's bang average if that
Another anon here called it "bluepilled cyncism" and it strikes me as exactly correct.

>>17335743
It's pretty good. Like a less visionary, but cleaner and longer version of Neuromancer, scratches the same itch very well.

>>17337119
Apparently he took a break to restore a barn and focus on his family. Seems healthy desu, I think having to go so deep into the darkness to finish TUC must have taken a lot out of him.

Good series take time to finish, Tolkien worked on LotR his entire life. I’m willing to wait a few years for the No-God books. The modern demand to write and publish everything rapidly according to a publisher’s demanding schedule is cancer to the slow and contemplative nature of the writing process.

>>17337119
Last I heard he was off larping as a carpenter in the Canadian wilderness

>>17336822
If the Holy War is based on the crusades it's a really overstated version of it. Like, they were barely a scritch when compared to the conflicts going on inside the muslim world and the mongol invasions. Keep in mind that the first trilogy was written two decades ago when discussion of Islam in the west was probably at an all time high.

Can someone recommend something epic in scope like The Expanse? Like discovering ring worlds, or planets at war with each other. Character development should be top notch too. thanks

>>17337029
if you're interested read this article, truly interesting https://www.mirf.ru/book/vlastelin-kolec-v-sssr-pereskaz-bobyr/ (use translator in your browser)
TLDR - the original translator of the book knew nothing about fantasy as a genre, but was keen in sci - fi. So she translated the original book with science fiction canons in mind. She also wanted all 3 book to fit in one - so she threw away a lot of exposition (sometimes even whole chapters). But the best thing about this edition is that there was a book inside the book which tells the story about five scientists who examine alien artifact - the ring.
All of this was done not only because the editor knew shit about fiction. U couldn't use magic in your stories cause u'd be blamed in mysticism. Also Tolkien was an English author, so he was "bourgeois" and soviet censors wouldn't like it.

>>17332578
>>17332885
must be the same smooth brain who wrote his cringy little reviews of Hyperion

>>17332605
>>17336532
>ngmi
Not him but what does that stand for?

>>17337011
>the other day I read that Wolfe confirmed that one of the books Thecla asks for while in the oubliette is a copy of BotNS
mad. share the link if you find it again, no worries if not. I love when the book itself occurs in-universe, like Blindsight in Echopraxia

>>17337371
newfags get me indignant

>>17337239
>so she threw away a lot of exposition (sometimes even whole chapters)
Today I learned that the Strugatsky's bitching about Soviet censorship was heavily understated

>>17337377
>love when the book itself occurs in-universe
Me too. I really enjoyed finding copies of the Metro books in the video games as well as posters and adverts

>>17337239
that is absolutely bonkers, thanks a lot for sharing. What an interesting thought experiment, to translate a work of fiction into another language without any idea of the base genre. surely there were concepts of folk stories and myth though? who knows. wild idea, wish my PycckN was good enough to blitz through russian scifi lotr

>>17335624
You got filtered, simple as. If only you would tripfag so I could filter you too.

>>17337426
Soviet people understood the concept of myths bc they had heritage of russian folklore. Our fairy tales, ballads, proverbs and all this things are truly unique and amazing. The problems is, it differs a lot from western Europe folklore and western fantasy would be accepted by soviets with some issues, i guess. Also, keep in mind the fact that translation of foreign literature was very limited, especially magic stories.

>>17337343
Yeah, that's me. What's bothering you? Wanna fight about it?

>>17337371
"Not gonna make it"
I don't know where the phrase came from exactly. But it appears to be used by faggots who want to feel like they're above you, but don't want to be bothered will all that annoying logic and reason.
Ignore them. Spouting "NGMI" is the biggest tip off that they're assholes and likely trolls.

>>17337620
nah, do your thing. at least you're trying to read great books. if your takeaways are different from mine, who cares?
still better than all that Sanderson and Bakker faggotry going on here.

>>17337646
First use on lit was on Wed Mar 8 19:39:24 2017 as the acronym anyway,

>>17337646
I think it originated from /fit/.

>>17337758
It did. /fit/ and Bodybuilding.com's Misc. memes underline lots of current internet culture.

>Damned after all.

>>17337769
My first glimpses of (((them))) was thanks to a misc thread. Wild times.

>>17337670
Alrighty then.
I figured I'd give this book a try, since it's been recommended a dozen times. The only thing that was holding me back from reading this series before was the bad audiobook narrator. But I found a version with a better narration, and so here I am giving it a shot.
But I have to admit that after getting it recommended so many times, I'm feeling it's rather overrated. I mean, I still haven't finished book 2 yet. But I was expecting this to be up there with the greats. And it's just like "Hooded man falls in love with every girl he sees and lops heads off."

But anyway, I was reviewing Sanderson just before this. Were you not here for that? Read The Emperor's Soul, Elantris, and Warbreakers. And regret most of it. I'm *this* close to deeming Sanderson "shit". If the next book I read from him is as much of a slog as Elantris and Warbreakers, then I'll swear off Sanderson forever. But the thing is, I don't even want to risk reading another Sanderson title, unless an anon enthusiastically recommends it. Which no one has done so far. Everyone's just like "I-I g-g-guess Stormlight is pretty good"

>>17337758
Really now? I thought it was an art thing first.

>>17337841
well, I scroll past most posts containing any hint of Sanderson or Bakker because these posts are mostly worthless trash, so I might have missed that.

regarding BotNS: I've felt kind of similar while reading it. loved the prose, but it felt kind of underwhelming. now in retrospect I like it more and more. hard to explain why, guess it's just the way the whole thing ties together.
definitely gonna read Long Sun and Short sun and re-read BotNS at some point.

Honestly, I didn't think Blindsight was that good.

>The reflex, like gagging, to forever be the one aggrieved.

>>17337925
it was good, but not as great as people hype it.
maybe I'm a pleb, but I liked the vampires.

>>17337911
>definitely gonna read Long Sun and Short sun and re-read BotNS at some point.
This is when it all comes together, it's incredible how coherent the plot and themes of the solar are maintained over the 20 years they were written.

>>17337566
yeah I was wondering how one could mis-translate Tolkein with the immense Russian folk mythos. Either way, it's an interesting story.

>>17337925
I read Blindsight when I was 15 and it really blew my socks off. due to this bias I've struggled to really view it critically. what didn't you really like about it? Or was it more a general 'meh'

Is it true what they say that the golden compass is just a smug atheist take down of narnia?

>>17338105
It was a more general meh.

I'd been exposed to the ideas before, though. I was in university and having classes on cognition, emotion, etc. Maybe that blunted the edge a bit.

>>17338283
Yeah, Blindsight's the kind of novel that either makes someone illiterate on cognition brain's explode or they don't get it at all.

>>17338283
I read it for the first time when I was taking Adv. Cognitive Neuroscience lawl

>>17338472
>jet turbines
?

>>17338500
bidirectional engines

>>17338518
But you need to go in six directions in space.

>>17338550
Maybe it's because you do most of your accelaration and deccelaration in a straight line. It might have other thrusters that are small.

>>17338500
99% of the spaceships on the covers of science fiction books have no similarity, in either appearance or even basic method of propulsion, to the spaceships described in those books. A lot of the time you might even find a spaceship-clad tome with no space travel in it.
The Revenger cover has a reasonably book-accurate space-vessel. The two sequels however, have atrociously bad spaceships on them, where the hack artist just phoned it in and slapped some crude sails onto what seem like public-domain 3d models that appear to be "heavily influenced" by Stargate ships.

>>17338682
But at least it isn't this blatant.

>>17338707
What a shitty unreadable font

Anyone know any good "dudes arguing in a lab" sci-fi? Stuff like The Andromeda Strain, technothrillers that remain focused on the science and don't just devolve into fistfights and gun battles in the final act.

>>17338741
8RRRRYRR

>>17338785
Blood Music

>>17331082
i think i liked having lotr read to me as a kid more than reading it myself or listening to the audio books. also the silmarillion is better than the other books.

>>17338785
A huge chunk of Asimov's oeuvre is 'men sit in a room and attempt to solve/rationalize a problem'

>>17338550
No not really. At best you only need small thrusters for adjusting your course to compensate if you get too close to a gravity well or something. You need thrusters of equal power in fore and aft positions so you can accelerate to top speed and decelerate to rest. The engines can be put in standby mode once you're at top speed since inertia will carry you at that velocity until you're ready to stop.

>>17338785
>dudes arguing in a lab
"Nerves" is a novella that gave me this feel

>>17334018
What'd he say?

>>17337239
man the revolution really destroyed Russian culture huh?

>>17336537
Is that a word found in the book? I'll admit, I don't know it. But I could probably figure out it's meaning from the context it's used in. Can you post the sentence or paragraph it was used in?

How’s the novel coming along, Anon? Get any writing done today?

>>17338990
This looks like it was made with Inkarnate.

>>17339030
You would be correct there, friend.

Is it actually bad or just misunderstood genius?

>>17338990
No, but post more maps. I've always been a little confused about Inkarnate. Does it actually generate maps from scratch or are you still drawing them yourself? Would you say it's worth it?

>>17339244
It’s genius and a classic.

>”Prepare to embrace your creators in the stygian haunts of hell, barbarian", gasped the first soldier.
>”Only after you have kissed the fleeting stead of death, wretch!" returned Grignr.
>Asweeping blade of flashing steel riveted from the massive barbarians hide enameled shield as his rippling right arm thrust forth, sending a steel shod blade to the hilt into the soldiers vital organs. The disemboweled mercenary crumpled from his saddle and sank to the clouded sward, sprinkling the parched dust with crimson droplets of escaping life fluid.

Bakker wishes he could write like this.

>>17339276
I just use the free version. It’s completely draw-your-own. The pro version allows more assets and options, but the free version is absolutely adequate for from-scratch worldbuilding.

I would consider your country names, friend; they don’t exactly roll off the tongue.
>>17339059
>>17338990
Pic related is the full world map of my novel’s setting. I find it easy to worldbuild, and have sketched out the basics of 3 languages in my setting as well as a detailed picture of 3000 years of world and local history. But writing the damn characters and their dialogue is a stumbling block for me.

>>17339308
>Bakkeresque names

Based

>>17339276
Inkarnate is a build your own. It's got two tiers: free and pro. Free tier gives you all the tools, but only basic assets. Pro gives you tons of different assets from a variety of flavors of world building to work with. Or that's how it was when I last checked. The dev was working on a major update but 2020 being what it was, I stopped following Inkarnate's development.

>>17339308
>ocean of seas
right...

>>17339437
it says “sighs” baka

>>17332720
The Lord Ruler walks out of a burning building as bones and heals himself.

>>17339308
>>17339426
Ah thanks, I think I'll pass for now then. I'm too much of a brainlet to make my world from scratch entirely, and my story mostly takes place on the water so I really just need relative locations, not topography.

>I would consider your country names, friend; they don’t exactly roll off the tongue.
Those are just the default names that Azgaar pumped out. I haven't put too much effort into map making yet. I just pumped out a couple to kind of get an idea.

>>17334820
>and now it's all of a sudden our of nowhere
What?
It was known she was an abomination and the dangers related to it.

She failed at managing her personas.
She was good at covering it up; Could not protect herself like the Twins managed to do.

Jesssica?
Keep reading.

>>17338785
The Black Cloud

>>17339308
do you just worldbuild? or do you work on characters and plot too?

Was watching an interview with Erikson and I feel kinda bad for him, he was talking about how he wrote forge of darkness partially as a way to flex his writing abilities and it got submitted to an awards committee where they apparently didn’t even read it, I guess that’s what you get for writing as autistically as him but still

>>17339884
yes, but i find characters and plot much more difficult.... that’s why my novel has been stuck in neutral for the last 5 years.

>>17334701
B A S E D

>>17331744
I read dianetics and it made me want to maul someone irl

I want to worldbuild but I just can't be bothered, coming up with names and histories and locations is too hard, I just want to write warriors fighting monsters and sorcerers and other warriors.

>>17338472
Reynolds is my favorite sci-fi author. Downright quality shit, I found chasm city in a bargain bin at my hairstylist’s when I was 16, it blew me the fuck out of the water.

>>17340248
do it

>>17340248
Then do it, faggot. Worldbuilding is only really needed if you have a big enough scale where the countries also double as characters that need believable motive, or where you need a strict map for things such as military campaigns. If your scale is smaller than that, just make shit up as you go.

>>17335825
That section is by far the best part of the book. Everything after doesn't really measure up to it as horror, and somewhere in the last third or so it becomes a straight up adventure story about some rich Victorian dudes in a battle of wits with a vampire.

>>17340259
The twist bothered me though. I can't just start empathizing with the super ultra evil guy.

How do you write good, unique, nuanced, flawed, but still heroic characters? It’s so hard bros

>>17333111

All clearly (pseudo)anglosaxon names.

>>17340248
I want to world build but I'm bad at telling stories in the traditional sense. My stories aren't "humanistic" as one critic of my work once told me. They're written like history, sometimes really compelling history, sometimes really dry and unnecessarily detailed, but I don't really do "close up" writing from a person's perspective. I just don't find it as interesting as describing the larger picture of what is going on. I don't think I'm capable of writing a novel like this, unless I somehow learn how to write characters as they appear in most novels.

>>17340495
Figure out what the heroic qualities of your character are. For example, one of the reasons I like the Earthsea books is that Ged is about as much of an ascetic or holy man as he is a straight up fantasy hero, which is informed by the pseudo-Taoist leanings of the setting

>>17340555
Try using as many POVs as needed. Academics as characters, too.

The big picture stuff must have some people pushing it and some people being pushed by it. What are they thinking about it?

>>17334056
That'd be because they were. A Wizard of Earthsea, IIRC, was done partly because Le Guin's editor asked her to do something for a younger public. The Tombs of Atuan got nominated for a Newbery award, same one Bridge to Terabithia got. Le Guin also was pretty forthcoming about worldbuilding by the seat of her pants and didn't know what was on any of the islands until she set a story on them, it's just not as noticeable as usual because she's drawing on a lot of anthropological (and general) knowledge while doing so.

>>17340555

Larger picture novels can be done good. The Foundation series from Asimov is an excellent example. By the end of it you cant remember any of the characters but the whole story is amazing and it sticks.

>>17338990
A steady pace of at least 1k words a day on the second draft. Revisiting the chapters I've written as long as 3 years ago has been a treat. I'm hoping I'll be done and submitting by march, but who's to say

>>17339308
thats interesting, because I really can't be arsed about detailed world building. I like the reader to do a lot of the work for me. I just make sure it's consistent.

>>17340676
please please post a passage here
that goes for all other would-be /sffg/ novelists ITT

>>17340701
to see if we're bad or how you compare?
sorry but i don't want any of my work connected to 4ch.

>>17337841
>I don't even want to risk reading another Sanderson title, unless an anon enthusiastically recommends it
I suppose as the resident sandersoy I'll test your resolve one last time. His Mistborn novels are still the best thing he's produced. The first 3 are a tightly written action fantasy with an excellent cast of characters and a "save the world" plot that ends up feeling meaningful in a way he doesn't hit in Elantris or Warbringer. I know how much you detest exposition dump lore, and I've said before that's almost unavoidable with Sanderson, but he manages to show some restraint with it through Mistborn. If you make it through Final Empire and still think he's shit, you'll know he's not for you, but I'd be remiss as a fan of you were still curious and I didn't point you toward the best shit.

>>17340750
not a good fren :(

>>17332801
white luck and judging eye are a little slow but the last two make up for it

>>17340784
lol thaat title formula is real shit tho.
Ive noticed just how many books are titled along the line of an [x] of [y] and [z].

gods of jade and shadow
children of blood and bone
A court of throne and roses

>>17331736
Proud of you, Ratto. Personal hygiene is important.

>>17338990
>The Spic

>Something must be eaten.

>>17334863
fuck off saruman is based

>>17340495
Focus on values. What does the character value in life, such that they would feel they've lived a poor life if they didn't pursue things in line with those values?

Values != goals. A good value can be achieved in many ways, whereas a good goal should be very specific. "A sense of family and belonging" is a good value, as that may mean the person adopts others, bridges connections between families, or more straightforwardly, get a spouse and have children.

A good character, IMO, has one or a couple of values that really shine through: it's clear that this value primarily drives them, but experience has shown them that there's at least a little bit more to life (or a lot more, if you want real nuance). Note, obviously, that the character need not be aware of this values/goals stuff: they can define their life entirely through goals, as most people do; or not think about goal-setting whatsoever; or have a few goals some of the time, and so on. But it should be clear to you what their real values are.

A well-made heroic character will have elements of heroism as at least some of those values-via-experience (as opposed to innate values and/or values from extremely early life experience).

>>17341081
that;s pretty much every fantasy these days and forever

The heavens, the sun, the whole of nature is a corpse. Nature is given over to the spiritual, and indeed to spiritual subjectivity; thus the course of nature is everywhere broken in upon by miracles.

What did bakkaro mean by this?

>>17335335
Fictional seduction
On a black snow sky
Sadness kills the superman
Even fathers cry

>>17341289
>What did bakkaro mean by this?
Using Hegel to justify his magic-system mumbo jumbo.

there is no better filter in /lit/ than the end of the warrior prophet with serwes heart

>WHAT THE HELL IS THIS THIS MAKES NO SENSE, WHERE THE HELL DID HE GET THE HEART FROM? DID HE HIDE IT UP HIS ASSHOLE OMG NO NO NO THERE IS NO GOD MIRACLES CAN'T BE TRUE THIS IS A PPPPPLOTHIOLE IT ISN'T EXPLAINED!!!

>>17341233
>t. can't read uncial script
ngmi my brotha

>>17332801
White Luck is unfortunately the weakest book in the whole series, it's a slog indeed. Just wait though. The next two books are pure fire, the greatest of Bakker's work.

Just bought blackfish city, what am I in for?

>mentally ill bakker autists are back

>>17341454
It's literally one super autist who spams soijacks and and other cringy shit.

>>17341454
Preferable to the schizo who can't stop shitposting about Sanderson imo.

>>17341454
Join us, Brother. Truth shines!

>>17341479
They are equally tiring, if only for the repetitiveness.

>>17338990
I'm still planning and writing backstory for this one. I want to start writing this weekend, because I know the plot and enough of the characters. I just want to come up with some familial factions and some of the figures in the church.

I know this isn't the case with all fantasy books but how come they always fall into the trappings of
>Elves
>Dwarves
>Orcs
Why do they do this?

>>17341502
>>17341478
Sorry, Anons. I'll stop if I displease you so. It's just the best fantasy series I've ever read, and besides it's infinitely memeable. Forgive me. I will depart, and go into the west.

>>17341538
Tolkein

>>17341538
They're well known tropes so you don't have to waste time explaining shit

>>17340784
ok. I'll give Mistborn a shot. But first, I'm going into book 3 of Book of the New Sun. So Mistborn has to wait.

I used to love reading scifi and fantasy when I was younger and I still love the settings but almost every time I try something I've been recommended I find the writing to be so stiff and amateurish that it detracts from my enjoyment of the books. Just this really repetitive, cliched phrasing that I immediately notice and it drives me nuts, even from supposedly acclaimed authors. The only author I've read who doesn't write like that is Gene Wolfe. So are there any others with a similar caliber of writing to Gene Wolfe?

>>17341826
Le Pringles Man is head and shoulders above everyone except Tolkien. But you could try Silverberg or Vance

>>17338157
No. It's not a "takedown" of Narnia at all, unless you think that children's literature must portray all the authority figures as wholly good, respectable, and void of personal flaws and protagonists as naive ingenues.

>>17338157
>>17341856
If you want to read an actual takedown of Narnia check out The Problem of Susan by Neil Gaiman. He destroys C.S. Lewis' entire career. Keep in mind that it only makes sense if you've actually read The Chronicles of Narnia though, so do that first.

>>17340495
>muh flaws

2015 called

>>17341893

>>17341851
Yeah, I considered mentioning Tolkien as another example of high quality writing but I figured that was already a given. I'll take a look at the others though. Any suggestions on which of their works to start with?

>>17341924
That comment seems correct.

>>17341978
That post seems retarded. You'd think the historic losses would make you realize that strawman arguments are not winning anyone over to your side but apparently you live in your own deluded reality where you can never be wrong about anything and every post you make is a badass argument-ender. Well, that can only take you so far before you hit the wall called facts.

>>17341931
Dying Inside and Emphyrio

>>17341893
I wouldn't put it so dramatically, but Gaiman was absolutely correct about how strangely Susan's character is handled in the last book. The combination of the dismissive "she turned silly and conceited" excuse with the fact that her whole fucking family got killed and she's left to deal with that completely offscreen is just bizarre. It's like Lewis decided to make a point instead of writing proper character development and story resolution, but that point didn't really make sense to anyone except himself.

>>17341978
>>17341924
At least learn to spell the name of your boogeyman correctly, you insane person.

>>17338857
If it's not rhetorical question than yeah, it damaged the culture a lot, especially everything related to religion, trying to change Christian dogmas on proletarian ideology.

>>17340784
Sanders is very left wing and always talks about social justice.

>>17341654
you should finish all its books, including Urth. they really are just parts of a greater story.

SLAAAAAVE
New thread ya disgusting MAGGOT

>>17342211
That's true, he does have a boner for marginalized people, but outside of basic class conflict there's really no lefty pandering in Mistborn.

>>17332620
>What is The Sound and the Fury?

>>17342638
New Thread!
>>17342638
New Thread!
>>17342638
New Thread!

>>17331082
Tolkien has many reactionary messages in his books, some are quite obvious, like Sarumans arc.