/lit/ - Literature

start with the greeks

>>4911784
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_OTz-lpDjw

>>4911787
They had a lot of gods and some of them were dead.

>>4911788
>newsboys

Oh god, they exist, I had forgotten

Hey OP, what are they?
Also, in what Nietchze work is this mentioned?

>>4911784
>God is NOT dead

>>4911819
Thus Spake Zarathustra

>Hey OP, what are they?
That mankind has outgrown the need for gods, that god is essentially meaningless in the modern world so it's up to each individual to decide their own meaning.

>>4911826
Cool I like choose your own adventure games. Don't really see the need to stop shaving for a few days, though I could go for a cup of coffee right now.

I think of it like: God is Dead *quiet*

He never spoke and will never speak and basically we're all on our own.

>tfw you finally step out of his shadow

>>4911792
Yeah! And they're like a fuckin supergroup now... the singer is the black guy from dctalk. Unfuckingstoppable!

>>4911792
Newsboys had some good songs, actually. "Shine" is still good, and that breakfast one too.

They're a hundred times better than literally all other Christan rock. They still kind of suck, though.

>>4911784
>god is dead

>>4911893
Yeah, that image really illustrates how true it is.

>>4911784
>implications
>muh after life
>muh loving father
>muh prayer to give me strength
>muh heaven
>muh after life
>muh everything will be ok at the end

Yea, God being dead means you gotta deal with all the shit in this life by yourself (as you've always done) exept this time you don't that magical illusion in your mind of some superpower that was there to help you.

And yea, when you die it's over, you are done. It is really your eternal obliteration and you will never ever open your eyes again, you will never be here again. For an eternity to come, you won't be.

It also means complete freedom to do you whatever the fuck you wanna do, and any rules you live by, you make up or adhere to, including moral ones.

>>4911896
>Yeah, that image really illustrates how true it is.

it does

>>4911899
It takes just as much faith to believe that as it does to believe in God.

>>4911914
Science proves you wrong, actually.

>>4911925
>Science proves you wrong, actually

Gonna need a citation for that then.

>>4911928
Wheelchair man, 2011.

>>4911914
>thinks it take as much "faith" to NOT believe in unicorns as it does to believe in them?
replace unicorns with big foot, the loch ness monster, the spaghetti monster, Thor... you name it

Didn't nietzche mean it metaphorically and the metaphor is that you become the supermanz but since god was made up by weakmanz it ends up being literal anyway?

Someone help me remember where I read this. Basically, god killed himself. Blew himself into pieces. Each piece is an atom. All of the universe is basically god's corpse rearranged in some kind of post-mortem pantheism.

The idea is that god basically knew everything and was everything, and this was a stalemate of sorts. The only move to make was towards non-existence. Thus the god killing himself part.

>>4911941
>Wheelchair man, 2011.
monocle man, 1930

>>4911943
>>thinks it take as much "faith" to NOT believe in unicorns as it does to believe in them?
this is a strawman
It takes as much faith to BELIEVE this: >>4911899 as if does to believe in God

>>4911959
"God's Debris" by Dilbert

>>4911970
Read Dawkins.

>>4911981
>Read Dawkins.
This is not a valid argument
read Chesterton

>>4911970
>this is a strawman
doesn't matter, keep living defined by "faith" then, if wishful thinking allows you to live a decent life, so be it

>>4912005
>doesn't matter, keep living defined by "faith" then, if wishful thinking allows you to live a decent life, so be it

>implying I'm even advocating my MY beliefs

So this means you concede defeat?

>>4911984
>This is not a valid argument

True. Not having an argument with someone misinformed about the balance of evidence for god. Read Dawkins.

>>4912012
>So this means you concede defeat?
>implying it even takes "faith" to not believe in God
do you even into atheism?

>>4911984
Seriously, no one cares enough to argue with you. Except for this one guy. If you want to live in self-deception, you can. Ultimately, no one is going to save it from you but yourself.

Speaking for myself, this stopped being an important question what feels like a lifetime ago. Then you move on to something actually worth discussing. Those who make Christianity and Atheism their identity are stuck and you're just spinning your wheels wasting their time while the rest of us are trying to accomplish other things that are actually productive.

>>4912018
Agnosticism takes no faith.

Atheism is a very hard stance on religion and does require some faith.

>>4912019
>Except for this one guy
I'm.. I'm sorry
I'll stop feeding the troll

>>4912031
Look what you have done, sempai.

>>4912016
I see you have been misinformed about the balance of evidence for god.

read Chesterton

>>4912018
>implying it even takes "faith" to not believe in God
Strawman. Not my point at all.
I am saying it takes faith to believe in the points made here. >>4911899


>>4912019
>Seriously, no one cares enough to argue with you.
plenty of people do. You care enough to write 93 words in response.

>>4912019
>Except for this one guy. If you want to live in self-deception, you can. Ultimately, no one is going to save it from you but yourself.

This assumes I am actually advocating for my personal beliefs. Getting personal and arguing about feelings isn't valid, sorry.

>wasting their time while the rest of us are trying to accomplish other things that are actually productive.
like posting on the internet?

>>4912025
No.

Since man made all these myths up, you are left with a theism devoid of any honest starting point or reason. If there is any god it/she/he/they either 1) don't like us/have nothing to do with us, 2) don't know about us, or 3) died during or after "creation". How in the hell do you worship this?
An agnostic simply doesn't want to peel that last layer away.

Oddly enough, it's the Christians who should be clinging to "scientism" to rekindle their dying religion.

Atheism isn't faith based in the least.

>>4911893
>the most religious place in western world is still religious

wow

>>4912048
>hristians who should be clinging to "scientism" to rekindle their dying religion.
Christianity isn't the whole of religion.

Christianity is falling to secularism however Islam is growing.
Islam is being imported into the Western world
Islam does not tolerate liberal progressive secularism

Atheism has opened a pandora's box that will breath life into the new theocrats of tomorrow

>>4912048
>If there is any god it/she/he/they either 1) don't like us/have nothing to do with us, 2) don't know about us, or 3) died during or after "creation".

You claim this based on faith, no? What are these claims based on?

>>4912048
Of course they shouldn't. Christianity should have faith in themselves to find observational evidence proving gods existence, aka Ken Ham's findings. These are not based in the scientific foundational knowledge, of course.

Atheism does require some faith because it means you are certain of the absence of god, which was once extremely more pervasive throughout the nooks and interstices of human existence. Now, though, you don't have so much of a severe obligation.

It definitely took a lot of faith in the human spirit for Nietzsche to declare god was dead. It's not faith defined by religion, but of course that's not the literal definition of faith anyway.

What's the transition like? Never experienced this, I became an atheist at age 3 after reading Bertie Russell.

I've always wondered.

>>4912064
Arabs are growing.

So if "liberal progressive secularism" as you see it, tolerates Islam, you might be stuck with multiple generations of devout Muslims in your western nations. But that doesn't seem to be happening.

>>4912087
>you might be stuck with multiple generations of devout Muslims in your western nations.
>But that doesn't seem to be happening.

Oh you must be sadly mistaken than.

http://www.frontpagemag.com/2013/dgreenfield/muslim-immigration-to-america-doubled-since-1992/
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/religion/2011-01-27-1Amuslim27_ST_N.htm
http://rt.com/news/christianity-decline-uk-islam-rise-405/
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4385024,00.html
http://www.d-intl.com/2013/12/17/most-european-muslims-want-sharia/?lang=en
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2013/12/21/Study-Two-Thirds-of-European-Muslims-Believe-in-Sharia-over-State-Laws

>>4912068
There all that's left to a theist to have faith in. Not believing in any of them isn't a faith.

>>4912102
>Not believing in any of them isn't a faith.
That's right, and that's called agnosticism.

Can we all agree this poster should think their posts through a little more?

I don't care that you have a name, its kind of endearing really, just try to keep up.

>>4911784
is this liek an epik maymay

this exact thread was done already and it was the craziest deja vu to see this on the catalog

>>4912101
No politifact? No Enquirer?

Whites are a minority. So what? If civilization can survive the next couple of crises, and raise people up out of the slums, educate them, the soap bubble of faiths will finally pop and following generations will live free of it.

Your little horsey picture is quaint.

>>4912111
>Not believing in any of them isn't a faith.
>That's right, and that's called agnosticism.
No boob. Believing that one of them is just as likely and that you can't make such a judgment is agnosticism.
>Can we all agree this poster should think their posts through a little more?
Yes you should.

Personally I went from Christian to "Gnostic" and inserted a heap of scientific facts and just made up my own faith. Existential crisis is all this got me. Then the epiphany.

>>4912122
>Whites are a minority. So what?
Strawman. whites being a minority is not my point.
Muslim becoming a majority and enforcing Sharia law is. This will happen if current trends continue.

>If civilization can survive the next couple of crises, and raise people up out of the slums, educate them, the soap bubble of faiths will finally pop and following generations will live free of it.

any backing to this claim?
If the poor could be anything productive they would no longer be poor.
The proletariat is shit and will always be shit. Those backward fools will never be able to provide a backbone strong enough to fight against the bourgeois. They will collapse and kneel for the pitiful prize of becoming petty bourgeois themselves.

Your little horsey picture is quaint.

>>4912102

what?

>>4912140
man, what the fuck

>man made all these myths up
>>If there is any god it/she/he/they either 1) don't like us/have nothing to do with us, 2) don't know about us, or 3) died during or after "creation".

how are you postulating these claims as objective fact, what on earth are you basing these claims on

>>4912141
Let me restate. (I do tend to overload sometimes)
They will not enforce Sharia law. I doubt they, the Arabs and Turks in western nations, will remain Muslim for long. I work with many Persians and they aren't very devout at all. Their children even less so. You, and RT etc., read "trends" wrong.

>any backing to this claim?
No, we'll probably continue to follow people like you and march our little selves out to be slaughtered till the extinction events choke us out of existence. No one will read Shakespeare then.

"God is dead" is easily one of the most widely misinterpreted phrases ever written.

>>4912151
nobody is postulating those claims as fact. Can you read? They're just conclusions that can be drawn based on what information we have.

Personally I think they're slightly silly conclusions, based on the woefully ludicrous assumption that God is like us, but that's neither here nor there.

I knew that feel. Then I went back to the Greeks.

Join us here where Chaos is the condition of possibility for differentiation and the existence of entities. Where Tartarus reigns below the ocean encircled earth, a deep abyss that even the gods are afraid of.

I take God is dead as a cry for help/desperation rather than a bold statement.

>>4911893
>Not getting Nietzsche's easiest concept
>shitposting this hard
>tripfag
Figures.

>>4911826
>That mankind has outgrown the need for gods

I don't know if Nietzsche would agree with this, considering his writings on the Greeks and Dionysus. He's definitely not an atheist in the traditional sense, The parable of the mad man is a critique of atheists. And in any case, "must we not become Gods ourselves to make us worthy of the deed [killing God]?"

Heidegger sort of takes up that question and finds it impossible for men to take on the role of Gods. Instead, he looks towards poetic language.

So what does "God is dead" mean?

>>4912307
The influence of the Christian God in important societal matters is all but gone

>>4912307
The ideal is lost.

>>4912162
>persians
>arabs

Top kek m8. Im Persian, and my family is atheist as fuck. Not only that, but we do a good job of assimilating. Arabs on the other hand? They will form their own ghettos, patrol the streets and beat people who drink alcohol or women who aren't covered up. They will have 15 kids for welfare money and raise each one of them on their local arab communities with strict islamic law. Do not make assumptions, Westeen Europe IS on its way to becoming an islamic state if current immigration trends continue.

The great irony of western liberal democracy is that its death will be brought upon itself. These people have very current ideas on how society should be governed, and this WILL express itself in the political sphere. Don't be naive

>>4912141
Haha my god this conversation is amusing. Do you even know what strawman means?

>>4911784
Are you talking about The Way of Kings?

>>4912140
Confirmed for regard who doesn't know what agnosticism is.

>>4912087
We have 50 million Muslims in Europe. There are signs that Allah will grant Islam victory in Europe—without swords, without guns, without conquest—will turn it into a Muslim continent within a few decades.

_colonel Gaddafi

>"God is dead." - Nietzsche
>"Nietzsche is dead." - God

Does anyone else remember these t-shirts? My friend had one.

>>4913051

Oh god, I do.

How about the

>"there are no atheists when the plane is about to crash"

>>4911819
Heinrich Heine, second book of "On the History of Religion and Philosophy in Germany" 1835.

Since there's no evidence for either, both stances require a degree of faith. But all evidence points to god being a human invention, so choosing not to beleive takes less faith

>>4913057
"If I convert it’s because it’s better that a believer dies than an atheist does." - CHristopher Hitchens