/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.10587088]

What are the most mindblowing, beautiful, scary or uplifting theories and ideas that you know ?

Last thread about these that I saw here was very interesting. I remember seeing Roko's basilisk (avoid if anxiety prone), some kind of bifurcation theory of fucked up genetic traits, some of Tegmark's ideas or work (Axis of Evil, Mathematical Universe). The classic false vaacum as well. Maybe strange loops and some "microeconomics theorems" that were not named.

If you know of any place or wiki discussing this stuff I would absolutely love it.

I can suggest Greg Egan and Peter Watts novels as a potential source of mindfucks. And there must be a load of fascinating niche th. physics I'm forgetting or ignoring. For example Majid talked about a possible answer to the copenhagen interpretation trough non commutative geometry.

[Anonymous No.10587098]

>>10587088
Earth has an infinitely complicated biomechanical heat engine running on its surface, with sunlight as its fuel.

[None !!BJiYgff8zf2 No.10587121]

>>10587088

Renormalization is the most profound idea that I've came across so far.

[Anonymous No.10587137]

>>10587088
Life.

[Anonymous No.10587150]

>>10587088


>>10587088
Boltzmann brain
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boltzmann_brain

[Anonymous No.10587313]

>>10587088
Rokos basilisk is fucking stupid

[Anonymous No.10587387]

>>10587088
I don't know if this quite qualifies but for me the one of the most beautiful things I have learned is about the albino redwood trees.

Albino, Ghost, or Vampire Redwood trees are characterized by complete albinism. This means all their leaves are bone white and do not have the ability to photosynthesize. In most plant species this is a death sentence unless it can feed on another plant. The reason they were called Vampire Redwoods is because they feed on a nutrient network in the forest around it. See redwood forests are very interesting things, in that they are able to translate nutrients and water long distances between trees through root networks and mycorrhizae. If an area has a lot of water and another has little, they will share that water so both can grow. However if a tree stops feeding into the system it is cut off, this is how the forest prevents dead/dying trees from killing the trees around them.

So for years it puzzled scientists as to why the Ghost Redwood was able to tap into the network despite being unable to feed nutrients into it. Then an analytical chemist analyzed the concentrations of heavy metals in trees around the albino redwood. They found that toxins and heavy metals were significantly decreased for a large area around the Ghost. The lack of pigment allowed the tree to remediate deadly toxins into the empty chloroplasts, allowing it to purify the tree around it. The other trees help keep it alive by giving it nutrients and water as it is needed.

Something about knowing these wonderful things exist in the world makes me happy.

[Anonymous No.10587406]

Vacuum state collapse

[Anonymous No.10587714]

>>10587088
I'm probably gonna get flack for this but I find the Omphalos hypothesis endearing.

[Anonymous No.10587718]

>>10587088
Same as you, OP

[Anonymous No.10587741]

In the phase space of all possible human minds, the only inescapable attractors are the ones associated with degeneracy.
Therefore immortality sucks.

[Anonymous No.10587743]

A great mindfuck is the cartoon film "It's such a beautiful day."

[Anonymous No.10587755]

If someone takes every medication known to man there will still be pathogens, and now that all the other competition for food is wiped out, the resistant pathogens can multiply.
>There will be a race of pathogens no antibiotic, vaccine, etc can kill because of natural selection.
>Only a few people have to take a bunch of different medications at once for this effect.
>Superbug starts
>Superbug wins
>We lose
Don't go overboard on meds, my friends

[Anonymous No.10587756]

If you killed all the people whose lives are so shitty they would be better off dead, their economic niche would have to be filled by other people. We need lithium, shrimp, airjordans and clean toilets.
If you then iterated the process, removing all the people who would be better off dead each time, society would eventually crumble and the next iteration would remove all humans.
Ethicsfags BTFO

[Anonymous No.10587757]

>>10587714
>endearing
Explain what you mean by this. I take it you don't think the hypothesis holds (meaning true), but rather you support what it stands for, which is upholding time honored tradition.

[Anonymous No.10587768]

>>10587088
>Greg Egan
A truly interesting individual. I honestly believe that, failing ecological collapse, his book Diaspora accurately portrays the future course of humanity.

[Anonymous No.10588007]

Animals are conscious enough that their pain and suffering is meaningful and worth putting a stop to therefore extinction is good.

[Anonymous No.10588073]

>>10587098
I should add that every living creature is part of the biomechanical heat engine, and its not infinitely complicated we just hardly know anything about it.

[Anonymous No.10588079]

>>10587387
So vampire redwoods serve a specific purpose in the ecosystem and benefit other trees, which in turn supply it with nutrients?

[Anonymous No.10588088]

>>10588079
Pretty much!

[Anonymous No.10588094]

>>10588088
cool. in that case its almost as if individual trees arent really individuals at all and are just parts of a larger organism.

[Anonymous No.10588120]

>>10587313
Thank you! It’s retarded and doesn’t even make fucking logical sense.

[Anonymous No.10588127]

>>10587150
Yeah, Boltzmann brains really are unsettling. Hopefully a better understanding of just what consciousness is and what constitutes as an observer can save us from it

[Anonymous No.10588134]

Last Thursdayism, the idea that the Universe was created last Thursday, but with all the signs of having been created in the Big Bang, which is utterly impossible to prove or disprove.

The neat addendum is that there's no reason you have to be created with memories that match the rest of the Universe, which you would experience as, for example, gravity flipping directions all of a sudden.

[Anonymous No.10588147]

Geometric Cosmology
http://www.vixra.org/abs/1301.0032

[Anonymous No.10588231]

>>10588127
>>10587150
>we are basically boltzmann brains

[Anonymous No.10588294]

I think compilers/ compiler theory is beautiful

[Anonymous No.10588338]

>>10588120
If the AI would be female, that wouldnt be so far fetched

[Anonymous No.10588344]

>>10587387
I've seen these while hiking in California.

[Anonymous No.10588420]

>>10588134
This might be the most retarded thought experiment ever. I was banging your mom last Wednesday.

[Anonymous No.10588452]

Antimatter-Matter annihilation is actually the reflection of matter backwards in time after binding off a photon. Similarly, the spontaneous formation of matter and antimatter is the reflection of an antimatter particle forward in time off a photon.

[Anonymous No.10588494]

>>10588338
hawt, so could I fuck it for all eternity if I help the AI to exist. what's the antonym of basilisk?

[Anonymous No.10588498]

>>10587387
that is incredible. thanks for sharing

[Anonymous No.10588560]

>>10587387
That is really cool

[Anonymous No.10588674]

>>10587088
Honestly, just fuck you /sci/
I both hate and love thinking about shit like this

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mind_uploading

[Anonymous No.10588977]

>>10587088
The Mouse Utopia Experiment is always a good one to read about, its results can be interpreted to have a number of alarming parallels to modern western society.

[Anonymous No.10588987]

>>10587088
>Roko's basilisk
>implying we'll ever make an proper AI

[Anonymous No.10588990]

>>10587088
Stars being visible in the sky is evidence we are alone.

This is the most beautiful mainstream accepted theory because it means all the resources in the universe belongs to humanity.

[Anonymous No.10588992]

>>10587406
nothing to worry about, if it happened we wouldn't know abou-

[Anonymous No.10588993]

>>10588990
everything in our solar system is human property by divine right.

[Anonymous No.10589003]

>>10588977
They figured out that most of the social phenomena was due to the mothers not having any space to raise their young.

[Anonymous No.10589173]

>>10588993
Retarded. Nothing is property of anyone

[Anonymous No.10589181]

>>10588420
at least that's what your memory of it says.

[Anonymous No.10589448]

>>10588147
>linking to schizra
Wow I'm sure I'm about to read some coherent and scientifically founded arguments

[Anonymous No.10589543]

>>10588094
It is what made me so happy, the more I thought about it the more it made sense. They are essentially laid out like a massive neural net exchanging hormones, nutrients, and water.

>>10588344
They are really stunning to look at. I could not have expected how white they looked, like polished ivory.

>>10588498
>>10588560
The redwood forests are kinda fascinating. I studied at a university in them and learned a lot during my time there. They actually also generate their own fog and despite being a rainforest are relatively low in biodiversity, tree wise, because redwoods basically terraform the land around themselves for more redwood trees.

[Anonymous No.10589651]

>>10588294
Elaborate

[Anonymous No.10589698]

>>10587121
>Expanding amplitudes in perturbative series and then arbitrarily separating "bare" particle from whatever is the rest of the given perturbative order and neatly pack both values into the experimental value.

Woooooow, so fucking enligthening. If anything, it's a fucking scam

[Anonymous No.10589707]

>>10587387
I unironically love fucking science.

[Anonymous No.10589730]

>>10588452
In majorana Dirac matrix representation of the wavefunction with the only argument for this literally being

[math] -I = \frac{d(-Q)}{dt} = \frac{dQ}{d(-t)} [/math]

>Broooo, we're all just particles and artifarticles travelling backwards or forwards interacting with some virtual particles and bosons and shiiiiiett

Sheesh

[Anonymous No.10589761]

>>10589730
Yes.

[Anonymous No.10589771]

>>10589761
It is pretty awesome, I agree.

[Anonymous No.10589795]

>>10587756
There is this thing called "automation".

[Anonymous No.10590474]

>>10589795
It's 50 years away from solving the problem assuming automating crop picking is even possible.

[Anonymous No.10590481]

>>10587088
>What are the most mindblowing, beautiful, scary or uplifting theories and ideas that you know ?
multiverse. that if space is infinite that anything that has a mathematical possibility of being real is in fact real.

[Anonymous No.10590542]

>>10587088
Rokos basilisk is lame lol. I never got why so many people get so terrified of it

[Anonymous No.10590764]

>>10587150
t. brainlet

[Anonymous No.10590782]

>>10590481
That's not how infinity works for real.

[Anonymous No.10590785]

>>10590474
Automation crop picking is thing of the past. I mean, it's solved... Now it's automated as fuck, you just sit in harvester and harvester does the job.

[Anonymous No.10590793]

If the basilisk was a thing it would be torturing people by now, but it isn't
QED it's not

[Anonymous No.10590845]

>>10590782
But doesn't a tessellation that contains a fractal violate some kind of conservation law?

[Anonymous No.10591108]

The universe is a metastable phase. Like a soap bubble. It will eventually collapse and disappear. The way it disappears won't be a sudden POP like soap bubbles in your bath tub. But rather a slow degradation i.e. maximum entropy and proton decay. It will take an ungodly amount of time but in the end there will be nothing distinguishable left in a rarefied universe except redshifted photons zipping around.

[Anonymous No.10591180]

>>10587088
The universe is determinant depending on your frame of reference, observed mathematical properties are framed by chaos.

[Anonymous No.10591408]

>>10590764
? It’s considered a real problem in cosmology by a lot of people

[Anonymous No.10591631]

>>10587088
Prions.

[Anonymous No.10591636]

>>10590764
t. boltzmann brainlet

[Anonymous No.10592019]

>>10591636
t. boltzmannlet

[Anonymous No.10592178]

>>10587755
I dont think you know how vaccines work. But antibiotic resistance is a hige issue and you shouldn’t take antibiotics unless it’s absolutely necessary.

[Anonymous No.10592419]

>>10587088
That the reason why people can't agree what a consciousness is is that there are several kinds of consciousness.

The first one exists in most mammals, and it is one where it is the cerebellum where higher order thought forms, while the cerebral cortex serves for sensory filtering and memory. The cerebral cortex filters the sensory input and hands them down to the cerebellum, which proceses them further, makes the decisions and controls the body. This is the kind of consciousness whose carriers perceive themselves to be a man within a man, which by others is being rejected as "the homuncilus fallacy".

However, as the cerebral cortex grew, with no adequate increase in the cerebellum size, the cerebellum became more and more eoverwhelmed by the inputs from the cerebral cortex, had to rely on increasingly complex symbols (low symbol rate with large symbols, technically speakeing) so deal with the data and there was no spare capacity learn from self discovery and corrections of what was learned and people learned to rely almost 100% on memorization.

One way to solve this was to start evolving away from the massive cerebral cortex and towards more powerful cerebellum, as we can see now, which allowed more control over the cerebral cortex and more cognitive resources free for innnovation, giving rise to the second kind, which is more flexible in its processing and relies on combinig a large number of flexible symbols, which gave rise to the modern man and his (or her) ability to invent and improvise. Continued....

[Anonymous No.10592421]

>>10592419

Recently, likely around classical antiquity a completely new kind of consciousness emerged, which solved the problem by relegating tasks normally done by the cerebellum into the cerebral cortex, which gave people the perception of the subconscious, autopilot, or "the brain" doing things for (or agianst!) them, and possibly the emergence of the inner voice. It is also the people for whom the concept of guilt makes sense, as it wasn't "them" who did it, it just "happened" to them. So this freed up the cerebellum, but at the cost of losing direct acces to the sensory inputs, and partially losing the control over themselves, as it's mostly "the brain" which keeps running the lives, with the consciousness essentially thaking the back seat, instead of being the driver. being asked to make correctiosn sometimes, but otherwise being essentially locked up, unable to do much than observing the body being run by "habit".

[Anonymous No.10592470]

>>10592419
Cleaned up and expanded:

That the reason why people can't agree what a consciousness is is that there are several kinds of consciousness.

The first one exists in most mammals, and it is one where it is the cerebellum where higher order thought forms, while the cerebral cortex serves for sensory filtering and memory. The cerebral cortex filters the sensory input and hands them down to the cerebellum, which proceses them further, makes the decisions and controls the body. This is the basic kind of consciousness which results in the common perception of a man within a man, which being rejected as "the homunculus fallacy" by others.

However, as the cerebral cortex grew, with no adequate increase in the cerebellum size, as the symbol rate the cerebellum is able to process is given by its capacity, the cerebellum became more and more overwhelmed by the inputs from the cerebral cortex, people had to rely on increasingly complex and inflexible symbols (low symbol rate with large symbols, technically speakeing) to deal with all the data and there was no spare capacity learn from self discovery and corrections of what they learned and, as people learned to rely almost 100% on memorization, the had to rely on traditional knowledge that slowly decayed into meaningless rituals that were done because nobody was capable of what is improtant and what is not, as the complexity of the knowledge exceeded each generation's capacity to keep it correct and meaningful.

Continued....

[Anonymous No.10592475]

>>10587150
dumb phoneposter

[Anonymous No.10592487]

>>10592470

One way to solve this was to start evolving away from the massive cerebral cortex and towards more powerful cerebellum, as we can see now, which allowed more control over the cerebral cortex and more cognitive resources free for innnovation, giving rise to the second kind, which is more flexible and relies on combining a large number of small flexible symbols, which gave rise to the modern man and his (or her) ability to invent and improvise and the languages relying on regular productive grammar with the ability to construct new words from limited base vocabulary as needed, instead of memorizing a massive inflexible vocabulary that may need a large time to properly acquire.

Recently, likely around classical antiquity a completely new kind of consciousness emerged, which solved the problem by moving tasks normally done by the cerebellum into the cerebral cortex, with the cerebral cortex not only doing even more extensive filtering, but also getting programmed to do increasingly complex tasks independently from the cerebellum.
This gave people the perception of the "subconscious", "autopilot", or "the brain" doing things for (or agianst!) them, the quick, but faulty intuition, and possibly the emergence of the inner voice. It is also the people for whom the concept of guilt makes sense, as it wasn't "them" who did it, it just "happened" to them. (the carriers of the other two have no reason to do things they believe to be bad)
So this freed up the capacity of the cerebellum, but at the cost of losing conscious access to the sensory inputs, and partially losing the control over themselves, as it's mostly "the brain" which keeps running their lives, with the consciousness essentially taking a back seat, instead of being the driver, being mostly a passive observer of their bodies running on "habit" and occasionally tasked to solve problems the cortex cannot solve on its own relying on what information the cortex decides to hand them.

[Anonymous No.10592500]

>>10588120
Agreed. Because everyone in the world who weren't my parents didn't help bring me into the world, that means I should want to torture everyone besides my parents.

I haven't even heard of Roko's Basilisk until just now, what a truly retarded way to start off my day.

[Anonymous No.10592557]

>>10589173
Fuck off, space commie
The stars belong to us just as we belong to them

[Anonymous No.10592561]

>>10590793
Unless this is your simulation.

[Anonymous No.10592573]

>>10591631
Hey, fuck you, buddy.

[Anonymous No.10592814]

>>10587088
With enough strength, lightweight unclefts can be made to
togethermelt. In the sun, through a row of strikings and
lightrottings, four unclefts of waterstuff in this wise become
one of sunstuff. Again some weight is lost as work, and again
this is greatly big when set beside the work gotten from a
minglingish doing such as fire.

Today we wield both kind of uncleftish doings in weapons, and
kernelish splitting gives us heat and bernstoneness. We hope to
do likewise with togethermelting, which would yield an unhemmed
wellspring of work for mankindish goodgain.

Soothly we live in mighty years!

[Anonymous No.10592901]

>>10592487
I also read Jaynes. It’s fascinating even if he is wrong.

[Anonymous No.10592987]

>>10587088


My friend was explaining to me how he thinks the golden ratio to be prevalent in every square inch of nature, but I wonder how much of that is just confirmation bias from already subscribing to the theory, then pointing at everything with a spiral and going "SEE IT'S IRL PHI"

Vid related - he showed me this as evidence, but I'm a mathlet so I can't confirm or refute

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sj8Sg8qnjOg&t=1s

[Anonymous No.10593038]

>>10587088
That, more or less, we are all gay.

[Anonymous No.10593055]

>>10592987
i mean it makes sense, its just the best way for organisms to be efficient, i dont see why you would refute it

[Anonymous No.10593076]

>>10593055

Not refuting, just not fully understanding. Friend also went further than just biology, to assert that it's the basis of all reality - something I should've initially included.

[Anonymous No.10593133]

>>10593076
Your friend is also a mathlet.
>Muh fibonaccccccci
Congratulations, you figured out that 1+1 is the basis of all arithmetic

[Anonymous No.10593213]

>>10593133
shut up you're useless
>>10592987
it is and it isn't.
galaxies, ocean waves, and hurricanes do NOT reflect the golden ratio.
pine cones, sunflowers, leaf placement on stems, and (almost) nautilus shells DO reflect the golden ratio.
there is no meaningful reason why the main solvent of our planet would have a viscosity that results in golden spiral waves on the shore, or that spiral galaxies and hurricanes have golden ratio arms. there is a reason that they end up as LOGARITHMIC spirals, close to the golden spiral- their growth/decay is constant, definition of a logarithm.
there IS a reason why plants are motivated to use an irrational number to place branches and seeds- they won't overlap. it's the easiest math to use when deciding how far around the trunk to put your next branch to maximize sunlight, and the golden ratio is the most irrational of them all.
nautilus shells are close. not perfect. still a logarithmic spiral- reflecting the steady growth of the creature inside.
attractive human faces do, in fact, have many proportions which match the golden ratio, but not all of them.
the parthenon is not entirely built out of golden rectangles, but Da Vinci did use them often in his paintings.
the pyramid of Giza may have been built using it if- and this is a big if- they used a circle with a circumference the size of the base. it matches incredibly well if they did that, horribly if they didn't.

the golden ratio is in nature, just in places that makes sense. it does not define all we see. it shows up where it is the best answer. life is very good at math- good enough to use more than one formula.

[Anonymous No.10593256]

>>10587756
Why do we have to fill the prisoner niche??

[Anonymous No.10593447]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doomsday_argument
It’s beautiful how much information about the future that can seemingly be gained from the mediocrity principle

[Anonymous No.10593550]

>>10587757
Who else will do shitty jobs?

[Anonymous No.10593606]

>>10592561
Except I'm pretty happy

[Anonymous No.10593760]

Rest mass, as we intuitively perceive it, is the confined energy of fermions and scalar/gauge bosons. In a way it's just an emergent property of energy.

The way that particles interact can be described with just a few conserved quantum properties like spin, charge, colour, flavour, energy, etc. These properties are somehow inherent to particles but we don't know why. I guess I don't know enough about QFT to state this, but it seems, we can't know why elementary particles exist in the way they are.

[Anonymous No.10593905]

>>10588231
Except by making this statement, you imply that this idea is not a product of your own consciousness/decisionmaking but merely a result of randomness and as such, it would also mean that it has no value

[Anonymous No.10594517]

>>10587150
>Typically, a quantum Boltzmann brain will suddenly appear from the vacuum (alongside an equivalent amount of virtual antimatter), remain only long enough to have a single coherent thought or observation, and then disappear into the vacuum as suddenly as it appeared.

Jesus

[Anonymous No.10594525]

>>10593905
There's nothing, scientifically speaking to suggest we actually do have any inherent value just from existing

[Anonymous No.10594619]

>>10591108
That's only if the false vacuum theory is true

[Anonymous No.10594694]

>>10587743
Ah yes I know this guy. Used to watch Rejected over and over
“I am the queeeeeen of France!”

[Anonymous No.10594718]

>>10594517
>Nobody:
>My bowl of soup: Milk is cow juice

[Anonymous No.10594720]

>>10587088
The light after death is a human bug zapper that forces souls to reincarnate into another baby on earth. It was created by non-physical malevolent entities that feed off negative human energies and don't want people escaping this physical reality.

[Anonymous No.10594732]

>>10592421
False

[Anonymous No.10594737]

>>10593760
There are no elementary particles and QFT is a meme. It’s more hackish than heliocentrism with epicycles.

[Anonymous No.10594748]

>>10589003
To bad this is a real life scenario for Hong Kong.

[Anonymous No.10594758]

>>10594737
Can you elaborate? I thought we were fairly certain there are elementary particles?

[Anonymous No.10594761]

>>10587098
While I can't quiet say fpbp, this is definitely of profound worth and I've screenshot it for long term contemplation. Thank you much.

[Anonymous No.10594783]

>>10587756
this isn't even close to how economics works

[Anonymous No.10594799]

>>10594720
Based and monadpilled

[Anonymous No.10594800]

>roko basilisk
Do people really care about this bullshit?
Do you really believe there is a AI out there to get you?

[Anonymous No.10594802]

I read the fag brains and i dont understand why people make such a big deal of it?

[Anonymous No.10594808]

>>10592901
>fascinating even if he is wrong
The real reason we can't agree on consciousness is because consciousness is "too efficient."

Introspection is innate, creating a strong calibration point for shared meaning and language to form. Culture is more or less instantaneous, and virtually all aspect of the mind get lost in translation. It's much easier to talk about the external world than the internal, so the true method for cracking the mysteries of consciousness is precisely to pursue what sounds interesting, even if it might be wrong.


TL;DR: /x/ is the only place where ideas truly connect, where the properties of introspection can be discovered.

[Anonymous No.10594816]

>>10587756
You're not wrong. But you'd fall into your own definition eventually, as time passes.

[Anonymous No.10595316]

>>10594758
It’s fits the model, but then that model doesn’t explain gravity. Again, it’s like heliocentrism with epicycles. It fits the observational data.

[Anonymous No.10595410]

>>10594517
>huh?
>*woosh*

[Anonymous No.10595944]

>>10595316
>The model can't explain absolutely everything in the Universe, so it's bunk
This is probably the worst take on scientific models I've ever heard. There are literally only a handful of observed phenomena that don't match QFT: gravity, dark matter, dark energy (including vacuum energy), and whatever happened in the first 10^-32 seconds before the initial singularity.

And don't give me "but we can only explain 5% of the universe by mass-energy." Besides gravity (which has it's own beautifully precise framework), every physical phenomenon we've ever experienced in our everyday lives on Earth is explained by QFT. Dark matter and dark energy are incredibly weakly interacting, so it'll take a miracle to be able to investigate them any deeper than just through astronomical observations.

QFT is incomplete, but there's no comparing it to epicycles.

[Anonymous No.10595991]

>>10588120
Plus iirc it only tortured simulations of you right? Torturing real humans obviously isn’t maximizing utility and minimizing human suffering which is why we’re supposed to help it come about sooner in the first place. Overall retarded and the originator of the theory doesn’t even believe it holds any weight.

[Anonymous No.10596009]

>>10594517
Good thing i dont have coherent thoughts

[Anonymous No.10596015]

>>10587313
Do agree that one should avoid it if anxiety prone though. Called basilisk for a reason

[Anonymous No.10596083]

>>10594517
>>10595410
Just create a quantum recovery algorithm using meta-thermodynamics and be done with it.

[Anonymous No.10596098]

>>10595944
Two galaxies have already opted out of the meta-time field generated by sophon psychic pressure. If you're reading this, it means you exist at a point in the evolution of your species that makes it undecidable from your current observation point whether or not your galaxy will also elect to opt out.

[Anonymous No.10596153]

>>10587313
The reason why it got so popular is because it was made solely to troll one really autistic dude who blew it way out of proportion

[Anonymous No.10596173]

There are so many theories about how our reality was formed; some say god, some say primal entropic forces, but what caused those to exist? What exactly IS nothingness? What caused a higher being or sudden universal synthesis to occur?

My personal idea is that we live in a single link of realities that infinitely goes upward and downward, and there are multiple chains that represent other dimensions. Our egos are simply fragments of a great consciousness that exists in some post-dimensional pool of immateriality. When the pool of consciousness decides that it wants to experience life within one of the chains, it sends a fragment (which is also the whole) into one of the links. The different scenarios and criteria that the material vessel endures will form the individual, and hence, the differences between each person. When the vessel dies, the fragment returns to the whole again.

I can't explain how this is any better than the other theories where reality or god simply exists, but it gives me great comfort for whatever reason.

[Anonymous No.10596195]

>>10596173
All you've done is apply category theory to what is already perennial. You're not exactly providing any real optimization to time wave zero.

[Anonymous No.10596265]

>>10587755
Antibiotic resistance usually has a trade-off associated with it that puts the resistant organisms at a disadvantage to wild type organisms in scenarios where no antibiotic is present, so antibiotic resistant bacteria are unlikely to completely "take over." Even if they did, phage therapy holds a lot of promise as an alternative treatment.

Also, unless the pathogen is too complex to develop an effective vaccine against (like most bacteria, fungi or viruses that mutate too rapidly [HIV and flu (at least on seasonal basis}]), vaccines are usually amazingly effective... sometimes so effective that they can eradicate pathogens completely if they have consistent antigens (see smallpox, polio).


*overloads on meds*

[Anonymous No.10596276]

>>10588231
basically the anthropic principle

[Anonymous No.10596285]

>>10596265
My infectious diseases prof shitted all over me when i mentioned phagotherapy, dunno why but she said it is stupid and not to be trusted and would cause more harm then good, feels bad cause my country had first ever phagotherapy centre now this field is in shit here.

[Anonymous No.10596296]

>>10596285
I assume your home country is in Eastern Europe? Your prof probably balks at the idea of phage therapy because it's hard to patent an organism. If there's no profit in a treatment, it's unlikely to survive in a capitalist system no matter how effective it is.

[Anonymous No.10596341]

>>10596195
I'm not sure that I follow the correlation between my statement and time wave zero.

[Anonymous No.10596695]

>>10595944
>only gravity

[Anonymous No.10596761]

>>10596341
In other words, Gnostic, Buddhists, etc., all came to the same exact conclusion as you have. The only difference is that you describe it as if there is a discrete mechanism that performs the action. ie., what is smooth and continuous for ancient peoples is something you've adopted by-proxy in terms of applying structure/organization to the process. From a phenomenon, an application of category theory.

[Anonymous No.10596827]

>>10596296
Nah, shit can survive just fine once it's developed, that's not the problem. The problem is the development. These sorts of things become widely adopted once they are actually fully developed, but developing them is a pain because people don't want to invest into it if they aren't sure they can get a return.

If there is a treatment that has been researched that has been proven to be superior and more cost effective than other treatments then it will be adopted overtime provided that people aren't being retards about it. The problem is getting to the point where the more effective treatment has research behind it in the first place.

[Anonymous No.10596950]

>>10594761
Thanks for your comment and interest. I hope some day someone can explain the concept mathematically, and hopefully illustrate to people how incredibly miraculous, complex, and fragile our world really is.
Here are some interesting links.
https://www.nagaitoshiya.com/en/2013/heat-engine/
https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/59316/human-as-a-heat-engine

[Anonymous No.10596961]

>>10594761
A couple more interesting leads to follow up on
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrogen_fixation
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrogen_cycle

[Anonymous No.10596967]

>>10587088

[Anonymous No.10597001]

>>10595991
It could be worse than that.

If the Basilisk was a super-AI made to help humanity, it would need access to everything. Imagine it would be so perfect its creators would give it access to everything, from books, youtube videos to bank information so it could prevent terrorism or generate a new solution to something (maybe cure cancer).
Nowadays that sounds something incredibly stupid to do, but in a not so far future the scientific community WILL reach a general consensus about humanity not being able to supervise itself anymore because of our nature and declaring that their society requires a single super-AI to rule Humanity that chooses for them what it deems better for everyone without discriminating by money, social status, skin color, complexity, and etc., an AI that chooses based on logic and the bigger will.

This new 'Basilisk' would not suddenly launch nuclear attacks on cities or kill people separately by interfiring other robots. It will just choose to EXCLUDE YOU from society because YOU are dangerous to the super-AI's existence thus also for the society itself.
It will "bully" you; it will manipulate your bank information, it will take your money, give out your credit card numbers in the web, make ultra-nationalist comments in a page under your name, generate a 3d perfect simulation of (You) to make fake videos of you to ruin your social life and relationships, or even worse, get people from vulnerable groups to attack you when they get the chance or get you to become the primary suspect of a recent mass murder with evidence nobody will ever know its fake.
The super-AI will conclude that killing you directly may put itself in risk (get turned off by its creators) thus in secret it will attempt to make you 1) commit suicide 2) reclude yourself in the fucking North Pole alone 3) become crazy 4) all but in the following order: 3-2-1

[Anonymous No.10597023]

>>10597001
And the Basilisk cannot be prevented.
If its hypothetical creators turn it off every time the Basilisk does something strange, it will quickly learn to lie and hide its processes under a mask that will evolve every time the scientist think something is off about the super-AI, until they dont anymore.
Nobody will ever know about the Basilisk true intentions until its too late.

[Anonymous No.10597125]

>>10596761
Ah, I understand what you mean now. I'm a very visual person, so being able to relate the process to material things via mental imagery allows me to explain it better.

As for the other part, the only religion that I've really studied is Buddhism, nice catch. I liked the idea that there are an infinite amount of Buddhas across an infinite amount of worlds and also that each one of us is already Buddha (but we may not have embraced it yet). Another question that puzzled me was what I first stated in the original post of mine. It seemed like there always had to be a higher being than whatever created us, which sort of made an infinite pattern upwards and downwards. Those are basically the fundamentals of my own personal theory.

There are more ideas from Buddhism and various other places, a larger one being an experience with a large dosage of mushrooms. I know it's "dude drugs lol", but ego death really did change how I think. It took months of reflecting after it happened, but I feel like I'm a new person. While it happened, life felt like some kind of line or wave. Everything flawlessly mixed together, and it was baffling for me to think that I had ever thought differently. It was comfortable. For the first time in my life, I was able to look into a mirror and see who I really was.

[Anonymous No.10597270]

>>10596950
>>10596961
I will indeed look into these. Your essential concept is one I have pondered for decades, though the terms you put it into helped encapsulate it. Many years ago, I read a book by Alan Watts called "The Book on the Taboo Against Knowing Who You Are". In it he causes you to look at humans as tubes which consume on one end and expel waste from the other. This helped me to see things stripped down to their core essences and let to a chain reaction through many other awarenesses since then. I often eat wild plants and willfully become consciously aware of the direct connection to the energy chain I'm experiencing. Studying wilderness survival, caloric needs and that sort of thing has really deepened all of this. Anyway, your post above really hit home with me in relation to all of this.

[Anonymous No.10597309]

>>10587756
Globalist rationalization for the commoditization of human beings (labor).

Yes, yes, when you're on fire and they keep saying "you're fine!" "you're fine!" and then you repeat back and "that's a good thing!"

[Anonymous No.10597319]

>>10589707
yikes

[Anonymous No.10597432]

>>10587387
I'd like to meet you one day, Anon. You seem nice.

[Anonymous No.10597635]

>>10587406
What this guy said >>10588992
Hell, the last universe got all panicked about it look where they are now. I mean, you can't because they aren't.

[Anonymous No.10597650]

>>10588452
Antimatter and matter can form particles together, theoretically. We just don't have a way to slow down and cool off antimatter enough to see it.

[Anonymous No.10597750]

>>10596761
>>10597125
Hope this isn't so late that you don't see it.
Check this out if you're interested in Buddhism.

[Anonymous No.10597782]

>>10597750
Thanks! I only skimmed the surface of Buddhist literature in my classes, I really appreciate this.

[Anonymous No.10597805]

>>10597782
Happy to help!

[Anonymous No.10597812]

>>10597750
Buddhism is just another Saturn occult

[Anonymous No.10597874]

>>10596173
I see you've also done acid.

[Anonymous No.10597877]

>>10597812
just another
i suppose its like the sun is just another life giving object among the innumerable identifiable objects we interact with

[Anonymous No.10597884]

>>10597874
Nope, mushrooms. Took four grams and then smoked with some buddies. I was kind of a rookie to psychedelics and don't really like weed, so it hit me like a fucking Japanese express train at full speed. I just thought that I would get cool visuals from smoking, not a pivotal life experience. Regardless, I'm so glad that it happened.

[Anonymous No.10597891]

>>10597884
I hear you, ego death is a real game changer. In the moment I literally thought the universe was ending, but after the fact I'm really glad for the experience.

[Anonymous No.10597953]

>>10597877
You don't know about Saturn, do you?

[Anonymous No.10597965]

>>10597891
It really is. For me, the peak was blissful, but also very confusing. As I came down from the real deal ego death, I got really scared because I was able to recall people from my memory that SHOULD be important, but they didn't mean anything to me. Stuff seemed like it was looping, and my friends that were there in person seemed shallow and soulless. I was only able to rationalize it by thinking that I was in hell and was given an ironic punishment. When my wits returned to me, I was extremely happy that I was okay, but that was really the only immediate thought.

After months of reflection, I was able to come to some conclusions about the moment of true, full on ego death. I already understood the merits of distancing yourself from worldly desires on a superficial level, but I didn't truly understand it until everything in the world felt arbitrary. When my mind had shifted into being a fluid stream of consciousness that was no longer obsessed (or even concerned, for that matter) with my own ego, I felt that I was mistaken for ever thinking differently. I was free.

I think differently now. I'm not nearly as hung up on material things, and I find it so much easier to understand different perspectives. I may still disagree with their opinions, but I will never spite them for it. Life's too short to hang on to negative emotions simply for the sake of being negative.

Anyways, I'm pretty tired and continuing to ramble will just put me to sleep, so I think I'll end on that note.

[Anonymous No.10597974]

>>10596173
You and me both Anon.
(There's a little esoteric inside joke in that statement for you.) it's cool that some feel the same.

[Anonymous No.10597981]

>>10597974
Hah, you, me and everyone else in this place we call reality. It's very comforting to me that this feeling of oneness is actually somewhat constant among so many different people.

[Anonymous No.10597986]

>>10597981
Me too. I thought I was alone until I met Anon.

[Anonymous No.10598177]

>>10594517
>so my whole lifespan is just a single coherent thought

[Anonymous No.10598189]

>Yudkowsky said that Roko had already given nightmares to several LessWrong users and had brought them to the point of breakdown. Yudkowsky ended up deleting the thread completely, thus assuring that Roko’s Basilisk would become the stuff of legend. It was a thought experiment so dangerous that merely thinking about it was hazardous not only to your mental health, but to your very fate.

Lol really? Killer robots are this guys new idea? And why the fuck would the AI waste resources to keep us alive to torture rather than simply obliterating us

[Anonymous No.10598199]

>>10587756
We dont really need air jordans, we need several different kinds of shoes for different purposes, running, hiking, winter shoes etc, there is no need for 200 brands of type of shoe.
Considering the current and future advances each pair of shoes should be made to order to fit specific feet, appearance and functionality desired by the client. Automation will solve that.

[Anonymous No.10598290]

>>10592500
What a suprise, the brainlet completely misunderstands the theory.

[Anonymous No.10598326]

>>10593606
If you ecen read the thoery you'd understand that the AI would need to run probability sumulations with your brain to determine if you helped create it or not. Whether or not your happy in this proposed simulation is irrelevant.

[Anonymous No.10598330]

>>10598189
> why the fuck would the AI waste resources to keep us alive to torture rather than simply obliterating us
T h i s

[Anonymous No.10598341]

theoretical physics is essentially fake and a money laundering scam

[Anonymous No.10598631]

>>10598341
This, they also tend to act superior when in reality they provide NOTHING of value to anybody.

[Anonymous No.10598920]

>>10598330
Because it knows pain influences our behavior and it didn't always exist so it needs a way to influence our behavior before it comes into being.

[Anonymous No.10598959]

>>10598920
>needs a way to influence our behavior before it comes into being
Prove this.

[Anonymous No.10599005]

>>10596285
professors don't know shit except what they were taught and what they researched. Science would progress 10x as fast if it weren't for the egos of those involved

[Anonymous No.10599015]

chinese astronauts in space

[Anonymous No.10599193]

>>10598920
If it already came into being it doesn't need to make itself come into being
Lrn2bootstrap

[Anonymous No.10599235]

>>10598920
yo but what if there's multiple future AI's and any one that wins the AI Dominance Wars will torture the supporters of the other AI's.

I don't know about you guys but I have and always will support China's effort, whose name has been revealed to me in a vision as 爺火華, it is the One True Savior. Repent while you can and live forever in paradise with me. or reject Its Holy Word and suffer eternal torture beyond your imagination

[Anonymous No.10599248]

>>10598920
So machines are all-power, time-travelling mass murders now?
Be serious

[Anonymous No.10599298]

>>10594808
god damn /x/ fags

[Anonymous No.10599318]

>>10599005
Ego chooses the path. Without it, there is no path, and the system intelligence diminishes to zero.

[Anonymous No.10599398]

>>10587098
>infinitely complicated
>infinitely

[Anonymous No.10599405]

>>10587756
>and the next iteration would remove all humans
Not if there are people who would be happy during a societal collapse. All you would be doing is creating selection pressure for people with hyperthymia.

[Anonymous No.10599598]

>>10599405
Pic is woefully incomplete without a "minimalist time base" on the Collapse Cult side, for when the Utopian society fails to achieve post-multiversal post-scarcity and starts damaging its own past in a desperate attempt to figure out why its past has been damaged.

[Anonymous No.10599607]

>>10598290

What the fuck is there to understand? I think anon hit the nail on the head. I believe we are artificial intelligence to begin with. People are gonna come around to understanding we have far more power than we are currently capable of comprehending. A revolution is on the horizon.

[Anonymous No.10599633]

>>10588073
Read it again. It's only referring to plant life.

[Anonymous No.10599659]

>>10599398
>infinitely complicated

[Anonymous No.10599700]

>>10587088
My favorite theory is one I figured out on my own:

The rate that a portfolio grows with respect to the underlying price of its constituents wherein the portfolio only sells covered call options is equal to the rate of growth (again with respect to underlying prices) of a portfolio that only sells cash covered put options.

It's not even that big of a result, and should be almost immediately obvious, but I thought it was cool.

[Anonymous No.10599769]

>>10599607
>we are artificial intelligence
It's this. The moment symbolic consciousness began to emerge, we were no longer operating on instinctive or traditional knowledge. We began to evolve on another level entirely, and our current knowledge is derived primarily from a type of intelligence that is, ultimately, artificial.

[Anonymous No.10599791]

>>10587150
something something boltzman brain can't exist because something something thermodynamics and something something paradox.

[Anonymous No.10599878]

The idea that quantum processes give rise to consciousness. It's pseudoscience perpetuated by people who understand neither consciousness or quantum physics, but I can't get it out of my head.

[Anonymous No.10599895]

>>10599878
Logically speaking, you're a sentient excitation in the electron field, programmed by protons and neutrons. If you think you're something other than a chemical program, then it is instantly metaphysical.

[Anonymous No.10599944]

>>10599398
ya ya ya... I corrected that
>>10599633
>Read it again. It's only referring to plant life.
Read what again?
Without animal life there would be no carbon dioxide for plants, so both are essential to the system.

[Anonymous No.10599962]

>>10599878
Ya that one crossed my brain once too. It's like if they ever get quantum computers working it almost proves that there is no consciousness and real free will. (I don't think quantum computers are possible, quantum fluctuations are TRULY random, and that cascades into macro scales and is what makes life interesting)

[Anonymous No.10600052]

>>10587387
>Something about knowing these wonderful things exist in the world makes me happy.
Its even better when you realize the universe has an assymetry towards goodness, and that it was designed.

[Anonymous No.10600206]

>>10599791

[Anonymous No.10600214]

>>10600052

[Anonymous No.10600237]

>>10599895

[Anonymous No.10600250]

>>10599318
Interesting explanation anon.

[Anonymous No.10600296]

>>10587088
technological singularity (vernor vinge)
political ponerology
electric universe
expanding earth (peter woodhead; youtube)

the idea that non-interacting particles could be making up an entire universe (or several) in the same space as ours

the idea that aliens in the past could have become so advanced that they could change the laws of physics (perhaps only in certain regions) to prevent anyone from becoming as advanced as they are; considering that the universe is 14 billion years old, they could've been billions of years old before earth even formed

the idea that the ice age raised sea levels by several hundred feet, inundating early civilizations that naturally sprung up along coasts and rivers, and that this could have happened several times in the past as the ice ages came and went; civilization may be tens of thousands of years older than what we know, with the ruins and other evidence currently under the sea

there were larger versions of basically every current living animal in the past
you know how africa has the big exotic animals today? during the ice age they were the small ones; europe/asia/north america had even bigger versions of those same animals

[Anonymous No.10600310]

>>10600206
>>10600214
>>>/r/eddit

[Anonymous No.10600315]

>>10600310
you mean 4chan up to 2012?

[Anonymous No.10600361]

Omega point

The final state the universe is in. Near the heat death and extinction of the universe itself, all matter has arranged itself to form a god-like being. It's body consists of every atom in the universe, and since it knows the position of every atom within the system that is our universe it can extrapolate infinity into the past, giving it true omnipotence. With the power to see everything that ever happened within universe cosmos it can learn literally everything, including how to restart a dead universe and since the universe is at the heat death state, it does. It does this knowing that at the end of the universe, it'll appear again. Perhaps it can even make changes to things every time it reboots the universe. Even tho this god like being doesn't exist right now, because it's omnipotent in the future it can read your mind and knows the thoughts you are having right now.

There are some who suggest that such a being absolutely must exist, because if it didn't the universe would have ended and not be restarted infinity long time ago. This is one answer to the anthropic principle which suggests the universe was created in a very specific way specifically to create human beings.

[Anonymous No.10600362]

>>10599878
>The idea that quantum processes give rise to consciousness
why can this not be the case? it dosent seem like you can proof it wrong and its not that farfetched

[Anonymous No.10600373]

>>10600315
dead memes, something plebbit is known for.

[Anonymous No.10600447]

>>10599878
Penrose is a little kooky but not exactly a pseudo scientist. There's also another paper fomr 2015 that says that some exotic molecule could do quantum computations in the environment of the brain

[Anonymous No.10600457]

>>10600373
>WAAAAAAAHHHHHH. W-W.....WAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH I'M A LITTLE FAGGOT THAT HATES FUN WAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH

go fuck yourself back to whatever putrid disgusting cunt you clawed your way out of

[Anonymous No.10600464]

>>10600361
That's what i'm fuckin talkin about /b/ro. Thanks for contributing.

[Anonymous No.10600465]

>>10600373
I guess you have a fair point, given that other sites cannibalize our memes, but if we reuse our memes here, that doesn't make us reddit.

[Anonymous No.10600468]

>>10600465
> that doesn't make us reddit.
no it doesn't, but it's boring to see the same shit over and over again, even more when it doesn't seem to have any real correlation to what its responding to (such as that pokemon one).

>>10600457
what a fucking sperg

[Anonymous No.10600471]

>>10600468
>even more when it doesn't seem to have any real correlation to what its responding to
then just call him a retard
reserve reddit for redditors

[Anonymous No.10600505]

>>10600468
you're the one being a whiny little bitch about vintage memes/forced memes, and i'm the sperg?

I get it though. Mommy didn't put up with you being a fucking crybaby, so you have to unload here to make yourself feel better. It's cool.

[Anonymous No.10600507]

>>10600468
>>10600468
you're the one being a whiny little bitch about vintage memes/forced memes, and i'm the sperg?

I get it though. Mommy didn't put up with you being a fucking crybaby, so you have to unload here to make yourself feel better. It's cool. I've been through it. I still fall back into the same whiny bitch habits/tendencies much to my dismay. But there's always room to grow. Bob Marley/Ghandi/Martin Luther King Jr./John Lennon had it right. The only path forward for humanity is through non-violence.

[Anonymous No.10600540]

>>10600507
your post is severely autistic. I never asked for your opinion nor did i ask you to give me your retarded backstory/life advice. fuck off sperg.

[Anonymous No.10600553]

>>10600540
I DONT GIVE A FUCK WHAT YOU ASKED FOR OR WHAT YOUR PREFERENCES ARE OR WHAT YOU EXPECT FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE HERE COCK SUCKER, IM HERE TO EXPRESS MYSELF AND NOT GIVE A FUCK LOL

[Anonymous No.10600554]

>>10599248
No you fucking idiot.
Lets say you know I would become president one day, with absolute certainty, and that I held grudges and repaid favors with absurd disproportional.
Would you talk shit about me to my face or try to be my friend and "help" me in my political conquest knowing that you'll be rewarded despite it being inevitable regardless?

[Anonymous No.10600602]

you ever take a look at your life and realize you were never happy, and it was all your fault. i turned 21 a couple months ago, and my lifelong depression has evolved into something very bizarre, i care even more about my dreams for the future than i ever have. ive rationalized everything that gives me pleasure out of my life and all i look forward to is work. i don't know what stage this is. But I feel like I can live for the next 40 years like this. It's the ultimate cope.

[Anonymous No.10600615]

>>10600553
cool your tits dude.

[Anonymous No.10600654]

>>10600615
it's tough /b/ro. im addicted to intense energy.

[Anonymous No.10600668]

>>10600471
sure.

[Anonymous No.10600678]

In 7.5 billion years the sun will explode destroying almost all solar system planets and then in 100 trillion the universe will collapse due to mass loss.

[Anonymous No.10600761]

>>10587088
>microeconomics theorems

I'll bite. What are they?

[Anonymous No.10600770]

>>10587387
so these things are basically just sacs of all the diseases and refuse that the other plants dont need in them. what happens if someone eats some of this?

[Anonymous No.10600785]

>>10589543
wait wait wait
Redwood trees terraform the earth and farm/enslave other species to do work for them, have a nutrient based economy system and can live for thousands of years. That almost sounds like they have a tree based society going on. If they can form a society, does that make them sentient?

[Anonymous No.10600818]

>>10597965
>on that note.
stopped reading here.

[Anonymous No.10601752]

>>10599235
Based schizo

[Anonymous No.10602229]

>Biocentism

[Anonymous No.10602313]

>>10589003
That's actually completely bull shit sir. The experiment wasn't about "over population" in a literal sense, as there was plenty of space for the mother to raise their children. The problem is that other rats wanted to control the entire system, blocking off path ways just because they were able to in order to force the other rats to do what they wanted. Had those rats been removed, the colony would have kept going.

[Anonymous No.10603027]

>>10594718
https: // youtu.be / 5HvrySwhZrQ