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[ERROR] No.11343735 [Reply] [Original]

Why does Hololive always have to do unarchived karaokes but Nijisanji gets to do them archived?

>> No.11343769

copyright trolls go for someone they can leech off of, not small creators with cents to their names

>> No.11343783

>>11343735
The difference is whether the Holocaust occurred or not
Cover has become very timid since that incident.

>> No.11343785

holo streams get enough views to be striked

>> No.11343800

I don't really watch Hololive, but I thought the JP members have archived karaoke? Maybe the ENs don't want to if they are singing English songs because of DMCA.

>> No.11343835

>>11343800
I did watch a Marine anime songs karaoke live once, she sang the Japanese version of Country Roads because that's a song from Whisper of the Heart. When I went back to watch it archived later that song was gone but everything else was still there. It was odd.

>> No.11343879

>>11343769
No it's the complete opposite. They target as many small creators as they can, because they don't have the pull with Youtube to fight back.

>> No.11343898

>>11343835
>Country Roads
The Denver estate is extremely aggressive about the rights to Country Roads.
Anyway yeah it's just copyright basically, the HoloEN girls sing a lot of English songs that Cover doesn't have the rights to. They use unarchived karaoke for that. It was my understanding that Nijisanji doesn't allow the NijiEN girls to do unarchived karaokes?

>> No.11343918

>>11343879
This is probably true, Kiara is the only person I've ever seen come back from a YouTube ban. And she did it twice.

>> No.11343959

>>11343735
Pomu got hit by copyright strike when she did unarchived, and now everyone (in EN) is avoiding doing unarchived karaoke.

>> No.11343988

>>11343898
>It was my understanding that Nijisanji doesn't allow the NijiEN girls to do unarchived karaokes?
That would make sense. It honestly seems kind of risky to do them to begin with, what if the copyright holder catches them singing it live? Can't they still get in trouble even if they don't archive it? And people reupload the unarchived karaoke anyway so it's like providing proof that they broke the law.

>> No.11343997

>>11343735
Niji sing bad enough that the algorithm can't pick it up

>> No.11344012

>>11343783
It's the opposite. Nijisanji is scared of getting striked even on unarchived karaokes so they only sing songs they have the right to.

That being said IRyS has done 10 archived karaokes already.

>> No.11344031

>>11343959
that's dumb af. It's a ID content detection.
Music strikes are extremely rare on YouTube even on VODs. Most of them are Claims or Blocks

>> No.11344044

>>11343988
Well, I should also clarify that I don't know what I'm talking about anyway. Maybe Cover actually gets the rights to the EN setlists, but they don't pay enough to be able to keep the VOD? who knows

>> No.11344064

>>11343735
Nijisanji need all the views they can get which is understandable since they're reclining so hard this year.

>> No.11344076

>>11344064
Everyone's declining this year. There's a pandemic, in case you've forgotten.

>> No.11344081

>>11343988
Youtube has made a deal with the big labels. You won't get striked, they'll just claim the video and get all the ads money

>> No.11344344

>>11343898
>It was my understanding that Nijisanji doesn't allow the NijiEN girls to do unarchived karaokes?
Where did you hear that? Elira has had a couple of unarchived karaoke streams that you can search up for yourself on nyaa, and that's less about copyright and more because she knows she can perform better. They can unarchive their streams and karaokes if they want/need to.
I haven't seen any of the EN livers imply otherwise.

>> No.11344393

>>11343988
I've seen small indies upload twitch karaoke vods to youtube with their songs specifically marked and timestamped, it seems that a lot of the time people don't care and ignore it but that might be because they're too small for it to be worth the trouble. That said even some songs get blocked in certain regions (anime songs getting blocked in Japan specifically is common) and others have to be taken down completely. Nina's (the Dutch indie) karaoke of Holy Diver hit her entire vod and even the reupload by someone else has the entire song muted, for example.

>> No.11344427

>>11344393
>Nina's (the Dutch indie) karaoke of Holy Diver hit her entire vod and even the reupload by someone else has the entire song muted, for example.
Do you have a streamable link or anything? I love that song, I'd like to hear this cover.

>> No.11344452

>>11343988
>>11344044

That takes far too much effort to pursue. First of all you don't have Youtube's handy bots to help you out, you need to do it manually, actually watch the videos to make sure it's your song on it, and then get all the other information like when the (now-vanished) stream happened.
And then, so you've "proved" they sang your song on stream. Now what do you get out of it? First of all it's difficult to prove damages off the bat, because they never have SCs turned on. By this time you've probably spent more than 3 man-days on the whole thing, which already cost you more than any money they would have gotten even with SCs turned on.
The real issue are Youtube copyright strikes, which are basically Youtube's way of gaming the DMCA. If Youtube didn't have strikes, it would be required to automatically police and remove copyright-infringing content even without being told to. If it failed at this (which it would, obviously, given the sheer volume of content), it would lose its safe harbor protection status and be held liable for every single act of infringement on its platform. So the compromise is to have it be automated (so it's cheap enough for Youtube to do reasonably) and severe enough that no one can reasonably claim that Youtube is not doing its job at protecting the rights of copyright holders.
The end result of that severity is that two strikes render you unable to upload or stream content for up to 90 days, and three Youtube copyright strikes delete a channel permanently. The strike takes place first, and then you can dispute it. So even erroneous claims can be damaging.
So you see now that the only thing that matters is avoiding Youtube copyright strikes. But within the bounds of the Youtube system, you obviously can't copyright strike content that doesn't exist - the purpose of the strike is already fulfilled, that content is gone - which is why it's fine for other people to upload it. Those people can be copyright striked, of course, but no one bothers to. If you wanted to go after the original infringer who no longer has that content? Well, Youtube's system is literally run by a skeleton crew who barely knows how it works, so you're going to have to prepare for a long, drawn-out back-and-forth to get the necessary evidence that will cost you ten times what you can possibly recoup in damages. Which would be near-zero, because, as above, you'll find that SCs are turned off for the stream, which then necessitates you and your lawyers to put together some convoluted arguments with shitty math on how singing your song in particular - not the other songs - generated some proportion of SCs for a later stream or something.
There is another kind called a Content ID claim - this is an automatic process which can make the ad revenue from your video go to the claimant. Many vtubers wouldn't really care about this if they're getting the views and pumping the algorithm - it's still better than having their work gone altogether.

>> No.11344475
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[ERROR]

>>11343735
It depends on the talent and their manager. They can be archived if they spent the time and money to get the permissions. Polka for example has all of her karaoke streams archived, but that is because she is willing to spend the time and moneys to do it.

https://youtu.be/mMDC8IfQATo

>> No.11344506

>>11344427
Yep, all the songs got preserved here:
https://pastebin.com/nS8QC1z8
And here's Holy Diver specifically:
https://files.catbox.moe/p579rj.mp4

>> No.11344574

>>11344452
Thanks for the detailed explanation, interesting insights!

>> No.11346213

>>11343800
The JP members only sing japanese song, which is easier for Cover to contact with and ask for permission, hence why all JP Holos get to have achived Karaoke stream, you can see the same happened to Fauna membership unlock stream, it's a karaoke stream but she only sang japanese songs, hence why she gets to have it on her channel. English songs are a different territory as Cover don't have that many connection outside of japan, asking permission for every single english songs that the EN Holos want to sing is a very complicated legal progress because copyright law in the west is fucked and there is no way of stopping it until mega corps like Sony, Disney fall.

>> No.11346250

>>11346213
I mean Sony owns a fuckton of music so true for them but who exactly is looking to sing Disney songs? Just a bunch of songs from children's movies? I don't see why anyone would want to sing that.

>> No.11346310

>>11346250
Elevens love Disney more than weebs love Miyazaki.

>> No.11346945
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[ERROR]

>>11344475

>> No.11347031

>>11346213
I can't comprehend why singing should be a reason for copystriking, even without the base bgm they strike channels for that, fucking greedy companies

>> No.11347276

>>11343735
japanese karaokes can be archived, english song ones cant. But dont worry, nijisanji is too afraid to do even unarchived english, because of a single strike they had once.

>> No.11347561

>>11347276
I'd rather they don't do unarchived karaoke anyway because it always leads to singing stupid shit like Baby Shark. Doo doo doo doo doo doo.

>> No.11351001
File: 46 KB, 927x272, unarchivekaraoke.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11351001

>>11343898
>>11343988
Elira's the only EN I follow even slightly and she has unarchive karaoke
Most of what she sings is just JP or vocaloid too, not due to the fuckstate of music copyright in the west

>> No.11351256

>>11343997
How ironic,the most well known case of the cover song being so close to the original song that the algorithm can't identify, happened in nijisanji
https://youtu.be/jgAgvRPfgWY

>> No.11351258

>>11343735
Nijisanji is a part of a mega bank.As long as they are mindful, they probably don't have to work at all for things like access, it just happens incidentally as they make deals.

>> No.11351947

>>11351001
Whoever uploads unarchived NijiEN stuff to Nyaa seems to have stopped doing it. There's a ton of stuff that's not there.

>> No.11351996

>>11351256
AM I THE ONLY ONE WHO ALWAYS GETS GUNDOU AND TOMOE MIXED UP??

>> No.11352102

>>11343735
Niji doesn't have holoniggers watching all their streams waiting for something to report

>> No.11352253

>>11343735
Because Cover is embarrassed of their "talents" trash singing abilities. That's it, no other reason.

>> No.11352288

>>11343735
for all the talk about being more loose, NijiEN managers dont let their livers sing songs they dont have the rights of, even if its unarchived.

>> No.11352331

>>11352288
Well HoloEN managers don't let their members talk about their periods on stream. Your move.

>> No.11352495

>>11343735
I’m from argentina and I want to ask if we’re using this image to bait post with again

>> No.11352499

>>11352253
Cover's top talents (in singing) are better than any niji

>> No.11352581

>>11352499
Kek, you are really funny. I recommend you to try yourself in stand-up comedy.

>> No.11352894

>>11352499
I am a holofag myself and I couldn't say that because I don't care enough to watch Nijis singing streams to even compare.

>> No.11353004

>>11346250
>why would anyone want to sing songs from super popular films that are constantly being searched for on youtube?
Not to mention that plenty of classic Disney songs are vocally demanding so it's an easy way for a singer to show off their vocal prowess with a song everyone knows.
Although, idk how popular this would be, but I wonder if a showtune singing chuuba would get anywhere with that niche.
Idk if the permissions game would be better or worse for shit like Roger&Hammerstein, but I could see it hitting a similar angle to wanting to sing Disney songs.

>> No.11353850

>>11344452
長すぎ

>> No.11353978

>>11353004
Nobody is going to "get anywhere" if they join any agency other than Hololive. If you want popularity then that is the only agency that can truly bring it to you in this industry. If you join another agency, it's not because you want popularity. It's because you genuinely enjoy the job.

>> No.11354214

>>11353978
Get anywhere is a very relative term.
I was using it more to mean "build a dedicated fanbase interested in that content" rather than "20k+ ccv streams, 500k+ VOD views regularly"

>> No.11354272

>>11353978
Or join a group because they just want to make a living.

>> No.11354353

>>11347561
Literally no one has sang baby shark, not even Gura. The dumbest meme song anyone has sang was Mori with Critikal's shit.

>> No.11354536

>>11354353
Gura did sang a parody of that single line during a Minecraft stream to fill the silence.

>> No.11356078

>>11343988
Isn't that why they disable superchats when singing unarchived karaoke?

>> No.11357066

>>11356078
Yes. Even privated archives can be copyright claimed and have the revenue killed.

>> No.11357614

>>11357066
I made a couple of AMVs on YouTube back in my youth but eventually I got embarrassed of them and hid them instead of deleting them. Then like 5 years later I got a copyright strike on one of them out of nowhere. So I went and deleted most of them. YouTube had some weird detection system with this stuff, even a video that nobody has interacted with for years still shows up for them.

>> No.11360562

What's going on?

>> No.11361798

>>11343918
t. only watches holoEN

>> No.11362087

>>11361798
Say something in Japanese. Right now.

>> No.11362224

>>11362087
watameron

>> No.11364992

So let me get this straight. Gura stole "oh nyo" from Digi Charat, and now Chumbuds are pretending she invented it herself?

>>
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