/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.16437087]

Why did ancient Greek poets and especially Theocritus give boy love the carpet treatment in their poems?

[Anonymous No.16437104]

Who?

[Anonymous No.16437114]

https://voca.ro/1lg7p3rRqCj8

[Anonymous No.16437175]

>>16437087
Because it's traditional and evropean and we need to reject Christianity and eat our brother's ass it totally won't cheapen our brotherhood have you seen the spartans they were all over each other dude

[Anonymous No.16437195]

>>16437087
They didn't like "boys" they liked young teenage males. Not effeminate ones either, they liked strong masculine twinks with perhaps beautiful and attractive faces. I can't speak for whether this was the case everywhere, though boy love itself did not occur everywhere, but Plato at least saw this love affair as being something of a mentoring role that would shape the young man into being a good man.

Think of it as basically like the relationship between Johnny and Miguel in Cobra Kai, except Johnny also fucked Miguel's Latin ass.

[Anonymous No.16437289]

>>16437087
I suspect the main reason these forms of love or socialisation aren't more prominent in culture is that individuals wielding power or influence over others is a cultural taboo in our times - it is something to fear. This is often couched in liberal ideals, but the reality is likely murkier... e.g. that individual authority competes with other modes of influence that have entrenched their legitimacy over time. Corporations, identity lobbies, and so forth... can all wield power over the vulnerable, but a man and a boy in intimate mentorship or love is considered threatening and could only manifest in illegal ways and in violations of developing persons. This also partly explains the glee with which fatherhood has been cheered out of family life, the rate of divorce and broken families has economic benefits for some businesses, professions, and entities.

[Anonymous No.16437290]

>>16437195
I swear one of the writers of Cobra Kai is on this board

[Anonymous No.16437303]

>>16437087
the secret to the greeks knowledge and success was the boylove. we have to go back

[Anonymous No.16437304]

>>16437289
Your point being?

[Anonymous No.16437367]

>>16437195
>Plato at least saw this love affair as being something of a mentoring role that would shape the young man into being a good man.
Does Clint Eastwood receive fan mail? I should write a Gran Torino fanfic where Walt makes Thao a man by getting deep into his bussy, and send it to him.

[Anonymous No.16437488]

>>16437290
Are there a lot of Cobra Kai posts? Its a legitimately good show.

[Anonymous No.16437795]

>>16437488
I saw some a few weeks ago but they always get taken down as soon as I get back

[Anonymous No.16437824]

>>16437087
>muh poets
Censored by Plato (pbuh)
>>16437175
>muh tradition
Refuted by Plato (pbuh)

[Anonymous No.16437831]

>>16437114
i bet you have a bunch of plans for friday night
>who?
what was that?

[Anonymous No.16437836]

>>16437824
Also
>muh sodomy
Refuted by Plato (pbuh)
>muh homosexuality
Refuted by Plato (pbuh)
>muh effeminacy
Refuted by Plato (pbuh)

[Anonymous No.16438143]

>>16437488
No it's not. Every single plot problem is artificial and could be solved either by talking or simply not being an asshole. The show seems to be going for shades of gray and gradual character development but hawk's character development was instantaneous and thus unbelievable. It was hinted at that Daniel was supposed to be a little bit cocky in the first episode which would have been good to bring credit to the shades of gray thing, but the writers are too pussy to make Daniel do anything unwise or antagonistic and the only thing antagonistic sort of done by him wasn't even him, it was his cousin.

[Anonymous No.16438146]

>>16438143
Same guy
I'll admit that the first season was good and that Johnny and miguels character development was very well handled

[Anonymous No.16438183]

>>16438143
I think Hawk goes through so much development because he basically represents the corrupted version of Miguel

[Anonymous No.16438371]

>>16437824
Were Cretans like the Jews of Ancient Greece?

[Anonymous No.16439342]

>>16437087
Because they had no effective contraception.

[Anonymous No.16439361]

>>16437114
Where the fuck have you been for like two months

[Anonymous No.16440368]

>>16437195
>strong masculine twinks
that’s an oxymoron.look at pottery from the era and they were typical teenagers, athletic but nevertheless skinny and androgynous.

[Anonymous No.16440385]

>>16437195
>strong masculine twinks
that’s an oxymoron.look at pottery from the era and they were typical teenagers, athletic but nevertheless skinny and pretty.

[Anonymous No.16440398]

>>16437195
>except Johnny also fucked Miguel's Latin ass.
>It seems, then, that you’ll lay it down as a law in the city we’re establishing that if a lover can persuade a boy to let him, then he may kiss him, be with him, and touch him, as a father would a son, for the sake of what is fine and beautiful, but—turning to the other things—his association with the one he cares about must never seem to go any further than this, otherwise he will be reproached as untrained in music and poetry and lacking in appreciation for what is fine and beautiful.

[Anonymous No.16440408]

>>16437195
>except Johnny also fucked Miguel's Latin ass.
They fucked thighs bro.

[Anonymous No.16440412]

>>16437175
>Evrope
more like
>Greek
cquse didnt ancient German hate faggots? And I dont remember celts ever mentioning them much either, And roman faggotry increased 10fold when they got closer Hreek connections. I assume its a product of mediterranean decadence.

[Anonymous No.16440415]

>>16438371
They fashioned a tomb for you, holy and high one,
Cretans, always liars, evil beasts, idle bellies.
But you are not dead: you live and abide forever,
For in you we live and move and have our being.

[Anonymous No.16440490]

>>16437087
>boy love
this picture is not pederasty but looks more like innocent teenage romance. wish i had a cute boyfriend as a teenager.

>the carpet treatment
what does this mean?

[Anonymous No.16440516]

>>16437087
>The existence of a Sotadic Zone was a hypothesis of Burton. He asserted that there exists a geographic zone in which pederasty (romantic-sexual intimacy between a boy and a man) is prevalent and celebrated among the indigenous inhabitants. The name derives from Sotades, a 3rd-century BC Greek poet who was the chief representative of a group of writers of obscene, and sometimes pederastic, satirical poetry; these homoerotic verses are preserved in the Greek Anthology, a collection of poems spanning the Classical and Byzantine periods of Greek literature.

>Burton first advanced his Sotadic Zone concept in the "Terminal Essay" contained in Volume 10 of his translation of The Arabian Nights, which he called The Book of the Thousand Nights and a Night, in 1886.

According to Burton's description,

>the Sotadic Zone is bounded westward by the northern shores of the Mediterranean (N. Lat. 43 °) and by the southern (N. Lat. 30°). Thus the depth would be 780 to 800 miles including meridional France, the Iberian peninsula, Italy and Greece, with the coast-regions of North Africa from Morocco to Egypt;
>Running eastward the Sotadic Zone narrows, embracing Asia Minor, Mesopotamia and Chaldaea, Afghanistan, Sindh, the Punjab and Kashmir.
>In Indo-China the belt begins to broaden, enfolding China, Japan and Turkistan.
It then embraces the South Sea Islands and the New World where, at the time of its discovery, Sotadic love was, with some exceptions, an established racial institution.
"Within the Sotadic Zone the Vice is popular and endemic, held at the worst to be a mere peccadillo, whilst the races to the North and South of the limits here defined practise it only sporadically amid the opprobrium of their fellows who, as a rule, are physically incapable of performing the operation and look upon it with the liveliest disgust."

[Anonymous No.16440527]

Aristophanes made fun of homos and effeminates all the time. Gay greece is forced meme by desperate homo university teachers cherrypicking whatever degeneracy they could find.

[Anonymous No.16440555]

>>16440408
I still have no idea why this was their thing, the hair causes chafing like you wouldn't believe

[Anonymous No.16440569]

>>16440527
>Aristophanes (pbuh)
Fixed that for you.

[Anonymous No.16440690]

>>16437114
I expect you to do this for every thread on /lit/
Godspeed anon.

[Anonymous No.16440826]

>>16439342
yes they did.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silphium

[Anonymous No.16441063]

>>16440516
Read Addington-Symonds and see how immediately false this view is in the terminology of the times.

[Anonymous No.16441470]

because intellectually edifying love is the purest and best form of love. the Greeks realised that women were not their intellectual equals so the love between a man and a woman could never be as pure and as edifying as between a man and his beloved (male)

it's highly based if you think about it

[Anonymous No.16441563]

>>16440527
Aristophanes making fun of passive recipients of anal sex =/= making fun of same-sex relationships in a culture where most homosexual intercourse was intercrural

[Anonymous No.16442083]

>>16440527
/this
it was always considered (rightly) repulsive by the great majority of the population

[Anonymous No.16442541]

>>16437114
thank you

[Anonymous No.16442544]

>>16441563
All homophobes are tops.