/sci/ - Science & Math

I would become a doctor but tell me all the things i would need to do

>dealing with sick and fucked people the rest of your life
No thanks

>>10408247
You already deal with yourself.

>>10408258
Ouch.

>>10408107
Reminder that doctors have by far the highest suicide rate, and the majority of them would not become doctors if they could go back in time.

>>10408107
Doctors aren't paid well where I come from. Please remember that you're probably viewing it from an American lens. Different places in the world have different values and wages depending on profession.

Doctors and Lawyers are (lower)middle class workers. Engineers,politicians and military officers are rich.

>>10408272
4chan is an american website.

>>10408107
>regretting their engineering degrees
Valid regret.
> science/math PhDs
Stupid regret unless you came from a fairly wealthy background in the first place. PhD gives you major pseud credit, and certainly is better off credential wise than the 4-5 years you would have spent in the workforce, and will command a higher salary.

Pro-tip, if you are struggling with a PhD, you would have struggled with your undergrad too. It is only a valid regret you include undergrad in that regret. Otherwise, it's cope.

>>10408280
I will punch you in the fucking throat

>>10408299
*calls security to remove the ethnic "person"*

>>10408107
I think the largest prerequisite to becoming a doctor is to be very socially inept. There are certainly exceptions to this, but generally, doctors aren't necessarily very smart, are extremely studious, and have shit people skills. For the people that fit this profile, becoming a doctor is a wise idea, because their social ineptitudes would prevent them from rising very high in commercial settings. For the few doctors that actually are very academically smart, there's a chance they might earn a LOT of money (international heart surgeon, neurosurgeon etc.)

If you're smart enough to go to med school and you have decent social skills/high emotional intelligence, you'd be better off going commercial instead (engineering/maths/phys/finance degree, business masters). Better working conditions, greater scope, and a much better salary - and you'll get there much quicker too.

>>10408386
cope

>>10408310
I'm white you absolute piece of shit. The country I described is in Western Europe.

>>10408280
its japanese you fucking mongoloid

>>10408107
im a med student at the end of the third year and I think about suicide everyday

>>10408389
The irony is that I'm a clinical neuroscience student with a guaranteed interview for graduate-entry medicine once I finish my BSc. I'm talking from first-hand experience.

>>10408435
>not medical school
Cope.

>>10408417
nice, I'm aspiring to this. Any advice for a freshman undergraduate?

>>10408107
>Why didn't you become a doctor?

Doctors are very intelligent people that are worked like beaten slaves.

They are EXPECTED to basically live at LEAST 2 years in a hospital for their residency.

Not getting enough sleep and living under pressure continuously is consider "good training"

Make a mistake on your worst day and your career can be over.

A good accountant will make more money than good doctor.

The only worse profession is being a veterinarian

>>10408671
I didnt known slaves were respected and had annual incomes of hundreds of thousands of dollars.

>>10408710
>worked like beaten slaves.

They are worked like beaten slaves.

Yes doctors make a good pay AFTER a decade of training, THEN they owe a fortune.

A doctor in his 50s begins to live quite well.

Becoming a master plumber and opening your own shop would do as well a Doctor with MUCH less stress and more free time. Not nearly the "respect" of a doctor but when you NEED a plumber you very happy when he shows up.

>>10408748
Why are you putting respect in quotations as if it doesnt matter or isnt obvious that doctors are by far the most respected people by career path. Owing a fortune doesnt mean anything when you make that every year, where most people will take more time to pay less.

>>10408107
I'm squeamish around blood, guts, and needles.

>>10408758

Doctors are respected because of their rareness and importance to life. All they are is human body experts, veterinarians that specialize in ONE species.

As soon as auto-docs start arriving the "importance and respect" that doctors had will evaporate like a fart in hurricane

Why would ANY human want to put his life into the hands of someone who could be having the worst day of his life when a machine will care for you to the best of ALL human knowledge of trhe human body and will not make a mistake.

>>10408785
Oh youre just another automation parrot

>>10408790
i hate these guys, they have no actual clue where either field is heading but spout "this can be easily automated" tradespeople are finding automation not in terms of someone else doing their job, but the systems that they work with require less and less trades knowledge to actually fix, the trade was first broad and trades people could fix unique problems, but as things become more and more standardized and more simplified trades people will be needed less.

>>10408790

A primitive auto-doc for military front line emergencies is needed and desired.

ATM machines have been around for 50 years, there are people today who have only had one or 2 bank transactions with humans involved.

Doctors are expensive, rare, and time consuming for many people to go to.

The mobile auto-doc WILL come along, and in time, the human doctor will be a rare specialist.

>>10408804
>"this can be easily automated" t

NO this MUST be automated. There is desperate need for medical care in the world. People ARE dying for the lack of seeing a doctor.

An auto-doc will include a tele-presence robot for the "human" touch.

Automating human maintenance and repair "Doctoring" is one of the easiest things to forecast coming.

>>10408842
You're clueless. Medical robotics is already a huge field, and it hasn't usurped any doctors from their jobs - it's just expanded the medical profession to include more engineers and technological scientists.

There's just no conceptual basis for automation in medicine. How the hell does an automated system make a diagnosis without a doctor or healthcare technician to take a patient history, guide the patient through the diagnosis processes, interpret the results? How inconceivably complex would an AI need to be to be able to make meaningful sense of something as simple as elevated blood pressure and interpret it in the context of an entirely unique individual patient? We know that algorithms become next to useless when used in the context of normal human interaction, so how the hell would a piece of technology be able to categorize all the information that's needed to make a diagnosis/treatment decision when it's delivered in a human way?

Can you point to any type of technology that suggests anything like this will be possible in the future?

>>10408107
>Why didn't you become a doctor? Can't you handle it? I guess you weren't good enough..
doin phD in Engineering, would be a psychiatrist if i could


a literally retarded dumb as a brick ex works as a psych nurse and makes $200k barely doing any fucking work and having an office of her own acting like a doctor

>>10408671
What are you, fucking Warren Buffet's personal account?

>>10408404
Just say which country so we can dismiss you, fucking piece of shit liar

>>10409014
If you join one of the big 4 financial services firms and you're not a total fuck-up, and you're prepared to handle some tough-conditions (still much better conditions than in medicine), you could easily be bringing home $400k in 12-18 years. Only the most business savvy, luckiest, or gifted doctors will ever earn that much, and it'd take those that do much, much longer.

>>10408404
The only white people are Americans.

>>10409007
>a literally retarded dumb as a brick ex works as a psych nurse and makes $200k barely doing any fucking work and having an office of her own acting like a doctor

I don't believe it. Unless you've seen undeniable evidence, don't believe that shit.

>>10409113
Many specialties make $500,000+ out of residency.

>>10408973
>There's just no conceptual basis for automation in medicine.

Again and again computer systems outperform doctors in diagnosis, planning treatment and in estimating prognosis.

Not that they are very good at these things but doctors are just terrible at them.

> recency bias
> statistical illiteracy
> unable to keep multiple possibilities in mind
> not up to date on the literature
> forgot medical training

>>10409119
>That equates to 37,100 new positions for NPs. Furthermore, nurse practitioners earn a mean annual salary of $97,990 (BLS 2014), more than double the average salary for all occupations at $47,230 (BLS 2015).

and she had a job in california, so her salary was 200k, and it's a job easy as shit. I know more about psych than she does, she doesnt even have to get her hands dirty. She just went to nursing school for 3 years and that was it for the fucking education she got. Oh and did I mention she's self-centered and dumb as a brick.

>>10409143
only girls can get that job tho

>>10409149
>only girls can get that job tho
nope. It's mostly by women because of the stigma attached to being a nurse.

>>10408107
I did undergrad math/cs and now I'm in medical school so that I can make a more meaningful contribution to the world, I'm never going to be a Gauss, Euler, Knuth, von Neumann etc. so in my mind why even bother?
I still enjoy reading math/cs in my free time (and unless you are a brainlet, even in med school you have a decent amount of free time) and I plan on going into a speciality where I can do some research that will apply what I've learnt in math/cs. We need more math people in med school I'm pretty sick of the brainlet premeds. In the future AI and quantitative work will play a larger role in medicine so medical schools will love graduates who have some experience in those fields, see pic related.

>>10409129
Pre-tax maybe, but not in take-home salary. It's convention where I come from to use post-tax salary - probably should have been more specific. My $400k figure was post-tax.

Even then, I think the use of 'many' is a bit liberal - as a percentage of all the specialties available, perhaps 4-5% might pay close to $500k pre-tax, and I doubt it's straight out of residency. Doctors have considerably higher overheads too.

>>10409132
I think we need to be specific about the term 'diagnosis'. Software might be better at identifying the presence of, say, breast cancer, but that, in and of itself, is useless information. Saying 'you have breast cancer' isn't really a diagnosis. A more realistic and meaningful diagnosis provides a far more comprehensive insight for the patient and takes into account information which can't be reliably fed into a software algorithm. We're talking about automation that helps doctors do their job - not automation that replicates what a doctor does or replaces them in any way, as was propositioned. These systems we have now, and those which are realistically viable in the future, many of which only appear to be automated, and wouldn't meet a rigorous definition of automation, will always be subject to the inputs of living, breathing doctors.

Not that I like doctors - I despise the vast majority of them, and I think, having had a privileged insight, their professional standards are abhorrent. But, unfortunately, there's no magical technology that's going to save us from them.

>>10409162
Can you do us all a favor and go into bioengineering research, please. The fact that most physical disabilities still exist in 2019 is pretty inexcusable. Although, if that pic is true, it explains why.

>>10408107
I would have chosen to become a doctor if I had the grades for it. I could have skipped a year to study hard and get in but I chose not to do that.
Not because I didn't want it or anything, just because I wanted to save face. My grades were good enough to get in ME just not Medicine.
However, this is one of those brainlet choices that I do not regret. My personality is just not suited to being a doctor. One mistake man. One mistake is all takes to hurt someone or worse, kill him.
I can't take that kind of stress. It would fucking kill me. All the responsibility I have to take designing stuff for ME is already ridiculous. If I unintentionally fucked someone up, I wouldn't be able to handle it.
I'm glad I got in ME instead.

>>10409162
How old are you?

>>10409184
will be that or clinical genetics or neurology for me
>>10409331
early 20s

>>10409162
It is hard for me to believe that people in medicine have such bad results compared to people in the humanistic fields.