/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.22020322]

Can somebody please suggest a book that discusses the practicality of eugenics or even just the topic of eugenics in an openminded manner

[Anonymous No.22020459]

>>22020322
It isn’t practical.
Go ask /sci/ why your great granddaddy’s biggoted pseudoscience isn’t given any credence nowadays.
Yeah yeah, you’ll say it’s the jews, but you have to fucking study the fucking reasons why, not what the name of the scientists.
Did you go along with the Fauci/CDC junk science too? Same difference.

[Anonymous No.22020460]

>>22020322
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Glad

Check out his "Jewish Eugenics" and "Future Human Evolution: Eugenics in the Twenty-first Century"

[Anonymous No.22020518]

>>22020459
Redditor response. The idea of eugenics being pseudoscience is hilarious. If not a Redditor, are you some sort of cretin who doesn't believe in genetics?

[Anonymous No.22020521]

>>22020459
>t. never heard about quantitative genetics applied to selective breeding of cattle

Kek, get a load of this idiot.

[Anonymous No.22020541]

>>22020460
Thanks anon, I am going to read the latter suggestion.

[Anonymous No.22020544]

>>22020521
Not him but... fattening up a domesticated animal vs. "improving" more vague variables in humans is... le different

[Anonymous No.22020556]

>>22020544
>vague variables
What a preposterous cope. By the way, "Fattening up a domesticated cattle" isn't eugenics, you imbecile. Why weigh in on something if you evidently are incapable of doing-so? Move on to a bait thread and make your feebleminded comments over there.

[Anonymous No.22020586]

>>22020322
just follow current world events and you can see it in action

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LSZCxzmhico

[Anonymous No.22020606]

>>22020556
I mean stuff like intelligence, you'll make autistics and fail a lot first. The traits desired in genetic engineering livestock/food is simpler and failure less "problematic"

[Anonymous No.22020610]

A big chunk of the people obsessed with eugenics seem to be the sort of dumb, socially maladjusted weirdos eugenics is supposed to stomp out

[Anonymous No.22020612]

>>22020606
>>22020606
Dude, you don't not what you talking about, you fell for the "autism = intelligence" myth, kek.

[Anonymous No.22020621]

>>22020610
Still doesn't make eugenics wrong, lmao.

[Anonymous No.22020635]

>>22020322
I bet a lot of pro-eugenics anons are part of that undesirable population that would be purged. Be careful what you wish for

[Anonymous No.22020644]

>>22020606
Define intelligence in a non-subjective manner right now.

[Anonymous No.22020647]

>>22020459
It works for every other living creature but magically not practical for humans.

[Anonymous No.22020648]

>>22020610
Makes sense though doesn't it?
>If only my ancestors didn't succumb to random selection, I wouldn't have a receding jawline, slow metabolism and dull wit
Or whatever features they obsess over.

[Anonymous No.22020660]

>>22020635
>I bet a lot of pro-eugenics anons are part of that undesirable population that would be purged. Be careful what you wish for
Liberal eugenics is about improving offspring... not killing off undesirables. You can live as an incel no problem and die

[Anonymous No.22020684]

>>22020635
>purged
no, just sterilized. Culling is only necessary if their presence is actively deleterious to others, in which case, mental asylums were (And would be) the resultant recourse.

>>22020610
That can likely be explained by the topic of eugenics being a third rail topic, thus, primarily people with anti-social will be willing to support the idea of eugenics publicly.

[Anonymous No.22020716]

>>22020621
Sure, but obsession with intelligence by people who aren't particularly bright is just weird.

[Anonymous No.22020717]

>>22020459
the western world has practical genetics in currently in place by weaponizing collective woman behaviour.

[Anonymous No.22020722]

>>22020459
the western world has practical eugenics in currently in place by weaponizing collective woman behaviour.

[Anonymous No.22020725]

eugenics is not only logistically impossible in modern society but is made totally obsolete and redundant by genetic engineering technology (which despite what retards might say can alter the genome in vivo)

[Anonymous No.22020739]

>>22020725
>eugenics is not only logistically impossible in modern society
It would literally be as easy as withholding gibs and eliminating affirmative action-like practices.
>but is made totally obsolete and redundant by genetic engineering technology
cannot currently be done at scale

[Anonymous No.22020757]

>>22020322
Francis Galton's Hereditary Genius, Alfred Ploetz's Racial Hygiene Basics, and anything by Albert E. Wiggam.
>>22020459
>It isn’t practical.
Things that aren't practical, but are helpful, will, over time, become more practical. You should elaborate on what you mean by "practical", by the way. It's too vague.
>Go ask /sci/ why your great granddaddy’s biggoted pseudoscience isn’t given any credence nowadays
>Yeah yeah, you’ll say it’s the jews, but you have to fucking study the fucking reasons why, not what the name of the scientists.
The "reason" is because the liberal worldview. Dysgenics isn't really the "goal" but a necessary step in establishing the liberal worldview as correct and we know this is the case. The idea of a "superior human" would be bad for the liberal worldview, so we currently deny that it exists (despite knowing that plenty Peoples are superior than others at specific things) and it won't be a lie after they get everyone to mix up and continue pushing for the muddying of races. We can talk about politics all day, but people widely agree that the average human is becoming dumber over time. The difference is the agreed upon reasons. I proclaim the reason is race and a rejection of eugenics. Sure, others will say "Its the water, its the water!" but no one wants to clean up the water. Others may say "its the education, its the education! Race has NOTHING to do with it." but there have been plenty of experiments that prove this to be false. Of course, the education is a problem, but it was "dumbed down" to help reduce the difference between the races. This is known information, not just conjecture. Look at the beginnings of "No Child Left Behind" act. They stated their goal from the beginning was to "close the gap". If you change the system and everyone suffers, maybe your initial idea was incorrect in the first place.
>>22020606
>and fail a lot first
lol! You implied success over time.

[Anonymous No.22020764]

>>22020322
>oh look, another edgelord thread

[Anonymous No.22020789]

>>22020764
>calling people edgelords in the year of our lord, on this website
nigger moment

[Anonymous No.22020928]

[Anonymous No.22020932]

[Anonymous No.22020998]

>>22020757
>liberal worldview
The human desire to be free, and safe from looks-based-murder and/castration by a state.

>>22020722
Men and women choosing from among the crowds, or choosing not to breed at all, isn’t eugenics

Ah, fresh nazis. Every generation turns out more of these idiots. Imagine Marxists liquidating you to stop reactionary genes.

[Anonymous No.22021020]

>>22020322
The trouble with Eugenics is that we are too stupid to do it properly. Just leave it to God and Darwin.

[Anonymous No.22021040]

>>22020322
I proposed an androcentric version on substack

[Anonymous No.22021068]

>>22021020
Which gene is the nazi gene?
We aren’t cattle or dogs. The truth is we’re not stupid enough. That’s the trouble

[Anonymous No.22021095]

What am I if I think that the idea that we could or should do a massive breeding program with the intent of creating a noticeably better race of humans is stupid but I also think that we should abort every foetus with serious disabilities and forcibly sterilise individuals with a significant chance of passing on a serious genetic disorder? Also there will be a transitionary period of 20 years where if you have something like down syndrome you will be allowed to live but babies caught with it or a similar disorder will be euthanised
So for example, we should sterilise those with Harlequin-type ichthyosis, abort foetuses with Harlequin-type ichthyosis and abort foetuses with down syndrome

[Anonymous No.22021743]

>>22020610
>dumb
Being able to ignore how important genes are to almost every fact of life or how likely you are to succeed is a luxury of those with good genes to begin with.

[Anonymous No.22021807]

>>22020322
The best argument for eugenics would be for the purposes of raising overall intelligence. Except there’s no way to measure intelligence because it isn’t defined by a number or by the size of an organ, it’s extremely varied in how it’s displayed and used. Any given person has 1-2 areas that they’re intelligent in and deeply understand, whether by talent or by learning and teaching, and they will be completely retarded in the rest. Eugenics completely disregards this, the idea that intelligence and certain traits can be altered and manipulated simply through education and training.
The obsession with birthing a perfect person is genuinely retarded, unless it’s intended for physical features, which still can’t be accurately measured until a person reaches puberty, or even later in their life. Education is by far the best and only method of improving the intelligence of a population.
>>22020757
>Others may say "it’s the education, it’s the education! Race has NOTHING to do with it." but there have been plenty of experiments that prove this to be false.
It’s absolutely the education, have you seen the state of modern schooling. Ancient Greece had better education 2500 years ago than we do today.

[Anonymous No.22021828]

>>22021095
eugenics with extra steps

[Anonymous No.22021857]

>>22020322
>trusting the State to decide if you get to have children
Lol
>trusting the State with eugenics when you don't trust the State with banning eugenics
Lmao

>>22021807
>any given person has 1-2 areas that they're intelligent in [...] and they will be completely retarded in the rest
The importance of this cannot be overstated, modern culture is simply too vast for any individual to be competent at everything.

[Anonymous No.22021866]

Eugenics is incapable of establishing itself as an ethical standpoint apart from any radical interpretation of traditional cultural norms or the creation of new ones. Nazism succeeded in the popular accession to eugenics through its appeal to the nascent, although admittedly confused and often arbitrary, reemergence of a Germanic folk culture which Hitler merely tapped into. The hard part isn’t getting people to acquiesce to eugenics, the priests did so all too happily, the hard part is getting people to believe it. As such, the chance for a popular wave of eugenics-approval is very nearly zero for the average person with a, if not overtly, hereditarily Christian moral framework. The chance for it to occur coincides with the inflammation or degradation of the average person’s morality. Not to mention that the positive identification of a human Ideal necessarily leads to the negative conception of what does not conform to the Ideal. The polarization of what boils down to essentially genetic epistemology has its own inherent dangers which should be obvious to anyone not wholly convinced that a person who doesn’t look exactly like them is an animal.
inb4 >lul, he’s not racist

[Anonymous No.22021867]

>>22020322
Heres a more measured take: State-enforced eugenics is one of those things that works really well in theory, but is impossible to properly implement into practice. As a state government, in order to survey, filter, and control the population, you need to hire people from this same population. Here lies the inevitable paradox of eugenics: those with the undesirable traits will always end up in some positions of authority, including those positions that are in charge of promoting good traits and weeding out bad traits in the population's gene pool. Any attempt at state-enforced eugenics will devolve into a bunch of subjective racist bullshit because of these very undesirables seeing themselves as the desirables and getting into positions of eugenic judgement.

[Anonymous No.22021874]

>>22021807
>Ancient Greece had better education 2500 years ago than we do today.

It can be brought back

[Anonymous No.22022155]

>>22021866
Very well put

[Strange Love No.22022159]

>>22021866

>the hard part is getting people to believe it

Nah, would be very simple if sold as a "voluntary" reproductive improvement strategy. IV zygote selection (extremely easy with current tech) with pre-implantation genetic screening to get the best possible genetic combination from a couple. Also, those you'd need to actually "weed out" (because deleterous load is simply too high) usually don't have the mental horizon to make a decision here or "believe" in the strategy ... you simply keep these on some cheap soma pod dwelling "social program" and mandatory birth control (open deal, easy state-sponsored life for abstaining from reproduction, their decision) until the issue resolves itself within a generation or two.

[Anonymous No.22022172]

>>22020518
>>22020521
>>22020647
>>22020722
>>22020757
Let's just reduce the genetic diversity related to the most desirable traits! What can possibly go wrong?

[Anonymous No.22022367]

>>22020998
It's not a free choice. Women are rarely are capable of thinking for themselves. They have no internal balancing system until their late 30s, where they can no longer play the role of young attainable girl. Their intuition is also geared towards sensing out groupthink and external pressures. Aside from their unfortunate delusion of elevating themselves highly just for sleeping with a successful man, awareness of successful people obliterates female capacity to evaluate themselves and others. Global, persistent media allows women to believe they are somehow in the same tribe as rich celebs. They will happily mutilate their own body, starve themselves, and buy items due to this belief, in hopes that they too will land someone of that caliber. As such, they raise their standards far beyond what they themselves could attain. This whole process weeds out many a retarded woman, as well as about 80% of men. The children of those who don't get weeded but deserve to be, becomes the slaves of the next generation.

[Anonymous No.22023594]

>>22021867
people have been glad to commit suicide or cut off their own genitals for moral reasons for thousands of years.

A eugenics program could be easily be instilled with a few brainworms. The real problem is that brainwormables are the biggest retards and are holding everyone back

[Anonymous No.22023948]

Pro-eugenics arguments:
>Science
>Data
>Logic
Anti-eugenics arguments:
>Ur ugly
>Selecting for certain traits will never work, trust me
>Appeals to authority

[Anonymous No.22024092]

I'm convinced we have soft eugenics with birth control, abortion, and a climate of kids being seen as a poor investment, "crotch goblins," or doomed to death under climatism.

[Anonymous No.22024094]

>>22020586
bill is a nice man but this world was a mistake

[Anonymous No.22024481]

>>22023948
That is backwards, anon
Except point 2. It is literally

Pro-eugenics arguments:
>Ur ugly, therefore we will castrate/eliminate you
>
>Appeals to authority. academia and state heads agree that we should play around with the livestock's genetic makeup, try to breed out undesirable traits. Don't like redheads? breed it out forever!

Anti-eugenics arguments:
>Science
>Data
>Logic
Again I say it. We are not cows or dog breeds. The state or the "experts" should not decide who gets to mate. You people are just sexually frustrated white supremacist chuds

[Anonymous No.22025051]

Simone and Malcolm probably have a book about that. I suggest you look at their pragmatist's guide series.

[Anonymous No.22025059]

Simone and Malcolm Collins probably have a book about that. I suggest you look at their pragmatist's guide series.

>>22024481
This bait sucks

[Anonymous No.22025159]

>>22020322
Bro there is so much retardation in humanity there is no where to start. Besides people make decisions about eugenics when they decide to mate with people in their own social class and traits anyways. How are you going to optimize a system where people are already picky as fuck. You’re going to be everybody in the the worlds parents and force arranged marriages? You wouldn’t make optimal decisions because you lack empathy and don’t live in the real world. Let people breed and form their own families, they will be judged for their mistakes and that will determine who their kids can breed with etc.
tldr: We have natural eugenics running already with no human rights violations having to be used.
Ps. And yet we are getting dumber and have retards like op posting their childish nonsense. There is no saving humanity because you’re all too retarded to look up and save yourselves first.

[Anonymous No.22025162]

>>22021807
We are obsessed with intelligence but that’s just because it’s an easy cop out - a total midwit cope

[Anonymous No.22025169]

>>22022367
Good thing it’s men that do most of the evaluation. Women not having agency is of no concern. Never has been. Civilization is not here because of women.

[Anonymous No.22025174]

>>22024092
Birth control has always been practiced in some form or another. Infanticide in free countries and other methods. Also you forget not fornicating really helps improve the quality of offspring.

[Anonymous No.22025475]

>/pol/nigs see how human selection turns working dog breeds into deformed showdogs
>/pol/nigs decide humans should enforce human selection on themselves
One might say, too stupid to live.