[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/lit/ - Literature

View post   
File: 163 KB, 814x1023, the_rage_of_achilles_by_giovanni_battista_tiepolo.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19262129 No.19262129 [Reply] [Original]

Which translation of the Iliad did you read anon?

>> No.19262322
File: 51 KB, 374x568, 978-0-226-46940-9-frontcover.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19262322

Lattimore's

>> No.19262495

I read Fitzgerald's, next time round I'll read Fagles.

>> No.19263131

>>19262129
There's?... Oh ffs whichever is best for a layman

>> No.19263141

>>19262129
I don't know, I wrote it

>> No.19263164

I've read Lattimore, Rieu, and Fagles.

All three are an enjoyable experience.

>> No.19263411

don't care, didn't read

>> No.19263416

>>19262129
Pope

>> No.19263423

>>19262129
Fagles. Plan to get Peter Green or Chapman for my next read.

>> No.19263453

>>19263164
Did you read the prose Rieu?

>> No.19263592

>>19263416
This is the only right answer. You need the SOUL to get anything out of it, I don't get why anyone would want to read these snoozefest "accurate" translations which the Greeks themselves would've found hilariously bad and boring.

>> No.19263597

>>19263592
After all the Iliad's not about the small details, it's about grand ideas and characters which gets across just fine, it doesn't matter how accurately the goat metaphors or whatever are translated.

>> No.19263693
File: 377 KB, 661x716, iliadtranslations.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19263693

>> No.19263713

>>19262129

Boring and gay, haven't done yet but I will do my (Fag)les when the time comes, the point isn't to appreciate such-and-such verse but to get the basic story elements for cultural reference.

>> No.19263717

Which translation is the most "epic" aka least dry. I'm not looking for 1:1 accuracy I just want something epic and cool lol

>> No.19263719

>>19263717
The movie troy

>> No.19263764

>>19263717
Pope again. It's actually in verse, it's heroic, dramatic, soulful. It's entertaining! (Gasp! How dare ancient books be entertaining????)

>> No.19263783

>>19263764
Not him but all the Pope shilling finally makes me want to read it do you know a good unabridged copy out there? I find alot on eBay but can't tell if they are abridged or commentaries etc

>> No.19263802
File: 917 KB, 1976x3160, IMG_20211021_112720_hdr~2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19263802

>>19263783
Ex-Fontibus publication. Comes with the pretty pictures too for maximum immersion.

>> No.19263808

>>19263453
I did indeed

>> No.19263815

>>19263808
That's the only copy they sell at my local stores. I ended up getting Fagles online because comparing all the translations Rieu really felt sub par, but you say its good? That's interesting and makes me feel less bad about that being the only copy people can pick up

>> No.19263818

>>19263802
Thanks friend, just got it off amazon.

>> No.19263921

>>19263818
Have fun!

>> No.19264166

>>19262129
penguin

>> No.19264192

I just ordered a victorian edition of Pope's Illiad illustrated by Flaxman (Chandos Classic) and I believe it'll be a jewel in my library

>> No.19264213

My first read was the Prose Rieu, which is fine to just get the context of the work for other things, but not very exciting in its own right.

I then read Fitzgerald which is an excellent read.

I've heard interesting things about the new Peter Green translation so I think I'll try that next time.

I also highly recommend Christopher Logue's War Music for a modern reworking of the Iliad rather than a translation. Stays very close to the spirit and is very powerful

>> No.19264231

>>19263764
>tfw dryden never did a full translation of the iliad

>> No.19264377

Maretić (revised by Ivšić and Bulcsú)

>> No.19264515

>>19262129
Robert Fagles' version, quite lovely it has a riveting, fanciful language and it has correctly preserved the meanings otherwise u can try Alexander the Pope' version...

>> No.19264522

I'm reading it now. Peter Green translation.

>> No.19264529

What's with all these anons reading Peter Green a month ago I thought I was the only one who even knew of it

>> No.19264562

>>19262129
Frederico Lourenço.

>> No.19264956

>>19263719
Troy is better than The Iliad really. It tells a much fuller story. The Iliad doesn't have half of the cool moments that Troy has.

>> No.19266417

If you're reading anyone other than Chapman fuck right off

>> No.19266429

>>19262129
Pope first time, which is one of the truly great translations but probably not the best for a beginner if they don't already enjoy classic English poetry.
Fitzgerald a while later, which was fine but I prefer his Odyssey.

>> No.19266449 [DELETED] 

>>19263597
You have no idea what you're talking about, soulless tard.

>> No.19266456

>>19263597
... it's poetry, retard, not a history book

>> No.19266620

>>19266429
I'm reading Pope next but I'm not familiar with classic english poetry, will I be able to enjoy it? I've already read one translation so I'm familiar

>> No.19266642

>>19266620
Just give the first few books a go. It's a great achievement in its own right, if you don't like the style you can drop it.

>> No.19266675

>>19266417
based and Keats pilled

>> No.19267480

>>19262129
Anyone serious has read multiple translations and has also learned Homeric Greek if there is any connection to his area of specialization.

>> No.19267505

>>19267480
BTW Lattimore, Pope, and Chapman are the best three. Fagles and Fitzgerald are a joke, dnr.

>> No.19269012
File: 91 KB, 1078x1331, F55FA00B-5EAD-422E-80D7-7F6ADB2C9CFC.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19269012

>>19262129
I learned ancient greek to read it.

>> No.19269180

>>19263597
The reason the Iliad was written down and standardized was to score the Homeric competitions based on accuracy.

>> No.19269723

>>19267505
>Lattimore
lol

>> No.19269734

>no one mentioned Butler
I'm getting nervous bros...

>> No.19270035

>translation

>> No.19270040

schadewaldt

>> No.19270822

If you were to cite an English-translated quote from the Illiad and the Odyssey, which translator would you use for both in professional context?

>> No.19270859

>>19267480
>>19267505
>>19269012

>not just reading the wikipedia synopsis, watching Troy and listening to an audiobook of the Fagles translation.
I unironically think this is all you need to experience the Iliad in all its glory. You can pontificate over the various """"""controversies""""""" between translations but let's not pretend this is anything other than academic wankery.

>> No.19270908

>>19270859
>reading the wikipedia synopsis, watching Troy and listening to an audiobook of the Fagles translation.
Aside from the Wikipedia synopsis (which I was going to do after rather than before), this was my plan. How'd you know?

>> No.19271037

>>19270908
>>19270859

why watch troy before reading
why audiobook
why fagles
this is all just b8 and some jab at Fagles

>> No.19271090

>>19270859
The audiobook is redundant, all you need is Wikipedia and Troy.

>> No.19271199

>>19271037
My autism requires me to use an audiobook even when I'm physically reading a copy of a book if the audiobook option is available. As for Troy, I meant to say I'd watch it after reading the it. And why Fagles? I don't know, it seems like the most mainstream option.

>> No.19271207

>>19271199
>My autism requires me to use an audiobook even when I'm physically reading a copy of a book if the audiobook option is available
That's odd, is there a reason?

>> No.19271265

>>19262129
King James

>> No.19271278

>>19271207
I really don't know. I noticed it while reading the Bible, and found myself more and more often pulling up the audio ESV to read along with me, as if to serve as my internal voice. First did it around the Psalms during a long car ride, but then continued doing it afterward even when I was just at my desk. I'll say, I'm much less likely to use an audiobook supplement if the work is narrative-based. However, I'm significantly more likely to use one for poetic writing.

>> No.19271316

>>19270859
I watched half of Troy yesterday. I used to like it, but it's aged poorly and having read The Iliad now it compares poorly. The decision to make Achilles and Hektor despise the gods and to not include any gods ata all was a big one that fucked with the story. Other things too like how Briseis is changed, just don't sit right. Also when Achilles cusses out Agamemnon it's really weak in comparison to the curses in The Iliad.

>> No.19271338

>>19271316
>The decision to make Achilles and Hektor despise the gods
I didn't like this either, I don't think Hektor despised though
>include any gods ata all was a big one that fucked with the story
I don't know, I can easily see why they did it. The main thing of Achilles Wrath/Fate and Hektor's is preserved. That being said, movie goes to shit after Hector's funeral.

>> No.19271458

>>19271278
>pulling up the audio ESV to read along with me, as if to serve as my internal voice.
Wow a real live NPC without internal dialogue kek

>> No.19271466

>>19271458
Cut me some slack. I had a head injury in my 20s while on the job site and so I lose focus a lot.

>> No.19271480

I thought the people talking about that Troy movie were being ironic.

>> No.19271546

>>19269734
dont worry anon, i read butler my first time through due to ignorance, and i gotta say, i regret it everyday.

>> No.19271747

>>19271546
>>19269734
what's wrong with Butler? Did he do the abridged version?

>> No.19271798

>>19271466
Poetry is meant to be read aloud anyway, nothing wrong with audiobooks autismbro

>> No.19271801

Fitzgerald, no contest.

>> No.19271816

>>19271798
no its just the dryest translation out there, felt like all the fun and everything was totally stripped until what was left was just the bare plot in english. Also it was prose translation if im not mistaken.

>> No.19271840

Has anyone read through the Peter Green translation? I was gifted it (and his Odyssey translation) as an early Christmas present, though already have a few translations of both.
I read the beginning of his translation and it seems decent but I don't have a good eye for such things

>> No.19271864

>>19271840
I'm reading it now and I'm on book 10. Don't know what to tell you though, this is my first Iliad reading. I put a few chapters of it vs Fagles and I liked Green better, for my own taste. I've looked at a number of reviews and comparisons and they all rate Green highly too.

>> No.19272025

>>19271864
A lump of dog feces would be better than fagles.

>> No.19272096

>>19272025
seethe Lattimorecuck

>> No.19272121

>>19272096
Lattimore is the best word-for-word translation, and I think it’s valuable to read at least one translation which prioritizes accuracy over poetry (without completely abandoning poetry). Fagles has no value whatsoever.

>> No.19272124

>>19272121
I knew it.

>> No.19272152

>>19272124
Glad I was able to convince you.

>> No.19272169

>>19272152
No. Switch Lattimore and Fagles in your post and it's correct.

>> No.19272192

>>19272169
Low IQ.

>> No.19272840

>>19271037
It isn't a jab you dimwit.
You only need a broad understanding of the main themes, characters and events. Fagles does a better job at that than other translations. He also keeps the momentum of narrative rather than getting bogged down in academic memes like "accuracy" and "poetry"
An audiobook because the Iliad was performed orally before being written down.

>> No.19272857

>>19263815
It was very popular in its time (his Odyssey was so popular it created Penguin Classics and rekindled interest in the Greeks that had been dramatically waning throughout the first half of the century) because it is very accessible. This has its drawbacks (a general lack of artistry being the main one) but if you go in with an open mind it can be a lot of fun to read.

>> No.19273182

>>19272857
>a general lack of artistry being the main one
E. V. Rieu's has been my personal favorite for years, I see a lot of talent on display reading his version and I do consider it a fine rendition of a classic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlXvRgbjwlU

>> No.19273198

Much have I travell'd in the realms of gold,
And many goodly states and kingdoms seen;
Round many western islands have I been
Which bards in fealty to Apollo hold.
Oft of one wide expanse had I been told
That deep-brow'd Homer ruled as his demesne;
Yet did I never breathe its pure serene
Till I heard Chapman speak out loud and bold:
Then felt I like some watcher of the skies
When a new planet swims into his ken;
Or like stout Cortez when with eagle eyes
He star'd at the Pacific—and all his men
Look'd at each other with a wild surmise—
Silent, upon a peak in Darien.

>> No.19273203
File: 57 KB, 326x500, 51hsG+fKitL.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19273203

>>19262129
Caroline Alexander

>> No.19273262

>>19273203
>muh vagina

>> No.19273292
File: 180 KB, 730x1200, 71eF++3bCqL.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19273292

>>19273262
Nope, that would be Emily Wilson’s translation. Alexander's is actually quite good.

>> No.19274584
File: 50 KB, 382x499, 61ExywXYIsL._SX380_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19274584

Should I read pic related before attempting to read the Iliad?

>> No.19274697
File: 120 KB, 640x853, tumblr_obmoc7lex31tgq4svo1_640.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19274697

>>19274584
No, read this instead.

>> No.19274807

>>19262129
A Finnish translation by the poet Otto Manninen. Surprisingly, it blows the two English translations I read out of the water.

>> No.19274814
File: 109 KB, 1173x610, Screenshot.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19274814

>>19274807
why is it so expensive?

>> No.19274818

>>19262129
Pollestad

>> No.19274833

>>19274814
You can find an older edition in an antiquary book shop or flea market for next to nothing. Check antikvaari.fi.

>> No.19275065

>>19264956
The Trojan war spans more than the Iliad which began with Achilles' wrath and his rivalry with his arch-enemy and dog-faced Agamemnon and ends with the death of the mighty Hector killed.

>> No.19275763

>>19271278
Can autists even go to heaven? Asking for a friend.

>> No.19275817

>>19269180
Do you have a source for that?

>> No.19275909

>>19275817
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peisistratos

this guy was the first to have homer written down

>> No.19275911

Milos Djuric

>> No.19275927

>>19262129
original Greek, unironically

>> No.19275941

>>19273292
correct

>> No.19275974

Fagles for just reading it, Pope for making it pretty. I like that Fagles has hints of poetic flair in it, almost inviting the reader to take up poetry to beautify it where Fagles didn't.

>> No.19276981

>>19264522
I just finished book 22. I shed a tear for Hektor's wife. This has really been an amazing story. Almost over though!

I also pulled up Pope's translation out of curiosity to read side by side a few passages. Pope's is beautiful, no doubt, and I think I must read it now at some point, but I am glad I chose Green for my first reading as the meaning is much clearer to me.

>> No.19276986

Lattimore obviously

>> No.19277023
File: 481 KB, 1102x1276, E77F8B2F-BEAD-4C46-AE13-5E587E766DCE.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19277023

>> No.19277031

>>19277023
>>19273198
/lit/ is a hivemind

>> No.19277302

>>19277023
Yeah no surprise that an Irishman was too stupid to learn Greek like all the real intellectuals did. One really cannot help but wonder for what purpose God created the Irish, unless to serve as the missing link between niggers and humans.

>> No.19277562

>>19276981
Just finished it. The last two books were not as powerful as I expected, to be honest. The whole funeral games thing was quite a tonal shift. I expected more emphasis on the desecration of Hektor. The pleading of Priam too, was a little strange, being as it was foretold by the gods and came as no surprise to Achilles, and he even gets mad at the old man and tells him not to push his luck as he knows he only made it to his hut with the help of the gods.

>> No.19277608

The third most popular Iliad quote on Goodreads is from the movie Troy lmao

This is a funny article I found about it when I was trying to discover how widespread that idiocy was

https://eidolon.pub/the-homer-we-want-7e7299acdfe2