op @ /sci but they don't seem to know any better:

Is it really naive to question the validity of mathematics outside a consciousness? I'm not saying the universe came into existence after human beings first appeared with mathematical thinking, but what is math but logical thinking? We have every reason to believe that the beginning of a universe was an era governed by quantum mechanics in some form, and that the uncertainty principle plays a major role in the theory. I always understood the uncertainty principle as a mathematical fact derived from fourier transformations. This suggests to me that the logic that allows the uncertainty principle to exist, was prior to creation of a universe with sentient beings. But logic itself is a result of conscious thinking, we could only come up with the uncertainty principle with logical analysis. Therefore, is conscious thought the substratum of logic?