/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

>How does Cover respond to this
lol

>Hololive legacy leech vs. Actually being in Hololive.
>Doesn't get the benefits of protection from the zhangs while still being successful with the China gimping expansion.
I don't know bros. Seems like kson is the loser in all this.

Good luck being even half as relevant outside of holo, some of these girls are absolutely bland and need the Cover boost.

Ksonfags are retarded

>>11589465
She have more protection now, than she had in hololive, anon.

>>11589384
They respond by checking to see if Rushia is still the #1 superchatted channel in the world (she is) with little to no effort and then go back to what they were doing.

indies have been mogging hololive's models for over a year now

cover just doesn't want to pay $5k+ for 50+ models, that's all

>>11589384
The potential to cut their views to 1/4 or less only saved by having a brand new hi spec model

>>11589384
>How does Cover respond to this?
>the potential they have outside of Hololive

But you see our shitty models are actually good because muh numbers

>>11589532
>spend less
>make more
Yes, that's how business works.

>>11589384
>How does Cover respond to this?
They ignore it, as it doesn't need a response.

>>11589516
>>11589553
>don't ask questions just consume product and get excited for next products

Do you think people watch V-Tubers for a godly live 2D rig?
That's like a bonus if that.

>>11589584
Exactly, glad you're learning anon

>>11589584
Yes

>>11589384
yeah i bet all the girls wish they could use there own money to buy a new avatar? What? Why?

>>11589584
You'll learn one day, tatsunoko.

Cover is a brand. You trade in freedom and model quality for more recognition and visibility.

>>11589584
Asking questions has never changed anything. Stop parroting memes and thinking you're some kind of profound philosopher for doing so. Nobody watches Vtubers for the model.

>>11589647
I do.

>>11589510
op asked a good question, cover l2d technology is lacking, the amount of breaks, depression, health problems is rising in hololive. If Kson retain her viewers and God forbid have consistent 5k+ live views i would sweat as the project manager of hololive.
I don't predict graduations, but demoralization and lack of new content will.lewd to questions, and as they say, gras is always greener on the other side.

>>11589667
You have absolutely no proof backing up any of your statements. I'm astounded you even made this post, really.

>>11589647
Based corpos lowering the value of good looking and well rigged models

>>11589584
Like you're doing with this half assed "character" change?

one look at subaru's rigging should be enough to tell you hololive doesn't care

Tatsunotards are becoming more pathetic by the day

>>11589667
Okay ESL-kun

>>11589667

>>11589384
Dont expect anything from a Japanese company.

>>11589647
Oh okay cool, so they should all drop their models and just stream as their roommate then? We'd all still watch, right?

>>11589384
All that money just to sit in the corner of the screen and read through reddit, then read through reddit in a different language.

Holobros, why so insecure?

>>11589519
You have to factor in every costume as well.

>>11589881
No, by your logic they should all stream silent black screens with no title and chat turned off. Go be stupid somewhere else you fucking troglodyte.

>>11589911
This is what passes for content nowadays. Children eat it up.

>>11589384
falseflag making the same thread >>>11518827
although I think those who reply again the same as a day ago are more retarded.

>>11589881
Isn't that what kson does when she wants the big bucks? She's barely a vtuber.

It's a damn good model but it should be common knowledge you only see stuff like this in either
>Indies who have much more say in their models and are much more invested
>Small startups that need an edge.

Genuine question: why is so little effort/priority put into mouth rigging when most of the content comes from them talking? Is it difficult? Does it look weird when done accurately?

>>11589384
>How does Cover respond to this?
they don't
>seeing the potential they have outside of Hololive
90% of them would be 2views without hololive, literally zero talent.

>>11589384
A new outfit is a much better investment than being able to turn a few extra degrees in each direction. Nobody cares that much for L2D animation, at least not nearly as much as they care for the appeal of the art itself.

>>11589384
>weak_bait.png

>>11590132
It's difficult to make a 2D character look like they're speaking properly when mouth movements are 3D. Really off the top of my head I think Bea has the best 2D mouth movements and I have no idea how she did it.

It's the rigger that controls how much their tits bounce when they move right? Then why the hell didn't they give Sana's model to Kronii's rigger?

>>11590132
Not every rigger is good at it

>>11590265
>Rig nice tit movement
>Talent only streams from the shoulders-up
Many such cases.

>>11589384
>the potential they have outside of Hololive
>No formal game sponsors
>No advertising on TCG, convenience store chain, restaurants, fucking national baseball league
>No record deals into top Oricon charts.
Sure, a good model went along way but having your voice televised on national television and your chuuba persona represented major sports team is something else entirely.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04MrPb_Ub7c

>>11590099
There are no en startups with a model like that but I'm sure VShojo will be the first one to retaliate with upgrades

>>11589465
>Cover
>protection

>>11589881
>muh absolutes

>>11590350
This is basically all Hololive offers plus social networking.
Worse models and less freedom for more marketing and access to collab with other hololive members.

>>11590350
Baseball sponsor won't mean much to those not involved.

>>11589584

This is exactly how holo drones operate.

>>11590441
And who exactly is your oshi again?

>>11590350
Do you really think she cares? Coco is a living proof that a big Hololive name can leave and still take a lot of her fanbase with her. This + no Cover cut + no corporate bullshit means a lot of girls would seriously think about it.

>>11590132
It's possible, but it would be very uncanny, kinda like a Syncro-Vox character a-la Annoying Orange or Clutch Cargo. It's better to keep things simple, as long as it's not completely fucked like Coco's old model or Gura's current model.

>>11589513

Cover humiliated her by suspending her and extracting a forced apology to be delivered to communists... for doing nothing wrong. They did a very poor job in restraining harassment on her channel thereafter. She has been a good sport about all that, vis a vis Cover. But they really treated her poorly

Kson has her own moderators, now. And no one's going to suspend her for pissing off a communist schizo.

I wish she were still with Hololive. Just not with the way she was treated by Cover.

She took a risk, but its starting to pay off.

>>11590629
The worst part was when they "accidentally" gave moderation of her channel to them.

>>11590350
speaking of which, is that a direct benefit to the girls? I mean for all that you mention they only use the image of the talent (which belongs to cover) so they would only be gaining publicity for the company?

>>11590438
And that's what really matters. Girls who get into Hololive don't have money for expensive models in the first place, but networking and sponsorships are absolutely priceless.
Besides, nowadays Cover is doing more and more with industry artists like Huke, LAM, and Wada. Those people don't take commissions in the first place, so no indie could possibly get a model from them no matter how much money said indie has.

>>11589584
this is unironically the brony mindset

>>11590746
Of course it fucking is. Working with those companies is a huge deal. When those girls stop being Vtubers for whatever reason, they'll have portfolios most entertainers could only dream of, so they could actually get a job someplace else.

>>11589808
it will always feel "off" watching kson no matter how good her model is because there is no delineation between her fantasy self and her real self

>be Coco
>make Hololive huge in EN
>become the biggest superchat earner in Hololive
>retarded niggers at Cover think they get away with not giving a shit about you and literally modding zhangs in your chat
>enough is enough
>pump&dump them after your fame peaks because they are fucking incompetent retards who take all your money
>go indie
>the majority of your fans follow you anyway
>still getting great viewership while being able to do whatever you want with zero corpo chains
>still getting massive amounts of superchats, only now you actually get to have the majority of it for yourself instead of a worthless corporation mooching off 60% of it
>get one of the best vtuber models ever made
>all the chuubas at your old company still adore you and wish you the best
>only cover got cucked, all because they are incompetent retards, and now there is living proof that leaving Hololive and going indie can actually work out.
She literally can't stop winning.

>>11590584
Working for a company is the Japanese religion. Their programmers will happily do 80hr weeks for the same pay as a combini worker.

>>11589516

There's no doubt they miss having Rushia and Coco as a 1-2 punch for Superchats. Coco was very, very profitable, and really did build esprit de corps among her fellow holos.

Still, they have lots of great performers and collabs. But I do suspect they are having some discussion on medium-term action to catch up to frickin' *Vshojo* on Live2D quality.

>>11589384
the real question is how do they make shit models/poorly rigged models while an indie (kson) mogs the shit out of them.

heh. you think this kson woman can beat me? pathetic.

Why is Yagoo such a cheap fuck when he takes 50% of SC revenue?

>>11589667
so........this..........is...........the power..........of...........cocofags...........whoa...........

>>11590912
They really aren't. Losing Coco was a blow to the company but probably one they had been planning for since the Taiwan debacle. She still made them assloads of money on her way out so I seriously doubt they are concerned about anything at all right now, honestly.

>>11590914
Indies own their models.

>>11590878
I think it's because of her voice, it's too distinct.

>>11590778
>Cover is doing more and more with industry artists like Huke, LAM, and Wada.

Don't forget about la abominacion de las tinieblas IRyS.
That was a fucking disaster and proved that hiring a big name artist is not a recipe for success and it can backfire just as easily.
There are cases like Kronii where an artist has such a big fanbase it carries over to the vtuber and provides a good early boost but for most people the artist doesn't matter as much as the art itself and no name artists have proven to be just as good or better than big names.

I'd say big names are neutral overall, they can work as a small early advantage or they can backfire so they're somewhere in between.

>>11590438
>more marketing and access to collab with other hololive members.
Which is the most important part when working in any industry vs freelancing. Hell, you think Kson would get yaman working on her new model without the connection during her holo period?
>>11590439
>those not involved.
When even low number ones like Aki and Towa got featured in, that means the opportunity extends to more than just top subs/supachat number members.
>>11590584
>>11590439
Baseball sponsor is only one example.
Kson is an outlier in that she already got some presence on the Internet before that. Someone like Marine who was active in Touhou circles or Miko/Fubuki who already got connection in Comiket doujin game circle could still get some boost or Noel who was a good businesswoman enough to have food brand and manga sponsorship for her roommate.
Sure you could always sustain a sizable audience when splitting off but not having a big corporate backing would mean less growth potential to get your image outside your normal niche.
>>11590746
Possible but limited to sponsors with their images, when actually talent's voice are involved ala radio shows/actual sponsors streams/songs then that would directly benefit both the chuuba and getting their feet in.
Pekora and Matsuri both had an audience before holo on NND, but no matter how big they are, none of them would even got deals like voicing shosage, visiting Square Enix HQ or even on the same voice show with Sugita and Mafia.
Fucking hell, getting on the same show as both of them is a big deal that no matter how NND famous Shion's pre-Holo persona, they wouldn't clear for her to be on radio shows like this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6jMTDiz9fU

>>11590914
They get mogged by fucking everyone. Have you seen Nijisanji 3d? Cover is a fucking joke.

>>11589384
They need a really solid fanbase that donates a LOT to make up for the drop in views. Pekora would be the only one who would even think of it, and she'd have to wonder how much of her popularity is her own personality, and how much of it is her design and her interactions with her fellow Hololive members.

At the end of the day, Coco left a ton of money on the table by going solo, even accounting for no more split. That's not gonna appeal to anyone else, Coco herself likely would never had done it if not for the China situation giving her a budge out the door.

>>11589584
Works for Nintendo

>>11590989
Same with Kiara. Her model was a massive debuff.

>>11590893
Based.
Who else could get away with leaving Hololive and still make it?
Coco can't be the only one but not all of them could get away with it.
Let's say they get a big graduation, go indie like Coco, top tier model, hell they even collab with Kson. Who would have the best chances to leave Cover with her audience and make it big as indie?

>>11589384
nice projekt melody rip-off

>>11589384
I mean if any of the girls want to, they are free to stream on their roommate account while being in Hololive. There is literally 0 benefit to leaving.

>>11591022
>Sure you could always sustain a sizable audience when splitting off but not having a big corporate backing would mean less growth potential to get your image outside your normal niche.

This is why you make semi corps like vshojo. And this is what Kson is planning.

>>11591066
kiara's voice and personality is a way bigger debuff

>>11591066
IRyS was a massive debuff, as big as it can get. Kiara was a moderate debuff, it didn't help her but it didn't hurt her as much either, it's at least passable though fanart of her still look better.

>>11591028
It's not just China now. Multiple Hololive members were complaining about Cover. Kiara gave a lot of insider info about this.

>>11590989
Falling for the famous artist meme is something companies need to stop doing. Concentrate on character design.

>>11590878

I think of it like this...

Real Kson is 100% uncut Kson. Coco/Souchou is the same uncut Kson amped up to 125%. Same energy, just more of it.

But I got as much amusement from imagining mocap-suit RL Kson flipping out and chasing Marine around the virtual set as I did from the 3D...

>>11589632
A lot of them would. Vshoujos are constantly buying new models even though they don't really need to, but they have a lot of money and it's something that's fun for them and their viewers. 10k isn't gonna break the bank when you see what kind of paychecks they get. Holos would be the same way if Cover let them go out and commission their own stuff, with the caveat that they still owned the rights and had final approval. But it would make things unequal for the girls, with the lower earners not able or willing to buy new stuff. The feeling of fairness and control is more important to Cover than the hype of more frequent new designs.

>>11591146
Tell that to Ame.

>>11590946
Doesn't seem to matter when some of their most popular talent (Gura/Pekora) have the plainest models of all and Pekora actually refuses to get costume upgrades.

(notice Cover actually apologized she doesn't have any months ago and she still doesn't)

>>11590629
Sauce for that nice image?
>>11590654
I originally thought it was an accident, but man, thinking about what a big fuck up that is, I realized it really wasn't an accident

>>11590989
Stop trying to cope for no good reason. Being able to hire industry artists is a huge plus to any agency, it's like having your indie videogame OST composed by Nobuo Uematsu. Artist's name alone gets people interested and brings uniqueness to the project. A big-name character designer with a big background is always better than a character designer from Twitter with a background of indie SoundCloud album covers.
Also, IRyS has a great model, all she needs is a better rig to go with it. It's not a disaster at all.

>>11591173
yeah it's the fairness that's holding them back and not the fact that their precious supachat profits would be going towards it

>>11591089
>kson ripped off Melody
and Dota ripped off Heroes of the Storm too right

>>11591208
Gura having the most subs doesn't mean she's the most popular. You are right about Pekora refusing new outfits, though. She has notoriously high standards.

>>11590206
Counted how many outfits Hololive (not stars) has and the total is ~136 costumes (not including base or walfie) that Hololive has.

>>11591160
Everyone complains about their job, at the end of they day they can take a look at the bleak hellscape that is indie vtubing and at their own cushy jobs and do the math.

>>11591221
>implying the average holo viewer cares or even knows who these famous artists are

I love the new kson model, but some of the stuff in there is completely useless from a practical sense. I still respect and enjoy that she wanted it done anyway, but corporations will never waste money like that. Especially when it also comes with a waste of time, her debut got delayed by a lot because of how long it took to make her model.
Anyone who wants to test their potential outside of Hololive is free to do so in their existing accounts before leaving, though. No one has to risk anything for this.

>>11591252
>Gura popular
She is. Accept it.

>>11591293
Exactly. The average Holo viewer is enough of an anime otaku to know who Huke or Wada are.

>>11591086
>Who would have the best chances to leave Cover with her audience and make it big as indie?
Marine, Suisei, and Noel, for starters.
Marine already got connections as from her doujin days and she seemed to be the type who networked a lot.
Suisei already got her resume filled from the songs and can work as moderately mid-ter seiyuu/anisong singer/online idol.
Noel already got sponsors as her roommate and her dream was to lean more onto supporting other talents with their sound/ASMR department with her self-funded studio.
>>11591110
>This is why you make semi corps like vshojo. And this is what Kson is planning.
We'll see how it go. But I don't expect her to go big right away and still within the Japanese net/her old connections on NND.
Norio got a bunch of Kadokawa connections yet her Noriopro benefit little from those.

>>11591146
I think her voice and personality fill a niche that is extremely popular with a portion of the audience.

>>11590850
I'm worried about festival and shion-me who didn't even finish high school.

>>11591173
They do comission then retard, do you think cover just decided to not give pekora anything but her joke outfit? She's the one that decides when and what outfit she wants, it's the same for every other girl, aside from holiday outfits every other outfit is self comissioned

>>11591212

Sorry, a random find in another kson thread! If you all aren't already there, Kson's own twitter is cumulating lots of nice material.

>>11589465
Coco and Tatsunokos contacted Youtube by themself anon. Cover did nothing for Coco.

>>11589384
What if all the talents threaten to leave together and become indies who all keep their relationships? It's not like they lose anything from shaking off the Cover parasite that takes 30+% income.

>>11591313
Gura is regularly mogged by several members in JP alone in both CCV and SC numbers. Subs mean absolutely nothing.

>>11591346
I mean letting the talents commission and pay for their own outfits out of pocket if they want extra ones.

>>11591378
VODs

>>11591346
Not true anon not evry case

>>11591374
>Cover parasite that takes 30+% income.
they already have more money than they could ever need, why even take the risk

>>11591374
All the less popular members would take a massive hit. Being "associated indies" isn't the same thing as being in the same company. They also ALL lose their models. 40 people trying to reincarnate all at once and retain whatever shreds of their audience they can hold on to is an extremely chaotic situation only a handful of them would come away relatively well off from.

>>11591391
They do exactly that.

>>11589384

>>11590132
It's 2021 and Miko and Subaru still cant have good mouth motions.
It's clearly not a matter of money. Hololive simply don't care. I am sure you will find simps that will copiumly (new word) tell you "that's their charm lol"

>>11591450
you'd have to be delusional to think that even the mid-tier holos are living the good life after the cover cut, the youtube cut and taxes

someone post the ts m copypasta

>>11590350
>fucking national baseball league
I thought that was their like third tier semi amateur league they had a deal with

>>11591374
>>11591541
You must be retarded if you think SC is where they got most of their money from.
Merch and sponsors are where most of their money comes from.
From what I remember (and I may be wrong) Coco didn't really have much going on in terms of sponsorships but she sure as hell sold a lot of merch.

>>11591516
Based

>>11591374
Funny how cover gets shit on for taking a mere 30% even though that's incredibly generous for the entertainment industry, the only way these girls could be making more is by being A-list VAs or actors

>>11591613
I paid 1 (one) dollar to see this pic.

>>11591516
Source please, for academic purpose.

>>11591639
Sparrow.
Its his only tuber pic tho

>>11591574
Pacific League is one of the only 2 pro leagues in Japan.
https://www.govoyagin.com/pages/japan_baseball

>>11591541
earning way more money than your average wagie just for playing vidya seems like a good life to me

>>11589384
900k subs
21k viewers on an outfit revel

600k subs
47k viewers on an outfit revel

500k subs
26k viewers on an outfit revel

They aren't guaranteed better numbers and anyone who isn't retarded knows that Kson is THE ABSOLUTE best posible scenario, not everyone has EOPs,JOPs AND saviorfags backing their new career. That and believe or not unlike Coco most holos actually enjoy being part of Hololive

>>11590405
>Make absolute statement
>Countered by contradictory absolute statement
>Why are you making absolute statements?
/vt/

>>11589516
I can't help it ok
I just want Rushia to be happy

>>11591576
You have to remember that there is the official merchandise which all goes to cover and the merchandise paid for by the talents themselves out of their own pockets.
for example the sponsorship money from the baseball team that has been mentioned goes all to cover.

>>11591884
It goes to Cover, but given that the talents themselves shill that merchandise they most likely either get a flat check for it or a percentage of the sales. We know that Cover doesn't include them in sponsorships without the approval of the talent and they can turn them down if they don't like it. so they're more involved that you might think

>>11591163
I never imagined the girls running around in the 3D suit but now that you mention it that's funny as hell

>>11590965
she did give them a fat going away cashout, but that is only gonna matter on their yearly for this year. they are ABSOLUTELY going to have to do something for next year or report to investors that they lost half their profit.

>>11589465
Yeah man she is really losing. Poor KSon now she can put her own mods in charge, her manager works for her, and she doesn't have to jump through hoops for merch and other things. Look she barely was in the top 5 of all VTubers with SC earnings, in a month span that involved Myth 1 year anniversary and Gen 5 New Outfits, and only youtube takes a cut meaning she receives more.

>>11591841

/vt/ is EN speaker land. I'm watching Kson's Chit-Chat stream from earlier today (Sunday evening Tokyo). Yen-denominated red Superchats are just rolling and rolling.

I think the Souchou re-debut is going over very well, in JP world.

Don't let this kson thread distract you from the fact that the chinks at bilibili are plotting against both hololive and kson fanbases by purposefully impersonating both sides in hopes to start a flamewar towards each other.

And so far it's making wonders for them, you retards are constantly falling for it.

>>11591884
Where's your source? Multiple girls have said that they get a fair share from both cover paid merchandise and their own, they just get nearly everything if it's their own, do you really think cover just makes them work for free for their own sponsorships?

>>11591884
Seeing how Cover is actually very generous in their rates compared to actual entertainment company, the talents probably get a decent % of sales on any merch that has their likeness. They have to approve their likeness being used after all.
It's very likely Kson still gets a % cut of Coco merch sold after her graduation as well.

>>11589584
The fuck are you on about? vtubing as a medium is categorically peak consoomerism, and criticizing it on those grounds is fucking retarding. It's the equivalent of walking into a Popeye's Chicken and Biscuits and then complaining that the food is unhealthy and that everyone working there is black.

>>11592015
Yes anon they came to /vt/ to falseflag to make the whole 10 people that care hate each other

>>11592015
everyone in this thread is a chink except for you anon

>>11592037
I hope so anon

>>11589584
Isn't this basically ksonnigs philosophy?

>>11591086
I think Pekora and Miko at this point in their careers. Maybe Rushia? Nobody other than them really stands a chance on their own.

>model looks like she's taking a dump
Why is it always about shit with coco.....

>>11591086
>Who else could get away with leaving Hololive and still make it?
Pekora
Miko
Marine
Rushia
Botan
Fubuki

>>11589584
yes, now go watch your daily minecraft streams

>>11590850
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

here's how it will actually turn out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBWC7pBQ_8g
"oh so you were an idol, but you didnt have to look pretty and half the time you were just playing video games instead of being active?"

>>11591632
sad, post it

>>11592127
What is the upper age limit for vtubing?

>>11592175
botan's age

>>11589465
>Doesn't get the benefits of protection from the zhangs
lol WHAT?

>>11591221
Yes if both artists are equal in skill and results the one with a bigger name is better no one would argue otherwise. The problem with a big talent is that they often do whatever the fuck they want because of their big name and nobody in cover has the balls to tell them their job is shit.
And you want to talk about coping and you say IRyS is not an abomination on every level lmao.
She's the prime example of why going for a big name can backfire. Nobody knows who the fuck Coco's artist was and she still managed to be the biggest around meanwhile you had Luna with a famous artist and she still performed the worst.
The biggest Hololive names have somewhat low profile artists and some of their best artists didn't have such a big profile.
Names are marketing tool nothing more and a marketing tool that makes the final product worse is just not worth it.
Kronii was lucky she got an artist that was both a big name and competent at the same time.

>>11592127
>an idol
You don't really believe in this meme of holo = idols, right?

>>11592015
if there was even a tiny bit of truth to what you're saying, thats a retarded plan because all it does is cause more people to talk about them

>>11589384
>Coco leaves Hololive and it's still succesfull
>Gibara and Lulu leave Nijisanji and now they are literally whos
And niggers keep saying that Hololive is just a brand and Nijisanji is the real talent, lmao

>>11592127
Their streamers and personalities anon, aside from the holos that constantly release music they'll branch out to entertainment gigs or maybe being seiyuus

>>11592119
Botan can leave but she wouldn't keep most of her audience. I doubt she'd care though.

>>11592127
I don't know if it's mentioned in the video you linked, but one of the former superstar idols that PPT admires was literally reduced to working in a grocery store for a while after she retired.

>>11592223
how succesful was kson before hololive?

most holos do seems to be, at a basic level, socially retarded otakus, so in the same way their viewers watch them to pretend to have a cute friend on the internet, some holos really just want the crutch of the other holos being forced to be their friends. some of them would never survive a solo career or be capable of any sort of networking

>>11589384
nothing. They're not kson. They will have 0 success outside of holo

>>11592246
She'd go back to be FPS bootcamp drill sergeant

>>11592223
Kson is a literal who before hololive. Everything she is right now, she leeched from Hololive

>>11589516
Actually she hasn't taken that spot yet, it's still Coco.

>>11592323
Leeches take, she gave Hololive a lot. It's better to say she built it up with the connections and reach she had in Hololive.

>>11592285
the only way any holo can maybe taste success after graduation is to use kson as an anchor and be part of her "team", thereby creating a critical mass of post-grad holo viewers

>>11592211
reminds me of George Lucas and Star Wars. Original trilogy is good because he had people working with him and telling him his ideas were shit and forcing him to change and fix them. Prequels come around and now nobody is allowed to criticize him and the movies are full of silly things.

>>11592408
You're using a lot of words just to describe leeching

>>11592491
okay where the fuck is this mass holo graduation meme coming from

>>11592265
enough to be interviewed

>>11592508
nowhere newfag, welcome to /vt

>>11592505
Me take no give=leech
Me take me also give =mutual benefit = not a leech
Is that simple enough for you?

>>11592265
She wasn't a namanushi like some other Holos but her videos went up on the daily rankings a lot on Niconico. One of the more well known out of the Holo past lives when it comes down to it.

>>11592508
watson is graduating soon and so is mori

>>11592491
>the only way any holo can maybe taste success after graduation is to use kson as an anchor and be part of her "team"
Surely you aren't this retarded, bunch of Holo already on the same level or surpass pre-Holo Kson's popularity in Nipland. Not all of them will be popular if they left but saying someone like Marine, Noel or Fubuki won't be successful if leaving without relying Kson is delusional

>>11589384
Well, considering Myth still doesn't have 3D models...

>>11592127
The idol touches on something Kiara also talked about concerning real idols, unless you're in AKB48 main group levels, you're barely making ends meet. Their agencies pocket all the money they make.
The only real career path for an idol is working as an actor, singer or general entertainment stuff.

>>11589384
You guys really need to stop with the ''just leave hololive lmao muh money'' Kson is an expection to the rule, people say ''I'll follow you no matter what'' but a lot of these are empty words there's more chance that they will get forgotten than retain the same popularity

>>11592127
The only true idol is sora

>>11592911
too old, too ugly

>>11589384
Potential of what exactly

>>11589384
>So umm... How does Cover respond to this?
I don't know. You should definitely make another 100 threads asking this same question like you did the last 100 times. It definitely won't continue to fuel resentment and irritation toward you faggots and your oshi.
> Some girls have to be looking at this, and seeing the potential they have outside of Hololive. New outfits won't cut it.
Ah, yes, the potential to show your tits and ass while having less collab opportunities, less sponsorships (and therefore less income), and less job security.
Truly Hololive is finished.

>>11592623
thinking that any holo can survive as an indie when they can't use their holo models or their holo narrative is delusional. kson isn't alive because of her talent or likability, she's popular because of her unique circumstance of leaving holo

>its another thread made by retards who thinks superchat is all the money Holos get
草

>>11593078
>holo can survive as an indie when they can't use their holo models or their holo narrative is delusional.
kek, Noel alone makes more money from her non-Holo activities than as Noel. Joining Holo is pretty much just a semi-part time for her.

>>11592531
The thing with Coco though is that she explicitly stated she went to Cover for a managerial position, instead they convinced her to be a streamer.

>We've gone from believing that Hololive gets the best of the industry to admitting that only a handful are worth anything beyond the brand.

>>11590315
>Rig nice tentacles
>Ina never uses them despite being a character artist herself
Yet she is the coziest kindest member in holomyth.

>>11592750

That in specific is not on Cover anon, for 3d they have to go to the studio, that means international travel to Japan aka 14 days of quarantine.

Needless to say is not happening.

>>11592248
Traditionally graduated idols end up marrying total weirdos who groomed them, then get divorced and teen pregnant. See every Morning Musume member.

https://aramajapan.com/news/tvmovie/variety/minami-takahashi-accuses-husband-of-not-brushing-his-teeth/115487/

>>11591086
Any member of HoloMyth

>>11590133
Anon, 90% of Holos already had massive numbers on their roommates accounts before joining Hololive.

>>11593291
>we

>>11593078
>isn't alive because of her talent or likability, she's popular because of her unique circumstance of leaving holo
What, you're talking about the number one most superchatted channel and you don't think her fans would've been dedicated enough to migrate over?

>>11593366
[citation needed]

>>11593296
every holofag says their oshi is the kindest in hololive

>>11590914
A lot of indies have done that. What hurts is that it was one of their own.

They won’t because Holobronies eat up whatever low budget and low effort Cover feet them without any question. That’s why the market is sinking and there won’t be any real revolution, they are too many and too low IQ to look for quality.
It’s not even just Kson but any other indie, without considering she probably makes the same money with 1/4 the views because she doesn’t have to pay half her money to whatever company who provides no support.

>>11591841
JP ones do because they can go to the HQ and socialize and work together in person and do their 3d lives and what not
They bond under the hololive flag and wear the jersey like a badge of honor. They also get classes and dancing lessons and I think a girl mentioned business and marketing seminars...
EN and ID have no concept of that as their managers are considered assholes and obviously not physically present

>>11593464
But ina is the kindest, where did I lie?

>>11593484
feet

>>11593509
Watch out, Anon, you are drooling.

>>11593078
I think the same, Kson already had a well know youtube channel, some roommate informations for other girls aren't that popular or they used to stream in other plataforms that aren't youtube, a lot of people watch hololive because is easy to have everyone on youtube the time that would take for some girls to have new channels, new models or spread the word where they went would kill the chance to rise again

>>11593249
I was referring to a real interview (for a website or magazine?).
not hard to find

>>11593501
Alright, loser.

>>11590893
Corpos and upper management always turn out to be retarded, regardless of the company/industry.

>>11590914
The truth is, you can't realistically expect big groups like NijiHolo to match up to this sort of quality when they've got things like deadlines and budgets to worry about. This one especially is kind of a perfect storm.

>THE best rigger around, also happens to be a big fan of hers since her Niconico era
>illustrator who too has a lot of personal attachment to her
>get the two of them in direct contact with each other (this is not how it usually works!)
>give them all the time they need and don't skimp on the costs

>>11593803
well why don't big groups just don't have deadlines then? they have enough money to not have them after all.

>>11593955
>well why don't big groups just don't have deadlines then? they have enough money to not have them after all.
You ever hear of a small defense startup called Lockheed Martin? You should apply for a job there; your approach to project management is a perfect fit for their company culture.

>>11593501
Getting your friend into hololive, denying the opportunity to thousands of infinitely more talented indies is not a very kind thing to do

>>11594035
As long as it means less nigger riggers then I'm all for it then.

>>11592127
They took their time and grossly glossed over this fact but I'm glad i guess they at least mentioned a bunch of former idols go into prostitution. Not saying active and famous ones aren't though....

>>11593229
Noel’s roommate makes more money because she sticks a camera on her fucking tits for an hour per video, most holos won’t be doing this.

>>11593453
Literally do your reps, I’m not getting banned for you. Cover nearly never hires someone who isn’t already popular/semi-popular. See: Gura, Mori, Ina, Pekora, Noel, Polka, Shion, Mumei. These are just the ones of the top of my head that I’m sure off.

>>11589384
Not a vtuber

>>11591994
Wtf how is kronii 2nd all time for hololive?

>>11590893
thread should've ended here

>>11594151
Keep seething, 2view.

>>11594493
Anon…

>>11591221
no matter how you feel, you can not defend sana's design and model. you just can't, it nukes her in every shape and form and her and ina could've done a 10 times better job than pako did. she got knee capped right from the get go and she wouldve done way way better with a better design and no level of fame from the artist couldve helped with the shit design

>>11592175
there is none, that's why we got so many hags and cakes

>>11594493
It's just last month, not all time. All time number 2 for Hololive is currently Rushia.

>>11589384
vstudio models have been showing features none of the corporate live2d have for quite some time now, kson isn't the one who's going to convert anyone

>>11594329
The biggest idol groups are all unironically front businesses for the yakuza.

>>11594545
>2view
like sana?

>>11589647
>>11590405
holy shit you're retarded

>>11594577
The design isn’t atrocious, it’s just fucking brown. Vtubers are supposed to take us far away from reality. I don’t need to be reminded niggers exist when watching a Hololive stream.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaKqn-AUOHU&lc=Ugz2oIfRNNvpc9cb8UB4AaABAg.9T8F8ffA7Ni9TWeLKbbO2q&ab_channel=NousagiTL

marine got mogged and humiliated by a babiniku for her company's shit tech and its honestly pretty fucking funny

>>11591450
>>why even take the risk?
>>they already have more money than they could ever need.

>>11594751
>this is the guy that gets to fuck pomu

>>11594712
no fucking way, even if she was pale skinned its still a dog shit design with completely random design elements that are ugly as fuck like her spiral head thing and those anal beads

>>11594151
You appear to be upset, ma'm.

>>11594426
Anon your standards of popularity are quite fucked when you put gura with any of those others

>>11594577
I actually really dig that retro late 90's style.

Not everything has to be moe blob, anon. Give her personality and streaming style a chance before judging her based on her avatar's looks, my dude.

>>11594688
I actually worked for one of Akimoto's companies, the guy really runs japan

>>11594911
Half the others were Japanese. Gura is a meme queen that rode off retards using her songs for Tik Tok. Some others had very very similar numbers as her. Like mumei.

>>11594930
Same, reminds me of Macross a bit, but with rounder eyes.

>>11594426
I don't think its necessarily popularity, but an ability to maintain a stream and be dedicated to it.

>>11591994
Off topic, but does anyone else find it funny that the top Vtuber in Japan is a guy?

>>11594930
i didnt say she didnt have a good personality or isnt enjoyable. im just saying from a marketting stand point her design held her back tremendously and hiring a big artist was a waste of money because he dropped the ball hard. you can like it and find it nice, but from the perspective of being appealing to the general public and average vtuber fan, it failed completely

>>11595091
I unfortunately dont follow too many male Vtubers beside Randon. Whose the person you're referencing?

>>11595091
Maybe he doesn't suck at video games

>>11594964
>some others
One other and only if she's actually her, and the japanese holos were not particularly that popular, they just belonged to a nnd clique and someone inside holo recommended them, noel and kson were the most popular and they were still whos in japan before hololive

>>11595168
If that's truly the case, it's really unfortunate. She's had some genuinely great streams and it's sad people are willing to pass on her over something so flimsy, imo.

Man, I'm really missing her already since she's taking a leave of absence to grieve. I hope she's doing okay on that note.

>>11595091
its hard to wrap your head around initially, but it makes sense when you realize that japan didnt really have as big of a streamer culture pre vtubers due to limited companies helping people with copy right and shit. kuzuha is basically japan's pewdiepie

>>11594930
>2021
>90s design
It's one thing to enjoy old designs. It's a terrible business decision to rely on such an old aesthetic though. 90s style anime is not at all mainstream. It is a legitimate debuff and I feel bad for her. People won't watch a single stream because of it. Add the brown skin and atrocious color choices, blonde on brown on white? And those weird huge balls in her hair. I seethe at management every time I see it.

>>11592849
You don't think Gura's viewers would follow her if she left Hololive? Mori?

>>11595529
Mori's would, but she might need to continue as a vtuber to retain everyone. Gura already proved she can make it as an indie vtuber.

>>11595235
thats just how marketing is, you need to grab people's attention ASAP or else they will never give you a chance even if you know they will enjoy the content. We had an entire generation of FPS box art being stoic white dude holding a gun because people straight up won't buy the game if they cant be a white dude with a gun

>>11595168
This mentality is why Cover cornered the market on vtubing and you're some schizo ranting on a basket-weaving forum.
Successful companies innovate. Not all their innovations succeed, but they have the money and want to maximize market share.
Coca-Cola spends a fortune on new flavors not because they expect them to be as popular as Regular or Diet Coke, but because they want to have as large a market presence as possible.
Sana is doing exactly what she was supposed to.

>>11595564
i am actually watching calli's career with great interest because you know eventually shes going to pull a joji, its almost guaranteed. but i really wonder what her end goal is as an artist. because for joji its obvious he wants to go as mainstream as possible, but i don't know if thats what calli wants

>>11595693
She wants to revive the 2000s j-rap genre

>>11595637
niji expanding into india is innovating, they failed but i can atleast see the risk and rewards in that venture. giving a girl a dog shit design is innovating how? to test if retarded shills will defend your atrocious management decisions and double down on them because you are too big to fail?

>>11595280
Essentially this mixed with the bro culture with other Niji males. He basically is Pewds compined with lets play groups. I am really interested in how EN Holostars and Wave 4 are going to be received because of this. Anyone who was watching Achievement Hunter, Super Best Friends and Game Grumps would know those groups actually had massive female followings along with their male following who were SUPER into those groups.

>>11595693
There's a schizo voice in my head telling me that one day she's just gonna go crazy and start a stream without her model and go full 3D

>>11589595
Bonus for some people, mandatory for others.

>>11594347
Let's not pretend Kson isn't aiming at coomers since before Holo. You think she got that popular because of how well she can chain a combo in Bayonetta?

>>11590132
Pretty much just difficult and costly. Why spend money on mouth movements with 200 different variations and have to link up each crease on the mouth which will take days to do when you can just have a hole that open and closes.
Although I've noticed roberu's mouth looks really good, his mouth model actually tracks when he closes his mouth for the P,B and M sounds, the mouth narrows and widens according to what he says and not just becomes a larger and smaller hole when he talks and this dude talks fast but the mouth model manages to keep up so it flows really nicely. 80% of his content are zatsudans so maybe he paid more for it to be good. Idk im just autistic about the small details im sorry

>>11590132
Behold, one of the most popular and loved vtuber who's mouth often doesn't even open when she talks.

>>11589881
idk about you but as an april fools or something i'd watch the hell out of that. Have them all be in full cosplay for the hell of it

abhorrent cringe thread

>>11592092
I think Miko and Pekora are carried too much by their hololive characters to make it far as an indie. They might get a boost by their hololive fans when starting out but will start to fade away if they stick to being a solo streamer.

>>11595637
You can take chances but if it's obvious sana's design didn't catch on, why not change it?

>>11596586
board*

>>11595801
Here, I'll explain it slowly.
Gawr Gura is a golden goose, right? Gets tons of sponsorships, makes tons of money, etc. So why didn't Cover just make Council a generation of 5 snarky lolis?
Because they're not a company for chumbuds. They want to try new designs and commission new artists because they know some people will want to watch Sana, Fauna, or Baelz and not watch Gura, Calli, or Kiara.
Your opinions are not fact, and the fact that there are Sanalites who LIKE her design and DEFEND it, including in this very thread, is proof that you are objectively wrong. She was made to appeal to people that aren't you, and in that, she is succeeding.

>>11596649
website*

>>11595956
She is going to go back to 3D which shouldn't be very shocking I think people have this weird belief that these girls are going to do this forever when most of them know the life cycle of a VTuber is short and have talked about it quiet often.

>>11589384
Is nobody going to mention how fucked up her right foot looks in that illustration?

>>11596086
>aiming at coomers
nice try ching, since when can coomers donate that much money?
she's just very endearing for the average japanese middle aged man, like a funny prostitute, and I mean that as a compliment

>>11596708
Adding onto this, just watching the fucking interview Coco did on Yagoo before she graduated.
He flat out tells you what he's looking for in new hires: something that sets you apart from existing talents.

>>11596767
I think you misunderstand, i'm talking about her doing this AS MORI. Regularly scheduled *spins wheel* minecraft stream, starts loading screen, and when the stream begins it's just 3d in the corner instead of mori and she doesn't acknowledge it whatsoever.

>>11589465
>cover
>protection
You do realize she broke down crying on stream with kanata consoling her because Cover made a bunch of changs her moderators by accident and they banned a shit ton of her members
It took weeks for her to undo all the damage

After that, Kson took complete control over the channel and made her own moderators, which completely solved the issue.
Cover corp never stood up for Coco or helped her, they just did nothing.

>>11589745
>>11589838
>>11589840
>>11590963
Are you guys comprehending his post? Everything he said is factually true, why be disingenuous, demand cover be better

>>11596987
No I understood I forgot to leave in the part where I said she wouldn't do that.

>>11592109
She has a fixation on assholes and shitting. Just like Kiara.

>>11589667

Hololive is still in pretty good shape. There are several things that will make other Holo girls reluctant to follow Coco out the door. First of all, a lot of them feel personal loyalty to the company because Cover lifted them out of total obscurity and poverty to dizzying heights of fame and financial success. A lot of the early Hololivers in particular were rags to riches stories.

Second is the sense of camaraderie seems pretty tight at the company. A lot of them were very upset Coco leaving, and many won't want to leave their friends, especially when they're getting a big paycheck from Cover and get to be famous.

Third is that if they left, they'd be taking a big risk trying to make it on their own. Some of them, particularly the more obscure Hololive members, would probably not succeed on their own.

Coco left because Cover grossly mishandled the China situation and continued punishing her even after the incident ended by not allowing her to do nayhting without the company's permission, and they ruined her Asacoco and meme review segments. She was clearly unhappy being at the company, and while she probably misses her friends, she's now raking in the cash and no asshole managers are throttling her stream ideas anymore and she can just do as she likes.

If Cover is smart enough not to let things get that intolerable for the other big talents, they'll be fine. But if they piss off someone like FBK or Korone or Pekora or Gura too much? Watch out. Particularly since I suspect Kson is likely to help promote any ex-Hololive talents if they go independent.

>>11596798
>when can coomers donate that much money?
>>11596086
How contradictory are you? If coomers can't donate much money, Only Fan wouldn't even exist. And don't tell me Kson doesn't aim at coomer audience, regardless of her online hostess conversation skills equivalent.

>>11592213
they do idol work. they arent accountants. they arent going to be able to go to a corporation and become a media manager or anything like that. japanese business men will see them as "vapid little girls with no real skills and self important attitudes"

>>11592243
both jobs aren't taken seriously outside of their own industries. they arent going to flip that into becoming a CEO. they won't even get hired for basic office work.

>>11597430
>she's now raking in the cash and no asshole managers are throttling her stream ideas anymore and she can just do as she likes
I can't wait to see the reactions of incredulous disbelief from ksonfags a year from now when half of Kson's employees are banned from YouTube and the other half are complaining that she doesn't give them permission to stream anything anymore.

>>11597834
Guess what, they won't be joining the wageslave force if leaving Holo as they either went back to streaming or do freelance entertainment work. Do you think Botan trained a bunch of teenagers in her FPS bootcamp because she got a STEM degree or something?

>>11589384
yeah but they need to be doxxed first before they try out the kson formula
lulu tried it and just did away with the vtuber entirely
it's a formula only B-tier women and higher can try
this would probably not work well for okayu, but would probably work well for mel

>>11597430
>she's now raking in the cash and no asshole managers are throttling her stream ideas anymore and she can just do as she likes.
But she's doing the same as always with her vtuber avatar, the only thing that was kinda innovative was that half-2D half-3D stream and it was honestly in pretty bad taste

>>11597899
>both jobs aren't taken seriously outside of their own industries.
Yes anon, that's why they're supposed to search for another job IN the industry, why the fuck would you think otherwise?

>>11597914
Youtube isn't gonna do shit. Potential sponsors on the other hand are another story, just look at the Playism shitshow.
>>11598144
Lulu was already pretty well known before she went facecam. She just got pissed that Nijisanji managers kept preventing her to do the only thing she joined for, playing games on stream.

>>11594577
It's nowhere near that bad holy fuck you make her sound like Irys.

>>11594712

It's hard to tell what percentage of the racist obsessives are just trolls. I might as well be pessimistic and guess its 7% rather than 70%.

>>11596708
its ironic as fuck that you asked why didnt they make a new gen of all gura clones, when the literal senzawa knock off uwu meme spouter is blowing her gen mate's the fuck out and the "innovation" has less than half her subs

again, im not a numberfag, nor do i hate sana as a streamer. but cover is out to make money, just because 2 white knights on 4chan liked her design, doesnt mean that it didnt directly nuked her performance as a full package and a product.

>>11596842
can you niggas read or no? what the fuck does a dog shit design handicapping sana's numbers(regardless of her personality) have to do with new hires?

>>11598389
She wouldn't even be able to do what she's doing now anymore if she was still Coco. Cover's restrictions were getting worse and worse.

>>11590350
But how much of that do they actually get? In terms of cut

>>11599099
More than kson's getting as an indie.
Superchats are nothing compared to sponsorships.

>>11599171
https://youtu.be/6eBCZmFC8NI

>>11599311
>Literally 1 sponsorship vs dozens.
>Kson's already back to towing the corporate line to make ends meet.
Ha ha holy shit. Such creative freedom.

>>11599536
Keep seething lmao

>>11599171
>Intel
https://www.inputmag.com/gaming/tempt-fate-with-this-japanese-cpu-vending-machine
Kek, they are really getting desperate to regain market in Japan post the Ryzen boom in 2019.
Still, Capcom, Xbox, Square Enix and Nissin probably paid much better. Pre Taiwan yab, Holo also got a bunch of ASUS sponsors.

>>11599536
>creative freedom
this meme is already burned

>>11599536
I see cope.

>>11590912

Its better for covers for coco to go elsewhere and be successful. This way the bugs can focus on attacking her and leave covers alone. Covers can go back to getting bug sponsorships and permissions and the /pol/ ppl can go fight a war with coco.

Covers strength was never having more tech than their competitors. It was always about giving a happy waifu environment for the viewers.
The synergy in hololive gives them the competitive edge that helps them succeed. Away from TW, politics and whatever other yabs.
Coco couldn't really fit in anymore after her brand was irreversibily tainted. The rest will benefit more in covers and outside.

>>11597430
Gura already starts to sound done with Cover’s shit in recent streams. Honestly if she leaves to become indie it would be the biggest shit show ever.

>>11600016

CN isn't fertile ground. I think shutting down Holo CN was a sign they were figuring that out.

>>11600437
You don't need to restart holoCN. But it really helps t o get sponsorships, permissions and fans without political problems. This is just not possible with Coco in covers.

>>11591320
Not doubting what you are saying but if Marine had such a network of connections, why was she so destitute just prior to joining Hololive?

Mangaka dead ended when publisher got canned, literal who vtuber and living off of paltry commissions from art requests.

>>11600565
Meanwhile fubuki..

>>11600305
Unironically one of the strengths of cover over its competition was keeping the atmosphere seiso.
No guys around, keep things somewhat wholesome. Not saying they ever go over the line but they generally try to respect it and it makes for a more perfect "cute girls doing cute things" atmosphere.

>>11600727

I can belieb that covers made things bad for coco so she'd leave on her own. They couldn't fit her in the seiso house anymore.

>>11600727
>cover
>cute girls doing cute things

>>11600613
Yeah I was thinking the same thing when I read his post. Literal who mangaka who lived off welfare and not so special vtuber. Doubt she had that many connections.

>>11599171
Doesn't the company pocket most of that for setting it up?

>>11600565
>>11600016
>covers
>covers
>Covers
>covers
You don't need the s

>>11600565
> Fubuki

So Fubuki next huh?

>>11590893
the model point is kinda cope, it's: 1. subjective, and 2. not that important in the scheme of things.

>>11601089
FBK brand isn't tainted like Coco. She'll survive and get back to shilling CN hardware like before.

>>11591374
you can ask similar questions about why a general strike remains a fantasy or why revolutions seem to inevitably turn to dogshit. people are really bad at collective action and creating and maintaining organization is hard and that's why the whole world looks the way it does. that's not to say it's impossible, but it becomes extremely unlikely in many circumstances

>>11597834
I dunno, a couple of them probably could.

>>11600896
you expect a chink to know that?

>>11601906
I was going to call him Zhang, but thought it might be some ESL-kun