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18680544 No.18680544 [DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

Why is there so much hate around the atheism movement now? It was one of the biggest sources of intellectualism online for the past 7 years.

>> No.18680551

>>18680544
>Intellectualism
I hope you're joking. I remember this guy talking about Teen Titans to own the "feminists" during GG.

>> No.18680554

>>18680551
It was. It got a ton of creationists off platforms and inspired a ton of people to get into science and creativity.

>> No.18680559

Was there anyone from New Atheism that debunked anything from Aquinas or Chesterton?

>> No.18680565

>>18680544
It was so cringe how they only had the balls to challenge Christianity/Catholicism.

>> No.18680597

>>18680544
Militant atheism just got too self-rightious for it's own good. That coupled with the diminishing influence of religion, plus the fact that a lot of the figureheads of the "movement" ended up becoming rightwing grifters, makes it a pretty easy target for hate and mockery.

>> No.18680614
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18680614

It literally solved nothing.

It only introduced further problems into society.

If you're questioning why people hate atheism, there's something wrong with you.

>> No.18680618

>>18680614
>It only introduced further problems into society
Such as?

>> No.18680619

>>18680544
Because of people like your picrel, and this >>18680565

>> No.18680622

>>18680544
it got turned into a joke by american teens

>> No.18680628

>>18680544
Because people realized that secularizing society doesn’t result in a rational technologically advanced utopia but a cesspool that opens the gates to degeneracy, scientism, feminism, liberalism, etc.
Religion ALWAYS wins baby

>> No.18680630

>>18680559
>Aquinas
debunked by his own divine revelation
>Reginald, I cannot, because all that I have written seems like straw to me

>> No.18680631

>>18680565
I live in India and the atheists here also have a hateboner for Christians. They attack Hinduism and Christianity all the time but won't say shit about Islam

>> No.18680633

>>18680628
gay ass nigga

>> No.18680635

>>18680628
Everything you listed off is buzzwords. List off actual problems please.

>> No.18680639
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18680639

>>18680544
It's all a game of aesthetics. When atheists were in-vogue in the early 2000s, they came off as cool educated guys dunking on rednecks and pedo priests. Then they started losing favour when their aesthetic transformed into
>rainbow-haired, vitriolic, out-of-shape fatasses scream very loudly about something while being very smug about it.
Granted, their predecessors were pretty smug, but they weren't rainbow-haired, limp-wristed fatsos. Who wants to associate with them? You can extrapolate this to Left vs. Right in the modern age and why conservatism/traditionalism is gaining popularity. People just don't want to associate with the aesthetic of progressives, they look and sound too cringe, even if they espouse things which past ages have considered to be noble. In other words, the LGBTXYSNFDLKNFLKFGN and third-wave feminists are what's killing atheism's optics.

>> No.18680641

>>18680559
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3yKxvW9yNA
>Aquinas
Pathetic

>> No.18680647

Unironically, because leftists now embrace multiculturalism and they perceive atheism to be offensive to brown people, who are inherently spiritual and magical in the minds on the liberal. It's also seen as a rationalist white male thing.

>> No.18680648

>>18680544
the zeitgeist (especially of 4chan) couldnt resist the hegelian contrarianism. its all a pendulum.

>> No.18680651

>>18680628
the only reason religion is on the rise worldwide is that shithole country have higher birthrate

>> No.18680654

>>18680618
It cemented the fact that humans always need something higher to believe in, and religion was simply replaced with secular religion (progressivism, Science! etc.)

You're not enlightened to shit. Atheists are some of the most profoundly arrogant human beings to walk the earth.

>> No.18680668

>>18680565
>>18680631
Islam actually fights back if you talk shit about them, and they're almost as good at creating a victim complex for themselves as the jews

>> No.18680669

>>18680654
This is correct and I say this as someone who was subscribed to TAA as a 14-16 year old. I thought I was hot shit because I cod regurgitate YT vids attacking easy targets and straw man constructions of Christianity.

Got baptized last year, never fails to make me laugh.

>> No.18680671

>>18680544
Atheists are like those schoolyard bullies that only go for the kids they know won’t defend themselves, you think those neck beards have the balls to go after someone that could beat the crap out of them? It’s why they only went for Christianity because they knew Christians would turn the other cheek, they never went after Judaism because they knew they would be expelled.
The one time they try to go after Islam Mahmoud knocked so many of their teeth out that they sat down and shut up permanently.
The equivalent of “bully not so tough after getting raped”.

>> No.18680673

Most major problems in the west have very little do do with religion anymore so its just beating up a very dead horse

>> No.18680679

>>18680651
Every single atheist population in the world has a fertility rate below replacement levels. If you take into account the fact the highly religious people are having 5-6 children it gives you a pretty good idea about the demographics of the future

>> No.18680680

>>18680668
from my own experience, during my edgy atheist faze, I didn't bother about Islam because I thought everybody knew it was just the work of an opportunistic warlord and going deeper into it wasn't worth my time

>> No.18680690

>>18680679
birthrate fail when people have access to contraception and women access to education. The raise of atheism and the lowering of birthrate are certainly corrolated, but I wouldn't say it's the deciding factor

>> No.18680691

>>18680680
Bullshit, you were scared

>> No.18680695
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18680695

>>18680544
I think there are two currents of opposition to New Atheism and they have to be analysed separately.
>left wing
I remember that initially leftists were very enthusiastic about New Atheists until few New Atheists exposed themselves as commited social Darwinists and extreme naturalists. Dawkins' comments on gender and race (famous trans-racialism debate), Harris' mild Islamophobia and catering to right wingers like Douglas Murray and Hitchens' opposition to abortion (it's of note that his leftist credentials seemed to be the most impeccable of all Four Horsemen) are cases in point. It certainly didn't help that New Atheism seemed to have an elective affinity with libertarianism and unrestricted capitalism and seemed to attract the type of person that would lurk 4chan prior to 2012 - hardly a target demographic for the left. This guy does a better job of explaining how the left turned its back on New Atheism
https://thecritic.co.uk/why-is-atheism-no-longer-cool/
>right wing
This should be well known to anyone who has been lurking 4chan for a long time but basically these people started to realize that religion is necessary to maintain social cohesion and avoid going down the path towards nihilism. The culmination of this strain are the metamorphose that 4chan underwent between 2012 and 2016 and whose echoes resound on all boards to this day and popularity of figures like Jordan Peterson and Bishop Barron.

>> No.18680697

>>18680647
It’s simply the kumbaya effect.
The only thing you about “new atheists” is they’ll try to reason you out of your religion. They’re reasonable enough to know culture isn’t static.
Honestly, you think either Hitchens liked giant Mosques in England?

>> No.18680701

>>18680690
Even in the West they win out. They simply don't allow their women to access contraception or higher education

>> No.18680706

>>18680691
I hadn't met a single muslim in my life up until that point

>> No.18680714

>>18680706
And still you were too cautious not to talk shit

>> No.18680718

>>18680690
>atheists that believe in evolution and survival of the fittest
>fails to reproduce

>religious that believes in a creation myth
>pops out 5+

Hilarious that the proponents of Darwin can’t fulfill “their biological purpose”.
Turns out atheism, rationality and scientism are maladaptive behaviors while religiosity is beneficial for survival and the continuation of the species.

>> No.18680723

>>18680633 I agree with that
And that
>>18680628
They both got sone solid points

>> No.18680729

>>18680695
One more thing I forgot to include - many New Atheists are biologists/natural scientists by profession or at least are familiar with the results natural sciences yield and their implications for religious doctrines and ideologies which makes them negatively disposed to some leftist tenets like social construction of gender etc.

>> No.18680730

>>18680695
>Christian reading Evola
kek, guess he hasn’t read enough

>> No.18680759

Have atheists ever created anything worthwhile?

>> No.18680763

Lmao at all the christers itt going: "I don't actually believe in my religion but i need to stop dugeneracy and nihilism and Christianity is the way to do it." This gets you... right back to where we are now. Nihilists pretending they aren't nihilists to fight nihilism... really?

>> No.18680775

>>18680763
I believe in the Lord Jesus Christ most ardently anon. Some larpers do not a whole religion define

>> No.18680781

>>18680763
Nobody is pretending, unlike you.

>> No.18680800

>>18680781
Bunch of people above me saying that religion is basically socdarwinian, that is to say they are making atheist arguments for "believing" in god. Which would be totally unneccesary if they were sincere and not Pauline/Mahometan style rabble organizers with some political agenda in mind.

>> No.18680801
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18680801

>>18680775
You belong in Gehenna, clearly you never understood the word.

>> No.18680803

>>18680801
Repent and believe the gospel

>> No.18680815

>>18680544
>Why is there so much hate around the atheism movement now?
Millennial atheists, either just rational atheists or euphoric fedora-tippers are now living in a reality where religion and 'traditional values' are now dead and have been fully substituted with SCIENCE! and PROGRESS! and they're desperately crawling back.
I know because this is exactly what I'm doing. Our whole generation fucked up.

>> No.18680816
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18680816

I think the truth of the matter is a combination of bits of all the posts made in this thread so far. They all touch upon grains of truth, from sociological to ontological, and when put together they form a bigger picture.

Here's how I see it myself: Do I think people can live righteously without believing in some sort of god(s)? Absolutely. Will they? most of them won't, at least. The belief in supreme, higher entities that you could dedicate yourself to is an easy way to cultivate a sense of purpose and justice in life, and more importantly than that, it's a fast-pass ticket to forming a cohesive, tightly-knit social unit. From what I've seen, and having lived in a highly religious country for most of my life, the benefits of religion are best exemplified in its social effects rather than spiritual effects. You have a group, they all share moral values, they all share cultural background, and they all share a similar ontological stance on life. When you introduce atheism into the mix, things a lot less cohesive and far more blurry. Without a belief in absolute transcendental laws, you'll have a much harder time asserting any sort of moral values, you'll get ontological stances up the wazoo, and culture starts losing its weight when people have to rethink the last hundreds of years of their history. It is essentially anti-establishment, but people need an establishment to belong to together, as humans are naturally highly-social creatures, having a sense of community is integral to sustaining ourselves lest we risk extreme disenfranchisement (NOTE: secularity is not the sole factor in this, it's just one of many). Frankly, total freedom is a burden, and not one that many people find beauty in when put to practice. Even secularists need something to latch onto amongst a group of their peers.

>> No.18680821

>>18680544
>It was one of the biggest sources of intellectualism online for the past 7 years.

Source?

>> No.18680833

>>18680815
Science and progress always wins out. Traditionalism is a cancer.

>> No.18680884

>>18680781
he's completely right and the thread demonstrates it. people here argue for their own religiosity from within some sort of materialistic-utilitarian or aesthetic perspective. internet "christianity" is not real belief but a lifestyle choice that competes with other lifestyle choices via memes denigrating or extolling the members of a given group. i'm gonna join a church because it's less "cringe" than opening my mouth really wide to marvel movie trailers etc etc. the medium is the message and so what spreads over the internet is not religion but a religiosity fandom.

>> No.18680888

>>18680816
Religion as a means of achieving lawful behavior is not any better than the law. Religious people murdered each other just the same as we murder each other today. Religion was slightly better as a social binder but the reason why our society's social fabric is completely destroyed is mostly the result of forced multi-culturalism. Technically you could achieve the same kind of social unity that religion provides through some other thing, like nationalism. That's not the point. The point of religion is to give life a meaning, which none of the sciences nor philosophy, nor the law, nor anything else can provide.
I used to think of religion as some kind of element of order but this utilitarian, socio-political vision of it makes no real sense, or at least that's not the core of it.

>> No.18680995

Humans are just too cowardly to accept that there's nothing objective about their lives and thoughts. That there's no higher framework to their existence and the world around them, so they invent one in order not to lose their shit at the infinite expanse presented before them. You can cope by replying with soijaks, but it won't make it not true. Nothing binds us to anything. As >>18680816 mentioned, in reality you have the complete freedom to create whatever you want, and follow any path you want. There will be external resistances to that, like the power of the state and the judgment of your peers, but internally, you are completely free, and no one wants to believe that, because it takes a lot of effort and courage to embrace a life like that, so you might as well believe in something bigger and more righteous than you.

>> No.18681005

>>18680884
Based McLuhan poster. Their mouths are opened just as wide. The bugmen were merely videodrome's first victims.

>> No.18681008

>>18680763
their reasoning isn't "religion is good for society, so I will pretend to be religious" it's "religion is good for society, so it must be true"

>> No.18681017
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18681017

Let me reminder you atheists what your patron saint, Richard Dawkins, said in his best-selling book, The Selfish Gene.
Culture can be broken down into memes, bits of cultural information that behave like living organisms. They are born, mutate and die depending on how useful or entertaining they are.
Atheism is dying because it’s neither useful nor entertaining while religiosity is.
You are getting filtered out by your own ideology.
You will not be missed.

>> No.18681022

>>18681017
Christianity will also be overtaken by islam

>> No.18681026

>>18681017
>he says, as islam is rapidly replacing christianity

>> No.18681031

>>18680995
As time goes by and a variety of these overarching constructions are tried and tested, we will approximate an understanding which could be considered more objective, having witnessed the effects of history on a variety of ideologies. If we don't erase ourselves, imagine how our perspective might look like with additional 20 000 years of accumulated history, 100 000 years, 500 000...

>> No.18681032

Nobody but neckbeards and relitards give a fuck
And why are you posting this on /lit/?
Fuck all your OT identity politics spam

>> No.18681038

>>18680995
I was having a thought about that earlier this morning. There's no objective reality. There's a degree of truth, which is what science figured out so far, and that's rather impressive, but reality isn't truth. My perception is definitely different than someone else's, despite physics being the same for both. And at the same time the sciences do not even bother to point out what reality is. Ultimately, all possibilities are open. Science doesn't know shit about the universe still, so we could be living in a simulation, or find out 10000 years in the future that the universe is entirely deterministic. We don't know anything about reality. So if we know noting about reality, and we will very likely never find out as a species throughout the aeons even in we focus our entire existence on that, because we'll never be sure, what does it matter if someone becomes religious and embraces God. And since even that doesn't matter, it doesn't matter what God you choose either. The only sensible indicator of what is right at this point becomes what fulfills the need of someone else once your individual need is fulfilled (personally, religion = meaning) so what is someone supposed to get from a religion if not a community? So a man should just belong to his community's religious group, but today this religious group either doesn't exist or it doesn't take its own faith seriously. Basically, it's impossible to find a religion on any other sphere but the personal one in this society.

>> No.18681040

>>18681022
>>18681026
“Religion” is not synonymous with “Christianity”. If you want my opinion Christianity is slave morality while Islam isn’t. The point is that atheism will not win.

>> No.18681045

>>18681017
Christianity is just a virus and you're an antivaxxer leftover

>> No.18681050

>>18681026
>>18681022
Uhhh, sweetheart(s)? He didn't mention a specific religion.

"Sales of X are going to overtake Y."
>haha, fag, Xb is outselling Xa. CHECKMATE

>> No.18681053
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18681053

>>18681017
>but muh third world shithole

>> No.18681055

>>18681031
It's too bad none of us will be alive to see it. I don't want to live forever, and I welcome death by natural causes, but the only thing I feel bad about is that my curiosity regarding humanity's state in the far future will never be sated.

>> No.18681057
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18681057

>>18681040

>> No.18681060
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18681060

>>18681055
>my curiosity regarding humanity's state in the far future
humanity's state in the far future is a few steps away, in your backyard or in the street

>> No.18681064

>>18680628
>liberalism
I believe you mean illiberalism

>> No.18681074

>>18681060
AntChads....I kneel

>> No.18681079

>>18681008
You don't see how the former follows from the latter? "It must be true" is going to run into a lot of obstacles for the modern hyperconnected individual, who is surely aware of competing religions which contradict one another, not to mention the lack of evidence for any of them which he usually relies on for is other opinions. But it can be made believable if you have a motive, and the motive here is a kind of romantic nostalgia, or less charitably, a cargo cult mentality, aimed at bringing back the based society to defeat the cringe society. And once you're thinking in terms of politics you've poisoned the entire thing; religion becomes downstream of you and your tastes as a democratic consumer, believed in for its use value as a battering ram or palisade, not for any sort of truth value, because you've subordinated truth to outcomes which benefit you. Bad faith stinks from a mile away.

>> No.18681083

>>18681053
You live in a first-world country, with abundant resources and you STILL fail to reproduce.
What does that say about you, if not that you are a genetic dead end?
By your OWN metric the religious in third-World shitholes are winners simply because they fulfill their biological purpose

>> No.18681093

>>18680668
Sounds cowardly on the athiests' part

>> No.18681097

>>18681079
off course, even apologist like WLC ultimetly believe in christ because of "withness of the holy spirit"

>> No.18681100

>>18681079
>You don't see how the former follows from the latter?
Not him but no, it's not like that. The vast majority of people here who LARP as religious do not actually have any real faith in anything, just like the commies whom they blame for destroying the world. They do nothing but proselytize on the internet because they are otherwise incapable of religious action. Modern religiosity exists in opposition to liberal politics, homosexuality, and whatnot. It's not a positive force for the majority of the tradLARPers here. nor it is for the clergy who buys ads on Google to predate on desperate people who google "suicide".

>> No.18681102

>>18681038
Not who you replied to, but this is the conclusion I came to myself a long time ago, especially this part:
>The only sensible indicator of what is right at this point becomes what fulfills the need of someone else once your individual need is fulfilled (personally, religion = meaning) so what is someone supposed to get from a religion if not a community? So a man should just belong to his community's religious group, but today this religious group either doesn't exist or it doesn't take its own faith seriously. Basically, it's impossible to find a religion on any other sphere but the personal one in this society.
This can be stretched to include morality itself too. What are morals but a product of need and a desire to glue together a community? But the need itself isn't enough of a justification, so we project its weight onto larger constructs (e.g. god, the nation, the environment, etc.) because apparently, our needs are just not good enough to live by.

>> No.18681104

>>18681093
Atheists are cowardly satanists, they know god exists, the rejection is something far more sinister.

>> No.18681106

>>18681083
by any metric the church going portion of first world country is getting lower every year

>> No.18681109

>>18681104
so in your worldview, everybody knows god exist, but the one who don't suck up to him are the cowards?

>> No.18681119

>>18681083
Low birthrates are a kind of bio-potlach. What could be a greater sacrifice than ending one's bloodline as a display of wealth? As if to say "I have no need for children, I have my degrees, pets, collectibles, investment portfolios, expensive housing, gig-servants, and so forth, none of which are to be put to use enriching my clan, I shall squander my wealth in a frenzy of consooming!" To which the other first worlder says, "Ah but have you seen my degrees, pets, collectibles, investment portfolios, expensive housing, gig-servants, and so forth, for I shall not use these to increase myself either!" And on the margin, the third worlder says "I wish to acquire this power, so I shall go north and my children may participate in such rites."

>> No.18681122

>>18681109
Yes.

>> No.18681123

>>18680668
Islam being inherently radical and becoming violent when you talk shit is ironically the very reason why it will be the last religion standing before the globohomo inevitably takes its head as well. It's not that they're making lots of kids. If they were Christian all those kids would transition easily into religion-less post-modern life.
The first step to kill a religion is to convince the masses that it's OK not to take it 100% seriously all the time. Give it a little work and everyone will just laugh at it more than they take it seriously. Then they'll laugh at people who take it seriously at all.

>> No.18681124

>>18681104
You live in a hyper-reality. I know for a fact that whatever gods humans have worshipped over the ages do not exist. Maybe there's some sort of creator out there, but it's not one (You) or anyone else ever prayed to. Pull your head out of your ass.

>> No.18681126

>>18681122
nothing quite as brave as submiting to a father figure

>> No.18681131

>>18681124
their cope is that all those gods are real, just demons in disguise

>> No.18681132

>>18681100
Ah so you are saying they skip the crisis of faith altogether and just go straight to the antiques shop for an exciting product, there was never any question of belief, only costume. It may be a bit of both.

>> No.18681133

>>18681106
And yet the native birthrate is so low you have to import those same religious people from the third-world you disdain. You at getting ethnically replaced by mosque-going Muslims and yet you stubbornly hold on to your ideology.
Humans aren’t rational and being so obsessed with logic actually leads to completely illogical and irrational conclusions that run counter to your interests.
If atheists are so smart why do they keep consistently choosing the losing strategy over and over again?

>> No.18681135

>>18681124
Get thee behind me, Satan. I am not an idolater.
>>18681126
Have you read the 10 commandments? Are you that ignorant?

>> No.18681136

>>18681060
best ant-related literature to prepare me for my imminent ant-like existence?

>> No.18681141

>>18681102
>But the need itself isn't enough of a justification, so we project its weight onto larger constructs (e.g. god, the nation, the environment, etc.) because apparently, our needs are just not good enough to live by.
I hate this contradiction between modernity's socialist brand of collectivism where you have to do your little part in the world for everyone's sake, and its narcissistic focus on individual choice, worth, etc.
This enormous castle of lies is making people dysfunctional.

>> No.18681146

>>18681008
i don't think that's always the case, and even if it was it would still be a subjection of the truth of divine revelation to empirical testing and therefore, you know, not actually religious. genuine belief would not be contingent on scientifically measuring the results of adopting it.

an issue with talking about modern religion is that religion often justifies itself with its age, so old religious symbols get reused by new movements to gain legitimacy, like some wiccan chick that pretends all the witches that got burned back in the day were her predecessors. when that happens within a still-existing religion you can have entirely new mindsets emerging under the guise of the old cult symbols and terms, with people believing themselves to be "christian" or whatever even if their perspective would be entirely alien to a believer from a couple of centuries ago. a person who insists that the turin shroud is full of objectively measurable jesus radiation is not a christian but some sort of new-age ufo cultist who just calls the ufos "jesus", but his wacky theories will get lumped in with actual faith. same with the internet political movements that decorate themselves with salvaged religious symbols and language.

>> No.18681151

>>18681135
>just read the thing you've rejected and you'd agree with me
Truly christers are lost without a state

>> No.18681157

>>18681141
Get used to it, because confusion is an inseparable part from humanity's ontological experience.

>> No.18681159

>>18680544
The actual implications of a godless universe are just too bleak for pretty much everyone so they recreate god in various meme forms in their ideologies. The basic framework that atheism gives us to understand human existence is Darwinism and it is unbelievably unpleasant.

Politics heated up in the 2010s obviously so the ideologies as they became more prominent and were submitted to critique became hostile to atheism which is clearly corrosive to both left and right.

>> No.18681162

>>18681133
>If atheists are so smart why do they keep consistently choosing the losing strategy over and over again?
I am not my decendant or the society I live in, I'm an atheist because I don't believe in any religion, what happens after I die is of no importance to me

>> No.18681164

>>18680559
Aquinas went like
>Well you see, everything that happens must have a cause, so if you go back for enough, there must have been some original cause for everything
>Therefore I conclude that Jesus Christ died for our sins
The biggest jump-to-conclusions I've ever seen. Self-debunking.

>> No.18681165

>>18680669
>I got baptized last year
so you’re still an arrogant contrarian faggot. you never changed

>> No.18681169

>>18681159
this, mostly converges with what I wrote here
>>18680695

>> No.18681173

>>18681135
What about the ten commandement, does not working on the sabbath make you brave?

>> No.18681176
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18681176

>>18680669
Kek I was subscribed to TAA for most of my teen years as well. I considered religion as something that only uneducated dimwits took seriously. I even read like half of the Antichrist by Nietzsche and some parts of the book where he says that the good is whatever increases the feeling of power. I had basically resigned myself to leading a life of cheap pleasures and developed several addictions. During the lockdown I started to take the idea of faith more seriously, and the general Christian worldview became more appealing to me. Unironically a couple of Jay Dyer’s debates helped me to realise that relativism and empiricism/materialism weren’t really viable positions. Currently I’d say that I’m closer to Christianity than agnosticism. Also the fact that atheists weren’t really interested in putting forward a positive and authoritative perspective on life was a strike against atheism. In general I’d say that the loss of faith in the past ~300 years of Western society has had more negative effects than good. Visiting the third world and meeting people who were generally more spiritually healthy was eye-opening as well. Sure they have to deal with water shortages and crushing dictatorships but at least they see their lives as important in the grand scheme of things

>> No.18681182

>>18681157
>confusion is an inseparable part from humanity's ontological experience.
confusion maybe, but this is just schizophrenic contradition, it's straight up doublethink. I am a precious, irreplaceable and unique individual but at the same time I have to adjust my morality, behavior, and everything else for the harmony of the collective. Religion erases all contradiction in this. You actually don't matter that much, so here's some rules, follow them.

>> No.18681199
File: 137 KB, 780x602, new zealand religion.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18681199

>>18681133
the younger generation of most western country are getting less religious years by years

>> No.18681201

>>18680544
because atheism has become so common that it no longer is a symbol of intelligence(allegedly) like it used to be.

>> No.18681209

>>18681169
Yeah I read your post and I agree with it, it is well thought out, was just trying to summarize the situation as concisely as I could. I have always been fascinated by evolution and the implications of that theory. I definitely do think there is something 'divine' in reality but the unrelenting coldness of evolutionary logic is just intriguing in its own way and people really seem to block it out.

>> No.18681214

>>18681173
The day must be kept holy

>> No.18681220

>>18681132
>Ah so you are saying they skip the crisis of faith altogether and just go straight to the antiques shop for an exciting product
Honestly yes. I'm not talking for everyone on this board but the vast majority of tradlarpers use Christianity like the average SJW uses pronouns or some made up sexual orientation they probably just fantasize about when they masturbate to weird porn. And just like even the tranny doesn't really believe he's a woman, and needs constant validation from others that he is, to the point where getting that validation is more important than his own personal belief that he's a woman, same thing goes for the tradLARPer. He's all about broadcasting and approval. Extremely few people are safe from the clutches of this modern culture of display as identity, and you can see the same pattern in almost every facet of identity: music, books, politics, religion, and now sex and gender, and tomorrow something else. Everything is turning into an accessory because in the culture of products and lies, nothing really matters about your own identity, all that matters is display, fashion. Because identity, the truth you know about yourself, can be fabricated at any time. So all that's left to do is be as flashy as possible. And this ties into our slow reversal into basic animal state, to the colorful dance of feather and waving of bright antennae, until even that will go, eventually, because pragmatism will take that too.

>> No.18681234

>>18681176
>Kek I was subscribed to TAA for most of my teen years as well. I considered religion as something that only uneducated dimwits took seriously. I even read like half of the Antichrist by Nietzsche and some parts of the book where he says that the good is whatever increases the feeling of power. I had basically resigned myself to leading a life of cheap pleasures and developed several addictions. During the lockdown I started to take the idea of faith more seriously, and the general Christian worldview became more appealing to me
Oh look it's me. Nietzsche is a retard, though appealing when you are 17. He's the Ayn Rand of philosophers.

>> No.18681236

>>18681151
Who’s lost here? Not me, but your soul is.

>> No.18681237

>>18680544
>It was one of the biggest sources of intellectualism online for the past 7 years.
You motherfuckers were always retarded.

>> No.18681238

>>18681220
Beware the thomist tranny and his demands of fidelity.

>> No.18681239

>>18681214
I understand the reasoning for the ten commandement, but what link was there between them and being brave?

>> No.18681241

>>18680544
All of the "new atheists" are now trannies and social justice crusaders.

>> No.18681243

>>18680654
>You're not enlightened to shit. Atheists are some of the most profoundly arrogant human beings to walk the earth.

Only a blockhead could write this and not see the hypocrisy.

>> No.18681248

>>18681182
You're overthinking it, bro. Morals are created ad hoc. They're made to maximise protecting each other from hurt (at least within the in-group). This ad hoc nature will naturally create contradictions, between trying to protect the individual and make them feel good, and protecting society at large and making it feel good. The individual and the mob are separate entities after all, we know this to be true, these two entities have different needs and produce different actions.
>You're free! You're valid! You're unique!
But you cease to be all of that if it means hurting another, i.e. disturbing the social order. But exercising one's personal freedom must necessitate hurting someone or something else in some way. That's the bitter of truth it. To be free, you have to be willing to hurt. But conversely, we will all do all that we can to avoid being hurt ourselves. And therein lies the schism, the "schizo doulethink" as you put it. To break the construct, you would have to do either one of two things:
1- De-value the individual and emphasise their importance as a gear within a larger machine, instead of a being with its own interests and dignity.
2- Accepting hurting others as well as the possibility of being hurt ourselves, acknowledge your own interests and the interests of the other.
Now, as you can quickly tell, if you go with #2, modern humanity society will simply not exist in its present state, but will take on a very different form. In practice, we're really much closer to living according to #1, we're only being lied to that we're valuable as solitary entities.

>> No.18681249

>>18681236
I mean you can't argue for yourself. You need to call the late Roman governor or the bishop or your mother to preserve doctrine in the face of opposition. You've internalized that attitude so thoroughly you believe I am in some danger for disagreeing with you.

>> No.18681250

>>18680654
atheist aren't more arrogant or humble than anybody else, they just believe what they've been told like most people. The highest factor when determining what religion somebody has is which one his parents had

>> No.18681251

>>18681209
Don't forget there's also the meme aspect of evolution, so atheism or 'believing in'/understanding evolution itself could be dysgenic.

>> No.18681258

>>18681239
Because it is a path which one must fight to stay pure, to ward off demonic influence and temptation from people such as yourself.

>> No.18681261

>>18680995
What you're saying is basically the same as a caveman saying
>hur dur planets could never exist cuz we don't see them sky is just a giant yurt tent and the lights there are just holes poked through
Except you're worse than a caveman, because you're discounting all phenomena that do point to a higher framework.

>> No.18681262

Because atheism is against both liberal and conservative agenda, and the heavily-polarized cyberspace is intolerant of opinions that go against what their hivemind believes in.

>> No.18681266

>>18681249
>You need to call the late Roman governor or the bishop or your mother to preserve doctrine in the face of opposition
What are you talking about? Jesus literally said in the gospel that his followers will be persecuted and the way to act is to resist not evil. Shortly after saying that he was persecuted by a tribunal and crucified. It's the exact opposite of needing a state to enforce a doctrine.

>> No.18681267

>>18681220
I think you're missing something about this picture though, the tradlarper and the sjw are signaling socially yes, but they're also genuinely searching around for something of a 'spiritual' nature and that's what their culture gave them to fix on. There are very obvious religious aspects to the sjw stuff, and I don't think they're 100% negative, there is an (imo misguided) desire to save the wretched of the world and accept some vision of the beauty of humanity and the world in that ideology, it's not purely negative even though it has harmful features. The tradlarper type is the same thing, a lot of it is posturing, even of a hateful kind, but those kids are unmistakably looking for some spiritual framework, they deeply want something that allows them to celebrate the good things in reality and relent against what is bad in their nature, even as they use it for negative purposes.

I'm not saying I really think either of these things are good but if you've ever known a sjw or trad type it's profoundly clear that they are in fact trying to reach some kind of religious feeling, at least at times. It's an impulse that almost everyone has I think.

>> No.18681272

>>18680544
Because atheism bases itself mostly on strawmen. It's not intellectually honest.

>> No.18681276
File: 476 KB, 700x713, 1593402713257.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18681276

>>18681261
>the universe isn't a big yurt
I choose to believe in the great yurt in the sky.

>> No.18681281

>>18681234
Yes the philosopher who's inspired many great artists and philosophers, who's responsible for Post-Modernism to Wallace Stevens is a retard for 17 year olds. Christ cucks must be mentally defective, there no God, when you die it's over, your not going to heaven, I often get drunk with mates and shit on churches around my area and I'm not gonna ever gonna be punished for it. I take girls virginities then dump them and it means nothing, literally enjoy turning sweet innocent girls into sluts by sleeping with them then leaving them.

There are no virgins left cause we seduce them, soil them, move on

>> No.18681284

>>18681266
You're still just citing scripture to an infidel.

>> No.18681287

>>18681276
How big would that yurt be

>> No.18681292

>>18681281
post body

>> No.18681294

>>18681287
As vast as the domains of all the great Khagans who ever rode combined

>> No.18681299

>>18681294
Then how did spaceman go to space

>> No.18681300

>>18681281
>I often get drunk with mates and shit on churches around my area
>I take girls virginities then dump them
You're proving my point, you're obviously young (and retarded).

>> No.18681307

>>18680718
>>18680718
>>atheists that believe in evolution and survival of the fittest
>>fails to reproduce
>
>>religious that believes in a creation myth
>>pops out 5+
where is the contradiction or how does this disprove evolution and prove creationism?
>Hilarious that the proponents of Darwin can’t fulfill “their biological purpose”.
>Turns out atheism, rationality and scientism are maladaptive behaviors while religiosity is beneficial for survival and the continuation of the species.
yes religion is beneficial to survival. this only proves it's a means to an end.

>> No.18681310

>>18681299
you've been lied to about the size of all the great Khagans' domains.

>> No.18681311

>>18681284
What?

>> No.18681318

>>18681299
Cosmonaut ride the iron horse from Kazakhstan to hunt the stars

>> No.18681320

>>18681251
That's a central feature of why evolution is so unsettling, you yourself are a tool, your thoughts and desires nothing but tools to compel certain behaviors. You needn't even be capable of understanding yourself for the logic to work.

Culture and civilization massively complicate the logic however and I dont believe anyone has yet been able to make an integrated theory of biological and cultural evolution, the latter basically completely lacks serious predictive and explanatory frameworks and those that do exist cannot make them fit with the former very well.

I was very interested in the 'neoreaction' people back in the 2010s because it seemed like they were trying to answer this specific question, and they said some interesting things, but ultimately they were just a bunch of bloggers and they got tied down in temporal political stuff mostly. It was an ambitious project though, applying Darwin to culture and history is clearly a potentially fruitful path, even if it probably not the whole picture.

>> No.18681327

>>18680544
Because most atheists, like most theists, don't know jack and only talk out of their asses. Very, very few of them are intelligent like Nietzsche, someone who, by the way, was already highly critical of the type of person in your pic in the 19th century.

>> No.18681328

>>18681311
>bible says I'll be persecuted for telling people to worship my god or be damned
Wow very prescient, must be true... holy basado sacrada famiglia

>> No.18681330

>>18681300
Kek,

>> No.18681339

>>18681310
Great khagan already collects brides from your village, you not even aware, too busy basket weaving like small child

>> No.18681342

>>18680544
Because most of the leaders of the New Atheism movement were fakes.
After 11/9 it was vital to show that religion is bad and leads to nothing but terrorism. So, the US government hired some fake intellectuals to do a black PR for religion. Once this bullshit with Osama came out of fashion - there was no longer a need to fund these clowns.
Also, the followers of the New Atheism movement were mostly obnoxious ex-evangelicals who in their propaganda of atheism used their old evangelical methods which are cringe AF.

>> No.18681343

atheism is for soulless bugmen and midwits

anyone with an iq over 115 appreciates religion

>> No.18681346

>>18681342
>11/9
WHAT DID I MISS

>> No.18681350

>>18681343
Are you implying atheists can't appreciate religion?

>> No.18681352
File: 14 KB, 256x256, exa_exapunks.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18681352

>>18680647
The new left doesn't like anything concrete or absolute. Everything must be based on rhetoric and "lived experiences" which, of course, is vastly different from person to person. This makes makes it impossible to look at anything with an objective lens.
>because leftists now embrace multiculturalism and they perceive atheism to be offensive to brown people, who are inherently spiritual and magical in the minds on the liberal.
If you don't believe in anything objective, your opponent can't use le facts and logic against you. Conflicting ideas are embraced by true believers in the cause.

It's a tactic designed to divide people, eliminate free markets, and stop any opposition to global capitalism. Remember that diverse workplaces prevent unions.

Tangentially related, but a great read:
https://outline.com/7fhRBg

>> No.18681353

>>18680544
Even if I wasn't a Christian I'd have no respect for these people simply because all they do is focus on Abrahamic religions showing that its more about a vendetta with a certain group than actual conviction. It just doesn't come off as if it's really coming from a place of reason so much as hatred.

>> No.18681354

>>18681328
My point was Jesus lead by example. You should be willing to die rather than resist evil, to stop the karmic chain at yourself, by death, if need be.

>> No.18681355

>>18681318
yurt roof would break

retard

>>18681320
God made us evolve how he wanted via quantum effects shaping random chance for gene combinations wala

>> No.18681356

>>18681346
In 2001, two American buildings flew into the Bagram Airfield in Afghanistan, killing thousands.

>> No.18681357

>>18681343
“Appreciating religion” means nothing, kneel at the cross of Christ.

>> No.18681358

>>18681339
It's true, Great Khagan kidnap all women in my family and now make me post funny on glowy box for amuse

>> No.18681366

>>18681355
Stars are inside the yurt you horseless peasant

>> No.18681368
File: 136 KB, 832x793, what philosopher believe.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18681368

>>18681343
Even most philosopher are atheist at this point

>> No.18681373

>>18680565
They never had balls, that's why they try to mimick a testicle with their faces.

>> No.18681374

>>18681356
#always forget

>> No.18681375

>>18681248
>between trying to protect the individual and make them feel good, and protecting society at large and making it feel good
I don't see that. The individual is intrinsically part of society but that does not necessarily imply a contradiction. The thing with religion is that (ideally) everyone's following the same personal set of rules, and this enables society to function. Compare that to government-issued law that is aimed at protecting people with different sets of personal rules, often on terms other than morality: it's not a crime to suck 100 cocks every night as long as you don't take money for it, then it's prostitution, but when that's a problem for the law it's not so on a moral basis but instead on the grounds of social order.
Religious people are individually committed to God, because that's who they personally answer to. The law, the government, and now corporations, act like some sort of intermediary between the individual and society, and they tell lies to both about the other. It tells the individual lies about his society, and it tells society lies about the individual. What does the individual answer to? Not collectivity, which is the same collectivity he belongs to, but an intermediary to this collectivity, which he is not part of. And he's just fed lies. Not on the basis of reality (see the previous post where I said there's no reality) but because of internal discrepancies in its own discourse. One obvious thing is how I'm supposed to worry about sweatshop workers in Vietnam, when I can't really do anything about their conditions since I'm not running the sweatshop. Then I'm told I'm supposed to buy locally sourced products, but the companies move production to Vietnam because the sweatshop workers cost less. Then who is responsible for this? Society at large, the companies who represent my/society's wishes, me individually? I am called for personal responsibility and the only way to carry this out is to go AGAINST the wishes of my own society, who obviously love the low cost sweatshop products. And then companies, responsible for the sweatshop production, offer me a product that satisfies my need/responsibility, which at this point is nothing but another consumer want/tantrum. With religion, this shit is easy, you do your job. Period. It doesn't say that "society" should do something different than you. It just says: these are the rules, do this. And other people who follow the religion also do (hopefully) that. But their failings are part of a flow between individual and collectivity. If the individual fails, he fails in his personal commitment to God, not toward his society.

>> No.18681377

>>18681366
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I'll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I've been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I'm the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of spies across the USA and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You're fucking dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that's just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in unarmed combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of the United States Marine Corps and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little "clever" comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn't, you didn't, and now you're paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. You're fucking dead, kiddo.

>> No.18681379

>>18681352
>Um so hi? It’s me, the hecking cute queer disabled (mildly autistic) socialist you um have to be comrades with?
Lmao this is clearly written by someone from 4chan, what am I looking at here?

>> No.18681384

Wouldn’t Nietzsche be against this type of militant atheism? What am I missing here with new atheists fangirling over N?

>> No.18681385
File: 1.12 MB, 1080x1080, 1613779496568.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18681385

>>18681354
>jesus of nazareth rex iudaeorum
>karmic chain
Uh oh

>> No.18681388

>>18681384
They're retarded

>> No.18681390

>>18681368
Well, maybe that is the reason why we don't have good philosophers anymore.

>> No.18681393

>>18681355
Is 'wala' a muslim thing? And yes the idea that God or something like God is harmonizing the general progression of reality does feel very true. The mere existence of natural splendor and complexity , the existence of our own waking awareness and being, it all rings of something much greater than accidental chemical mechanism.

I do understand though the opposing view that this is a dream, a dream we believe for evolutionary purposes and nothing more.

>> No.18681399

>>18681384
99.9% of humanity doesn't read books.

>> No.18681401

>>18681385
DO NOT TRUST SEIGA SHE IS A HAG AND A WHORE AND HER TITS ARE SUPER SAGGY

>> No.18681404

>>18681385
I'll leave you with a quote.
> If you can't spontaneously detect (without analyzing) the difference between sacred and profane, you'll never know what religion means. You will also never figure out what we commonly call art. You will never understand anything.

>> No.18681410
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18681410

>>18681401
Duly noted.

>> No.18681413
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18681413

>>18681379
It's actually from Stupidpol on plebbit. (Hi guys.)

Pretty decent place to debate about identity politics where you can argue with leftists who aren't going to call you a nazi just because you don't want your family to be brutally murdered by millitary age immigrants who want to kill infidels.

>> No.18681415

>>18681267
>the tradlarper and the sjw are signaling socially yes, but they're also genuinely searching around for something of a 'spiritual' nature and that's what their culture gave them to fix on
I disagree, unless you also concede that these people have completely lost all sense of what "spiritual" even means. Spirituality is inherently directed inwards. Even if its results may become manifest in one's behavior and actions, the spiritual search is private.
One common thing between the tradLARPer and the SJW is that they're not concerned at all with "saving the world" beyond an ideal push for consistent thought which is entirely done by opposition. In the ideal SJW world there are no "Nazis" and in the ideal tradLARPer world there are no trannies. This is why once all the Nazis are gone, the SJWs will find more Nazis among their own ranks, and so on. And the tradLARPers will find more trannies within their ranks, and so on. It's inevitable because there is no personal belief in display ideologies except the demotion of some "other". It cannot be a unity under a certain behavioral banner because if the individual has done no spiritual search and has no personal set of beliefs, he cannot imagine what the banner will look like. He can only think "I don't want THAT" and see that it is removed. You could argue that this is simply a misguided attempt to "save the world" but there's no "saved word" at the end of the SJW/tradLARPer's imagination because the last frame is blank. And unable to find that last frame where the world is saved, he continues the quest forever.

>> No.18681417
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18681417

>>18681404
>thinking there's a difference between sacred and profane

>> No.18681418

>>18681410
Since when can vampires breathe underwater? This is clearly a m*rmaid imposter.

>> No.18681419

It's not that they're hated now, they just lost the narrative support that they received when they were still useful to the ones forming the narrative. They literally just got dumped by mainstream media and social engineers, they went from being paraded around as cool and intelligent guys to being mere fedoralords, which is what they were all along, it just wasn't the manicured image you were presented with when they had their place in combating Bush-era republican retardation.

Never forget : what is cool and what is hated is always dependent more on institutional backing and its whims than it is dependent on anything concrete. Tradcaths and /pol/tards would be shown off as cool and subversive dissidents against an evil regime instead of the basement dwellers that most of them are had the mainstream media have a use for them, just like '68-ers were astroturfed into being cool and rebellious by hollywood instead of merely degenerate, it's literally that simple. What percentage of people hate christianity because they read the bible or had some experience with it, and what percentage of people hate it because they saw South Park make fun of it in one episode when they were 14?

The narrative, the framing of issues, the particular optics : it's all that ever matters in mainstream discourse.

>> No.18681423

>>18681418
They don't breathe at all retard

>> No.18681426

>>18681418
She was actually a shark all along!

>> No.18681427

>>18680544
Maybe people realized that they don't know if there is a God, most people in the world have an intuition that there is some kind of God or God like thing out there and Athiests belief that there is no God. And there is no way they can know that there is no God.

>> No.18681430

>>18681399
Ignorance is bliss anon

>> No.18681436

>>18681418
vampire don't need to breath, that's why they sleep in coffin

>> No.18681444

>>18681415
You're attacking the worst aspects of these people though, have you ever actually known one irl? They are clearly not just evil and motivated by hatred, these are popular movements, masses of normal people engage in them.

These are the means by which these people can interact with meaning in a culture that is very broken, yes it is fundamentally unsound, and yes they are giving in to the worse impulses they have in many respects, but they are still just people attempting to understand the world and find some kind of sense to it, their basic impulse is not wrong.

>> No.18681452

>>18681419
great post. this is what I was also lamenting when I said that individuals are being torn apart by schizophrenic narratives. these generational changes are happening so fast and so inorganically that the only way to survive is to abandon all identity. the ideal human being in the future will be able to think one thing one moment and the exact opposite the next

>> No.18681454

>>18681444
Checked but don't simp for people who would guillotine you if they had so much as a gram of state power

>> No.18681456

>>18680654
>It cemented the fact that humans always need something higher to believe in
As a collectivist group maybe, as individuals no.

>> No.18681461
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18681461

>words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words words
Being human is so tiring. I just want to love and be loved.

>> No.18681468

Such dishonest comments ITT. kek. Atheist did attack Islam.

>> No.18681471

>>18680695
Left-wing New Atheists became SJWs around the time of the Fourth Great Awakening (~2013-ongoing). They soured on New Atheism because anti-Islamic sentiment within New Atheism went against the core imperative of the post-WW2 left (protecting "Victims"). Right-wing New Atheists were the progenitors of the Alt-Right. The core difference between the two is that the latter believed that God wasn't real and the former believed that God wasn't very nice.

>> No.18681474
File: 2.56 MB, 300x424, 1612390246289.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18681474

what makes one religion more "true" than another?

>> No.18681478

>>18681444
>They are clearly not just evil and motivated by hatred
I didn't say they were? I didn't even imply that this behavior is planned, neither on the SJW part nor the tradLARPer's side. I believe that there are malicious and cynical people in both ranks but I also believe there's some kind of genuine identity crisis at the base of this, which is normal because everyone right now is flailing helplessly in search of an identity. I'm just saying that this way to cope with a lack of identity is illusory and there's nothing spiritual in it, it's just a desperate attempt to find communion with a community through approval, mostly carried out through the ritual burning of a strawman.

>> No.18681481

>>18681474
You will know it by its fruit.
So, Christianity.

>> No.18681486

>>18681454
I know they'd guillotine me and I'll simp for them anyway, that's not out of some sense of righteousness, believe me I am not really the nicest person, but the same portion in me that doesnt hate and is not bad I see in all of them too. This portion, this fundamental fact of non-hatred and understanding is the only thing that I can think of that redeems us all.

>> No.18681487

>>18681419
>Tradcaths and /pol/tards would be shown off as cool and subversive dissidents against an evil regime instead of the basement dwellers that most of them are
The fact that we have no institutional support and are constantly demonized by the media is proof that we are actual dissidents and not just LARPing basements dwellers

>> No.18681496

>>18681471
One of the only good posts itt. In a way the entire present culture war was seeded by OG South Park.

>> No.18681501

>>18681487
Well, you're a dissident basement dweller, and a lot of you are indeed LARPing.

>> No.18681502

>>18681474
They're all pointing at the same fundamental truth, which is why the same morals keep cropping up over and over.

>> No.18681508

>>18681487
No it's proof that you are useful, like the criminals shown on the nightly news before the advertisements for cars and vacations. Don't be like those people, behave and work on your credit score.

>> No.18681509

>>18681487
Honestly that is faulty reasoning and there's no necessary correlation. According to this logic, you could say that people who believe that reptilians have messed with human history to hide that the Earth is flat are right just because everyone unequivocally thinks they're retarded.

>> No.18681510

>>18681478
I see what you're saying, and you're right, but I think there is always still a fragment of the spiritual impulse in these kinds of things. I mean they just so clearly look like they're crying out for it at times

>> No.18681529

>>18681474
The transcendantal argument and presuppositionalism popularised by youtube theologian jay dyer

>> No.18681533

>>18681083
What's the purpose of reproduction?

>> No.18681548

>>18681533
To have 10 free worke- I mean children to plow the field with you, and maybe hopefully one of them will be a big shot and carry you on their backs.

>> No.18681562

>>18681461
based

>> No.18681584

>>18680718
>>18681083
Baseline is set off of precedent. Shitholes have relative stability and simple calculus. First world countries are suffering a contraction from extreme wealth to diminishing over time wealth. The psychological effects of living in a society where wealth is decreasing is more depressing than a stable shit hole. Humans aren't going to shit out kids in the middle of a crisis and our monetary system has developed purposefully into a perpetual crisis by design to limit population growth. If religious ignorance won out we would over populate the Earth and permanently destroy its life supporting systems. The powers that control the Earth's number one concern right now is peaceful depopulation methods. Depression is one of the most potent methods.

Who would win? Some dude that scribbled "Be fruitful and multiply" when the human population was under a billion total or informed rulers panicking that prosperity dogma will kill the planet?

>> No.18681603

>>18681584
>guys i dont believe in the beard sky man haha i believe in the world governments colluding to depopulate the world haha i am so rational and enlightened

>> No.18681613

>>18680544
Because it was popularized by loser virgins who were obsessed with cartoons, star wars and superhero nonsense.

>> No.18681616

>>18681496
I wouldn't say it was caused by South Park. I've never watched it so I don't really know what relation it has here. I think New Atheism was more of a reaction to the Bush years than anything. Aside from the ideological split, the lack of Bush caused the whole thing to peter out.

Also, I think the
>God isn't real vs. God isn't very nice
dichotomy is the core difference between the post-Christian Left/Right. There's a Rene Girard interview where (summarizing) he describes two different forms of anti-Christianity. On one hand you have the Nazis and their descendants who more or less completely rejected "concern for victims". OTOH you have the post-war left, which in its current form is mostly a reaction to Nazism, that basically views Christianity as a failure for being insufficiently radical towards "the victim". Obviously the Left rejected Christianity first but it is rapidly being done on the Right as well, though the conflict between the two is unchanged.

>> No.18681635

Hey guys, nice thread, I want to read all your posts, but I gotta go run an errand, can you all stop posting for like an hour please? Thanks.

>> No.18681664

>>18681635
God is that you?

>> No.18681670

95+% of atheists aren't smart enough to be atheists. Most of them don't actually know what they believe and can only vocalize it in vague concepts. When they try to express what they don't believe, they usually resort to strawmen (assuming they even make an argument). I've got nothing against someone who, being an educated and intelligent individual, has come to the conclusion there is no God. Most atheists are just too lazy or apathetic to be anything else so they parrot comedians and talk show hosts.

>> No.18681672

>>18681502
>same fundamental truth
Which is?

>> No.18681678

>>18681616
>think New Atheism was more of a reaction to the Bush years than anything. Aside from the ideological split, the lack of Bush caused the whole thing to peter out.
From the same cultural milieu. A metonym of it if you will.

>> No.18681692

>>18681584
Your ancestors reproduced under much harsher conditions. They had sex and bore children even during the Black Plague, during wars, during famines and during natural disasters.
>The psychological effects of living in a society where wealth is decreasing
Your ancestors were infinitely poorer than you and yet they still had children. You think the psychological effects of being unable to afford more funkopops is worse than living in fear that you might drop from lethal disease or be blown to smithereens by a bomb dropping on your house?
The psychological effects you speak off are only affecting you because you turned your back on religion and embraced rationality, science and materialism. So if there is no God out there then nothing matters, right?
Nihilism sets in, the only thing you value is material wealth, your only purpose in life become self CONSOOMING and the prospect of being unable to CONSOOM in greater quantities than before is so depressing that you give up having children because they won’t be able to CONSOOM more than the previous generation.
This is the result of pursuing rationality and logic at all costs, you end up coming to completely absurd and ironically irrational conclusions like “we should depopulate the planet even thought global birth rates are going down across the board”.

>> No.18681703

>>18681672
We're all one bro. Drop acid a couple times for the tl;dr or start meditating.

>> No.18681710

>>18680544
Atheism+.
It replaced the value of skepticism with idpol listen and believe.
It is now a walking joke

>> No.18681729

Always fascinating to see theist sophistry at /lit/. An Atheist is someone who doesn't believe in the existence of god. That's it. Unlike religion it's not an organised structure with specific set of rules. Sure, there may have "atheist" groups in your country but, a Catholic in my country believes in God, prays to Jesus, listens to the Pope, just like any other Catholic. But as an Atheist I see no reason why I've to be associated with a specific"Atheist" group of your respective countries.

>> No.18681731

>>18680628
>Religion ALWAYS wins baby
I mean what you posted above became the lefists new religion. You speak out against any of the above and you get religious ferver back.

>> No.18681743

>>18680544
>Doesnt focus on Islam
>scientism and lack of skeptism towards pharma
>Listen and Believe

>> No.18681745

>>18681731
>I mean what you posted above became the lefists new religion
not him but no, that's not a set of beliefs. leftists' buzzwords are not beliefs, their only aim is to destroy something else
religion (when it's not a LARP) is adherence to a set of beliefs, this is nothing like what leftists do

>> No.18681746

>>18680544
People realized atheism is a lie from the pit of hell. It's not cool to mock the living God. His arms are open for you to repent though and he loves you

>> No.18681775

>>18681746
God is gay.

>> No.18681784

>>18681743
Strawman.

>> No.18681805

>>18681729
>sophistry
Its not sophistry, your just a retard who cant read. OP asked about
>the atheism movement
A group of personalities revolving around the base idea that God as we collectively understand it does not exsist. Its not an umbrella term for all atheists, like punk movement musicians did not cover all anarchists. Just a small subset of ppl who held a belief.

>> No.18681836

>>18680597
>a lot of the figureheads of the "movement" ended up becoming rightwing grifters
Who?

>> No.18681843

>>18681805
Yeah, as if every atheist thread on /lit/ isn't subjected to the same strawman arguments by anons.

>> No.18681852

>>18681784
>Strawman
It's not a strawman you mong, its not describing a persons position, it is stating what they did/did not do.
Objective things,
>Doesnt focus on Islam
Islam is antathetical to western scientific values and is fundamentally untrust worthy due to the practice of Taqiya. People were too scared or just petered out of talking about it.

>scientism and lack of skeptism towards pharma
The fellating of science/scientists and treating people who questioned science (literally science even if done is a waterheaded way) with take down videos instead of guiding them towards enlightenment.

>Listen and Believe
Atheism+ and the new leftists struggles sessisons "cancelling" were the final nail in the movement that split the community into leftist zealots. And right wingers / grifters.

>> No.18681854

>>18681852
The only reason why Islam stayed completely untouched by the anti-religious discourse is that if you talked shit on Islam someone would chop your head off. And that hasn't changed today.

>> No.18681862

>>18681692
You can't be a consumerist if you are actually rational.

>> No.18681879

>>18681692
If you did even the slightest bit of research you would find that birthrates declined during all the periods you mentioned. I'm not glorifying modern wealth decay and making a false equivalence that it is somehow more harrowing than disease (kek) or war. I'm merely explaining to you that someone else did do the research, noticed the pattern, and implemented a system that would produce an adequate psychological stressor to acheive the result of diminished reproduction over a long period of time.

To reduce the effect to how it impacts frivolous consumerism is absurd ignorance. This has nothing to do with knick knacks like funko pops and everything to do with essentials like debt, home ownership, health care, retirement savings, and job stability. In modern society most of these basics are fucked by all metrics. Our friends across the pond do better, but even they are facing a crises of home ownership, retirement savings, and job stability.

But I'm arguing with a retard anyway

>This is the result of pursuing rationality and logic at all costs, you end up coming to completely absurd and ironically irrational conclusions like “we should depopulate the planet even thought global birth rates are going down across the board”

No fucking shit, sherlock. That's exactly what is happening. The fact that global birthrates are falling is evidence that the measures taken to reduce population are working. This is an ongoing project, not something started last year.

>> No.18681914

>>18681852
Muslims aren't human. Atheists know this, which is why they typically refrain from entering discourse on the religion and instead simply promote Western governments annihilating their countries.

>> No.18681927

>>18681852
Such balant lies. Islam was shit on by atheists constantly.

>> No.18681965

>>18681879
You're stupid. You're giving a baseless assumption that attributes current events to a high power, without having any proof for it. Like a prehistoric man who sees a lightning and says, "that must be Zeus being angry", you see population decline and say, "that must be the elites lowering birthrates".

Not to mention the sheer absurdity that "Earth can't support more people" when we have vast untapped lands in Africa and Asia.

>> No.18681966

>>18681852
They did shit on Islam, especially during the period where Europe was being hit by constant terrorist attacks and especially Sam Harris. Christopher Hitchens wrote about it in his book where he was shitting on all religions even the eastern ones.

https://youtu.be/ZCHHfBeu0QE

>> No.18682038

>>18680630
>debunked by his own divine revelation
>>Reginald, I cannot, because all that I have written seems like straw to me

As quoted, you have take his remark out of context. This is the context:
>Such things have been revealed to me that all that I have written seems to me as so much straw.

Aquinas is setting up a comparison: his work, in comparison to a remarkable divine revelation, seems to him so much straw.

He's not saying that his work, as such, is worthless; rather, in comparison to the revelation of God, it is so much straw.

The same of course would properly be said of any human creation - whether of Shakespeare or Mozart - in comparison with God himself.

>> No.18682119

>>18681965
Humans need water not land. Go look at where all of human population is clustered, land doesn't mean anything. You seem hung up on the idea that our world has rulers, name a point in time in history when it did not. Just a singular time period in 10,000 years of civilization when there were not rulers.

Regardless, we're past that point even mattering much. The effects of diminshing wealth driven depopulation are all downstream from fiat currency and usury systems. Take your grievance up with a math equation, not a flesh and blood shadowy cabal. I personally hold the belief that the purpose of this system had a higher cause than pure greed. Depopulation from induced financial stress is an easy extrapolation to make from a currency system that rapidly deteriorates savings and generational wealth. Either the depopulation is just a side effect or it was the goal. I choose to believe it was the goal, but I don't claim my belief to be infallible.

>> No.18682607

>>18680544
Because like most people worth a damn will say, atheism is nothing but sneering and posturing ever since Dawkins and Hitchens gained prominence. What the new atheist movement is missing is actual depth in their reasoning and critique of Christianity and monotheistic religions in general, as well as being competent at reading the Bible and knowing some fundamental theological concepts. One would do a lot better if they read Nietzsche and Moby Dick and based their critique on that, rather than listening to those frauds.

>> No.18682615

>>18680544
>for people need to realise that mere etymological arguments or, worse, small-minded rationality can not be considered as a finality, but merely minuscule fragments of a metaphysical phenomenon

>> No.18682624

>>18682607
>What the new atheist movement is missing is actual depth in their reasoning and critique of Christianity and monotheistic religions in general, as well as being competent at reading the Bible and knowing some fundamental theological concepts
Lol no popular movement has knowledge of any of this stuff anymore. It's all about superficial "criticism" now

>> No.18682645

>>18682607
I hate atheists more than rapists, at least rapists aren’t dishonest.

>> No.18682656

>>18681509
What??? Not that anon, but according to their logic it would mean that people who believe in reptilians are dissidents, which, no matter how silly and strange their notions, they are.

>> No.18682662
File: 86 KB, 750x750, 07bc837887825f8abebf7211ec4a7253.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
18682662

>>18680544
>Why is there so much hate around the atheism movement now?

Frankly, because it never developed. It was just a type of youth contrarianism when Evangelicals were a huge political force. Intellectually, what the movement produced was literally just baby's first foray into philosophy that never bothered going anywhere further into the themes of epistemology and metaphysics that were presupposed in their overall views. I'm not even saying that atheism is false per se, just that the internet atheist movement of the 2000s turned out to be just intellectually sterile and degenerated into the I Fucking Love Science types of today.

>> No.18682668

>>18681461
Imagine just being a frog and chilling by the river

>> No.18682843

>>18681040
Islam is absolutely slave morality, and the newest generations of its adherents that have migrated to Europe are embracing globohomo faster than Christians ever did.

>> No.18682877

>>18681022
>>18681026
And then consumed by the hedonism and materialism as well, accomplishing nothing

>> No.18682937

>>18681836
Dawkins, most notably.

>> No.18682975

>>18680641
Fucking hell, what a retard

>> No.18683020

>>18680641
Holy shit

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