/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.15772277]

How did he know?

[Anonymous No.15772337]

>>15772277
Well, he is a heck of a Houellebecq, but not quite as good ad the "Great Replacement" christchurch manifesto.
That cover is fucking shit btw, it makes it look like a james patterson turd, just post the francais original instead, you retarded anglo.

[Anonymous No.15772376]

>>15772277
da joos clued him in on ze inbound Paris attacks

[Anonymous No.15772404]

>>15772277
People seem to be under the impression that he's condoning islam, when the end (IMHO) is all about how islam becomes just like contemporary christianity, insofar that the MC's conversion happens on a purely materialistic basis instead of genuine spiritual conviction. The parallels with Huysmans' "conversion trilogy" are not mere coincidence : Huysmans' alterego in that trilogy converts to christianity out of genuine conviction that was built bit by bit along the way there, completely unlike the conversion of Submission's MC.

So in conclusion the end implies that there's no sanctity and tradition that the european "spirit" won't be able to destroy and denigrate - the european milieu is like aqua regia, dissolving anything it touches.

[Anonymous No.15772418]

>>15772277
pretty bad book, doesn't really live up to his earlier works.
Just the setting is absurd, Islamists getting elected and suddenly overturning France's constitution and building a new Roman empire? this is some larpy tier fiction, but I guess like with all of his other works the setting doesn't matter it's about the characters, which still doesn't hold a candle to the elementary particles in terms of social alienation commentary

[Anonymous No.15772449]

>>15772418
all alt-history is larp fiction, name a single coherent alt-history book.
I remember reading the man in the high castle and cringing at how bad the politics of the world were

[Anonymous No.15772518]

>>15772404
Really interesting and contrary take anon, appreciate it very much. I read Soumission as an explication of the idea that Europe's secular humanism and de-facto nihilism would be unable to withstand any real attempt by a proselytizing religion or philosophy to take hold, which I think is still true, but I think you're also on to something with how that proselytizing only became accepted when the material/sexual benefits were its vanguard as opposed to any spiritual message.

Really appreciate your post.

[Anonymous No.15772535]

>>15772277
This book isn't really about "Islam taking over France" in any concrete predictive future history sense. It's the opposite of alarmist really. It's more about the spirit of the age. It's why I don't think this >>15772418 is that strange in the context of the novel. It's about grand sweeping changes that are actually kind of mundane - culturally and individually.

[Anonymous No.15772549]

I honestly have a lot of respect for Islam and the arabic golden age in al-andalus, have traveled well in Tunisia. however the average arab today is extremely low IQ, inbred, and the more minarets that jut out of the French landscape the worse things will be for everyone.

[Anonymous No.15772552]

>>15772549
are arab guys cute

[Anonymous No.15772559]

>>15772552
90% have huge noses, weak chins/jaws (that they hide with facial hair) and just overall bad skull shape. Girls are hot though, at least Maghrebis

[Anonymous No.15772566]

>>15772518
Glad you liked my post. I think your view of the novel and mine can definitely be reconciled - it's ultimately about european secular humanism, how a proselytizing religion like islam will be able to take it over in europe, but not without the poison of secular humanism dealing a fatal blow to islam in the process, recreating itself eventually after it dissolves islam internally.

[Anonymous No.15772574]

>>15772549
Everything good about the islamic golden age can be attributed to either persians or the spiritual ancestors of arabic philosophy, the greeks. The islamic golden age happened despite, islam, not because of it - could you imagine christian europe achieving what it did if we also had an al-ghazali-like uncircumventable authority who denied causality?

[Anonymous No.15772581]

>>15772566
I'm sure in 2080 when France is majority non-white with a 87 average IQ, the population will be full of secular humanists and will have abandoned Islam as a benighted religion

[Anonymous No.15772596]

>>15772581
There is a huge difference between first and later generation immigrants. If a country continues to import first generation immigrants to the point where they are the majority, then their culture will probably change pretty dramatically to that of the home country.

But that's not really how immigration works - a non-white 3rd generation immigrant to a material and secular society is likely to have views far more akin to materialism and secularism. You can't assume views solely based on skin color.

[Anonymous No.15772607]

>>15772581
Do you genuinely believe that european culture will just disappear without the trace? Europeans as a genetic group will probably become a minority, but it's extremely unlikely that literal wahhabism is even possible in a milieu like europe - we'll probably become like the greeks to the romans, an intellectually superior previous civilization that eventually succumbed to decay and degeneration, but not without exerting enormous influence upon posterity.

That's besides the taint of materialism that is already festering among the 80 IQ brown masses.

[Anonymous No.15772615]

>>15772277
Most people reject his message. They hate Houellebecq because he tells them the truth.

[Anonymous No.15772618]

How did he know?

[Anonymous No.15772629]

>>15772596
>You can't assume views solely based on skin color.
Actually I can. According to Pew, 42% of French muslims support suicide bombings, as opposed to 35% for all age groups. You're literally 100% wrong.

[Anonymous No.15772637]

>>15772629
Good triple double, bad nonsensical post

[Anonymous No.15772638]

>>15772629
Way to miss the point about views changing in latter generation immigrants.

[Anonymous No.15772641]

>>15772637
42% of French muslims age 18-31

[Anonymous No.15772648]

>>15772638
misstyped cause multitasking, see
>>15772641

[Anonymous No.15772652]

>>15772277
>nobody commenting on OP's blessed digits
Checked and cringepilled

[Anonymous No.15772661]

>>15772596
Except most Islamic terrorists drink, smoke, gamble, eat pork , and visit prostitutes. They become terrorists precisely as a response to combat this so called westernization you describe. Look it up, nearly every single terrorist attack in Europe in the last 20 years follows this pattern.

And it begs the question to begin with, if the 1st generation of immigrants has such antisocial values why would you want them to ever achieve this 3rd generation?

[Anonymous No.15772690]

>>15772607
>Do you genuinely believe that european culture will just disappear without the trace?

[Anonymous No.15772703]

>>15772277
>Dorkly funny
I hope whoever wrote that review is havin a good laff while Mohammed cuts his throat.

[Anonymous No.15772707]

>>15772638
Why would they change when they're swiftly becoming the majority? What's going to change them exactly? The decrepit, dying, and shrinking population of natives?

[Anonymous No.15772711]

>>15772690
Well, yeah, "traditional" european culture is already starting to sink below the horizon, but by european culture I mean it as it currently is, with all its retardation and degeneration. By the time the Romans conquered Greece the greeks were already pale shadows of their ancestors.

[Anonymous No.15772721]

>>15772711
>Well, yeah, "traditional" european culture is already starting to sink below the horizon, but by european culture I mean it as it currently is, with all its retardation and degeneration. By the time the Romans conquered Greece the greeks were already pale shadows of their ancestors.
It's amazing to me that someone can post something so stupid and divorced from self awareness. Traditional European culture died with Christianity, anon. You know, the Semitic cult that predates the current one taking over.

[Anonymous No.15772722]

>>15772707
Pictures like these make me want to kill myself.

[Anonymous No.15772736]

>>15772722
Why bother?

[Anonymous No.15772778]

>>15772736
I'm personally at a bit of a loss as to why the powers that be would make this happen - this muttified, cultureless, 80 IQ world that they're building is also the world that their children will inherit. What's the endgame here? A bunch of Jews LARPing as Southern Planters and fapping to Inglorious Basterds while ruling a braindead half-feral brown underclass for the rest of time?

[Anonymous No.15772816]

>>15772574
>The islamic golden age happened despite, islam, not because of it
I'd argue otherwise, Islam provided unseen political stability in the middle east which lead to the environment where the sciences could flourish, it's no coincidence that the middle east never recovered from the Mongols, Persians of course contributed a lot, but so did notable Arabs and Andalusians(Averroes, Alhazad, Ibn Hazm...)

[Anonymous No.15772819]

>>15772778
I've never quite heard a convincing explanation either. You can see why certain groups benefit short term of course, but long term? It might be nobody is really in charge of the long term trajectory in any meaningful way.

All this is just leading to Chinese hegemony though, the Jews will find themselves a small island in Israel when the West really starts popping off.

[Anonymous No.15772827]

>>15772778
There's no conspiracy or end game here, it's just the political class doing anything and everything they can to consolidate wealth and power at every turn with indifference to the consequences. Their children won't go to the same schools as your children. Their communities are gated with private security forces. They are citizens of the world anyway, and have no obligation to stay in London or Berlin or whatever, they can hop on a plane and still access their money anywhere in the world after all. You really shouldn't try to reduce the trend in the west to some absurd Jewish plot, for one thing it's stupid, for another it ignores the reality of the traitors within.

[Anonymous No.15772841]

>>15772629
42%? That is surprisingly low.

>>15772596
https://i.4cdn.org/wsg/1593875857563.webm
Please respond to this.

[Anonymous No.15772861]

>>15772778
>I'm personally at a bit of a loss as to why the powers that be would make this happen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQPsKvG6WMI
It's not difficult to grasp.

[Anonymous No.15772865]

>>15772827

Well tbqh, I do not see how political actors would not benefit from improving society. On one hand, ones legacy is highly important to anybody of good character (both family lineage and cultural legacy), and it is also true that in many ways the nobility of the past had living standards and relative freedom beneath that of the common man so clearly creating a society that in on the whole better well tend to create higher degrees of freedom for those at the top because a better society will have a higher apex

[Anonymous No.15772878]

>>15772827
Cicero was one of the most based writers and politicians to have lived. I have never gotten over a sense of despondency after reading his works and the history of the Republic and how close he came to holding it together despite everything trying to tear it apart, and then ultimately failing. He played a losing hand as beautifully and as well as was possible.

As far as the endgame, you're obviously right about the consolidation of wealth and power. But ultimately what does that wealth and power buy you? In the past people would have used it to purchase those things that are essentially aesthetic: i.e. art - literature, music, theater, paintings, sculpture, etc... Or to put it more plainly, they used their power and wealth to commission the things that we think of today as *culture*.

But the power and wealth of today has abandoned any pursuit of aesthetics and cultural growth. I suspect this is because the majority of wealth is *new*, and we're dealing with wealth being increasingly concentrated with the nouveau riche, and old money that has taste is increasingly checked out, and increasingly dwarfed by the new. We lose a great deal when our cultural gatekeepers abandon their posts, or when they are overwhelmed.

[Anonymous No.15772886]

>>15772827

Well tbqh, I do not see how political actors would not benefit from improving society. On one hand, ones legacy is highly important to anybody of good character (both family lineage and cultural legacy), and it is also true that in many ways the nobility of the past had living standards and relative freedom beneath that of the common man of today so clearly creating a society that is on the whole better will tend to create higher degrees of freedom for those at the top because a better society will have a higher peaks than before.

I stand by the fact that our elite are ideologically motivated and they're pursuing their moralisms to an ultimate logical conclusion with little regard for society or even their status and legacy

[Anonymous No.15772898]

>>15772865
A rising tide doesn't lift all boats when we have airplanes. The stake which anyone has in their country in modern society is low but for the wealthy it barely even exists. The nobility of the past still had to bump shoulders with the common man, this is not true today in the slightest. What's more, more and more the common man doesn't even resemble the nobility to begin with, so when neither nation, nor class, nor religion (westerners have no religion, be reasonably), nor ethnicity binds you to the group you rule, your concern for them is understandably low. This is Americanism incarnate, and the ideology of Americanism has been exported to the rest of the world and Europe in particular.

I like pic related, at first it is funny, but then it is sad.

[Anonymous No.15772975]

>>15772277
he's right about everything and that's a good thing. It's about time Europeans ditched the christian worldview (which was corrupted to become weak-willed and effeminate) and adopted a warrior religion like Islam and started wrecking shit again

[Anonymous No.15772986]

>>15772827
fukc c*cero

[Anonymous No.15773006]

>>15772986
Fuck yourself, Anthony.

[Anonymous No.15773013]

>>15772629
That's a very stupid use of statistics here anon. By your own figures a religion based predictor of opinions would not perform much better than a coin toss. You also confused skin color with religious belief.
My advice would be to stop posting until you've finished highschool.

[Anonymous No.15773039]

>>15772841
I'm more worried by the 35% of support among non muslims really. I mean what the fuck are those people thinking? Makes it really hard to believe anon here.

[Anonymous No.15773113]

>>15772986
Isn't that figure for French Muslims irregardless of age? Maybe I've misunderstood.

[Anonymous No.15773161]

>>15773039
Isn't that figure for French Muslims irregardless of age? Maybe I've misunderstood.

[Anonymous No.15773205]

>>15772827
Cicero also said about Jews "one knows how numerous this clique is, how they stick together and what power they exercise through their unions." The Jews were coincidentally kicked out Rome several times in that century.

In yet another strange coincidence Israel is the only developed Western country that isn't replacing its population with immigrants.

[Anonymous No.15773210]

>>15773205
Their country is already full of arabs.

[Anonymous No.15773278]

>>15773205
Israel demonstrably has higher rates of immigration than plenty of other countries.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_net_migration_rate
Do you just pretend places like Spain, Estonia, Latvia, etc... don't exist? Granted Israel does have a low immigration rate but so do lots of countries for lots of reasons. Fuck off with your pol shit. I mean, reasonably, who the fuck would want to go to Israel? You'd need to learn Hebrew, the job prospects are shit, and they certainly don't handout welfare like western countries do - - to say nothing of the prospect of eating a random Hammas rocket. Ireland has even lower immigration rates though, is that because of a conspiracy or because it's a shithole compared to other prospective countries? Obviously the latter.

[Anonymous No.15773295]

bailed on finishing serontonin, dont really see after reading half of it what it was doing that atomised didnt do better

[Anonymous No.15773297]

>>15773278
>Israel has higher migrants per capita than Denmark or the Netherlands
Is /pol/ just wrong about everything?

[Anonymous No.15773306]

>>15773278
Israel also does genetic testing for citizenship to make sure they're Jews. Meanwhile the leader of Ireland in 2018 announced a plan to have 1 million immigrants come by 2040. Do you think they will test for Irish genetics?

[Anonymous No.15773316]

>>15773278
also Ireland has a much higher per capita gdp than Israel, it's not a shithole.

[Anonymous No.15773343]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gnpCqsXE8g&list=FLFXn3bLM4t6okYcNXZnng7A&index=2&t=5s

nigga this shit has been going on since the cold war era, video i posted is from 1983, western civ has been dieing since before your parents were born, it will only get worse and theres nothing you can do to help.

[Anonymous No.15773355]

>>15772975
>It's about time Europeans ditched the christian worldview (which was corrupted to become weak-willed and effeminate) and adopted a warrior religion like Islam and started wrecking shit again

Submission is literally about people like you. See >>15772404

[Anonymous No.15773363]

>>15773316
GDP isn't a metric for shitholeness. Ireland most definitely is a shithole, drunk vehicular manslaughter is their national sport.

>>15773306
Jewish ancestry is not a requisite for Israeli immigration. Your entire argument is a non sequitur. Also announcing plans over the span of 20 years is hardly the same thing as following through on said plans, the UK has a fetish for immigration, that doesn't make it a conspiracy, there's plenty of European countries that don't share the Anglican perversion for brown people.

[Anonymous No.15773370]

>>15773343
>posting a video that's already been posted in this thread

[Anonymous No.15773382]

>>15773316
Ireland's GDP is artificially inflated because a number of large multinational companies (including Apple, IIRC) are on paper headquarted there so they can take advantage of low corporate tax rates.

[Anonymous No.15773392]

>>15773363
Ireland has the 3rd highest quality of life ranking in the world, Israel is around 20. You clearly have some hatred for Irish or maybe generally white people.

Anyone at all can see the disparity between Israel and other developed countries in how they treat issues like immigration, ethnic pride, etc. Not only that Jews in white countries will often promote this behavior in Israel while promoting the exact opposite in the countries they live in.

[Anonymous No.15773436]

>>15772703
It says darkly

[Anonymous No.15773437]

>>15773363
>>15773382
>>15773316
You can make more money living in the US purely through welfare than the average GDP/capita of many countries in the world. Does that mean Chicago isn't a shithole? Would you really rather live in that hood rat infested hell than say in pic related, which is on average per capita at less than half the average welfare income in the US?

[Anonymous No.15773448]

>>15772707
How long must this go on? How do people read headlines like this and just move on with their day? Are they really not going to put up a fight?

[Anonymous No.15773450]

>>15772827
Cicero never said that lol

[Anonymous No.15773465]

>>15773392
>Ireland has the 3rd highest quality of life ranking in the world
Another statistic that means absolutely nothing.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Where-to-be-born_Index
So the US is equivalent to Germany? AND PREFERABLE TO SPAIN OR JAPAN? Don't make me laugh.

>You clearly have some hatred for Irish or maybe generally white people.
Laughter. White countries are clearly the best in the world, that doesn't mean Ireland isn't a shithole dude. It's nothing but drunks and stupid papists.

>Anyone at all can see the disparity between Israel and other developed countries in how they treat issues like immigration, ethnic pride, etc. Not only that Jews in white countries will often promote this behavior in Israel while promoting the exact opposite in the countries they live in.
That's a nice but meaningless anecdote you have there.

[Anonymous No.15773469]

>>15773370
the video i posted goes much more in depth

[Anonymous No.15773495]

>>15772277

If you think that's impressive wait until you find out Serotonin was written *before* the yellow vest movement happened.

[Anonymous No.15773537]

>>15773316
>also Ireland has a much higher per capita gdp than Israel, it's not a shithole.
Guess that means Qatar is a nicer place to live than either of them, or Sweden, or Australia. It's hilarious to me how deeply ingrained the worship of materialism in westerners but at the same time they get all pissed off at the consequences of this kind of spiritual bankruptcy, they feign outrage when policy makers do exactly what they'd do in their place.

[Anonymous No.15773546]

>>15772277
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfxgB0_IUoI
>people defend and praise this psychotic French goblin

[Anonymous No.15773589]

>>15773546

Literary Criticism in 2020: Canaries found to be responsible for 100% of coal mine disasters.

[Anonymous No.15773700]

>>15773495
to be honest the french are always rioting and striking, the 60s were much worst than the yellow vests

[Anonymous No.15773737]

>>15773450
What gave it away? Was it the attribution date a year after Cicero's death?

[Anonymous No.15773778]

>>15772778
The debate on immigration has been conflated with the debate on race, arguably for nefarious reasons. This has been to the benefit of big businesses in Europe, who are able privatise their gains from cheap imported labour, and socialise their losses - by relying on the taxpayer to pick up the cost of social support when those migrants are out of work. In the UK for example, there's little incentive for either mainstream party to cut down on immigration since they both benefit; Labour gain from an increased voter base while the Conservatives and their business interests profit from the effectively limitless supply of cheap labour. Other interests that gain from mass immigration are non-integrating migrants and the migration industry, among others. I don't necessarily see how there's a Jewish conspiracy, it seems to me to be another example of big business blindly serving its own interests even when it might be destroying its life-source in the process

[Anonymous No.15773939]

>>15773778
Regardless of the cause what are we supposed to do? The only way to get away from the horde of migrants is to become rich and live in a gated community. And even then something like Brazil is the likely endgame and that's just as shit even if you're wealthy

[Anonymous No.15774049]

>>15773778

[Anonymous No.15774241]

>>15772418
it's actually believable in the context of the islamic party ultimately getting in through a coalition with the socialist party

[Anonymous No.15774334]

>>15774241
and you think the socialist party will actually push for sharia law in France? It would be more believable if the coalition was with the far-right

[Anonymous No.15774543]

>>15772418
It seems like you have visited Paris in the last 15 years. You should go.

[Anonymous No.15774912]

>>15774334
Let me guess either you are not european or you have blinded yourself to the hypocritical workings of european socialist parties

[Anonymous No.15774966]

Anyone with half a brain can foresee the future of Europe.

[Anonymous No.15775078]

>>15774912
I'm French actually, and even if the """socialist""" party here (which is basically watered down liberals) did side with Islamists for an election, there is simply no way in hell you'll see Sharia law enforced and if you honestly believe France would start stoning homosexuals you're braindead.

[Anonymous No.15775437]

>>15775078
Dude, that girl who critized islam and had to be protected got hate from leftist parties for insulting islam, even mr. Macaron had to speak about it. France will be islamist in 50 years.

[Anonymous No.15775701]

what's his best book, /lit/?

[Anonymous No.15775765]

>>15775701
Atomised and Platform are his best ones, hard to say which one is better tho.