/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.16964330]

Exodus 7:3-4
>And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, and multiply my signs and my wonders in the land of Egypt. But Pharaoh shall not hearken unto you, that I may lay my hand upon Egypt, and bring forth mine armies, and my people the children of Israel, out of the land of Egypt by great judgments.
Why did God harden Pharaoh's heart? Would the Pharaoh have let the Israelites go if his heart hadn't been hardened?

[Anonymous No.16964351]

>>16964330
because god wasn't done showing off.

[Anonymous No.16964770]

>>16964330
To flex on the gentiles

[Anonymous No.16964803]

>>16964330
Pharoah was just on the cusp of letting the Israelites go multiple times but God kept hardening his heart. I feel like the gnostics have a good explanation as to why OT God is such a dick

[Anonymous No.16964835]

>>16964330
The translation isn't "I will harden Pharaoh's heart" it's "I will let Pharaoh's heart be hardened"

It's not God making Pharaoh act against his own free will, it's God allowing Pharaoh to act of his own free will, even though it would be better for the Jews if he didn't.

[Anonymous No.16964895]

>>16964770
The entire universe is a flex on gentiles frfr

[Anonymous No.16965256]

>>16964835
Then why does literally every english translations---even Jewish translations---make it either that God hardened his heart or that God made him stubborn?

[Anonymous No.16966076]

Because the Egyptians had no covenant with God and therefore weren't people, as per the metaphysics of the entirety of the Old Testament.

If you think God hardening pharaoh's heart is bad, wait until he tells the Israelites that they are 100% right to wage an aggressive war against a bunch of disparate tribes in the promised land, and telling them it's cool to kill the women and children.

The Old Testament is a political epic, in addition to being a foundation for morality in society.

[Anonymous No.16966122]

>>16964803
Why do you presume to know it would be better for Pharaoh to let them go? You're basically putting your word against the Creator of all things to can grasp the outcome of everything; why should I presume God's way wasn't better than what He had allowed to come to pass?

I also don't see anything "dickish" about God in the OT; it was a time of rival tribes, whole peoples died; whole peoples warred amongst themselves and destroyed themselves utterly.

>>16966076
>wait until he tells the Israelites that they are 100% right to wage an aggressive war against a bunch of disparate tribes in the promised land, and telling them it's cool to kill the women and children.

And what is wrong with that? The Israelites failed to heed this command anyway and suffered from the idolatry the leftover women and children brought to Israel.

The NT does say that to be united with the One True God is to have the Universe fight for you - ergo, the opposite is true; that to stand against God means the universe seeks to destroy you.

[Anonymous No.16966146]

>>16966122
Ah, I'm mistaken here; it's not the NT where it is said the "Universe fights for you", but Sirach (OT).


for the ungodly, refusing to know thee,
were scourged by the strength of thy arm,
pursued by unusual rains and hail and relentless storms,
and utterly consumed by fire.
17
For—most incredible of all—in the water, which quenches all things,
the fire had still greater effect,
for the universe defends the righteous.
18
At one time the flame was restrained,
so that it might not consume the creatures sent against the ungodly,
but that seeing this they might know
that they were being pursued by the judgment of God;

[Anonymous No.16966159]

>>16964895
based universe

[Anonymous No.16966201]

in II Kings, a prophet kills 42 children because they made fun of him for being bald

[Anonymous No.16966216]

8:28 has him freely do it using the same term. Gods permission is often described as his action within scripture.

[Anonymous No.16966219]

>>16966201
correction; they were killed because they were mocking God's chosen. to mock them was on the same level as mocking God; this is why Jacob refused to kill Saul

He said to his men, "The LORD forbid that I should do such a thing to my master, the LORD's anointed, or lift my hand against him; for he is the anointed of the LORD." With these words David rebuked his men and did not allow them to attack Saul. And Saul left the cave and went his way.

Elisha was anointed by God as one of His prophets; if the kids had mocked him without anything happening nobody would have taken him seriously.

bad things happen when you defy God

[Anonymous No.16966222]

>>16966076
those people were evil

[Anonymous No.16966243]

>>16966201
Elija was a prophet entering Judah and being immediately tormented by Judah's children showing they were far separated form the lord if their kids would be so bold as to ridicule a prophet, not to mention "go on up, go on up" seems to be mocking even Elisha implying they had no regard for the lord of his prophets. At a time when lineage and was incredibly important to ancient Israel it makes sense the punishment for this would be the destruction of their seed as it is both a punishment and a way to save the messianic line for Christ to come.

[Anonymous No.16966417]

>>16966222
>infants and children of entire peoples were evil

[Anonymous No.16966420]

>>16966219
>harmless banter
>death

[Anonymous No.16966479]

>>16966420
>Yes

[Anonymous No.16966514]

Remember when Stephen and Saul went to convert the gentiles?

>7-54 When the council members heard Stephen’s speech, they were angry and furious. But Stephen was filled with the Holy Spirit. He looked toward heaven, where he saw our glorious God and Jesus standing at his right side. Then Stephen said, “I see heaven open and the Son of Man standing at the right side of God!”

>57 The council members shouted and covered their ears. At once they all attacked Stephen and dragged him out of the city. Then they started throwing stones at him. The men who had brought charges against him put their coats at the feet of a young man named Saul.

>59 As Stephen was being stoned to death, he called out, “Lord Jesus, please welcome me!” 60 He knelt down and shouted, “Lord, don’t blame them for what they have done.” Then he died.

>8 1-2 Saul approved the stoning of Stephen.

[Anonymous No.16966521]

>>16966514
>Jesus
Cringe

[Anonymous No.16966539]

Israel was faithless and deserving of God's punishment.

[Anonymous No.16966548]

>>16966479
Yes hilarious just meme it off and forget about it!

[Anonymous No.16966614]

>>16966122
Why would an omniscient, omnipotent, absolutely transcendent and perfect entity give even the slightest fuck about petty conflicts between desert tribes? This is unrealistic.

[Anonymous No.16966618]

>>16964330
>Why did God harden Pharaoh's heart?
Ask a priest.