/wg/ - Writing General

[Anonymous No.18881722]

How's that novel going buddy? Almost finished? Still no character name?
previous:>>18860292

For Prose:
>The Art of Fiction
>Story Genius: How to Use Brain Science to Go Beyond Outlining and Write a Riveting Novel (Before You Waste Three Years Writing 327 Pages That Go Nowhere)
>On Becoming A Novelist
>Writing Fiction: A Guide to Narrative Craft
>How Fiction Works
>The Rhetoric of Fiction
>Steering the Craft
>On Writing, Borges

For Poetry:
>The Poetry Home Repair Manual
>Western Wind: An Introduction to Poetry
>This Craft of Verse, Borges

Related Material:
>What Editors Do
>A Student's Introduction to English Grammar
>Garner's Modern English Usage

Suggested books on storytelling:
>The Weekend Novelist
>Aristotle's Poetics
>Hero With a Thousand Faces
>Romance the Beat

Traditional publishing
> Formatting manuscript
https://blog.reedsy.com/manuscript-format/
> Write a query
https://www.janefriedman.com/query-letters/
> Track your query
https://querytracker.net/

Other Resources
>General grammar/syntax/editing help
https://owl.purdue.edu/owl/purdue_owl.html
> When/where/how should I write?
https://jamesclear.com/daily-routines-writers
> What software should I write with?
https://self-publishingschool.com/book-writing-software-best/
> Amazon Publishing to make that KDP monie
https://kdp.amazon.com/en_US/help/topic/G200635650
> Be like Charles Dickens and write serially
https://www.royalroad.com/
> Basic overview of the Screenplay format
https://screenwriting.info/

[Anonymous No.18881740]

Are faggots still trying to force this general even though it’s dead at this point?

[Anonymous No.18881749]

Tell me about your own story construction theory/method/guideline

[Anonymous No.18881752]

>>18881749
Why would we ever do that?

[Anonymous No.18881776]

>>18881749
I dunno, usually it's just a good premise and then I build the puzzle around it, for short stories. Sometimes I try to find the most plain things and try to construct a story around it that resonates.

[Anonymous No.18881786]

>>18881722
>finish the manuscript
>wait for my readers (mom, brother and a friend) to give me feedback so I can incorporate that in the editing phase
>radio silence
No progress is being made. Wrote some goodreads reviews to keep the fingers tapping away at something.
The past is increasing. The future is decreasing. I should edit today, but I'm lost.

[Anonymous No.18881799]

>>18881749
I just think about the coolest possible climaxes(not just the climax of the whole story but also in terms of scene/chapter high points) and then it's all about building the ideal circumstances that lead to them in the most engaging way possible.

[Anonymous No.18881809]

>>18881749
Star Wars sequels were written with this template, weren't they?

[Anonymous No.18881878]

>>18881749
think of a goal
think of the type of character that would have the most trouble achieving that goal
think of the specific obstacles the character would potentially face and base the plot points around each of them

[Anonymous No.18881926]

Am I correct in my assumption that slush pile is actually mostly slush? It’s not mostly aspiring good authors with interesting prose but pure slush. Illiterate people writing about their lives with improper grammar and horrific writing style and uninteresting stories.

Am I also correct that if you write with good grammar, write a decent story that keeps the pages turning, you are most likely in the top 5%?

[Anonymous No.18881939]

Why are all my main characters always nuts schizos?

[Anonymous No.18881944]

Any Polish writers here who'd like to share works for critique?

[Anonymous No.18881945]

>>18881939
Because you don’t plan and outline ur characters. Into the the slush pile.

[Anonymous No.18881960]

>>18881926
No and no

[Anonymous No.18881964]

>>18881960
Elaborate.

[Anonymous No.18882074]

>>18881749
I guess it's overarching plotlines with added story arc subplots.

[Anonymous No.18882094]

>>18881964
So you disagreed for the sake of it.

[Anonymous No.18882193]

>>18881749
>Tell me about your own story construction theory/method/guideline
PERSONAL AUTISM INCOMING
1. Finding the love interest ("muse" - romantic/sensual/sexual inspiration of the MC - dictates the tone, aesthetics, symbolics, poetics of the narrative)
2. Finding the main character (active principle, dictates the vector of decisive action throughout the story - the narrative stems from his/her desires, vision, undertakings)
3. Putting together the Main Character + Love Interest to create their World / Thesis/Antithesis = Synthesis. The synthesis that comes out of the love interest and main character's union (passive + active principle) is a system with its own narrative/linguistic/semiotic regime and a course of action. A "World" is created that encompasses the characters' cultural references/history/heritage, their interests/desires, their creations/discoveries/adventures, their psychology, emotional experiences, etc. Various characters and plots are built on top of this. Because it is a union of opposites, it is complete.
4. Five-Act structure that I use =
Act I > The base ground, the "previous" state of the world before the narrative takes place. The "energy" is resting
Act II > The "energy" begins rising, the mechanics of the story are activated, everything is filled with beginnings, there is a sense of euphoria and youth
Act III > Narrative apotheosis, apex/ecstatic peak, all emotions and aspirations come to a culmination, the narrative is pushed to the paroxysm, usually it is an absolute schizophrenic moment
Act IV > Everything goes to shit in the most brutal and violent manner possible. It must be unpredictable, dramatic, and immoral - the consequences of the previous act going too far
Act V > The "after" state. Once again, we go back to the base ground and observe the changes and "energy" fluctuations that it has underwent throughout the narrative.

[Anonymous No.18882256]

Pizza time draws closer, as does another 10k slab of words. Feels good.

[Anonymous No.18882299]

>>18881786
How do you not feel really embarrassed when showing people your writing?
I've only just started writing but even the thought of telling people I'm trying to write makes me feel embarrassed.

[Anonymous No.18882353]

>>18881749
I procrastinate.

[Anonymous No.18882447]

>>18882299
Not him but I never tell people I write because I fucking hate people who do that. If you write then just do it and then show me the end product. I don't wanna hear about your novel you been working on or how you're a writer, that never finishes anything. Normies do this shit all the time.

[Anonymous No.18882488]

Good morning or good evening depending on where you are, hope you good sirs and ladies are all in good health and are wearing a smile today. Weeks ago, I descended upon this forum in a highly brash and irritating manner, my initial incursion fueled a deep desire to receive feedback, helping me critique my work, demanding I squeeze more effort out of myself.

After a thorough pummeling at the hand of /lit/'s most eloquent wordsmiths, I reached down, grabbed my prolapsed bussy, stuffed it back in and pulled my trousers up in one easy motion. Returning here, at this moment, to receive another thorough bashing, perhaps one that will finally break a buck under that metaphorical hot 'bama sun. Maybe it is just the sleep deprivation or the mental illness, I cannot tell, but if you'd be so kind as to observe the pair of links below. At one time I wrote a draft and thought it was good. It was shit. Please, look at it, it is like the game Pong, functional as a back-and-forth, but lifeless, not an open world. I hope in my latest version I have weaved something interesting, something that shows one man's journey to the redpill about urban life. It is terrible, to witness those who fall through the cracks, even worse if you fall through them yourself.

https://jason-bryan.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/TheShitkickers-Chapter1.pdf
>this is the earlist rough draft I have

Compare the above to my most recent work below, any and all feedback is appreciated:

https://jason-bryan.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/tsk-chap1-new.pdf
>most recent work, please review and give feedback, thank you

[Anonymous No.18882511]

>>18882299
Having a friend who also writes helps

[Anonymous No.18882513]

>>18882488
seek help

[Anonymous No.18882557]

>>18882488
Pick a tense and stick to it. Your first sentence of the second link is fucked.

[Anonymous No.18882568]

>>18882557
>https://jason-bryan.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/tsk-chap1-new.pdf
How would you fix the tense of the first sentence?

I've been debating if I should thread the sentences together or leave it with 3 "thes" in a row

[Anonymous No.18882574]

>>18882568
Are you Retarded?

[Anonymous No.18882579]

>>18882574
Yes, please help? I'm trying my best here, if you can help point out my fuck-ups, I would greatly appreciate it.

[Anonymous No.18882580]

>>18882568
Sry the tense thing I said is unrelated to how the first sentence is shit. Your first link is riddled with changing tense.

[Anonymous No.18882585]

>>18882579
You want help? Read Elements or Style. It’s free pdf online.

[Anonymous No.18882596]

>>18882580
Oh my first link is like 8 months old, my 2nd link is from a couple days ago.

[Anonymous No.18882710]

>>18881722
First draft done and now going through second rough draft where I'm checking
>check each scene's structure and if they fulfill their purpose
>if characterization is correct
>incorporate more style as my first draft is really basic
>check technical details (economy, science) that have to be right
It should take me a few weeks to get through it and honestly feel much more confident about the novel from earlier this year. If I keep at it I can have a "final" copy to send out by early December.
I don't have a comp title yet but if I had to describe it
>Revelation before things get better
>scifi horror in a transhuman utopian setting
Highly derivative but I think I synthesize enough to make it cool.

[Anonymous No.18882724]

>>18882447
I don't know, I've met people who really like to talk about it because they want to understand what goes into crafting a story, even if they mainly watch movies/tv it's fascinating to just discuss that even if you don't say what you're actually doing.

[Anonymous No.18882748]

>>18881722
I started writing my first novel on Saturday. Have written 4000 words so far, aiming for a 100k novel of a three part series. Epic fantasy with existential narrative. Spent a week beforehand researching how to write, what mistakes to avoid. All 6 of my beta readers loved the prologue.

[Anonymous No.18882821]

>>18882748
>Epic fantasy with existential narrative.
Quite an ambitious start.

[Anonymous No.18882877]

>>18882821
Go big, or go home.

[Anonymous No.18882892]

>>18882877
Yeah, and 2.5 years later, my novel is only half finished.

[Anonymous No.18882939]

>>18882724
I feel like I garner a broader sense of authority by going straight into critical analysis of a given piece of media instead of mentioning I write on the outset. I barely believe I am any of the things I actually am, let alone a “writer”.

[Anonymous No.18883047]

>>18882748
>existential narrative
I do this with horror but its fairly light and simple arguments if at all. Questions and fears about existence are more cool.

[Anonymous No.18883057]

>>18882892
You gotta up that pace. Stop worshipping your first draft

[Anonymous No.18883076]

Do you use semicolons? I've had plenty of times where I wanted to use a semicolon, but used a period or a comma instead because I didn't want to come off as a pretentious cunt. I wish people used semicolons more.

[Anonymous No.18883156]

>>18883076
I would have answered but you used an anime avatar completely unrelated to your message.

[Anonymous No.18883411]

>>18883076
I have 7 semicolons in 140k words. They have their place.

[Anonymous No.18883470]

>>18881220
>What's on your writing music playlist my dude?
A lot of Buckethead songs from Electric Sea and Electric Tears. A little of Ludovico Einaudi. There's a small artist named Sad Souls from Ann Arbor, MI, that I really like. Explosions in the Sky and Lifeformed, another small artist who did music for Dustforce.

[Anonymous No.18883580]

>>18882488
I can read this later tonight when I have some time.

[Anonymous No.18883762]

>>18883076
I use semicolons to replace a single comma or full stop in sentences where the information is important. In theory it's to make it more memorable because they'll probably notice the uncommon grammar.

[Anonymous No.18883787]

>>18882256
The 10k is done, 10,096 this time. Now, about the pizza...

[Anonymous No.18883801]

anyone working on scholarly stuff, is that welcome here?

[Anonymous No.18883826]

>>18881939
Probably because of what the other anon said, your stories aren't coherently structured and you make your character insane rather than try to get things sorted out.

[Anonymous No.18883869]

Can I get some feedback? This excerpt is from a surrealistic adventure novella I'm writing. In this chapter, the protagonist is pushing through the backwoods of the Florida panhandle, on the hunt for a missing scientist. My description feels pretty solid to me, but I'm on the last draft and I'm trying to add some action but it just feels flat no matter what.
https://pastebin.com/Z9wEApQL

[Anonymous No.18883876]

>>18881939
My characters are always nuts schizos because I am sexually attracted to nuts schizos

[Anonymous No.18883877]

>>18883411
that is a good ratio anon, semi colons are so easy to make mistakes with, you should only use them when absolutely sure. retards should not even bother.

[Anonymous No.18883921]

>>18883801
sure but if it is going to get published or be submitted to a academic program posting online might trigger anti-plagiarism software.

[Anonymous No.18883928]

How do u right

[Anonymous No.18883939]

>>18881740
Jesus are you still here seething that the ousting of the animefags didn't kill the general? Dude it's been a month. It's fucking pathetic. Just fucking write you stupid nigger

[Anonymous No.18883945]

>>18883076
i have a terrible semi-colon habit, i use them all the time
almost used one in that sentence kek
>>18883921
good thinking.
i don't need help with my style, really (i've written enough papers), its more arguments/evidence. really i just need to make friends in my cohort

[Anonymous No.18884015]

https://medium.com/@JHenryDavis/dont-let-em-fool-you-bff8f7061d1a
Hey, finally decided to upload my writing somewhere. Gonna be posting short pieces on this blog thing every week. Feedback appreciated. I still consider this practice until I'm ready to submit to proper magazines.

[Anonymous No.18884031]

>>18883945
yeah the issue with going to general public with academic stuff is that the arguments and evidence are so niche and specialized it is highly unlikely you will be talking with someone who understands the cutting edge, or whole context of current positions, which is where you want to be. talking to people in your program/area of study, not shit like /wg/ is usually better, also if you are in a chick heavy discipline like the humanities you can end up fucking them.

[Anonymous No.18884060]

>>18884015
>https://medium.com/@JHenryDavis/dont-let-em-fool-you-bff8f7061d1a
I didn't look very closely at the url and my first thought was: this reads exactly like one of those hollow, pretentious upper-middle-class stories about 'da struggle' from someone who has literally never missed a meal in their lives.

[Anonymous No.18884084]

How do you write about heroism in an age when getting killed by a cop because you were too high to not act stupid around them is considered heroic?

[Anonymous No.18884110]

>>18884060
I wonder what exactly makes it read like that. I can't say the piece is autobiographical but it's not so far off as you found it.

[Anonymous No.18884111]

>>18884084
You write about actual heroes. For example you could write about a white guy fighting against interracial marriage to stop white genocide.

[Anonymous No.18884148]

>>18883787
GJ dude. Enjoy the pizza.

[Anonymous No.18884535]

>>18882299
I feel a little embarrassed telling people I write offline—I've only told a few and they were mainly coworkers. I wouldn't tell my family but I'm more than happy to tell online peeps though. Even though I send links to those that ask, I know they likely won't read it because it's about 3-4 doorstoppers, but at least I can affirm I am writing by showing my work.

[Anonymous No.18884721]

>>18881722
I'm reading back through my novel and it feels dull, like "x walked over here. Then they went here and this happened..." Which maybe is oversimplying it but how do I make sure each chapter is actually worthy of existing? How do I keep in essential details that might not be super interesting?

[Anonymous No.18884728]

>>18883876
We should meet then!

[Anonymous No.18884921]

>>18884721
Ask yourself if the chapter advances the plot in any meaningful degree. Does it build character? Does it help you establish the world? If it does none of the three then you need to take a good look at it.

[Anonymous No.18884959]

Any good books on writing short stories specifically?

[Anonymous No.18885201]

>>18881786
Chuck it in a pastebin or something and post it here, the worst that could happen is someone calls you a cringey fag.

[Anonymous No.18885209]

>>18885201
https://jason-bryan.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/TheShitkickers-Chapter1.pdf
>this is the earlist rough draft I have

Compare the above to my most recent work below, any and all feedback is appreciated:

https://jason-bryan.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/tsk-chap1-new.pdf
>most recent work, please review and give feedback, thank you

[Anonymous No.18885235]

>>18882299
I know how you feel anon, I'm embarrassed to read my own journal such is the cringe... Here's something I wrote the other night pumped to the brim with melancholy
>"Depart! Depart from this mortal coil! We have tarried too long in this fetid realm. My once precious soul now a plaything for the damned. How can one persevere amid this torrent of anguish? Within my mind desolation sweeps through like a hurricane obliterating any vestige of hope. I no longer care for anything. My familial connections are expunged, my social relationships erased and romantic liaisons eradicated. I feel as though I am already floating in the Styx. Eternal damnation pouring down my throat and flooding my lungs. Step forth heroes of yore! Rescue this embittered soul! Sadly no help is coming, the wandering souls are free to drag me down into the crushing depths.....
Whaddya think? Pretty cringe right?

[Anonymous No.18885243]

Guys how do i actually start writing from scratch,

What of these resources or general things should i look at first.

what should i practise or work on first?
I literally have no idea what to do.

But ever since working I don't have anything worthwhile going on and after doing lots of reading i want to try my hand at writing.

What do guys?

[Anonymous No.18885249]

>>18883156
Animefags are the only writers here, newfag.

[Anonymous No.18885290]

>>18883869
I think the writing is decent, better than anything I could've done, but I think the opening parts where you describe the guy going through the mud goes on a little too long. It's mostly you saying the same thing about him not being able the ground being mud over and over again.
Also the two sentences;
>I managed to get one. It had sunk itself into the exposed flesh of my forearm and I was able to slap down on it.
Feel repetitive to me. I'd just say something like;
>One had sunk itself into the exposed flesh...
Overall good work, though, anon. The cockroach part was pretty exciting to read about.

[Anonymous No.18885292]

>>18884959
I have an old short story guide by Flannery OConnor. Havent read it yet because Im starting with novels. Learn from people who did good short stories like OConnor, Ray Bradbury or Philip K Dick. At least those are the authors I think of.

[Anonymous No.18885341]

>>18884015
I actually quite liked it anon. Your grammar needs a lot of work, and the prose isn't perfect, but I think it was much better written than a lot of stuff on here. My own writing included.

[Anonymous No.18885349]

>>18885243
I started from an outline first, though not all are outliners. If there's something you find cool or compelling, think of themes or a main idea first. What do you need in that story to portray those ideas? What characters do you need to get from point A to B and what relationships or arcs do they have to illustrate it? From there learm about literary devices and techniques, and just write. Write every chapter even if its only 20k words and lacks style. Now you have a story to actually work with in your second draft, where you can improve things that dont work.
If you dont outline, take characters you like in a setting you like and figure out organically what they do. You may surprise yourself and even learn something new about the world.

[Anonymous No.18885362]

>>18885349

Thanks for the ideas, But im thinking smaller scale, I have zero experience writing full stop. i dont wanna start a novel i wanna just write little things but like i dont know where to start or how to map it out in a sense of progression you know?

[Anonymous No.18885383]

>>18885341
Thanks for the feedback. I’m trying to imitate a style and that results in sometimes long and oddly punctuated sentences.
However, if you found those parts hard to read then I clearly need to execute that better. I don’t really know whether I should further develop this style or write in a more conventional manner until my own voice comes through naturally.

[Anonymous No.18885392]

>>18885362
Listen to the podcast Writingexcuses start from season1 and skip episodes as you see fit. It will help you get into tge writing mindset and they have writing prompts every week to improve. It really helped me personally, though keep in mind it's mainly for genre fiction. If you want to be literary you will have to gain much more technical prowess and have a new/compelling thing to say.

[Anonymous No.18885431]

>>18885392

I'll give it a listen, I recognize there is so much to take in and i'm just trying to be in sponge mode rn and not try and do anything to quickly

[Anonymous No.18885479]

>>18885383
I also try and emulate an author who uses weird grammar. I personally found it helpful to borrow from his tone, but not his strange grammar decisions.

[Anonymous No.18885482]

>>18885479
This is fair. I wax and wane wrt how many overlong and oddly punctuated sentences I use. I may save them for particular moments from now on.

[Anonymous No.18885486]

>>18885362
Start with short stories. A lot of really great novels started as short stories and many great novelists wrote short stories before they ever wrote novels.

[Anonymous No.18885574]

>>18885290
I'm glad to hear that the roach part did come across the way I wanted. Do you think you'd get bored and give up if you had to keep reading parts like where he slogged through the mud, or do you think you'd power through that if there were enough scenes like the roach part? Because the novel is like 60% unpleasant slogging through the wilderness and 40% action/dialogue.

[Anonymous No.18885606]

Is "the author/artist went crazy making it" really a sign something is a work of genius?

[Anonymous No.18885693]

>>18885606
Not necessarily. Like I mentioned here at the end >>18885349
The writing process can entail personal revelations, and some people can't handle them.

[Anonymous No.18885704]

>>18885243
>Guys how do i actually start writing from scratch,
Spend some time thinking before actually writing. Get a plot outline sorted, world-building and so on. The fill it out as you write, polishing on the edits.

[Anonymous No.18885717]

>>18883945
>almost used one in that sentence kek
You should have desu

[Anonymous No.18885723]

>>18882299
>telling people I'm trying to write makes me feel embarrassed
Good. Its should. There is absolutely nothing cringier than telling someone something like that.
>embarrassed when showing people your writing
This, on the other hand, is mental illness. Telling someone you're planning on doing something - especially writing - is awful because you're attempting to get praise for something you haven't done. Showing someone something you've written is the complete opposite. Your problem? You seem to be writing in order to obtain some external validation. You should be writing for you first, because you have a story you want to tell which you feel hasn't been told or hasn't been told well enough. In order to get over your embarrassment issue you should write something that would be difficult for you to share. Most likely erotica. But if you aren't embarrassed to write that something else. Your end goal is not giving a fuck.

[Anonymous No.18885729]

>>18882299
Seek help

[Anonymous No.18885753]

>>18881722
>How's that novel going buddy?
You tell me anons. What do you think of this short passage from my novella.

[Anonymous No.18885771]

>>18885753
Didn't read past the first sentence.

[Anonymous No.18885782]

>>18881722
>have an extremely sheltered urban upbringing
>never been innawoods, made anything of value with my own two hands or done stuff that’s remotely dangerous/interesting
>have anxiety that prevents you from trying to do these things as an adult
>lack of real-life experiences in the world hamstring your ability to write on a variety of topics

People say that I have a way with words (in my own language, I’m a dirty ESL), but I can only write light novel-style bullshit about VRMMOs or stuff about other extremely online people whose existence is mostly digital.
It sucks, bros.

[Anonymous No.18885827]

>>18881722
>How's that novel going buddy? Almost finished? Still no character name?
Going great. Just started re-drafting chapter 22.

[Anonymous No.18885950]

>>18885753
They rode all night, the light from their headlamps offering a tiny, careening sphere of illumination amongst the dark, still mass of the forest, as the disconcerting sound of their hastily constructed engines pierced its silence. 30 strong the pack charged through it, leaving only muddy tracks and silence in their wake.

Their masks and goggles spattered with mud covered their equally soulless faces, their bikes adorned with the the spoils of war, headlamps casting split beams of light from the eye sockets of their fallen foes mounted skulls.

I fucking suck and in 2 minutes I fixed your thing for you

[Anonymous No.18886255]

>>18881722
>How's that novel going buddy?
Coming to a close on the fifth one, maybe 2-3 more main chaps before ending it on the epilogue. Then, I dunno. Might go straight on to the sequel or leave it for a bit to plan it.

[Anonymous No.18886264]

>>18881722
Just need some feedback!

[Anonymous No.18886609]

How many of you still work a job and also write? I've heard plenty of advice to quit and go full-in on writing but I think it's too risky. If I can do good at all in the next 3-5 years I might consider full-time writing though. If so what does it look like for you
>daily routine and work from 8-5
>read for an hour in my lunch break
>take care of stuff at home and then write for 5 hours on weekdays
>weekends is same but I replace work with writing and the evening with reading

[Anonymous No.18886647]

>>18886609
>I've heard plenty of advice to quit and go full-in on writing but I think it's too risky
That's "risky" in the same sense that shooting yourself in the head is "risky"

[Anonymous No.18886696]

>>18886264
Then why are you here?

[Anonymous No.18886716]

>>18886609
I work 6-3 ~ 7-2/3 on the Friday/weekends and I'm usually too exhausted to write but if I get lucky I might squirt out some 400-500 words when I get home, granted I don't immediately close my eyes and die instantly. Historically, I MIGHT write for a bit, or I might just jerk off and play vidya and read or do other things. Since the beginning of this month, I went on break so I'm enjoying my newfound time not stressing over constant crunches and past deadlines that are seemingly due every week.

At the far end of my last volume, I used to write between customers with some success on my phone. I feel like my scheduling chapters is often at odds with work since I tried to aim for a Friday/crunch weekend release for a while and sometimes it works, but if I slow down for even one second or hit a roadblock in the story then it snowballs and it throws my rigid schedules into complete disarray. I used to publish chapters as soon as I was done editing them (meaning every 4.5 days on average) so I might just go back to releasing whenever I'm done for my own sake.

[Anonymous No.18886787]

>She wore an embroidered twill dress, ironically, stiffly buttoned-up to her neck, that hung loosely off her frame.
Can I get away with this sentence?

Or do I need to reposition it to:
>She wore an embroidered twill dress, stiffly buttoned-up to her neck, that ironically hung loosely off her frame.
For some reason I hate this though. Or perhaps omit the word 'ironically' entirely, as it's implied in the sentence.

[Anonymous No.18887301]

>>18886609
>How many of you still work a job and also write?
Me, it's a hobby first and foremost. Not a job, money from it would be kino, however.

[Anonymous No.18887321]

>>18885771
Could you tell me what turned you off, did you just not think it was well written?

[Anonymous No.18887364]

>>18886787
Why even mention that it's ironic explicity? Let people notice the irony themselves. If you must do anything, just use some literary device that calls attention the irony. I'd say a hint like that would be better.

[Anonymous No.18887382]

>>18886609
I write at my job stealing company time.

[Anonymous No.18887402]

I use "then" mid sentence too much. Help.

[Anonymous No.18887412]

>>18887364
So go with the third option, then
>Or perhaps omit the word 'ironically' entirely, as it's implied in the sentence.

As far as being explicit with it's mentioning, I just liked how the structure of the sentence flowed, with the word splitting up the clauses. It felt jarring, but not in a abrasive sense, you know what I mean?

[Anonymous No.18887464]

>>18887402
When you're about to write 'then', write 'fuck' instead, that way you can remove them on next edit of your draft. :^)

[Anonymous No.18887467]

>>18887321
He's probably just baiting you.

[Anonymous No.18887480]

>>18887402
I used "and then" way too often in my first draft. Accept there are going to be words you'll use too often, but do your best to cut them out while editing.

[Anonymous No.18887558]

When I try to write a story, my first go around looks kinda like this
>Sam wakes up. Sam drinks coffee. A bad thing happened to Sam's mom. Sam remembers. Sam is sad.
Basically getting the meat out as fast as possible. Then my second and third go around would be me actually trying to make that a story with feeling, dialogue, and proper description.

What's a better way of doing this and making a story?
This is very convenient for me but I worry I'm missing something essential.

[Anonymous No.18887593]

>>18887558
Maybe I'm missing something too but that sounds about right to me

[Anonymous No.18887599]

>>18881722
Hey, I'm looking for help on some magic terminology. I had the idea for a WWII-styled alternate history setting where magic returned to the world in the early 1900s(?) and each nation has done research into it independently, and are using it in combat for the first time in this war. The thing is, I want all the various nations of Europe (besides Britain) and Asia (there are more of them involved without being specifically allied with another than in the historical WWII) to have their own terms for magic users, and the various schools of magic, with a clear theme, like Germany calling specific kinds of magic "x-kraft", like "Flammenkraft" for fire magic, etc., that kind of thing. But besides the German one, and some vague ideas for French and Spanish, I'm stuck on what would work best for the other big powers, like Russia, Italy, China, India, Japan, and so on. Does anyone have any suggestions for me please?

[Anonymous No.18887637]

Anyone care to comment on the start of my short story? Gunna submit it on sunday.

>The Silence of Thought sat bleakly above the turquoise waves of the sunken world. A star crawler no more, the defiant hull sat unmoving and open to the heavens above. The prodigal colonists had expanded little beyond its protection, unable to venture across a world with no dry land. Saphon-II had not welcomed them when they crashed into its waves. It was all they could do to drape their civilization across the ship and survive, their lights twinkling off the waves like the stars they had been denied.
>Even the skies had grown dark, with the annual rain rolling in across the horizon and devouring the night sky. For the colonists however, rain meant power. Millions of tons of water would pour into the gaping ship, powering the generators. For the week after the storms, the ancient factories would return to life. While thousands of people bustled through the overgrown scaffolding they called home, the council was gathered around their table bickering about what to prioritize with the power. Except for one of them.

[Anonymous No.18887675]

>>18887599
I don't have any suggestions but I just want to say your idea is cool and I'd read it

[Anonymous No.18887689]

>>18887599
Okay but what is your story actually about?

[Anonymous No.18887690]

>>18881749
I literally just write. I'm not sure what's going to happen in the next paragraph, let alone what the entire plot will be. Ideas develop as I write, and I just put into context those thoughts. If it works, it works; otherwise, I eschew the idea and move on to another. And yes, writing does take me a long time.

[Anonymous No.18887706]

>>18887467
Maybe, but I wish he'd explain if he wasn't. I'm fine with people hating it, but it'd be nice to hear some feedback on why.

[Anonymous No.18887737]

>>18887637
It was a little tough to follow at the start, but I liked it anon. A few suggestions;
>It was all they could do to drape their civilization across the ship
I don't really understand what you're saying with this sentence. Maybe something about "keeping their civilization afloat" lmao would be better.
>For the week after the storms, the ancient factories would return to life.
I would phrase this as, "In the week after the storms" myself.
Good luck with the submission anon.

[Anonymous No.18887739]

Do I really need to add 'he said.. she exclaimed... X opined' etc. after all my dialogue? Unless there's multiple individuals in the conversation that need to be curated to reduce confusion, I feel like those clauses are just clunky, unaesthetic, and easily implied.

[Anonymous No.18887754]

>>18881722
I self-published my short story on amazon just recently.
Only edited it twice and then some.
And slapped a cover on it after making it on paint.

Yay....

[Anonymous No.18887773]

>>18887689
A war story set in the aforementioned alternative fantasy WWII. Wasn’t that clear?

[Anonymous No.18887802]

>>18887754
Post a link.

[Anonymous No.18887815]

>>18887802
It's in review

[Anonymous No.18887840]

>>18887815
Good luck, bud.

[Anonymous No.18887842]

>>18887599
Have you considered reading history books and trying to understand how many factors went into the lead up into the war, the war itself and the fallout? It's a long as hell read but I recommend Tragedy and Hope by Carroll Quigley, you can skip to the consequences of WWI and go from there as 2/3rds of the book goes into understanding WWII. I say this because if you make alternative history, your readers will often be educated in history and question the implications the alternate elements would have on politics and economics. I'm sure there's a way to avoid those considerations but if you want to be thorough.
Also check Brandon Sanderson's rules in magic systems, which is just his opinion and plenty of magic systems are more whimsical. The main idea is that it costs something to use magic, so using magic to solve problems creates consequences that raise the stakes or tension, and in such a way that readers can craft in their mind what is possible before it happens.

Personally I'd like to develop a magic system that is generated via character development so it can be a way to dramatically show when someone has changed or who they really align with.

[Anonymous No.18887868]

>>18887739
Some authors boldly use "he said" often, though it's rare. It's less annoying than always using words that pop-out too much every single time, you can ignore "said" and most people do.

Some people ignore tags entirely, but it only works if the character voices are very different, and in good writing they ought to be. I try to strive for that unique voice so tags aren't necessary and you just hear the words in their voice automatically. Also if the dialogue goes back and forth for long enough, you may need to reminded people who is talking in case they get lost.

[Anonymous No.18887909]

>>18885753
I think this would be better if the descriptions and details were sprinkled out as the characters are interacting with one another or doing something.

Reading description after description is personally mind-numbing for me.

[Anonymous No.18887926]

>>18887737
I used 'drape' because the settlement hangs off the bottom of the ship, sorta like tree houses I guess. I think afloat would be too on the nose.

[Anonymous No.18888110]

>>18887909
I feel ya anon. I'm trying to let the descriptions give some of the background of the characters, but I think it's something I really need to work on.
Thanks for the feedback, either way, it's really appreciated.

[Anonymous No.18888124]

>>18881722
>writing sci-fi schlock
>there’s a special type of liquid armor that soldiers wear
>one character asks another character what it is
>I loredump 2,000 words on the ancient battle between serpentine god-royals and humanity in massive underwater oceans, which ended up with one of the serpents being converted to Catholicism and giving crusaders this magic armor as a token of his faith in our faith that Jesus Christ did for our sins
>already sensing that this information will only be slightly useful down the line
I’m such a retard. I don’t want to delete any of it, but it’s just so out of place that there’s a mini history lesson at this scene. Maybe I’ll just move the story to a bit later in the book.
Fuck.

[Anonymous No.18888139]

>>18888124
Why did you post this shit on /sffg/?

[Anonymous No.18888152]

>>18888139
I posted it here and /sffg/, because this thread isn’t really for sci-fi in my experience, and /sffg/ isn’t really for writing
It belongs in neither, naturally I posted it in both

[Anonymous No.18888165]

>>18888152
So you shat up the on thread that isn't writing because?

[Anonymous No.18888194]

>>18888124
Your summary kinda sounds like more fantasy than sci-fi I gotta admit

[Anonymous No.18888197]

>>18888124
Okay but what is your story actually about?

[Anonymous No.18888207]

>>18888165
Well, I got a helpful response in that thread
And it’s not like I was the only one asking for writing help >>18887017 >>18887570
>>18888194
>>18888194
It’s half about exploring alien oceans and marine exobiology and half about Christians interacting with alien religions and gods

[Anonymous No.18888226]

>>18885782
Get a job in fast food and make friends with some of the more chill aspiring rappers and drug dealers you work with. Use their stories to inspire your own.

[Anonymous No.18888250]

>>18885782
Try using depth of emotion to embroil an otherwise boring, plainface, or otherwise milquetoast plot about literally anything, into work of fiction that keeps the reader emotionally engaged. Just take some inspo from Dosto, naw mean?

[Anonymous No.18888302]

>>18887868
Imagine having three people discussing something important but mundane, say "do you see anyone out there?"

Now imagine what you would have to contort things into such that you didn't need to tag a conversatin that boils down to "Do you see anybody out there?" "No. Wait there was light over there" "That was a bug" "No I think it's a person with a flashlight" etc.

Not all dialogue has the depth to it to express individual voice

[Anonymous No.18888601]

>>18888124
Tolkien wrote a lot of stuff about his worlds he never intended to publish. The fact that you're that invested in your universe shows you're on the right track, don't delete it.
Also, it sounds awesome.

[Anonymous No.18888621]

So I started editing. I've been splitting paragraphs up. Can't believe I wrote suck unwieldy blocks of text before. Cleared up a few sentences and rewrote others, added lines, deleted others.
Is this is? Is this how you polish a turd?

[Anonymous No.18888674]

>>18883876
I'm a schizo... wanna suck my dick?

[Anonymous No.18888683]

>>18881722
I want to write a comic book. But I can't write OR draw. What a world...

[Anonymous No.18888707]

>>18888683
I have a bunch of comic book scripts written up. One day I'll have the money to pay an artist to draw them. In the meantime, write what you like.

[Anonymous No.18888720]

>>18888621
Yes, the first drafts are so bad you wouldnt show them to your worst enemy.

[Anonymous No.18888738]

Any /lit/ fags ever publish their own book? Curious

[Anonymous No.18888777]

>>18888738
F Gardner

[Anonymous No.18888945]

>>18881722
none of you are helpin yourselves in this artistically sterile environment just get a twitter account, follow the /lit/ refugees, and when they follow back post excerpts for critique. you can even self-publish after and get readers. asking for crit on a shit site is a waste of yoour time.

[Anonymous No.18888951]

>>18888738
logo

[Anonymous No.18889109]

How do I go about organizing my characters and my idea for how the plot is to be laid out? How do you?
I'm starting a webcomic-tier thing with an artistic partner, and I feel very apprehensive every time I start to sketch out character arcs and major plot events. We have a good idea of what we want to do, but I guess I feel like every time I start to plan out executions, I feel limited?
I don't know, I'm gay and retarded.

[Anonymous No.18889149]

Just logged into 4chan to see the state of you talented young writers. Keep at it, tiger.

[Anonymous No.18889183]

I come up with plot beats I think are cool and then think of ways to lead the plot there

[Anonymous No.18889235]

>>18889109
Just do a line and put stuff on it

[Anonymous No.18889393]

Anyone else going "fuck it" and writing fiction without the usual trappings of plot, or narrators, or even characters? I'm so tired of fussing over dialogue tags and having to shoe-horn conflict into my creative works just because I prefer to write. The medium shouldn't feel so self-same when there's plenty of historical works that don't fit the mould.

[Anonymous No.18889459]

>>18889393
I just write the story I want to tell with whatever improvisation that usually leads to retroactive realization of what I was going for.

[Anonymous No.18889508]

>>18888302
True. I would use tags in those cases.
>>18888621
My first drafts have no style at all and the characterization almost always drifts into something I didn't intend. The editing process makes the story, and if anything that 2nd draft is your best opportunity to fix issues that will be harder to fix as you go on.
>>18889183
A lot of outliners do that and so do I. It there is a beat that gets your point across, the rest of the story is like formulating premises that synthesizes the conclusion that is your story beat. I like how Howard Tayler puts it by calling it "the big dumb thing."
>>18889393
So like non-fiction, but it's about a fictional world?

[Anonymous No.18889527]

>>18889508
>as you go on
You mean this isn't it?

[Anonymous No.18889576]

>>18882511
How to find one?

[Anonymous No.18889585]

>>18889576
For me it was hanging out with the other losers during recess.

[Anonymous No.18889642]

>>18889527
No, 2nd draft isn't the end. You have to run through the story multiple times and not every one does it the same way, look up more details of what you might need to fix but for me:
>1st draft: write all the chapters for a story based on the outline you came up with
>2nd draft: drama - do the scenes work; characterization - are the characters consistent
style - give the appropriate voice and feel for each scene; pacing - analyze word count in sentence, paragraph, chapter and the white space, technical - analyze and ensure you know what you're talking about so your readers don't get insulted
>3rd draft: character case studies on weakness, quirk, growth, how their subplots overlap with other characters and the main plot, and how sympathetic the reader will be for them; focus of the characters; make motivation feel more natural; make movements convey meaning; more pacing adjustment to fit the new moods of a scene; charts - chart out where you drop symbolism, themes, foreshadowing, and major literary devices, make a separate chart for each one; Line edit - go line by line to correct passive voice, grammar weakness, purple prose, and add textured description using minor literary devices
>give this 3rd draft to alpha readers who tell you how the book makes them feel to gauge its effectiveness
>4th Draft: make final adjustments based on alpha readers, submit to editor if you didn't already have one and make further adjustments
>book is finished and now you have to find out who will shill it for you

[Anonymous No.18889669]

>>18889508
>So like non-fiction, but it's about a fictional world?
This is the most obvious way, yes. Although you can still do something in-between using the epistolary form or that of an (actual, not merely framed) memoire. Maybe more. It feels like this is an under-explored are despite having plenty of works within it; nobody seems to talk about it.

[Anonymous No.18889671]

>>18889642
You're just not being very efficient. Why wouldn't your 1st draft have most of what you say your 2nd should have? How did you write all those chapters if you didn't have any of that work done in them?

[Anonymous No.18889744]

>>18889671
I already have designs for scenes and characters that should work in the outline, but it doesn't hurt to analyze it after the first draft if there is a problem that is only apparent after your write it.
>why write all those chapters
Some of the work naturally comes to you, but the other drafts are to perfect it. And you can't nitpick over missing something in the first draft because that is the logic of the "eternal rewrite chapter 1" condition, which is barely better than the "eternal outliner." So my advice is once you have something you are pretty sure will work just write a story and don't spend too much time polishing it until you can look at every chapter and be able to compare and contrast them. Too much early polishing can also be inefficient because if you write chapter 2 and realize it would be better to change something in chapter 1 instead of 2, its better to look at after all the chapters are done.
>>18889669
I've heard of genre fiction in the epistolary format, and it absolutely can work but you have to trust your reader to put the pieces together as you present the letters to them as artifacts that reveal the story.

[Anonymous No.18889798]

>>18888601
Thanka

[Anonymous No.18889850]

>>18889744
I already have all 44 chapters done since a week ago, I've been going through them and editing that bulk. In order to get to this point I had to already agonize over where in the narrative some parts would fit and moved them around.
There's no point in writing a bunch of crap and then trying to fix it when you can write something decent instead and then try to improve on it.

[Anonymous No.18889871]

>>18889850
>44 chapters
You're justified in working on it the way you do. Writing large stories is challenging to pull off no matter what, and it's especially painful to do a rewrite if you don't fix things early. My story is only 16 chapters by comparison.

[Anonymous No.18889895]

Anyone else here one of those online writing platforms like Writebox?

I just fucking hate Microsoft Word man

[Anonymous No.18889932]

>>18889871
Two more and it is legal.

[Anonymous No.18889935]

>>18889932
You did good work man, i got 4 story ideas that don't even amount ot 10k

[Anonymous No.18889940]

Tips on adding to a scene? Let us say I have Scene A: Trainride.

What would you write during this scene?

Or let us say you have another Scene B, where the MC wakes up to an empty house. What do you write thereafter? My problem is I can think of the really rough sketch of a scene, i.e. why does it have to exist but I have no idea what else to add to it. I am autistic yes.

[Anonymous No.18889953]

>>18889871
Are you even the anon I was talking to? You went from saying to make a first draft and literally fixing everything over the consecutive ones and now you're saying you should fix things early and I'm confused

[Anonymous No.18890030]

Is it odd to have a first person novel, that for a chapter opening feels like 3rd person omniscient to describe the arrival of another character to where the narrator is?

[Anonymous No.18890040]

>>18889940
Generally speaking, don't add to scenes.

If you need to draw out suspense or something, focus on what it is your character would do and then decide whether that's an interesting thing to put to your story

[Anonymous No.18890078]

>>18890030
Sounds cinematic, honestly. A bit like how Hitchhiker’s Guide starts from the state of the earth and then zooms into the MC

[Anonymous No.18890151]

>>18888207
Meant to include you in this reply
>>18888207

[Anonymous No.18890156]

>>18890151
gah, I need sleep. this post is for >>18888197

[Anonymous No.18890189]

>>18890078
Cinematic is fine.

The more dubious, but more correct, choice I'm making is omitting the majority of the battle between the protaganist and the antagonist. I spent last chapter going blow by blow essentially to saturate the reader with his anger and then his desperation, ended it on him realizing he has a morally questionable way to win (killing the antagonist's subordinates who sorta deserve it), chapter end

Chapter start is another character coming about the carnage that ensued

[Anonymous No.18890190]

>>18889953
I am the same anon. I was saying that is just my style. To be clear my first rough draft isn't completely bare. I do put in work for cool ideas and technique as it comes to mind. It's a flow of consciousness but I will take short breaks to come up with a cool way to say something, but I don't linger for too long. A lot of those technical things I draw from my outline but I discover more about characters and situations as I write. If I wrote a massive book I would be even more careful about avoiding rework, which is why I agreed with the slower approach in your case. The important point is you have to balance between impetus and coherence.

If you have too little impetus and too much coherence, you have to rewrite chapters anyways once you realize that a previous chapter wont fit as well with a new perspective of the newer chapters. That is okay for some stories, but if there's a story beat you really want to hit and you are drifting too far away it will be a problem.

If you have too much impetus and not enough coherence, you run into the scenario you described where you have 44 chapters that aren't coherent enough to improve together. I think a good balance between the two has to be struck.

[Anonymous No.18890207]

>>18890190
>you run into the scenario you described where you have 44 chapters that aren't coherent enough to improve together.
I described that?

[Anonymous No.18890429]

>>18890078
>>18890189
Any other examples of cinematic writing?I have a particular project I've kept on the shelf for quite a while because I want it to have that quality, but I haven't been able to figure out how to capture the feel of film in prose.

[Anonymous No.18890632]

>>18890207
You implied that you were trying to avoid it.

[Anonymous No.18890641]

>>18890632
You need to read better

[Anonymous No.18890795]

>>18881722
>Symbolism? Character arcs? First draft? What's that?
>I just write bro

[Anonymous No.18890796]

>>18890429
Michael Crichton is pretty much the king of it. Most of his books begin with a cold open (usually from the villain's POV), consist of two-dimensional characters, and take place in roughly-sketched out stock locations (corporate office, jungle village, or Big City With One Defining Trait [San Francisco has a lot of hills and trolleys, Seattle has a lot of drizzle, people in New York are rude])

[Anonymous No.18890822]

>>18890796
Crichton is comfy.

[Anonymous No.18891212]

>>18890156
Ahdnsm

[Anonymous No.18891220]

>>18881722
Hey, I'm thinking of having the main magic system of a setting I'm working on be based on runes, but I realized rather quick that I'm kind of stuck on what to actually have the runes look like. Besides the Sigil System RPG and Witch Hat Atelier (see picture related), my best source of inspiration is Norse runes, and I want to avoid just copying those. Someone else I asked suggested Runequest and ogham script as sources of inspiration, but I haven't had the time to check them out yet, what else would you suggest?

Also, what are the pros and cons of having the runes represent letters vs individual words/concepts (again like in the pdf in the latter case)? And if I go with the latter, besides the obvious, like runes for the various elements, what are some 'key' runes that I should include? Any suggestions please?

[Anonymous No.18891328]

>>18891220
Okay but what is your story actually about?

[Anonymous No.18891444]

>>18887599
>magic in ww2
im assuming the nazis will have the coolest powers?

[Anonymous No.18891452]

>>18887739
>Do I really need to add 'he said.. she exclaimed... X opined' etc. after all my dialogue?
no.

[Anonymous No.18891488]

Is it a sign of bad writing if almost all my sentences are long/complex? Like on average ~50 words. I've tried editing them down but I feel like they lose their effect or sound worse.

[Anonymous No.18891514]

>>18888738
Call of the Crocodile

[Anonymous No.18891559]

>>18891488
Any examples?

[Anonymous No.18891856]

>>18891488
>almost all my sentences are long/complex
>on average ~50 words
probably. 50 words is a lot. sounds like nothing but commas and semicolons. that may be your style, but remember that variety is the spice of life.

[Anonymous No.18892017]

>>18891488
If all your sentences are similar length or structure that is bad prose because it is repetitive enough that it will annoy people that notice. You can write like that in the 1st rough draft if that's how it comes out, but you will have to edit the ideas to more clear and with a variety of length and structure for a more pleasant read.

[Anonymous No.18892020]

>>18888738
No one on /lit/ writes.

[Anonymous No.18892065]

>>18888738
There's this book. I'm sure there must've been others at some point.

[Anonymous No.18892096]

On the 27th of March, 1349, one of the watchmen of the castle of York whistled into the cold night as he patrolled upon the southern wall, which faced fields that have been empty for a long time. As usual, he and the other watchmen assigned to the wall would congregate in one of the many watch towers overlooking its great hall.

is this how you write a story? Am i gonna make it

[Anonymous No.18892297]

>>18881722
I've been working on a setting where everything has a spirit representing its true essence, a bit like a mix between Shintoism and Platonic ideals, with the smaller the thing that the spirit represents, the weaker it is, with most weaker spirits being non sapient (for instance, only the largest and oldest, or at least otherwise significant, trees would have a sapient spirit, just for starters).

I was thinking that magic would involve manipulating this spiritual underlayer of reality to achieve a supernatural effect. It would have started out as just trying to do things to get the attention of powerful spirits in certain ways, which would eventually evolve into directly making deals of mutual benefit with spirits, like offering something to the spirit of some fields to help ensure a plentiful harvest. Then someone would eventually find a way to directly manipulate spiritual energies through arcane means and rituals, getting an effect without a middleman (it probably helps if one has some spirit ancestry, since more powerful spirits can take on truly physical forms separate from their source, and I'm certain that the first to use magic this way had a spirit as a parent). The third method I was thinking of would have someone either merge with and/or consume a spirit via either a particular deal or a ritual, effectively making them part spirit and giving them some of their powers. What do you think? Can you think of any other ways to use magic, or any pros/cons to the three methods I listed above, please?

[Anonymous No.18892304]

>>18892297
You posted this garbage on /sffg/ already. Fuck off

[Anonymous No.18892305]

>>18892297
Was there any need to double post this shit?

[Anonymous No.18892505]

I have no idea how to develop or continue my story

[Anonymous No.18892565]

Is it better to write your story in a linear fashion or can you hop from scene to scene?

[Anonymous No.18892578]

>>18892565
Whatever works for you desu

[Anonymous No.18892650]

>>18892578
Nothing works for me anon

[Anonymous No.18892881]

My friend wants to know if I want to keep helping them with their novel.
Is this an appropriate response?

>The more I think about it, the less "Disaffected edgy cool person kills people because the world sucks and is trying to kill him. And then dies because the world sucks, but comes back as an upset zombie and wants revenge and then destroys everything other people built because they were so upset" appeals to me.
>Just feels like something you'd stick in your manifesto.

[Anonymous No.18892992]

>>18881722

I'm having an issue writing out of the "roleplaying" perspective due to years of mingling on boards and MMORPGs. Any advice?

[Anonymous No.18893206]

>>18892505
Ask more questions about where you are stopping and you will know why. Or you could start from principles of what you want out of it, and that will answer what has to happen and which characters you need to make it happen. One question - answer step at a time and it falls into place.
>I want a story to be about consequences of a decision
>give point of view to two characters who take the opposite decision
>those characters are already in a relationship so their decisions generate a conflict that drives a personal plot that eventually ties into the larger story
>each conflict gives them motivation to do different things to solve conflicts, and that synthesizes scene ideas of what they might do to solve their problem
So on and so forth. Put a bunch of cool things in the toolbox for your story and you will know when to pull them out for the situations each scene
>steer characters into story beats and an ending that you want

[Anonymous No.18893208]

>>18892565

What >>18892578 says, you just got to go with whatever way you prefer. Explain the transition or just have it happen. Up to you and your bias.

[Anonymous No.18893264]

>>18892565
I think the latter is way too convenient. The reader is smart enough to fill in gaps by themselves, they can infer how much time has passed and whatnot in between parts.
You don't always want to be writing about characters going from A to B, not if you don't have some good dialogue or action to fill it in.
If you want to decide "now the characters are here" the reader will take your word that they're missing nothing important.

[Anonymous No.18893486]

I create main characters for the express purpose of falling in love with one another and leading happy lives together.

[Anonymous No.18893983]

>>18893486
BASED

[Anonymous No.18894000]

Holographic humans in various shades danced across the floor. The engineers designed them off a variety of evolutionary biology theories. Youthful and vivacious, with stout figures that accentuated their perfect breasts and legs. Well-defined male versions had broad backs and muscular builds. They chose the forms based on the evolutionary theory that sexual attraction was about increasing the organism’s chances for survival via the successful propagation of one’s DNA. Women would therefore seek men who could provide for and protect the offspring. Genes attracted to weakness were rooted out by high infant mortality caused by starvation or predators. In men, large muscular builds meant a successful hunter-gatherer. Those who succeeded in the hunt would consume high-protein diets.
Theoretically, nature had established a predilection for women. A young and fertile woman would allow a savage to spread his genes successfully at a higher frequency, increasing the probability of further propagation of the genes. Five children with a fifty percent chance of survival with a young mate was better than two children with a thirty percent chance with an older one. After hundreds of years of selection, the brain must have evolved nerves more likely to select these beneficial traits, creating what the modern liberal would call sexual objectification. The designers could never agree on whether humanity had overcome these primordial foundations.

[Anonymous No.18894016]

I've thought about writing a grimdark fairy tale novel. Tell me what you guys think about this idea.

>Farm boy with a magical lantern nearly drowns in a river
>He meets a magical scarecrow man who's a guide for children to move on to the after life
>In order to go back to his own world he needs the souls of seven other children.
>All of the souls of these children represent the seven deadly sins or just bad aspects of people.
>They all tell the boy to never end up like them
>He's finally allowed to go home at the end after having a near mental break down crying his eyes out.
>Goes home and apologizes profusely to his family.

What do you guys think?

[Anonymous No.18894018]

>>18894016
gay

[Anonymous No.18894039]

>>18894016
stop watching anime

[Anonymous No.18894057]

>>18894039
>Any fantasy elements are now anime
How many fucking stories have you actually read? Genuine question? Because literally nothing that I wrote was based off of any anime that I know of.

[Anonymous No.18894097]

I’m writing a trans/autogynephile character and want advice. How can I make them creepy but not pathetic?

[Anonymous No.18894108]

>>18894097
Imagine a Chad meme where it's like
"DEMITRIUS, YOU ARE SHITTING YOURSELF REEEE"
and the Chad goes
"Yes."

[Anonymous No.18894156]

>>18894016
>farmboy

Anything else but such.

[Anonymous No.18894183]

>>18894016
>In order to go back to his own world he needs the souls of seven other children.
What does he do with them? Are they "absorbed" or "consumed"?
I think you could write it in a way where his escape doesn't come at the expense of others, his journey sounds rough enough as it is.

[Anonymous No.18894192]

>>18894156
To fit with the whole scarecrow thing.

[Anonymous No.18894199]

>>18894183
Yeah, I'll do something like the farm boy has acted up, misbehaved, isn't doing good with his family yadda yadda. Then the Scarecrow offers him another chance at life, but he has to see how he'd end up first. Sort of like scaring him straight.

[Anonymous No.18894210]

Finally over with the editing stage of my novel; I got one of the best guys from the company and he did a stellar job. Now it's been sent to a copyeditor and we've found a cover artist. Things look good.

[Anonymous No.18894229]

>>18894183
Or maybe the scarecrow man puts him through "trials" to let him go back, after the boy cries and begs him to already regretting it.

[Anonymous No.18894239]

How incely is this? (Yes I posted it above. Edited it a bit)
>Holographic humans in various shades danced across the floor, some alone, some with patrons. The engineers designed them off a variety of evolutionary biology theories in insure maximum enjoyment. The women ones were youthful and vivacious, stout figures accentuated their perfect breasts and legs. Well-defined male versions had broad backs and muscular builds. Their designs were based on evolutonary theories on why certain physical traits are more attractive. Primarily, the theories revolve around identifying features, which help increase the organism’s genetic fitness. Women would therefore seek men who could provide for and protect offspring. The high testesterone and protein diets of a successful hunter would manifest into a virile male. Theoretically, after millions of years, the genes that saught these men won.
>A man predilection for women was also established by the theories. A young and fertile woman would allow a savage to spread his genes at a higher frequency, increasing his genetic fitness. Having more healthy offspring ment a higher probability an offspring would eventually reproduce. Given the high infant mortality of the ancient world, this made all the difference. After hundreds of years of selection, the brain likely evolved nerves to select these beneficial traits, creating what some would call sexual objectification. Theoretically. The designers could never agree on whether humanity had overcome these primordial foundations.

I don't necessarily agree with the theories but I wanted to mention them as they play a role in the setting and plot.

[Anonymous No.18894327]

>>18894239
>mixing tenses
And this is the edited version?

[Anonymous No.18894349]

>>18894239
>the theories revolve around identifying features, which
Comma splice.
>saught
Not a word.

Overall, it's not incelish, but more like extremely surface level. "Guy who doesn't read comes up with ages old theory and thinks it's revolutionary" type of thing. Everything after "help increase the organism’s genetic fitness." could be cut basically, because it's self explanatory. The reader can connect the dots.

[Anonymous No.18894366]

>>18894327
Not what I ment

[Anonymous No.18894375]

>>18894349
I agree, I took it all out.

[Anonymous No.18894438]

>>18894239
Work on your prose before worrying about whether this is too "incel-y". This does not read well at all.

[Anonymous No.18894487]

>>18894239
This is great and I see nothing wrong with your prose. Do not listen to the trolls.

[Anonymous No.18894558]

>>18894438
I agree, it's why I am in favor of taking it out. I like the concepts but they are hard to explain eloquently

[Anonymous No.18895745]

I wrote my first story. It's fanfiction and it's making me cringe inside. Would y'all be interested in reviewing it?

[Anonymous No.18895809]

>>18895745
>fanfiction
You can do better than this. You ARE better than this.

[Anonymous No.18896016]

>>18895745
No, because I wanna see some well-built, expansive and interesting OC settings.

[Anonymous No.18896322]

Anyone else have a hard time writing their really honest thoughts and feelings down? I'm thinking about writing some lyrics for my songs but it feels almost wrong to write my thoughts down (they're mostly negative), like I'm crossing some threshold.
The joke is I'm not even gonna show anyone, it's just for me.

[Anonymous No.18896345]

>>18896322
Not at all, my whole book is filled with me being completely open about how I felt and thought about things 8 years ago
I think that distance in time is the key.

[Anonymous No.18896485]

>>18894210
I wonder what they will end up naming my story and what the cover art will be. Sometimes lack control over that and honestly awful at naming books for the right market.

[Anonymous No.18896535]

>>18895745
Fanfiction of what?

[Anonymous No.18896738]

>>18896322
>Anyone else have a hard time writing their really honest thoughts and feelings down?
If I am directly doing it as me-to-paper, much easier if I use a character to do it.

[Anonymous No.18897038]

>no idea how to move forward with my editing since 2/3 test readers said absolutely nothing about how I could improve and the third is too busy to give criticism
>end up writing a new story instead
I'm not making it, am I?

[Anonymous No.18897046]

What does /lit/ think? https://dipp.substack.com/p/liquor-store-paralysis-part-1-welcome

currently working on part two, where the main character, a worker at a liquor store is introduced, i plan on him going on a rampage

[Anonymous No.18897136]

>>18889642
Thank you for this message. It really told me to write my novel first through and not polish every chapter after it’s written.

[Anonymous No.18897330]

>>18896322
No the hard part is sharing it

[Anonymous No.18897877]

Just finished second draft of chapter 22.

[Anonymous No.18898044]

>DOOMSDAY PROPHET OF OUR TIMES, Will Fuchs, or at least that’s who he believed himself to be. He was a stock worker at Triplet Rivers Wine & Spirits. He would put on an obsequious and malicious looking smile at the hint that any of his coworkers or customers said anything that just so happens to be even remotely funny. To put it lightly, if he were to go on a murdering spree and smash every bottle in the store, it wouldn’t surprise anyone familiar with him. Despite his oddness, he was a magnificent worker and his boss, Alexei Dimitriev, an immigrant from Russia with reputation and long standing experience in the industry of wines, especially Arcvine, absolutely adored him. If Will gets an order, he will do it, and he won’t even dare to demand anything more from his superiors. He has worked there for 7 years and is still getting paid only minimum wage, which has remained stuck at 15 dollars an hour since 2024.
>At Home, Will had a blog and a youtube channel where he would document the collapse of the nation and the planet. An advocate for human extinction, an accelerationist collapsitarian who believed we’ve gone way too far down the tubes already, and we may as well just accelerate towards the end then prolong both our suffering and the suffering of all of our fellow earthlings. His online name was Hambone.
>“It is to my belief that the quicker our destructive species of smooth skinned murder monkeys are wiped off the face of the planet, the better off that everyone else who inhabits the planet will be” said Hambone in an interview conducted by the chief writer of Collapse Viewed from the Himalayas, Mangal Bishwakarama

[Anonymous No.18898086]

>>18897136
Youre welcome anon

[Anonymous No.18898233]

Son of the Sun - Chapter 18
https://pastebin.com/ysQxeREz